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Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2018
Comments
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Ye he would have because his touch is awful .Will I Am Not wrote: »yourdeadwright wrote: »Sorry I didn't realise it was in the rules that he had to volley it,
You know it was his choice to volley it control a shoot like a top class forward he is suppose to be
If he controlled it he would have had to beat the defender to get the shot off.
It wasn’t a sitter by any metric.
A good chance yes.
If that was Kane ,Aguero even Salah you'd say they missed a sitter ,0 -
Will he park the bus Sunday ? If he does and its a lose the media will slaughter himYour Airbag wrote: »Valid concerns and questions to ask.
For me I ask, at what point does the measurement of success change to patterns of play from results, is it Feb 18?
While City are miles ahead, we have no real way to see if other teams are much better while United are second and De Gea has 19 clean sheets (Romero also has some).
We heard Jose say the next phase of development is getting his team playing better in attack. That he is not looking to change the players but move on with them.
But does he need to make big strides in Feb 18, have to be this seasons or with 3 months to go is it time to dial back and go for results?
Just trying to find a middle ground here, try to undertstand why Jose would 'dial back' at this stage. Do we ignore what he is saying for yhe future, that as a manager is factoring a huge amount into current decisions and future ones.
After the last two managers I can see why we want to see immediate improvements and that extends to style. Is Jose worth giving the time? (I certainly think he is)
Spurs have beaten Madrid 3-1 at home, drawn 1-1 away to them and come from 2 goals down away to Juve to get a draw and they have done it playing some lovely attacking football.
Ask yourself can you see UTD getting those results in our current form with this style of play? I doubt anyone would think so
I think the fact we are 2nd in the league is being read into too much by people, its used as some justification that we are better than those below us. Our early season for is the only reason we are in 2nd, since the City game we have been wildly inconsistent. We are only 4 points ahead of 5th place Spurs and all below us are currently playing better, maybe except Chelsea. Spurs are playing well overall, Liver pool are attacking very well and none of t hem put on the kind of sleep inducing displays that we do.
Finishing top 4 is under serious threat unless Jose sorts this out.0 -
Such a fallacy going around from United fans that this is what you get with Mourinho. He's by far at his career most conservative at United and has changed his mentality for the worst.
As i said in match thread his Porto side were free scoring and scored in all away matches en route to the Champions league.
His Chelsea side that won in 2005/06 were joint top scorers
His Inter side were top goal scorers for both title seasons and scored in all bar away one knockout game in thier champions league win.
His Madrid team were top scorers in his first two seasons there and actually still holds the record for most goals ever in a la liga season.
Since then there's been a steady decline in his approach and a more fearful approach to away games vs top sides for whatever reason. But what you seen last night is not what made him the best. His side's were always the most organised but offered lots in the other direction too.0 -
Adamocovic wrote: »Slightly off topic but I do despise that phrase. Normally thrown out at opposing arguments to something that is completely subjective and not factually proven. Only positive is it reminds me of the old PES days on the playstation.
Fcuk me. I know PES has issues with licensing but having to use ostriches for Portugal is news to me :pac:0 -
I could be way off the mark here but i get the feeling Jose doesn't have full faith in a lot of the squad he is using so when he does need to use them he trys to play it safe in a hope things wont go to ****.
Id imagine if and when he gets the chance there are a lot more players he would get rid of.
Im happy to see him at the club and we have improved as a team but it does bother me to see the them playing such negative horrible football in the big games and often in the lesser games when we should be hammering the other team.
Thats not how this current united team with the top players it does have should be playing. I hate comparing us to rivals but Jesus if Liverpool can go out and blow ordinary teams away in the Champions league wtf is stopping us!!0 -
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yourdeadwright wrote: »Ye he would have because his touch is awful .
If that was Kane ,Aguero even Salah you'd say they missed a sitter ,
Would I? Are you in my head now?
A sitter to me is a chance you score 9 times out of 10. An open goal. A one on one like Martial had v Newcastle.
I don’t think any of those players you mentioned take a touch and shoot before the defender has time to recover, he was right beside him.0 -
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Wouldn't be like Jose to blame his medical staff for a poor performance ................. Oh wait0 -
Can’t wait for Liverpool to drop more points against a bottom half team. Those rocks are just waiting to be crawled back under.0
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Such a fallacy going around from United fans that this is what you get with Mourinho. He's by far at his career most conservative at United and has changed his mentality for the worst.
As i said in match thread his Porto side were free scoring and scored in all away matches en route to the Champions league.
