Baby On Board

weldoninhio

Skylar Massive Serf wrote: »

So that people will know that a woman is pregnant and would appreciate a seat. It's not always visible and there's often reluctance by some people to assume a woman is pregnant in case they insult her.
This removes all that awkwardness and also means women in the early stages of pregnancy, who might be suffering from tiredness or morning sickness, but are not yet obviously pregnant might be offered a seat. (Not by you, of course, but by someone without a chip on their shoulder).

I suffer from tiredness in the morning, maybe I should get a badge??

Fighting Tao

weldoninhio wrote: »

Yeah?? So why do we need silly badges??

I didn’t realise that congratulations was in order.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

weldoninhio wrote: »

I suffer from tiredness in the morning, maybe I should get a badge??

Oh I just knew you were going to post that. I nearly took it out but decided to see if I was right.

jooksavage

weldoninhio wrote: »

I suffer from tiredness in the morning, maybe I should get a badge??

If you've ever shared a bed with a heavily pregnant woman you'll know the true meaning of tiredress in the morning.

jooksavage

jooksavage wrote: »

If you've ever shared a bed with a heavily pregnant woman you'll know the true meaning of tiredress in the morning.

You need a badge m8

jooksavage

I can imagine the anti-badge stuff here coming from the mouths of the same guys who said "woman and children be-damned" as they donned a petticoats and jumped into the Titanic's lifebaots. :-)

Lol full disclosure I stand on public transport as a rule and a preference and am always nothing but wonderful to pregnant women, the elderly and small children.

But internet fingerwaggers just bring out the churl in me.

Grown adults telling grown adults how they 'should' behave my gawd

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Deleted User wrote: »

Lol full disclosure I stand on public transport as a rule and a preference and am always nothing but wonderful to pregnant women, the elderly and small children.

But internet fingerwaggers just bring out the churl in me.

Grown adults telling grown adults how they 'should' behave my gawd

It's a debate on a debating forum.

em_cat

irelandrover wrote: »

I also don't believe if they were asked in real life by a pregnant lady that they would respnd in the same way.

In Dublin, at rush hour on the red line, YES they would, I see it every day, so much that I am no longer shocked.

Id always give up might seat to someone who needs it more if i notice. But when im on public transport im normally in my own little world.

See that's the problem, everyone is in their own little world...on the bus or the LUAS I would be listening to music, but I am conscious that I am still in public & should have some level of awareness around me, that goes if I am reading a book, yes I really mean a real printed book...

Skylar Massive Serf

Skylar Massive Serf wrote: »

It's a debate on a debating forum.

I'll have to disagree with you there

"I have a certain set of ideas about manners and obligations in terms of life's niceties and I think that they should apply to everybody else also; if you disagree with them on the internet you are an AWFUL PERSON" is not a debating position.


Firstly it deals with a purely relative set of values.

Secondly, and I've alluded to this, presuming to instruct grown adults in morality on a question of personal manners is ugh gauche. It's not a debate.

Thirdly, the shocked and saddened in this thread are not debating they are scweaming insults.

end of the road

weldoninhio wrote: »

I suffer from tiredness in the morning, maybe I should get a badge??

you are being ridiculous. you are just a tad tired and you will get over it in a while or so. a woman carying a baby will be tired for a lot longer then you could ever be. you have no argument.

Deleted User wrote: »

I'll have to disagree with you there

"I have a certain set of ideas about manners and obligations in terms of life's niceties and I think that they should apply to everybody else also; if you disagree with them on the internet you are an AWFUL PERSON" is not a debating position.


Firstly it deals with a purely relative set of values.

Secondly, and I've alluded to this, presuming to instruct grown adults in morality on a question of personal manners is ugh gauche. It's not a debate.

Thirdly, the shocked and saddened in this thread are not debating they are scweaming insults.

it's a debate on a debating forum about what is the decent thing to do in the situation being discussed.

c68zapdsm5i1ru

Deleted User wrote: »

I'll have to disagree with you there

"I have a certain set of ideas about manners and obligations in terms of life's niceties and I think that they should apply to everybody else also; if you disagree with them on the internet you are an AWFUL PERSON" is not a debating position.


