Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2018

Liam McPoyle

MojoRisinnnn wrote: »

44 shots conceded to Sevilla and Huddersfield in the last 2 games compared to the 11 we had, laughable. LVG Served up some of the most stagnant and mediocre football and was heavily critisiced and rightfully so, why is a José exempt? What is there ‘to trust’ ? The lads defending him above are bonkers.

While I'm not denying the overall drabness of our display tonight stats like this mean the square root of fcuk all.

Neither Sevilla or Huddersfield scored against us.

Shots mean nothing without end product.

Remember last season against Burnley, we had something like 28 shots on target and didn't score, a team can have all the possession or shots they want, if they can't do anything with it then it means nothing.

Andrew Beef

ericzeking wrote: »

Jose, in the process of alienating a true talent, a mercurial talent the like of which is synonymous with United in Pogba before serving up such a lack of ambition on the pitch against very mediocre opposition says an awful lot to me. This guy is not a United manager. It isn't just about winning, it's about the way you go about it.

Left in situ, he'll win more titles, no doubt, but he'll do it in a pragmatic way with pragmatic players...Pogba will be gone, Martial will be gone, Rashford will be gone and he'll sign a few more Matics... that's where Mourinho want's to take United. But hey you'll get to gloat in work that we won 1 nil on a Saturday.

However I would say that if it comes down to a choice between Pogba and Jose, Woodward will almost certainly pick Pogba, the guy is worth a fortune to the Corporation yo. There's chicken wings to be sold.

The problem is that Pogba has been mercurial in the Memphis Depay sense of the word rather than the George Best sense of the word. Bottom line, Pogba has been rubbish. Jose can only do so much.

GSPfan

The best manager we could end up with if Jose left would be Brendan Rodgers.

I seriously think that will be an option if Jose left. There really is no one else I think who is available and worthwhile.

This will all blow over or blow up. I’d say blow over.

secman

I don't know why people are bothered , we are second in the league... still in the CL.... still in the FA cup....... now some of ye might think .. a " Comical Ally" impersonation but I can assure you it's totally coincidental... everything is fine.. no need to overreact... don't mind what you are witnessing... it's fine ..really.


Note the small print...these facts may change soon and it's not my fault if they do.

.

Liam O

The amount of shots being given up, on both sides, the left on Saturday and the right last night is definitely worrying. Give them to Ronaldo, Messi, Muller, Lewandowski and the likes and United could be looking down the barrel of an extremely embarrassing result. De Gea isn't going to bail them out out against the real cream of the crop because they won't give him the chance to.

There's something wrong at the core of the team when Pogba and Matic are incapable of making 5 yard passes and Mata winds up showing up at left back after you've just brought on a winger. Players aren't being played in the positions that suit the team best. Martial, in good form this season on the left, dropped to the bench when someone joins who has shown in the past close to WC level right sided attacker. No balance. No cohesion and don't even take the chances that they do get.

The last 2 games have been nothing more than lucky imo and the chickens will come home to roost sooner or later. This has happened every season since Fergie left, it's ingrained in the club. Won't be playing Huddersfield and Sevilla level teams in the quarter finals if the home leg is negotiated and won't be playing many teams that level for a little while in the league either.

TitianGerm

limnam wrote: »

As I said, we've won 3 games in 60 years in Spain. _3_

This is not a shocking result.

Europe is about drawing away winning at home.

Every time a team does it, people say but but but but.

We need to win at old trafford. I'd take that.




League is over.

Whats tricky about it.



If me aunty had a bollox she'd be my uncle.

No one said it was a shocking result but it was another poor performance. United didn't even defend well, they just seemed to let Sevilla do what they wanted.

You better tell everyone else the league is over so seen as there are 13 games left. You might not win the league but there is still CL qualification to play for.

Also your last comment in completely childish.

@Titangerm

@Titangerm

You mentioned in match thread that Utd are currently losing the tie in the match thread?

If utd 0-0 at home doesn't it go to extra time?

I believe Utd will win in 90 minutes however.

pjohnson

Suprised more people aren't praising Pogba after his amazing performance!

