Debt Collection note out of the blue - Tesco Mobile

Andy From Sligo

just out of the blue today I got a letter in the post from Cabot Financial saying I owe their Client Tesco Mobile Ireland €584.54.

2 questions - why have Tesco Mobile not sent any letters/phone calls or any correspondence whatsoever before they got to this stage of passing it onto debt collectors and can they do that? - should'nt I have been afford at least one or 2 letters from Tesco Mobile before getting this from the debt collectors so i could have resolved anything with Tesco Mobile firstly before they passed it onto a debt collector? -whats the consumer rules/laws on this matter?

Thanks.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

I assume, by your OP, that you don't dispute owing the money.

Tesco Mobile should have sent you some demands at some point.

Contact Tesco Mobile, ask about previous correspondence or the lack thereof and arrange payment directly with them.

Andy From Sligo

Thanks, all sorted - well sort of.

Tesco mobile said nothing they can do because it gone to debt collecting agency, tesco mobile said they sent out 1 letter but we didnt get it (dont you think they would have had to send it out by registered post/signed for) - and then said they tried the phone number but the SIM was never even activated! - so for Tesco Mobile stupidity and them not taking out direct debit payments when they should have done and not querying it at the time they have washed their hands and passed it onto the debt collectors.

Debt collectors arranged that 30eur per month can be paid by direct debit to them until the bill is paid. Should be glad they arent putting interest on it!

Farmer Bob

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

whats the consumer rules/laws on this matter?

Thanks.

Cabot are acting as their agent, collecting the debt on their behalf. All above board, unfortunately for you. How old is the debt anyway?

It’s not like the UK where debts are sold to debt collectors, and there needs to be a paper trail to show the debt was correctly transferred.

Andy From Sligo

Farmer Bob wrote: »

Cabot are acting as their agent, collecting the debt on their behalf. All above board, unfortunately for you. How old is the debt anyway?

It’s not like the UK where debts are sold to debt collectors, and there needs to be a paper trail to show the debt was correctly transferred.

according to tesco a year and half

Vic_08

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

according to tesco a year and half

Are you saying that they are wrong?

You are moaning about everything tesco have done wrong but at some point presumably you signed up to a contract that you subsequently did not pay or are we to believe that they have targeted you incorrectly?

At the same time as this you also have another issue brewing with tesco mobile by not adhering to conditions on another deal https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=105931333&postcount=26
This seems to be a recurring theme with yourself, ignoring policies/terms/your obligations, complaining about the way you are dealt with and then expecting others to bend over backwards on your behalf to fix issues you have caused.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

Thanks, all sorted - well sort of.

Tesco mobile said nothing they can do because it gone to debt collecting agency, tesco mobile said they sent out 1 letter but we didnt get it (dont you think they would have had to send it out by registered post/signed for) - and then said they tried the phone number but the SIM was never even activated! - so for Tesco Mobile stupidity and them not taking out direct debit payments when they should have done and not querying it at the time they have washed their hands and passed it onto the debt collectors.

Debt collectors arranged that 30eur per month can be paid by direct debit to them until the bill is paid. Should be glad they arent putting interest on it!

Hold on Andy, you are placing an awful lot of blame on Tesco Mobile there. Why on earth would they have registered a demand sent to you? Using a phone number that was on your account is not stupidity. And it's their fault DDs didn't go through, I assume you were aware of an obligation on your part to pay them for something and that you hadn't paid them.
Going by your phone upgrade post it suggests you are still a Tesco Mobile customer so how come you don't seem to know you owed them money?

Ursus Horribilis

Some of these companies seem to be at sixes and sevens when it comes to this sort of thing. But you can't get away with not paying for a service indefinitely. Some day it eventually comes to light and a bill comes your way. I know from past dealings with Tesco Mobile that they're not the sharpest tools in the box. But I'm afraid that mostly the fault lies on your side. You presumably knew this bill wasn't being paid even though you'd signed up to a contract? If it was your car insurance direct debits that weren't being taken out of your bank account , would you be as laid back about it?

Andy From Sligo

OK - I will try and explain it a bit further and more to understand because I think people are getting the wrong end of the stick. And dis-regard the other issue about me not remembering to trade in the other phone because they are unrelated separate incidents , so i dont know why the link is being copied and lumped in with this post.