Firstly it deals with a purely relative set of values.

Secondly, and I've alluded to this, presuming to instruct grown adults in morality on a question of personal manners is ugh gauche. It's not a debate.

Thirdly, the shocked and saddened in this thread are not debating they are scweaming insults.

Totally disagree. We are debating the merits of a baby on board badge and many posters find the attitude of a minority, who state that they wouldn't give a pregnant woman their seat because they're entitled not to etc rude, inconsiderate and selfish. That's an opinion, and it seems to be the majority opinion on here (thankfully).

Hi there EOTR

Do you think you're in a position to tell weldoninho how tired they are.

Hungrycol

Can I get a badge that says "I offered my seat but she refused it because she was getting off in two stops"?

Fighting Tao

Maybe an “AMA With a Heavily Pregnant Woman” is needed.

Trekker09

Skylar Massive Serf wrote: »

It's a debate on a debating forum.

Apparently it's a finger wagging exercise!

em_cat

Mystery Egg wrote: »

Love too be mansplained on tinternet

People with no experience of pregnancy or disability saying righteously what they'd do, instead of just having a bit of care for your fellow man. It's genuinely funny watching people bend over backwards to defend being d1ckheads

Sorry, but I've a disability that throws my centre of gravity off every day, 24 hours, 7 days a week, I don't get to give it up in 8-9 months.

I don't expect people to give up their seat, but I do expect that in today's modern world people are going to be self-absorbed, so If need a seat, I will politely ask.

And to be fair, being pregnant isn't a disability so please stop lopping it in with the needs of those with disabilities.

end of the road

Deleted User wrote: »

Hi there EOTR

Do you think you're in a position to tell weldoninho how tired they are.

yes . not only does his attitude say it all to me, but unless he has an actual illness or some other medical reason that makes him tired all the time, he is not going to be anywhere near as tired as a pregnant woman.
also, he actually isn't entitled to a seat on public transport at all. there is no such entitlement funnily enough, you are only entitled to travel.

em_cat

Mystery Egg wrote: »

Okay. So a significant portion say "if you need a seat fukc you, I want my seat I'm entitled blah blah".

Then there's the "if you want a seat ask for one" crowd who interpret a badge notifying you of pregnancy or disability as passive aggression.

And finally there's the "I'll gladly give you a seat but NOT if you ask" crowd.

Moral of the story seems to be don't be sick, old, disabled or pregnant basically. Cool cool

I wonder how come no one at the NRH told me I could have a badge for being disabled? Are you referring the blue padge for parking?

I mentioned this whole pregnancy badge thing to an ailing, very old grandparent who literally survived the holocaust, tattooed arm and all and she had some very interesting things to say about it, none of which I can repeat as I would be banned.

end of the road

end of the road wrote: »

yes . not only does his attitude say it all to me, but unless he has an actual illness or some other medical reason that makes him tired all the time, he is not going to be anywhere near as tired as a pregnant woman.
also, he actually isn't entitled to a seat on public transport at all. there is no such entitlement funnily enough, you are only entitled to travel.

Ur wrong Ur not

Mondo123

I'm kinda saddened to read on this thread how ppl asked by pregnant ladies for their seats refused. I had a close friend this happened to and she ended up fainting on the train an having to be carried off.
I know it's old fashioned but jeez there has to be some level of humanity left in society. I'm currently pregnant myself but gladly don't need public transport. Even pregnant now I would get up in a heartbeat for someone that I could see struggling to stand be they 17 or 77... life's not all about oneself

Trekker09

OK, I get the fact that some people might have unseen disabilities, bad backs etc, and would be as deserving as a pregnant woman, but what I can't fathom is the logic in "well what about me and my condition" attitude, basically denying the validity of pregnant women to a seat. Do Irish Rail bin the whole project as, by this logic, it's discriminatory to people that aren't pregnant? Or would a better approach be for people to contact Irish Rail and recommend that they extend/re-word the badge to include a wider range of people.

Extend their bloody carriages you mean?

ceadaoin.

em_cat wrote: »

I wonder how come no one at the NRH told me I could have a badge for being disabled? Are you referring the blue padge for parking?