TitianGerm

M!Ck^ wrote: »

@Titangerm

You mentioned in match thread that Utd are currently losing the tie in the match thread?

If utd 0-0 at home doesn't it go to extra time?

I believe Utd will win in 90 minutes however.

Did I say United were losing the tie? If so I apologize because I meant Sevilla have a slight advantage.

More results in the second leg will put Sevilla through. A win or a score draw. For United to go through they need to win on the night.

I do think United will go through though.

What are your thoughts on recent performances? I know United haven't conceded many but they are giving up an awful lot of chances and sooner or later they will be punished.

Last year I feel you defended a lot better whereas this season (for the last few months) it's just like they allow the opposition have a go.

TitianGerm

TitianGerm wrote: »

Did I say United were losing the tie? If so I apologize because I meant Sevilla have a slight advantage.

More results in the second leg will put Sevilla through. A win or a score draw. For United to go through they need to win on the night.

I do think United will go through though.

What are your thoughts on recent performances? I know United haven't conceded many but they are giving up an awful lot of chances and sooner or later they will be punished.

Last year I feel you defended a lot better whereas this season (for the last few months) it's just like they allow the opposition have a go.

I'm not sure why expectations have suddenly changed?
UTD Did not conceed no matter how well someone believes we did or did not defend.

It's the same when you play to win trophies.
If he can deliver them, (which he already has) then I'm ok with that.
I don't care for shot stats or bull**** possession it's about results.

With Jose this is what he has done throughout his career in away fixtures throughout his career.
I'm not sure why someone expects this to change.

Tactically he had everyone sit deep last night and even Pogba. And it looks like everyone followed that plan but for some individual errors. This won't always be the cause but this is the knockout phase.

My four criticisms of Jose have always been:

1) He still doesn't know what his best team is after nearly 18 months.
2) He should be regularly playing Utd with 3 in midfield with Pogba furthest forward.
3) Pogbas form has dipped in the last few games but I still believe that's also a fault of Joses team selections and how he's utilizing his best player.
4) His faith in Valencia from an attacking perspective is frustrating, as he regularly fails to deliver accurate crosses from the right hand side.

TitianGerm

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I'm not sure why expectations have suddenly changed?
UTD Did not conceed no matter how well someone believes we did or did not defend.

It's the same when you play to win trophies.
If he can deliver them, (which he already has) then I'm ok with that.
I don't care for shot stats or bull**** possession it's about results.

With Jose this is what he has done throughout his career in away fixtures throughout his career.
I'm not sure why someone expects this to change.

Tactically he had everyone sit deep last night and even Pogba. And it looks like everyone followed that plan but for some individual errors. This won't always be the cause but this is the knockout phase..

I don't think this is how Jose at his best set his team's up. His team's were notoriously difficult to break down, gave up very few chances and then punished you when he counter attacked.

Early this season United were very like this. They defended as a unit, counter attacked well and punished mistakes by the opposition.

Now, as you say, you are sitting deep but no one really pressures the man on the ball, they just allow them to pass it around them.

It just looks like something has changed. Whether the players are no longer willing to work as hard as Jose wants them or that Jose has tweaked the defensive set up a bit.

If United give up as many chances as tonight against Chelsea the weekend Hazard or someone will take one of those chances.

Liam McPoyle

pjohnson wrote: »

Suprised more people aren't praising Pogba after his amazing performance!

His poor performance is Lukaka and Joses fault.

Not sure how, but that's the only logical explanation.

bangkok

'Prickly Jose defends tactics'

http://www.skysports.com/share/11261200

Is he getting a dig in at sanchez there about not defending??!

Liam O

TitianGerm wrote: »

I don't think this is how Jose at his best set his team's up. His team's were notoriously difficult to break down, gave up very few chances and then punished you when he counter attacked.

Early this season United were very like this. They defended as a unit, counter attacked well and punished mistakes by the opposition.

Now, as you say, you are sitting deep but no one really pressures the man on the ball, they just allow them to pass it around them.