OK so back to this post -

I fill out a direct debit form with my bank details which has the money in there to cover the bill pay phone , now what tesco mobile ireland do after that I dont know. I dont know what companies do with direct debit forms .. but I am presuming they get put through to the bank and the bank gives money out of my account to tesco mobile ireland - correct? - as the saying goes "take the hassle out of bills by paying by Direct debit" - yes? - so anyway i signs the forms now if someone was not doing their job properly and never sent the form to the bank to request the monthly payment or whatever they are supposed to do with the forms I filled in and signed that is not my fault.

now to this supposed letter they sent out to me that I didnt get saying I owed them so and so before they passed it onto a debt collector... well i didnt get it, if they sent out by recorded post/signed for they would know that, they would have a record that I signed for it ... and one letter? - I think they could have afforded to post one more letter of final demand just in case the first one got lost in the post ... and in any case the odd times I get a letter sent to a previous all address it always gets forwarded to our newer address -well all other letters do, why would a tesco mobile letter not be forwarded to me but all other letter get to us?

OK so they said they tried contacting me by phone. Now, the SIM that came with the phone was never used and never activated (and they knew this yesterday because the customer service person said "yes I see it was never put in the phone and activated") - so why were they ringing a phone number that wasnt activated and why werent they aware that when they were calling that number then. I cannot even find this SIM ... but if i ever do I am going to put it into a phone and see if they really did phone to tell me about outstanding bill .. it should have gone onto the voicemail message on that SIM shouldnt it have, even though it hasnt been put in a phone and activated shouldnt it?

So anyway, I have another tesco mobile bill pay phone (comes out of the same bank/direct debit) - why didnt they ring me on that and tell me I owed them money on the other bill pay phone. - it surely wouldnt take much to tie up the fact that I had 2 different numbers with Tesco Mobile coming with the same name, same bank details.

So yes i'm sorry but taking into the fact that I signed the direct debit form and bank details out when getting the phone and for some reason someone in Tesco Mobile never forwarded them forms onto the bank or wherever they were supposed to go at the time - and because they didnt try hard enough to contact me about the outstanding bill before passing it onto a debt collection agency ... then yes of course i am laying most of the fault with Tesco Mobile Ireland.

davo10

It's not their fault you didn't activate the sim, it is pretty obvious that they would try to contact you on the number of the sim you got from them.

Are you claiming that you didn't notice that the money wasn't being taken from your account every month? Sorry, that's hard to accept.

Andy From Sligo

oh it seems pointless explaining any further on this,

I already wrote that long post saying i filled out the direct debit form but they didnt take the money when they was supposed to do ,

but it looks like everyone seems to be pro Tesco Mobile and dont seem to think that any of this was their fault - so its pointless writing any more on it.

This section says "consumer issues" and i thought it was the place where consumers could get some advice

But does no one think it was really bad (and someone not doing their job properly) of Tesco Mobile that I fulfilled my part of the deal that I signed all the forms and them not to take the money out of my account by direct debit when they were supposed to and then let it mount up and then pass it onto a debt collection firm?

If people cannot see what I am getting at and that Tesco Mobile made a huge mistake and are in the wrong, then its not worth me continuing to explain any more.

dudara

Look, I somewhat agree with you that Tesco Mobile didn't do everything they should have. Yes, they should have taken the direct debit payments, but on the flipside, you should have noticed that payments were not being made.

I definitely think that they did not do enough to contact you. I accept their use of the phone number, but if they failed to contact you via phone, then they should have resorted to formal letters notifying you of the debt. I think their internal processes failed there, and I would write a formal letter of complaint over that.

my3cents

Is there even a contract formed if the SIM wasn't activated?

Andy From Sligo

dudara wrote: »

Look, I somewhat agree with you that Tesco Mobile didn't do everything they should have. Yes, they should have taken the direct debit payments, but on the flipside, you should have noticed that payments were not being made.

I definitely think that they did not do enough to contact you. I accept their use of the phone number, but if they failed to contact you via phone, then they should have resorted to formal letters notifying you of the debt. I think their internal processes failed there, and I would write a formal letter of complaint over that.

Thanks, i think thats what i shall still do. The rep in tesco such a nice guy though he was , hope he dont lose his job if i write a letter of complaint. Maybe he forgot to send the forms off when he sold me the phone

Andy From Sligo

my3cents wrote: »

Is there even a contract formed if the SIM wasn't activated?