I mentioned this whole pregnancy badge thing to an ailing, very old grandparent who literally survived the holocaust, tattooed arm and all and she had some very interesting things to say about it, none of which I can repeat as I would be banned.

I think a badge for people with hidden disabilities would also be a good idea if they felt unable to stand for long periods and would like one. I think it is currently being proposed for pregnant women because , as evidenced on this thread, people are more reluctant to offer seats to them as opposed to elderly or visibly disbaled people . What any of that has to do with your grandparents terrible experience I don't know

Trekker09

Deleted User wrote: »

Extend their bloody carriages you mean?

Possibly, but thats not the fault of pregnant women

Katgurl

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

Funnily enough, I don't believe a word of it

Which part specifically? And why don't you believe it?

If you mean you don't believe that I get up you would be wrong. Years ago I travelled on public transport on crutches for months and always now make an extra effort to look out for people who might need the seat more than me. Many times I had to ask people to give me a priority seat despite them doing their very best to pretend they couldn't see or hear me.

I am pregnant ATM but have no problems travelling. However if it does happen I will be wearing my badge and if necessary asking people to let me sit down.

I am not especially surprised you don't believe me btw. We all tend to seek out people similar to ourselves to spend our time with and then mistakenly believe they are representative of the population in general. So the females you know are probably c**t$.

Katgurl

Saruhashi wrote: »

Yes, and when I'm old and sick and I need a seat on the train or bus I will ask politely and if I get a "no" then I will ask the next person.

Instead of standing around wearing my pathetic little badge and hoping that someone will notice me.

You could have just said "excuse me, I'm struggling a bit here and I'm pregnant could I please take your seat". I reckon most people would be agreeable to that.

Depending on which door you use on the luas, and how busy it is there's a chance that you'd only even be spotted by a couple of people who are sitting in seats.

Most people I see on public transport have their attention on their phones or other distractions. What are you doing? Standing around waiting to be noticed?

Did you at least try to get attention? Do you sigh really loudly and talk to yourself saying "just me and my badge here, standing around all day, punished for the crime of having a child"? :pac:

If you ever asked me for my seat I'd gladly oblige. No problem whatsoever.

Otherwise, I'll be looking at my phone or reading my book, trying to avoid eye contact with the other passengers.

There's no point standing around hoping to be noticed and then giving out because nobody gave you a seat. You want a seat? Ask politely.

"Oh no but I might get a rude answer". Well, if proabbly less than 1% chance of a rude answer is enough to make you choose to endure extreme pain then that's on you too.

She is still free to ask if someone doesn't get up. But if she is wearing the badge someone might offer who actually doesn't mind.

Trekker09

.....it just seems people are making excuses for bad manners and ****e behaviour really

Trekker09

Trekker09 wrote: »

.....it just seems people are making excuses for bad manners and ****e behaviour really

Like calling people ***** on a message board over actual imaginary behaviour

Trekker09

Lampudo wrote: »

You are pregnant, not disabled. Plenty of heavily pregnant women can squat 80kg plus in the gym.

Really?

ceadaoin.

Lampudo wrote: »

You are pregnant, not disabled. Plenty of heavily pregnant women can squat 80kg plus in the gym.

And plenty of heavily pregnant women have SPD and find walking or standing extremely painful. Probably a hell of a lot more than can squat 80kg in the gym to be fair!

The Rape of Lucretia

Trekker09 wrote: »

Really?

Yeh. Pregnancy is a lifestyle choice, not an unfortunate infirmity.

end of the road

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Yeh. Pregnancy is a lifestyle choice, not an unfortunate infirmity.

doesn't matter, give up your seat.

The Rape of Lucretia

end of the road wrote: »

doesn't matter, give up your seat.

Thats a pretty offensive discriminatory attitude to have towards the non-pregnant.

Trekker09

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Yeh. Pregnancy is a lifestyle choice, not an unfortunate infirmity.