It just looks like something has changed. Whether the players are no longer willing to work as hard as Jose wants them or that Jose has tweaked the defensive set up a bit.

If United give up as many chances as tonight against Chelsea the weekend Hazard or someone will take one of those chances.

Just on the lack of pressure, I believe this is why United look better with Jones and Bailly in there. They don't step off and allow attackers time to make decisions. Lindelof was good last night but Smalling and Valencia just backing up as a player carries the ball from wide positions into the box as Correa did time and time again was ridiculous.

TitianGerm

Liam O wrote: »

Just on the lack of pressure, I believe this is why United look better with Jones and Bailly in there. They don't step off and allow attackers time to make decisions. Lindelof was good last night but Smalling and Valencia just backing up as a player carries the ball from wide positions into the box as Correa did time and time again was ridiculous.

Actually that's probably a better way of putting it. The United players seem to be backing off a little more rater than closing the space.

Matic was very in your face before Christmas but he looks to have tired now and that could be why the midfield seems to be a little weaker.

Rayne Wooney

Brainless calling Jose pathetic after that, if we hadn’t got the best goalkeeper in the world we would have lost that game comfortably. What more can Jose do?

Pogba gets another chance in the much hyped midifeld 3 and puts in another dismal performance, it’s becoming ever more obvious that he isn’t the player we thought we bought and he won’t become the player we need him to be. He hasn’t been a whole lot better than Mkhitaryan was and that’s saying something. A good perfomance now and again against Swansea or Bournemouth and the memory of the padding out of his CV he did in Italy is all he’s living off. A world class player will shine under any circumstances, Pogba is not that,

We’ve got a 0-0 to take to Old Trafford but we will go out of this competition when we meet a good side. We play football like we’re chipping away at a mountain with a toothpick, unthreatening.

S.M.B.

Liam O wrote: »

The amount of shots being given up, on both sides, the left on Saturday and the right last night is definitely worrying. Give them to Ronaldo, Messi, Muller, Lewandowski and the likes and United could be looking down the barrel of an extremely embarrassing result. De Gea isn't going to bail them out out against the real cream of the crop because they won't give him the chance to.

There's something wrong at the core of the team when Pogba and Matic are incapable of making 5 yard passes and Mata winds up showing up at left back after you've just brought on a winger. Players aren't being played in the positions that suit the team best. Martial, in good form this season on the left, dropped to the bench when someone joins who has shown in the past close to WC level right sided attacker. No balance. No cohesion and don't even take the chances that they do get.

The last 2 games have been nothing more than lucky imo and the chickens will come home to roost sooner or later. This has happened every season since Fergie left, it's ingrained in the club. Won't be playing Huddersfield and Sevilla level teams in the quarter finals if the home leg is negotiated and won't be playing many teams that level for a little while in the league either.

My rough calculations say that Martial has played ~75 minutes on the left out of the 540 minutes that he could have played since Sanchez arrival.

Now he was never going to play all 540 as there rotation was always going to take place but 75 minutes in his favoured position is very disappointing and concerning when it comes to his long term future at the club.

Rayne Wooney

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Brainless calling Jose pathetic after that, if we hadn’t got the best goalkeeper in the world we would have lost that game comfortably. What more can Jose do?

Pogba gets another chance in the much hyped midifeld 3 and puts in another dismal performance, it’s becoming ever more obvious that he isn’t the player we thought we bought and he won’t become the player we need him to be. He hasn’t been a whole lot better than Mkhitaryan was and that’s saying something. A good perfomance now and again against Swansea or Bournemouth and the memory of the padding out of his CV he did in Italy is all he’s living off. A world class player will shine under any circumstances, Pogba is not that,

We’ve got a 0-0 to take to Old Trafford but we will go out of this competition when we meet a good side. We play football like we’re chipping away at a mountain with a toothpick, unthreatening.

Do you consider that this change was forced midgame and that Jose's tactically set the team up to defend deep?

No you don't it seems

TitianGerm

TitianGerm wrote: »

I don't think this is how Jose at his best set his team's up. His team's were notoriously difficult to break down, gave up very few chances and then punished you when he counter attacked.