Could be true, i should look into it

Andy From Sligo

SIM could even been de-activated by them as well if it hasnt been used couldnt it?, is that what they normally do?

Vic_08

my3cents wrote: »

Is there even a contract formed if the SIM wasn't activated?

If he signed a contract then yes,

Just a guess here but he also got a subsidised phone on the contract with a minimum term, it seems the only vaguely logical reason why someone would sign-up for a bill-pay contract and not even bother registering the sim.

If not then it was a rolling 30-day which he didn't bother cancelling. Not registering the sim is not the correct procedure for cancelling a contract.

Devil's advocate here but are we supposed to 100% take the word that it was Tesco's fault the DD failed, any possibility Andy didn't fill in the form correctly?

All of which are side issues to the fact that he entered into a contract that he didn't pay.

davo10

my3cents wrote: »

Is there even a contract formed if the SIM wasn't activated?

Tesco provided the sim and the service, it's up to the consumer whether they make use of it. If you take out gym membership, you don't query if a contract is formed if you decide not to use the gym facilities, do you?

my3cents

davo10 wrote: »

Tesco provided the sim and the service, it's up to the consumer whether they make use of it. If you take out gym membership, you don't query if a contract is formed if you decide not to use the gym facilities, do you?

I'd still check the T&C's of the contract just in case. Continued use of the SIM is often deemed all that is necessary to agree to changes in a contract so its not impossible that first use of the SIM starts the contract. I wouldn't hold out to much hope but I wouldn't dismiss it out of hand either.

Grab All Association

OP am I right that you joined Tesco Mobile and probably lost/damaged your phone. You then signed up for a new contract to get the same/similar phone. Hence he never put in the SIM card in to the phone?

OP entered his bank details and either he entered/filled them wrong or Tesco screwed up.

Tesco couldn’t call the OP because he wasn’t using the sim card in the phone.

Is that what happened?

Blame on both sides here. OP for not checking his current account balance and Tesco for not writing to the OP (very unlikely the letter got lost in the post)

Andy From Sligo

gave phone to wife, better than her existing phone she already had had bill pay SIM from Tesco and wanted to keep her number - so it went into phone no problem (I am presuming tesco mobile phones are locked to them and not unlocked)

When I filled out forms for direct debit (think there was another film had to fill out as well, so 2 forms) - the rep at the desk perused the details after I filled it out, am sure if there was anything wrong or not filled out correctly he would have noticed and said something.

OK we could say here that Tesco Mobile didnt screw up but the bank did thats another possibility I suppose . but someone didnt be taking the money like they should have done.

yes in future i will have to stringently check my direct debits more and if i find somebody hasnt took money then i suppose i will have to contact them - Direct debits are supposed to be convenient and hassle free . not in this case.

maybe just a little lesson to others I suppose, check and double check your bank details and if it looks like a company is not taking their payments (for some reason!) get onto them or your bank or you will eventually end up with a Debt collectors letter out of the blue even though you done everything right on your side of things.

Vic_08

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

gave phone to wife, better than her existing phone she already had had bill pay SIM from Tesco and wanted to keep her number - so it went into phone no problem (I am presuming tesco mobile phones are locked to them and not unlocked)

When I filled out forms for direct debit (think there was another film had to fill out as well, so 2 forms) - the rep at the desk perused the details after I filled it out, am sure if there was anything wrong or not filled out correctly he would have noticed and said something.

OK we could say here that Tesco Mobile didnt screw up but the bank did thats another possibility I suppose . but someone didnt be taking the money like they should have done.

yes in future i will have to stringently check my direct debits more and if i find somebody hasnt took money then i suppose i will have to contact them - Direct debits are supposed to be convenient and hassle free . not in this case.

maybe just a little lesson to others I suppose, check and double check your bank details and if it looks like a company is not taking their payments (for some reason!) get onto them or your bank or you will eventually end up with a Debt collectors letter out of the blue even though you done everything right on your side of things.

Finally we get (most of) the true story. You signed up with the full intention of never using the sim just so you could get the phone.

Considering how illogical and expensive that is compared to buying a PAYG or sim free phone or just getting an upgrade on the actual account you used the phone on I can't help wondering if there was some scheme here to try and avoid paying the monthly bill right from the start.