His Chelsea side that won in 2005/06 were joint top scorers
His Inter side were top goal scorers for both title seasons and scored in all bar away one knockout game in thier champions league win.
His Madrid team were top scorers in his first two seasons there and actually still holds the record for most goals ever in a la liga season.
Since then there's been a steady decline in his approach and a more fearful approach to away games vs top sides for whatever reason. But what you seen last night is not what made him the best. His side's were always the most organised but offered lots in the other direction too.
What good is his past form to us is this is his new, as you say, fearful approach. We can only judge him on what he produces for UTD and right now its very low quality negative football.
There was plenty of acknowledgement from people of his past achievements as recent as last night in the chat, from me for one, but we have present day Jose managing us.0 -
Your Airbag wrote: »Sevilla could have wrapped up the tie if there finishing wasn't so sh*t, this wasn't a Jose master plan that worked, Sevilla just weren't good enough to find the net even with our poor defending.
To be honest apart from the first few games of the season when Utd had a great run, that's how I've felt all season (and last season) against nearly every team they've faced. Their defence is only statistically good (when it was touted as such), not because Utd's defence is particularly good, but because the other teams couldn't put their chances away. DDG being the exception.
Utd's attacking play is horrible for the players they have. It's spineless, lacks footballing intelligence, individuality and creativity. It's better than the LVG era sure, but not by much.0 -
Will I Am Not wrote: »Can’t wait for Liverpool to drop more points against a bottom half team. Those rocks are just waiting to be crawled back under.
I'd be worried about ourselves. Looking at the next fixtures we could be in a spot of bother.
Man United: Chelsea (H), Palace (A), Liverpool (H)
Liverpool: West Ham (H), Newcastle (H), Man United (A)
Chelsea: Man United (A), City (A), Palace (H)
Spurs: Palace (A), Huddersfield (H), Bournemouth (A)
Currently only 4 points between us (2nd) and Spurs (5th). How we do out of the next 9 available points I think will be huge.
Both Chelsea and Pool have looked better than us recently, couple that with our poor record of late versus the top 6 you would have to worry about the possibility of us dropping potentially as far as 5th place.
I'm not a doom and gloom sort of person but have to be wary of that. If we slip out of the top 4 tensions and media scrutiny will increase. These next three games are absolutely crucial for how well our season will go. José can either give the media more fuel or go and silence them.0 -
Good be 3rd on before kick off Sunday and be beat by Chelsea isn't impossible,Adamocovic wrote: »Will I Am Not wrote: »Can’t wait for Liverpool to drop more points against a bottom half team. Those rocks are just waiting to be crawled back under.
I'd be worried about ourselves. Looking at the next fixtures we could be in a spot of bother.
Man United: Chelsea (H), Palace (A), Liverpool (H)
Liverpool: West Ham (H), Newcastle (H), Man United (A)
Chelsea: Man United (A), City (A), Palace (H)
Spurs: Palace (A), Huddersfield (H), Bournemouth (A)
Currently only 4 points between us (2nd) and Spurs (5th). How we do out of the next 9 available points I think will be huge.
Both Chelsea and Pool have looked better than us recently, couple that with our poor record of late versus the top 6 you would have to worry about the possibility of us dropping potentially as far as 5th place.
I'm not a doom and gloom sort of person but have to be wary of that. If we slip out of the top 4 tensions and media scrutiny will increase. These next three games are absolutely crucial for how well our season will go. José can either give the media more fuel or go and silence them.
Be interesting to see what Jose tactics would be if we go into the Liverpool game behind them in the table and all of a sudden a draw at old Trafford suits them
As they will love being attacked away from home it suits there style,0 -
Your Airbag wrote: »What good is his past form to us is this is his new, as you say, fearful approach. We can only judge him on what he produces for UTD and right now its very low quality negative football.
There was plenty of acknowledgement from people of his past achievements as recent as last night in the chat, from me for one, but we have present day Jose managing us.
Yeah but that's my point, people were trying to validate his performances saying that's what brought him success in the past, but thats so far from the truth, he was never consistently negative in away matches before. This is new Jose and I can't make much sense of it. The Liverpool away game was the best example, they were struggling badly at the time defensively, weekly cock ups of lol proportions, then United went there a simply did not want to know, it was ridiculously counter productive and very un Jose like.0 -
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Pretty accurate summary to be fairJames Ducker: “United may well get through to CL QF but they feel like a team going backwards not forwards at the moment. There’s just not a great deal to like. It’s joyless football. It’s not ultra defensive, it’s just a strange sort of inertia, a nothingness. Just all very underwhelming”0
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And he's not wrong. . Eaten bread is soon forgotten and peoples fickle patience is clearly evident in this forum. I think any manager that plays a defensive formation is, for numerous reasons, not confident that an attacking formation will be the most beneficial for the squad they have at that particular time.