Early this season United were very like this. They defended as a unit, counter attacked well and punished mistakes by the opposition.

Now, as you say, you are sitting deep but no one really pressures the man on the ball, they just allow them to pass it around them.

It just looks like something has changed. Whether the players are no longer willing to work as hard as Jose wants them or that Jose has tweaked the defensive set up a bit.

If United give up as many chances as tonight against Chelsea the weekend Hazard or someone will take one of those chances.

I'd consider Utd looking weaker defensively of late for the simple fact the two best defenders are not playing.
Quite the possible reason for said slight adjustment.

TitianGerm

M!Ck^ wrote: »

I'd consider Utd looking weaker defensively of late for the simple fact the two best defenders are not playing.
Quite the possible reason for said slight adjustment.

Bailey has played very little this season but the other spot is open for whoever wants it. Unfortunately Smalling and Jones have made a few errors, Rojo can be a liability (rush of blood usually) and Lindolf hasn't played much after a unsteady start.

Adamocovic

I just think our overall play has been quite slow on attack and we've not held onto possession that well at all. Seems like a long build up letting defences regroup and ultimately trying a nothing ball or working hard to create a chance.

When you see the likes of Pogba, Mata, Martial, Rashford, Lingard, and Sanchez in the squad you would expect creating goal scoring chances to come easy. And couple that with a prolific goalscorer in Lukaku expectations are high. At the moment it hasn't been the case. It may be a combination of tactics and individual performances but something must change. As always a lot of focus seems to be put on our defence, but in my eyes it's the attack that's failing, and losing so much possession only leads to putting our goal under more threat.

Hoping we see Bailly and Jones back at CB in the league now, but that will not effect the style of our build-up and attack. Next game versus Chelsea will be very difficult.

deaddonkey15

S.M.B. wrote: »

My rough calculations say that Martial has played ~75 minutes on the left out of the 540 minutes that he could have played since Sanchez arrival.

Now he was never going to play all 540 as there rotation was always going to take place but 75 minutes in his favoured position is very disappointing and concerning when it comes to his long term future at the club.

Especially when you consider that he was in pretty good form before Sanchez arrived.

IITYWYBMAD

pjohnson wrote: »

Suprised more people aren't praising Pogba after his amazing performance!

I know you're being ironic, but it was a horrendous display, given he got what he wanted. Obviously things not good in the camp between him and Jose.

bangkok wrote: »

'Prickly Jose defends tactics'

http://www.skysports.com/share/11261200

Is he getting a dig in at sanchez there about not defending??!

That was cringe worthy.

StringerBell

bangkok wrote: »

'Prickly Jose defends tactics'

http://www.skysports.com/share/11261200

Is he getting a dig in at sanchez there about not defending??!

No, just more desperation from you.

Adamocovic

Also, I know it's well past it now and not the most important thing, something that gets on my nerves is the short corner at times.

Like the one yesterday. You have tall players like McTominay, Matic, Pogba, Lukaku, Smalling, and Lindelof all pushed into the box and then mess around with a short corner to get it to your right back on the opposite side before losing possession.

I'm all for clever set pieces but what happened to a lovely placed corner and towering header. It's not like we lack height. Even with a short corner prefer the receiving player to launch it in first time.

Just a little rant of mine. Don't see the point of overcomplicating the unnecessary.

bangkok

StringerBell wrote: »

No, just more desperation from you.

How? Why do think he took off sanchez?

StringerBell

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Especially when you consider that he was in pretty good form before Sanchez arrived.

Here is a rare occasion we will agree, I think he has got this wrong. Sanchez can play on the right no problem and Martial was in very good form on the left. The right is still an issue and bringing in Sanchez looks to have done nothing to solve it when it could have gone a long way to helping. The left side was functioning well without him with good options there to rotate. It seems a little bit like putting new windows in a house without a front door or some variation of that saying.

The right side of the pitch was pretty much vacant last night with Mata coming central all the time, never picking up his man and Valencia not able to cover the entire side and basically ignoring Correa completely allowing him multiple opportunities to receive the ball under no pressure and turn and run at the defence.