I am curious as to what you want out of this, an apology for not chasing you up over the failed DD and sending out more payment demands or do you expect them to write-off your debt and allow you to keep the free phone?

Based on your form I am guessing it is the latter.

Andy From Sligo

Vic_08 wrote: »

Finally we get (most of) the true story. You signed up with the full intention of never using the sim just so you could get the phone.

Considering how illogical and expensive that is compared to buying a PAYG or sim free phone or just getting an upgrade on the actual account you used the phone on I can't help wondering if there was some scheme here to try and avoid paying the monthly bill right from the start.

I am curious as to what you want out of this, an apology for not chasing you up over the failed DD and sending out more payment demands or do you expect them to write-off your debt and allow you to keep the free phone?

Based on your form I am guessing it is the latter.

shame that- is that how you judge everyone? that they want to get a freebie? - or is it just me your judging?

I didnt think it was illegal activity to purchase a Tesco mobile bill pay phone and put in a Tesco mobile bill pay SIM in it ... or if it is I never heard of it being illegal to do that !

I bet it isnt ilegal or dodgy and i bet a lot of people do that, are you saying that its illegal or wrong to get a pre-pay phone and put a bill pay sim into it as well then?

No. I am not expecting a freebie - the damage has already been done now, I am paying back to the debt collector now (and i most probably have got a black mark against my name now too) because A.) either Tesco Mobile never sent the form(s) to the bank or B.) they sent to the bak but the bank screwed up by not taking the direct debit out of my account or C.) (and highly unlikely) that I filled out the forms wrong in front of the tesco mobile guy.

what do I want out of this? - well I suppose a letter of apology wouldnt go a miss, I'd like Tesco mobile to revert their decision and take the debt back from the debt collecter and (even if it means filling out another direct debit form) putting the phone back onto bill pay and pay Tesco Mobile 30eur a month for the outstanding (even if that means going on another 18month contract if needs be)

- as it is I have to pay the debt collector 30euro a month to clear it up but wont get no free calls / texts / internet that I would if I was paying it to tesco mobile if I was giving them the 30 a month

if that makes sense - it all sounds so confusing i know. But if they or the bank or whoever didnt stuff up I would have just been paying 30eur per month as normal out of my bank account by direct debit and not even noticing it.

Now the debt collectors have this , I am paying them 30eur per month until the 580 whatever is paid off , what happens if they turn around one day and want to full amount paid in full ... or what if they sell that debt on (can they do that?) or what happens if another debt agency takes them over?

davo10

my3cents wrote: »

I'd still check the T&C's of the contract just in case. Continued use of the SIM is often deemed all that is necessary to agree to changes in a contract so its not impossible that first use of the SIM starts the contract. I wouldn't hold out to much hope but I wouldn't dismiss it out of hand either.

Seems op got a handset, whether he put the sim into doesn't really matter, it seems he gave the handset to his wife.

Op, did you ask Tescos for copy of mandate?, that way you can check for sure whether it was filled out wrong by you. If it was filled out correctly and you can prove that by showing them a statement with IBAN details, then they should at least take part blame for their error, if you filled it out wrong and they could not contact you on the number/sim you purchased, well then you are 100% at fault and should take your medicine without making accusations against Tesco.

Andy From Sligo

davo10 wrote: »

Seems op got a handset, whether he put the sim into doesn't really matter, it seems he gave the handset to his wife.

Op, did you ask Tescos for copy of mandate?, that way you can check for sure whether it was filled out wrong by you. If it was filled out correctly and you can prove that by showing them a statement with IBAN details, then they should at least take part blame for their error, if you filled it out wrong and they could not contact you on the number/sim you purchased, well then you are 100% at fault and should take your medicine without making accusations against Tesco.

Thanks, thats a constructive answer - yes I shal have to go through my paperwork . Do they normally give you a copy of the paperwork when you do these things?. It was about a year and half ago so I cant really recall whether I got a copy .

Tesco Mobile rep did have a good look through the paperwork I pretty much remember that. If there were any mistakes he would have pointed it out surely wouldnt he. He even punched details into his PC terminal as well, pretty sure about it. - dont they even have to check that you have a valid bank details and money in the bank for the direct debit before they even hand over the handset?