Fergie reverted to defencive tactics when he felt United were vulnerable or if he felt it was the best chance of succeeding in a game. If he felt his team was strong enough he would play the swashbuckling football people remember. 3 years of Moyes and mostly LVG tearing apart a league winning squad, shattered confidence and poor club decisions have set the club back years. Jose's job is to try and get things back moving but he has to keep the club up challenging and getting some success while doing it. Its not like Spurs or Arsenal or Liverpool where a manager can finish outside the top 4 and know they will keep their job.
Pep took over a Barca team on the rise, the greatest of its generation, a Bayern team that owns German league and a city team that recently won the league ,spends more money then united and has a squad/club that's used to regular manager changes.
Jose took over a squad completely disjointed, underperforming and full of players who just were not good enough. This included quite a youngish squad lacking in experience and success (certainly in comparison to City). He has tried to bring in quality players all through the spine of the team and has on paper made united look more likely to be a top 4 contender then they did 2 seasons ago. He has also brought them furthest in the champions league in 4 years and won the only cup United never had. Despite how poorly many are complaining about the football the team is 2nd in the league.
The football is poor, but instead of the generic (well its obviously the managers fault), perhaps fans should try and remember what it was like in 2006 when SAF was trying to rebuild back up the team to its former glories. United were playing poorly and got knocked out of the champions league in a poor Group, by Benfica. Fans were calling for his head and he asked for patience. But still, some fans whinged and moaned that SAF was past it (9 years older at that time then Jose is now) after 3 years of United underperforming. I would love to see a DVD of uniteds swashbuckling football under SAF in 2006 season.
I see no difference here. Fans not even giving one of the most decorated managers of his generation, more then a year and a half to get things settled. It takes time to build a legacy and success, but the fickle fans who think they are on some sort of righteous cause to get Jose out, only serve to make his job harder, putting more pressure on the players and thus making it more likely it wont work out. There is a regular use of hyperbolic statements and nice soundbite narratives that don't really have any substance, but they are popular rag paper language that seems to rally the most vocal.0 -
Your Airbag wrote: »Pretty accurate summary to be fair
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/europe/4494936.stm
Instead they delivered another miserable Champions League show that betrayed their proud European heritage.0 -
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Your Airbag wrote: »Pretty accurate summary to be fair
Sadly is at the moment.
I know people will continue to argue we need to add more "United Standard" players, but until how we play changes it won't make much difference to me.
It's slow play, unadventurous play. I like Lukaku and do agree he isn't getting a lot of chances created for him. On paper, Sanchez, Mata, Pogba, Lingard, Martial and Lingard should all be creating goal chances. They are creative players who are being asked to play deeper defensive roles. How deep were the team yesterday? most of the play was coming from the half way line.
That to me has nothing to do with the quality of our defending. We look completely stumped on attack at the moment. And I do suspect our inability to dictate the attacking game, and hence losing out on possession is only putting our defence under more pressure and hence leads to people thinking it's the source of our problems, but if we improve our play on the ball and in attack I see the defence getting back to the more solid state it was in.
The tactics you would think need to change. I know José probably doesn't want to risk it, maybe he fears we will be exposed more, or maybe he's stubborn to what he thinks will work and is content with just getting by, but personally think it's a bigger risk to not make any changes.
Yesterday for example we spent most of our time in possession playing nothing passes around the midfield, with the occasional long ball launch by Lindelof or DeGea to an isolated Lukaku. The defence and CMs get the most of the criticism but to me the attacking players should be able to unlock defences and create chances. I look at players Matic and Carrick for example as players to offer security in the middle of the field as a bridge between defence and attack, not as an attacking playmakers (others may disagree).
Sadly with our current tactics we are wasting the quality and creativity of our front players. Maybe the players themselves need to improve but it seems like they are following a structure. The players are dropping deep, leaving a huge gap between them and Lukaku and coming short for passes to play them back again. It's not great to watch.
I'm struggling to remember the most recent game where we looked great and played lovely football. How we started the season is a complete contrast to how we are playing right now.0 -
Adamocovic wrote: »I'd be worried about ourselves. Looking at the next fixtures we could be in a spot of bother.