StringerBell

bangkok wrote: »

How? Why do think he took off sanchez?

How? Just the usual you attempting to twist something into a negative to have a pop where there is none. This is nothing unusual like and I don't see the need to pretend its anything other than that.

Why he took off Sanchez? Keep him fresh for Sunday/Things weren't coming off for him/Try a different option/Fresh legs in the wide areas to run at the defence/Same way he has rotated Martial/Rashford all season/MaybeSanchez wouldn't pass him the red sauce either.

You can twist all you want like, nobody is ever fooled by it or your motivations. Jose very clearly rejects the premise of the question, as he should. ONLY someone with an agenda could twist that into him having a pop at Sanchez.

bangkok

StringerBell wrote: »

How? Just the usual you attempting to twist something into a negative to have a pop where there is none. This is nothing unusual like and I don't see the need to pretend its anything other than that.

Why he took off Sanchez? Keep him fresh for Sunday/Things weren't coming off for him/Try a different option/Fresh legs in the wide areas to run at the defence/Same way he has rotated Martial/Rashford all season/MaybeSanchez wouldn't pass him the red sauce either.

You can twist all you want like, nobody is ever fooled by it or your motivations.

Yea everthing is fine.. keep your head in the sand

Mourinho also bristled when he was asked whether Sanchez was the type of player who needed clear instruction before every game to get the best out of him.

"What? I think you are all, or many of you, are in a new sport! In England, some guys say the wingers shouldn't defend," added Mourinho.

"The next time I see David Beckham I'm going to ask him: 'David, when you were playing right wing at Manchester United, when the opposition left-back attacked, do you stay looking at the stands? Or do you come back with the guy?' I'm going to ask David that.


I presume you still think pogba was sick at the weekend??

Mitch Connor

Until the mindset of the team changes, I don't know that any of our players in attack are going to perform.

There is no speed to the play, there is no real attempt to play out from the back and create anything. Movement is poor, and within contained zones.

We look to hit the forwards to early with long balls that isolate them against the defenders, we are slow to reposition to offer out balls. The movement is frankly shocking.

We play defensive without actually being any good defensively - DDG bailing us out again and again.

Absolutely painful to watch - and I really don't think it is just down to the players not being good enough (although a number aren't up to standard, imo). Liverpool ripped Porto apart - player for player they are not hugely better than us, but they are far better as a team in attack. Chelsea restricted Barcelona to less shots and less clear cut chances than we did vs Seville.

While I 100% agree that United need to improve our players in various positions (Right Back, Left Back, Centre Back) - I think a huge amount has to be put on Jose poorly coaching the team and not setting us up to get the best out of the side that we have. When Martial, Rashford, Lukaku, Sanchez, Pogba are all playing poorly it can't JUST be down to the players. You have to consider the entire set up of the side.

yourdeadwright

The season where Sanchez looked like a super star was as a 9  for Arsenal not left not right but in the middle,
People talk about United not being fluid, Play Alexis down the middle with Martial one side and Mata/Rashford the other,
Lakaku again missed an sitter last night, he doesn't do it in the big games, still hasn't scored against the top 8 in the Prem this year,
But Jose will not drop Lakaku as he is already being questioned about Pogba and no way will he drop his under massive singing ,

Will I Am Not

Rashford coming on looked an obvious tactical change to me. Sat a little deeper, settling for the 0-0 but giving us a better chance to hit one over the top. Likewise Martial for Mata.

Will I Am Not

yourdeadwright wrote: »

The season where Sanchez looked like a super star was as a 9  for Arsenal not left not right but in the middle,
People talk about United not being fluid, Play Alexis down the middle with Martial one side and Mata/Rashford the other,
Lakaku again missed an sitter last night, he doesn't do it in the big games, still hasn't scored against the top 8 in the Prem this year,
But Jose will not drop Lakaku as he is already being questioned about Pogba and no way will he drop his under massive singing ,

You’re calling that volley a sitter?

bangkok

Will I Am Not wrote: »

You’re calling that volley a sitter?