Andy From Sligo

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

.,....

as it is I have to pay the debt collector 30euro a month to clear it up but wont get no free calls / texts / internet that I would if I was paying it to tesco mobile if I was giving them the 30 a month

if that makes sense - it all sounds so confusing i know. But if they or the bank or whoever didnt stuff up I would have just been paying 30eur per month as normal out of my bank account by direct debit and not even noticing it.

Now the debt collectors have this , I am paying them 30eur per month until the 580 whatever is paid off , what happens if they turn around one day and want to full amount paid in full ... or what if they sell that debt on (can they do that?) or what happens if another debt agency takes them over?

Ah here Andy, you’re tying yourself up in knots.

You never put the sim in so you never made use of any calls, texts and data that was available to you when the contract started. And it was available to you had you chose to use it.

Consider yourself lucky that you have a payment plan of 30 per month and move on.

davo10

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

Thanks, thats a constructive answer - yes I shal have to go through my paperwork . Do they normally give you a copy of the paperwork when you do these things?. It was about a year and half ago so I cant really recall whether I got a copy .

Tesco Mobile rep did have a good look through the paperwork I pretty much remember that. If there were any mistakes he would have pointed it out surely wouldnt he. He even punched details into his PC terminal as well, pretty sure about it. - dont they even have to check that you have a valid bank details and money in the bank for the direct debit before they even hand over the handset?

Rep may check that you filled out the details but not necessarily their accuracy. They should have a digital record of your details including the IBAN you gave. If they input the wrong details and you gave the correct IBAN, while it may not absolve you of your debt, it would certainly show they contributed greatly to the situation and they should make an allowance for that in the form of a discount on the debt. Ask them to prove you entered a contract with them, they will have to show you the contract and the mandate.

If they can't produce the paperwork, I don't see how they could succeed with any court proceedings. This won't effect your credit rating by the way, but others have posted that service providers do share information.

Andy From Sligo

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Ah here Andy, you’re tying yourself up in knots.

You never put the sim in so you never made use of any calls, texts and data that was available to you when the contract started. And it was available to you had you chose to use it.

Consider yourself lucky that you have a payment plan of 30 per month and move on.

I dont get any of that -

my wife has 30euro plan but crap phone - she liked the SGS6 but could not get it because she already had bill pay with tesco mobile and wasnt eligable for an upgrade at that time .. I got it for her , she put her TESCO Mobile Ireland bill pay SIM in and continued to use her number - what is wrong with that/ what did I do wrong?

So, if I ever find the SIM of that handset there is 2 things. If they havent already disabled/disconnected it then how am I going to get 30eur a month calls and texts and Internet on it - how am i going to do that now they have passed my bill onto a debt company?

Just answer me this peeps - is there anything wrong with buying a phone on bill pay but not using its Supplied SIM for it but using another SIM by the same mobile phone provider? - it might not seem logical to some but thats what i did.

Andy From Sligo

davo10 wrote: »

Rep may check that you filled out the details but not necessarily their accuracy. They should have a digital record of your details including the IBAN you gave. If they input the wrong details and you gave the correct IBAN, while it may not absolve you of your debt, it would certainly show they contributed greatly to the situation and they should make an allowance for that in the form of a discount on the debt. Ask them to prove you entered a contract with them, they will have to show you the contract and the mandate.

Thanks, i will get in touch with them see if they can send me a copy of the form(s) if i cannot find them myself in my filing cabinet.

So, yeah that sounds like a good idea if they reduce the debt if it was part their fault.

Mind you when wife talked to tesco mobile on my behalf the other day she said nice person on the phone... but nothing they can do now about anything because it has come to the stage its been passed onto debt collector now so its nothing to do with Tesco mobile now she said.

EDIT: who is likely to have the paperwork for the direct debit now? would it be Tesco mobile or the debt company seeing as they have passed the debt onto a debt collector?

Ursus Horribilis

You can do anything you want with a bill pay phone, just as long as you pay the contract you've entered into.

As an aside, I used to work in a job where we had direct debits and standing orders being paid to us. You'd be surprised how often the banks would lose or make a mess of the paperwork.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

Just answer me this peeps - is there anything wrong with buying a phone on bill pay but not using its Supplied SIM for it but using another SIM by the same mobile phone provider? - it might not seem logical to some but thats what i did.

Not really anything wrong, except you don't seem to be paying for it. How could you not realise that?