Man United: Chelsea (H), Palace (A), Liverpool (H)
Liverpool: West Ham (H), Newcastle (H), Man United (A)
Chelsea: Man United (A), City (A), Palace (H)
Spurs: Palace (A), Huddersfield (H), Bournemouth (A)
Currently only 4 points between us (2nd) and Spurs (5th). How we do out of the next 9 available points I think will be huge.
Both Chelsea and Pool have looked better than us recently, couple that with our poor record of late versus the top 6 you would have to worry about the possibility of us dropping potentially as far as 5th place.
I'm not a doom and gloom sort of person but have to be wary of that. If we slip out of the top 4 tensions and media scrutiny will increase. These next three games are absolutely crucial for how well our season will go. José can either give the media more fuel or go and silence them.
Meh. They won’t be in here after dropping points against dross either way.0 -
Some people genuinely believe Mourinho is intentionally playing cautious football and somehow isn’t aware it’s not producing results?
Crazy0 -
yourdeadwright wrote: »Wouldn't be like Jose to blame his medical staff for a poor performance ................. Oh wait
Must be a continental thing. One of Peps favourites too"People say ‘go with the flow’ but do you know what goes with the flow? Dead fish."
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Rayne Wooney wrote: »Some people genuinely believe Mourinho is intentionally playing cautious football and somehow isn’t aware it’s not producing results?
Crazy
We haven’t parked the bus in months. We’re just not very good.0 -
https://www.theguardian.com/football/2006/jul/31/sport.comment
It is an increasingly inescapable conclusion that, unwittingly or otherwise, JOSE is winding down, a prizefighter who no longer has the stomach or the wit for an admittedly enormous challenge which, once upon a time, he would have fervently inhaled.
Indeed, it must irk him beyond belief that United are making exactly the same mistakes that Liverpool did: lack of pheromones in the transfer market; laughable, fall-back signings at suspicious and ridiculous prices; deluded ramblings ("we are as good as CITY, no question") - and, worst of all, a dressing-room where playing the field seems as important as playing the game.
Jose , is partly suffering because of the impossibly high standards he set, and he carries the fatigued incomprehension of a man who is out of time.
All I did was replace the comments on SAF with Jose and replace Chelsea with City. Amazing how history repeats itself, media and fans throw toys out of the pram at scent of trouble. I see similarities between "Sack SAF" and "Sack Jose" and I would bet that keeping both managers would be the most prudent choice. It worked with SAF, why wouldn't it work with the man who made SAF job most difficult as an opponent?
Jose is not finished, hes just taking longer then normal to stablise the club and there is pain to be had in the process. If that pain is not great football then so be it.0 -
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https://www.theguardian.com/football/2006/jul/31/sport.comment
It is an increasingly inescapable conclusion that, unwittingly or otherwise, JOSE is winding down, a prizefighter who no longer has the stomach or the wit for an admittedly enormous challenge which, once upon a time, he would have fervently inhaled.
Indeed, it must irk him beyond belief that United are making exactly the same mistakes that Liverpool did: lack of pheromones in the transfer market; laughable, fall-back signings at suspicious and ridiculous prices; deluded ramblings ("we are as good as CITY, no question") - and, worst of all, a dressing-room where playing the field seems as important as playing the game.
Jose , is partly suffering because of the impossibly high standards he set, and he carries the fatigued incomprehension of a man who is out of time.
All I did was replace the comments on SAF with Jose and replace Chelsea with City. Amazing how history repeats itself, media and fans throw toys out of the pram at scent of trouble. I see similarities between "Sack SAF" and "Sack Jose" and I would bet that keeping both managers would be the most prudent choice. It worked with SAF, why wouldn't it work with the man who made SAF job most difficult as an opponent?
Jose is not finished, hes just taking longer then normal to stablise the club and there is pain to be had in the process. If that pain is not great football then so be it.
Time will tell.0 -
All I did was replace the comments on SAF with Jose and replace Chelsea with City. Amazing how history repeats itself, media and fans throw toys out of the pram at scent of trouble. I see similarities between "Sack SAF" and "Sack Jose" and I would bet that keeping both managers would be the most prudent choice. It worked with SAF, why wouldn't it work with the man who made SAF job most difficult as an opponent?
Jose is not finished, hes just taking longer then normal to stablise the club and there is pain to be had in the process. If that pain is not great football then so be it.
I don't think too many are actually calling for José to be sacked, but just would like to see him attempt a different approach.