On his good foot he def should have hit the target

StringerBell

bangkok wrote: »

Yea everthing is fine.. keep your head in the sand

Mourinho also bristled when he was asked whether Sanchez was the type of player who needed clear instruction before every game to get the best out of him.

"What? I think you are all, or many of you, are in a new sport! In England, some guys say the wingers shouldn't defend," added Mourinho.

"The next time I see David Beckham I'm going to ask him: 'David, when you were playing right wing at Manchester United, when the opposition left-back attacked, do you stay looking at the stands? Or do you come back with the guy?' I'm going to ask David that.


I presume you still think pogba was sick at the weekend??

Whether everything is fine or not doesn't make a blind bit of difference in the latest piece of trash you have posted.

You are attempting to make something out of nothing, a rejection of a question, a rejection of a notion that wingers don't have tactical instruction. I am not going to be sidetracked down any rabbit hole with you.

You post was bull**** and transparent.

Adamocovic

bangkok wrote: »

Yea everthing is fine.. keep your head in the sand.

Slightly off topic but I do despise that phrase. Normally thrown out at opposing arguments to something that is completely subjective and not factually proven. Only positive is it reminds me of the old PES days on the playstation.



We can go back and forth all day debating whether José has fallen out with a player, or whether something was meant as a veiled insult but truth is there is not a definitive right answer until someone from the team comes out and says otherwise.

Pogba/José relationship in particular is something the papers have been pushing that may well be true but until we get some sort of response from either a person at the club or one of the two in question it's just speculation. And so open to interpretation. Think it's funny to accuse someone has "having their head in the sand" if they don't believe there is any truth to the rumours. Also bit much accusing someone of being a conspiracy theorist for thinking they are true.

Also I don't think people are claiming everything is hunky dory at the moment, but that doesn't mean they have to agree with the speculation regarding the player/manager relationships.

Anyway would do us a world of good if we put in a good performance against Chelsea. Have a feeling however it will be another slow tactical style for us. Would love to see us play with some pace and attacking flair but expectations are quite low for that. With Liverpool so soon after this game it's a big one. Do well during next 3 games and we could create a cushion for 2nd, lose both against Chelsea and Pool and we could see ourselves down to even 5th place (Spurs have an easier run).

deaddonkey15

yourdeadwright wrote: »

The season where Sanchez looked like a super star was as a 9  for Arsenal not left not right but in the middle,
People talk about United not being fluid, Play Alexis down the middle with Martial one side and Mata/Rashford the other,
Lakaku again missed an sitter last night, he doesn't do it in the big games, still hasn't scored against the top 8 in the Prem this year,
But Jose will not drop Lakaku as he is already being questioned about Pogba and no way will he drop his under massive singing ,

Lukaku is pretty much guaranteed to play when fit. Probably the only other player in the squad with that privilege is de Gea. The difference is, de Gea has earned it and continues to justify it by putting in world class performances and single handedly keeping us from losing games. Lukaku simply does not do the same thing at the other end.

DM_7

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Until the mindset of the team changes, I don't know that any of our players in attack are going to perform.

There is no speed to the play, there is no real attempt to play out from the back and create anything. Movement is poor, and within contained zones.

We look to hit the forwards to early with long balls that isolate them against the defenders, we are slow to reposition to offer out balls. The movement is frankly shocking.

We play defensive without actually being any good defensively - DDG bailing us out again and again.

Absolutely painful to watch - and I really don't think it is just down to the players not being good enough (although a number aren't up to standard, imo). Liverpool ripped Porto apart - player for player they are not hugely better than us, but they are far better as a team in attack. Chelsea restricted Barcelona to less shots and less clear cut chances than we did vs Seville.

While I 100% agree that United need to improve our players in various positions (Right Back, Left Back, Centre Back) - I think a huge amount has to be put on Jose poorly coaching the team and not setting us up to get the best out of the side that we have. When Martial, Rashford, Lukaku, Sanchez, Pogba are all playing poorly it can't JUST be down to the players. You have to consider the entire set up of the side.

Valid concerns and questions to ask.