I know that, fortunately my wife and I have 2 kids. I was surprised that weight lifting was OK for heavily pregnant women as my wife nearly lost our 2nd child while lifting a 25kg bag of flour (she's a baker)

Trekker09

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Thats a pretty offensive discriminatory attitude to have towards the non-pregnant.

Nope, it's showing empathy and manners for somebody that could more than likely do with the seat more than you can

em_cat

ceadaoin. wrote: »

I think a badge for people with hidden disabilities would also be a good idea if they felt unable to stand for long periods and would like one. I think it is currently being proposed for pregnant women because , as evidenced on this thread, people are more reluctant to offer seats to them as opposed to elderly or visibly disbaled people . What any of that has to do with your grandparents terrible experience I don't know

Because she was made to wear a yellow Star of David as a ‘badge’ of her being a Jew. It made sense to me bc they are both yellow.

I think this whole baby on board badge thing is bloody ridiculous and expectant mums should get over it & stop being miffed if people can’t immediately tell. If you have a medical condition that is worse bc of the pregnancy then fine ask for a seat politely & you’ll likely get one. No drama needed.

Being pregnant is not the same as having a disability, hidden or not.

end of the road

em_cat wrote: »

Being pregnant is not the same as having a disability, hidden or not.

nobody stated it was.

Trekker09

em_cat wrote: »

Because she was made to wear a yellow Star of David as a ‘badge’ of her being a Jew. It made sense to me bc they are both yellow.

I think this whole baby on board badge thing is bloody ridiculous and expectant mums should get over it & stop being miffed if people can’t immediately tell. If you have a medical condition that is worse bc of the pregnancy then fine ask for a seat politely & you’ll likely get one. No drama needed.

Being pregnant is not the same as having a disability, hidden or not.

Why are people fixating on a supposed link between pregnancy and disability when nobody has claimed there is one?

Allinall

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Thats a pretty offensive discriminatory attitude to have towards the non-pregnant.

Offensive to who?

What’s wrong with that particular discrimination?

em_cat

end of the road wrote: »

nobody stated it was.

No but mystery egg kept going on as if it were in the same category.

weldoninhio

I wonder would “No” badges or “I don’t care if you have a Baby on Board” badges would sell well. Would stop the awkwardness of having to tell up the pole ladies that you aren’t getting up.

em_cat

Trekker09 wrote: »

Why are people fixating on a supposed link between pregnancy and disability when nobody has claimed there is one?

Because some posters began lumping pregancy in the same category, as sick, elderly or disabled.

Yes, sometimes medical issues arising as a result of or during the pregnancy can warrant being considered as an entitlement to use the priority seating areas, but the onus is on the pregnant woman to ask, not get miffed bc people don’t notice & stop taking it personally if the person refuses or is too ignorant to notice.

And yes it’s sad that today we are all so self-absorbed that it takes a yellow badge to get over the ‘awkwardness’ of asking for a seat on public transport.

I do my best to stay aware of my surroundings while in public, sometimes I offer my seat to someone who looks like they may need it more than me, but I don’t need a bloody yellow badge to remind me to have some manners, be aware or considerate.

doolox

How is it fair that a person has bought a seat on a transport system to surrender that seat to someone else and the other users get away with sitting on their seats?

Would you give up something you have just bought to a complete stranger especially in an age of equal rights and strident anti male climate being put up without protest or defence in most sections of public opinion and media.

We see RTE's recent "solution" to differences in News Anchors pay....make all the new ones female, probably pay them equal with no hassle and jobs done. No pesky expensive men to worry about anymore.

Work life is hard enough for most men nowadays than having them stand all the way on a bus to work. They probably have to do all the heavy lifting in the office when they get there as it is an expectation of a gentleman to put his back out to save the ladies from such a risk.

Until recently the max weight allowed to be carried by men was 50 kg while women were restricted to 20 kg. It has only recently been equalised.

Thank God most men drive to work or work in places where all day parking is available.

As I said before the public transport companies need to supply more seats for their passengers. It might even be a safety issue at this stage like the insistence on all seater stadiums at football matches.

Things such as the LUAS for a few stops is not too bad but a trip like Tallaght to City Centre or the outer suburbs can take more than an hour and is ridiculous.
Would you stand on a trip all the way to Athlone?? Timewise this is what is being asked off some unlucky passengers on Dublin Bus.