Obviously he's more knowledgeable in the game than us and knows what he wants to do but a lot of fans would like to see how a more fast paced attacking style may do, a negative of it being we might get exposed at the back.
Personally I don't want José to be sacked, but it does frustrate me that we have so many players with either great pace or creativity who are being completely stifled by opposition defence.
I'm all for progress and patience, but it's hard not to look at the players we have at our disposable and feel we should be getting more out of them. In terms of results we are definitely seeing improvements, but personally don't see the improvement in our play being proportionate to the quality players that we have brought in.
People can complain that I'm not being realistic, and throw out the old adage that results are everything, but there's only so many games like the one we watched yesterday that you can watch before questioning whether we should be looking at changing our style of play.0 -
Adamocovic wrote: »I don't think too many are actually calling for José to be sacked, but just would like to see him attempt a different approach.
Not being snarky here, but this has happened multiple times this season. We've changed playstyles a multitude of times, and each time we do, the same problems persist through the changes.
We played 4-3-3 last night with Pogba in the position everyone said he'd thrive in....and yet, its also widely accepted as our worst offensive display of the season. So now we're back to "Lets change it up again"?
The issue, I feel, is every time Jose answers those critics, and adjusts somewhat to what people want, it's on to the next "Oh, maybe he should try 2-3-4-1" or whatever.
There's legit complaints, don't get me wrong. But continually shifting formations, mindsets, approaches....it's not going to change a whole lot right now imo.0 -
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/europe/4494936.stm
Instead they delivered another miserable Champions League show that betrayed their proud European heritage.https://www.theguardian.com/football/2006/jul/31/sport.comment
It is an increasingly inescapable conclusion that, unwittingly or otherwise, JOSE is winding down, a prizefighter who no longer has the stomach or the wit for an admittedly enormous challenge which, once upon a time, he would have fervently inhaled.
Indeed, it must irk him beyond belief that United are making exactly the same mistakes that Liverpool did: lack of pheromones in the transfer market; laughable, fall-back signings at suspicious and ridiculous prices; deluded ramblings ("we are as good as CITY, no question") - and, worst of all, a dressing-room where playing the field seems as important as playing the game.
Jose , is partly suffering because of the impossibly high standards he set, and he carries the fatigued incomprehension of a man who is out of time.
All I did was replace the comments on SAF with Jose and replace Chelsea with City. Amazing how history repeats itself, media and fans throw toys out of the pram at scent of trouble. I see similarities between "Sack SAF" and "Sack Jose" and I would bet that keeping both managers would be the most prudent choice. It worked with SAF, why wouldn't it work with the man who made SAF job most difficult as an opponent?
Jose is not finished, hes just taking longer then normal to stablise the club and there is pain to be had in the process. If that pain is not great football then so be it.
I'm sure you think your making some valid point here but the fact is the football under Jose has been terrible for a long time now. It doesn't look like getting sorted anytime soon, his passive aggressive nature in interviews and dealing with players look only like he will alienate members of the squad.
Jose is getting valid criticism after months of dour football and one of the most limp UCL performances in recent memory. He has no right to be exempt from criticism. I have never called for Jose to be sacked and I didn't see anyone else do that last night, there was plenty of justified reaction to the lifeless display we saw.
The fact you have linked to two articles criticising Fergie is strange. I'm sure you think your making a point but what your showing is managers get criticism. Is that really shocking to you? Moyes and LVG got tonnes of it and yes as you have show with link, Fergie got it too.
Jose is not some golden child exempt from criticism. It's valid and well deserved whats been levelled at him today in the media and on this and other boards today.0 -
Is the touch site playing up for anyone else?0
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Not being snarky here, but this has happened multiple times this season. We've changed playstyles a multitude of times, and each time we do, the same problems persist through the changes.
We played 4-3-3 last night with Pogba in the position everyone said he'd thrive in....and yet, its also widely accepted as our worst offensive display of the season. So now we're back to "Lets change it up again"?
The issue, I feel, is every time Jose answers those critics, and adjusts somewhat to what people want, it's on to the next "Oh, maybe he should try 2-3-4-1" or whatever.
There's legit complaints, don't get me wrong. But continually shifting formations, mindsets, approaches....it's not going to change a whole lot right now imo.
I'm sorry but this is excuse making. Jose is shifting formation not because he is listening to fans aor anything like that, he's way to bullheaded for that but because he hasn't figured out his best formation, and whilst we have switched formations our style of negative football hasn't greatly improved with those formation switches.