For me I ask, at what point does the measurement of success change to patterns of play from results, is it Feb 18?

While City are miles ahead, we have no real way to see if other teams are much better while United are second and De Gea has 19 clean sheets (Romero also has some).

We heard Jose say the next phase of development is getting his team playing better in attack. That he is not looking to change the players but move on with them.

But does he need to make big strides in Feb 18, have to be this seasons or with 3 months to go is it time to dial back and go for results?

Just trying to find a middle ground here, try to undertstand why Jose would 'dial back' at this stage. Do we ignore what he is saying for yhe future, that as a manager is factoring a huge amount into current decisions and future ones.

After the last two managers I can see why we want to see immediate improvements and that extends to style. Is Jose worth giving the time? (I certainly think he is)

bangkok

What did people make of when tony o donoghue asked jose has paul a chance to make team for return leg and he said "who?" and walked off??

Mitch Connor

DM_7 wrote: »

Valid concerns and questions to ask.

For me I ask, at what point does the measurement of success change to patterns of play from results, is it Feb 18?

While City are miles ahead, we have no real way to see if other teams are much better while United are second and De Gea has 19 clean sheets (Romero also has some).

We heard Jose say the next phase of development is getting his team playing better in attack. That he is not looking to change the players but move on with them.

But does he need to make big strides in Feb 18, have to be this seasons or with 3 months to go is it time to dial back and go for results?

Just trying to find a middle ground here, try to undertstand why Jose would 'dial back' at this stage. Do we ignore what he is saying for yhe future, that as a manager is factoring a huge amount into current decisions and future ones.

After the last two managers I can see why we want to see immediate improvements and that extends to style. Is Jose worth giving the time? (I certainly think he is)

Actions speak louder than words.

We have seen nothing, at all, to suggest Mourinho is working to improve the attacking structure or change the style of the team to get the best out of the players. All we see is Jose's formation and a bunch of players thrown at it.

Maybe he does have grand plans and designs, but until I actually see changes and improvements, I can't say I am optimistic.

DM_7

Will I Am Not wrote: »

Rashford coming on looked an obvious tactical change to me. Sat a little deeper, settling for the 0-0 but giving us a better chance to hit one over the top. Likewise Martial for Mata.

Jose said the plan was to bring on Rashford, Martial and Lingard late on when he thought more chances would be likely, game more open. Lingard could not happen with the early sub.

DM_7

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Actions speak louder than words.

We have seen nothing, at all, to suggest Mourinho is working to improve the attacking structure or change the style of the team to get the best out of the players. All we see is Jose's formation and a bunch of players thrown at it.

Maybe he does have grand plans and designs, but until I actually see changes and improvements, I can't say I am optimistic.

While I expect he is true to his words on where he wants the team to be, I can't argue with your own thoughts.

MojoRisinnnn

bangkok wrote: »

What did people make of when tony o donoghue asked jose has paul a chance to make team for return leg and he said "who?" and walked off??

Just pointless and he looked like a moron, he knew full well what he was asking. Poor Tony yet again getting snapped at by a tactically inept manager.

Your Airbag

The dust has settled form last night and yes we got a result but nobody can deny there are problems at the club and I can't see anyone defending that display. It was one of our biggest games of the season and Joses plan was to conceded all territory and possession to the opposition.

Sevilla could have wrapped up the tie if there finishing wasn't so sh*t, this wasn't a Jose master plan that worked, Sevilla just weren't good enough to find the net even with our poor defending. I watched all UCL football this month and can honestly say our games last night was the most boring 90 mins of football I have seen in years, the trouble is we have had many games like that this season.

We offered zero threat in attack, our midfield three can't string simple passes together, Matic's form is terrible, Pogba did nothing, absolutely nothing last night.

City and liverpool have hammered their opposition, Chelsea and Spurs draw to two of the best teams in football and we get one shot on target against Sevilla, ONE! Hundreds of millions spent to assemble footballs most expensive team and the manager doesn't have the balls to let them attack.

The worst thing about it is Jose will feel justified that this was the right way to go and if we make it through we will see this tactic again. A Barca team would humiliate us if we come up against them.