AudreyHepburn

If you’re heavily pregnant, elderly or obviously injured or ill then there is no question but you should be given a seat.

I don’t think you can judge anyone too harshly though if the woman is big and looks like she could just as easily be overweight or if the injury/illness isn’t obvious.

end of the road

doolox wrote: »

How is it fair that a person has bought a seat on a transport system to surrender that seat to someone else and the other users get away with sitting on their seats?

unless you reserve a seat you actually haven't bought a seat. one actually isn't entitled to a seat on public transport at all, even a reserved seat can't be guaranteed. you technically pay to travel only. i believe it is in the terms of travel.

doolox wrote: »

Thank God most men drive to work or work in places where all day parking is available.

oh no, not thank god at all. driving in the cities is a huge burdin on both the tax payer and public transport users. it's not sustainible long term and therefore a congestion charge should be implemented in the cities and it should be high.

doolox wrote: »

As I said before the public transport companies need to supply more seats for their passengers. It might even be a safety issue at this stage like the insistence on all seater stadiums at football matches.

there is never going to be a seat for everybody. no suburban or urban public transport company to my knowledge has ever achieved a full seat for everyone service.

doolox wrote: »

Things such as the LUAS for a few stops is not too bad but a trip like Tallaght to City Centre or the outer suburbs can take more than an hour and is ridiculous.
Would you stand on a trip all the way to Athlone?? Timewise this is what is being asked off some unlucky passengers on Dublin Bus.

and all over the world. standing on urban and suburban services is a world wide problem.

Dutybelt

doolox wrote: »

How is it fair that a person has bought a seat on a transport system to surrender that seat to someone else and the other users get away with sitting on their seats?

Would you give up something you have just bought to a complete stranger especially in an age of equal rights and strident anti male climate being put up without protest or defence in most sections of public opinion and media.

We see RTE's recent "solution" to differences in News Anchors pay....make all the new ones female, probably pay them equal with no hassle and jobs done. No pesky expensive men to worry about anymore.

Work life is hard enough for most men nowadays than having them stand all the way on a bus to work. They probably have to do all the heavy lifting in the office when they get there as it is an expectation of a gentleman to put his back out to save the ladies from such a risk.

Until recently the max weight allowed to be carried by men was 50 kg while women were restricted to 20 kg. It has only recently been equalised.

Thank God most men drive to work or work in places where all day parking is available.

As I said before the public transport companies need to supply more seats for their passengers. It might even be a safety issue at this stage like the insistence on all seater stadiums at football matches.

Things such as the LUAS for a few stops is not too bad but a trip like Tallaght to City Centre or the outer suburbs can take more than an hour and is ridiculous.
Would you stand on a trip all the way to Athlone?? Timewise this is what is being asked off some unlucky passengers on Dublin Bus.

It's not about about things being fair, it's about common courtesy and looking out for a fellow human being. If you're a well bodied male or a female, especially if you're young, it makes sense to give up your seat to someone who struggles to stand on their feet and feel pain from doing so etc...

Canis Lupus

Dutybelt wrote: »

It's not about about things being fair, it's about common courtesy and looking out for a fellow human being. If you're a well bodied male or a female, especially if you're young, it makes sense to give up your seat to someone who struggles to stand on their feet and feel pain from doing so etc...

Meh, let them take taxis.

whatlliwear

I am shocked by some people's responses here. Having recently had a baby I can say I would always offer my seat to an obviously pregnant lady. I, personally didn't have to take public transport very often when I was expecting. I also stood and refused seats that were offered to me a lot of the time- but there are days you really need a seat. And on those occasions I would have been eternally grateful for someone if they offered their seat to me. I also never expected someone to give up their seat.

clairewithani

Whoopsadoodles made the point already, it is not just about the pregnant lady. It is also about the baby she is carrying and keeping it safe. Being heavily pregnant throws your centre of gravity off balance and it can be difficult to stay balanced on public transport. Offer your seat to the mother for the baby's sake if not for hers.