The only reason we are still in the tie is DDG, not because of Jose's great tactics.

bangkok

MojoRisinnnn wrote: »

Just pointless and he looked like a moron, he knew full well what he was asking. Poor Tony yet again getting snapped at by a tactically inept manager.

Asking would his world record signing be back in the team for the return leg? Yea what an awful question to ask

yourdeadwright

Will I Am Not wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote: »

The season where Sanchez looked like a super star was as a 9  for Arsenal not left not right but in the middle,
People talk about United not being fluid, Play Alexis down the middle with Martial one side and Mata/Rashford the other,
Lakaku again missed an sitter last night, he doesn't do it in the big games, still hasn't scored against the top 8 in the Prem this year,
But Jose will not drop Lakaku as he is already being questioned about Pogba and no way will he drop his under massive singing ,

You’re calling that volley a sitter?

Sorry I didn't realise it was in the rules that he had to volley it,
You know it was his choice to volley it control a shoot like a top class forward he is suppose to be

yourdeadwright

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote: »

The season where Sanchez looked like a super star was as a 9  for Arsenal not left not right but in the middle,
People talk about United not being fluid, Play Alexis down the middle with Martial one side and Mata/Rashford the other,
Lakaku again missed an sitter last night, he doesn't do it in the big games, still hasn't scored against the top 8 in the Prem this year,
But Jose will not drop Lakaku as he is already being questioned about Pogba and no way will he drop his under massive singing ,

Lukaku is pretty much guaranteed to play when fit. Probably the only other player in the squad with that privilege is de Gea. The difference is, de Gea has earned it and continues to justify it by putting in world class performances and single handedly keeping us from losing games. Lukaku simply does not do the same thing at the other end.

I agree, fans seem to give him a pass for no reason, NUmber ( who cost close to 100 million should be able to make there own goals, Lakaku need to be giving 3 chance on a plate before he gets one,
Iv said since day one, he will score against crap teams due to numerous chances created for him and fail in big games, He will be gone by the end of next season ,

MojoRisinnnn

bangkok wrote: »

Asking would his world record signing be back in the team for the return leg? Yea what an awful question to ask

I was referring to Jose

Will I Am Not

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Sorry I didn't realise it was in the rules that he had to volley it,
You know it was his choice to volley it control a shoot like a top class forward he is suppose to be

If he controlled it he would have had to beat the defender to get the shot off.
It wasn’t a sitter by any metric.
A good chance yes.

Your Airbag

DM_7 wrote: »

Valid concerns and questions to ask.

For me I ask, at what point does the measurement of success change to patterns of play from results, is it Feb 18?

While City are miles ahead, we have no real way to see if other teams are much better while United are second and De Gea has 19 clean sheets (Romero also has some).

We heard Jose say the next phase of development is getting his team playing better in attack. That he is not looking to change the players but move on with them.

But does he need to make big strides in Feb 18, have to be this seasons or with 3 months to go is it time to dial back and go for results?

Just trying to find a middle ground here, try to undertstand why Jose would 'dial back' at this stage. Do we ignore what he is saying for yhe future, that as a manager is factoring a huge amount into current decisions and future ones.

After the last two managers I can see why we want to see immediate improvements and that extends to style. Is Jose worth giving the time? (I certainly think he is)

Spurs have beaten Madrid 3-1 at home, drawn 1-1 away to them and come from 2 goals down away to Juve to get a draw and they have done it playing some lovely attacking football.

Ask yourself can you see UTD getting those results in our current form with this style of play? I doubt anyone would think so


I think the fact we are 2nd in the league is being read into too much by people, its used as some justification that we are better than those below us. Our early season for is the only reason we are in 2nd, since the City game we have been wildly inconsistent. We are only 4 points ahead of 5th place Spurs and all below us are currently playing better, maybe except Chelsea. Spurs are playing well overall, Liver pool are attacking very well and none of t hem put on the kind of sleep inducing displays that we do.

Finishing top 4 is under serious threat unless Jose sorts this out.