If Jose can't find his best XI and get them playing well the he should have bought bettering fitting players to a system he had in mind, he has spent hundreds of millions to put on a display like we saw last night and is benching one of our best talents because he hasn't been playing well lately because he the manager has been playing Pogba in a position he is clearly not suited too.
This is all on Jose, ridiculous to suggest otherwise.0 -
Not being snarky here, but this has happened multiple times this season. We've changed playstyles a multitude of times, and each time we do, the same problems persist through the changes.
We played 4-3-3 last night with Pogba in the position everyone said he'd thrive in....and yet, its also widely accepted as our worst offensive display of the season. So now we're back to "Lets change it up again"?
The issue, I feel, is every time Jose answers those critics, and adjusts somewhat to what people want, it's on to the next "Oh, maybe he should try 2-3-4-1" or whatever.
There's legit complaints, don't get me wrong. But continually shifting formations, mindsets, approaches....it's not going to change a whole lot right now imo.
In your examples though I think it's only the formation that is changing. The mindset and approach to the games, especially the bigger ones, is very much the same.0 -
Not being snarky here, but this has happened multiple times this season. We've changed playstyles a multitude of times, and each time we do, the same problems persist through the changes.
We played 4-3-3 last night with Pogba in the position everyone said he'd thrive in....and yet, its also widely accepted as our worst offensive display of the season. So now we're back to "Lets change it up again"?
The issue, I feel, is every time Jose answers those critics, and adjusts somewhat to what people want, it's on to the next "Oh, maybe he should try 2-3-4-1" or whatever.
There's legit complaints, don't get me wrong. But continually shifting formations, mindsets, approaches....it's not going to change a whole lot right now imo.
I'm aware talk of changing positions and formations has been discussed but I am referring to our playing style, the way we got about our game when in possession.
You can disagree and may be including that in your original post but for the majority of this season no matter the personnel or formation we play I have viewed the way we go about attacking to have followed a pretty common trend.
Like I said before, players dropping deep to collect the ball, pass and go, Lukaku becoming isolated in doing so, and a slow, some would call patient, build up of knocking the ball around the centre of the pitch.
You can change the formations and players as much as possible but I'm under the impression that until the intent on the ball changes it won't have a huge impact on the quality of football. Can affect the result but style is the key.
I'm aware people disagree with me here, but I'm not going to think we should continue with what we're doing and hope it works, as to avoid rocking the boat with changes. Some people will be content to sit back and say we will just bring in better players during the summer. Personally think we should be expecting to see better attacking football with the quality of the players we have out there.
Obviously if we finish top 4 this season it will be seen as another step closer to being back at the top, with focus on improving again next season. I get this, and maybe I lack patience, but it just frustrates me that for all the creative attacking players we have we are resulting to long balls and slow build-up.0 -
About frickin time the club has created a Youtube Channel. They are just after posting a bucket load of content. Looks great tbh. Hopefully they do things like tunnel cam and some fun videos involving the players like they do over on the Arsenal and City channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC6yW44UGJJBvYTlfC7CRg2Q/featured?disable_polymer=10 -
wanderer100 wrote: »About frickin time the club has created a Youtube Channel. They are just after posting a bucket load of content. Looks great tbh. Hopefully they do things like tunnel cam and some fun videos involving the players like they do over on the Arsenal and City channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC6yW44UGJJBvYTlfC7CRg2Q/featured?disable_polymer=1
Hadn't even noticed we were missing one!
For a club so in touch with social media how has it taken this long haha!
EDIT: Lord they've already uploaded like 95 videos!0 -
Your Airbag wrote: »Pretty accurate summary to be fair
I wonder is Jose doing a Trapattoni; knows his side is weak and limited and is trying to grind out results until he has built a side capable of playing nice stuff. I don't think the current squad is capable of playing nicer stuff. There's no one (non-GK) you'd call a 'fine' footballer.0 -
IamtheWalrus wrote: »I wonder is Jose doing a Trapattoni; knows his side is weak and limited and is trying to grind out results until he has built a side capable of playing nice stuff. I don't think the current squad is capable of playing nicer stuff. There's no one (non-GK) you'd call a 'fine' footballer.
I don't mean any offence but I can't really tell if you are being serious with this post. Completely different situation for Trapattoni and Irish squad and has little relevance to our situation.
Attacking/Playmaker options: Alexis Sanchez, Paul Pogba, Juan Mata, Antony Martial, Romelu Lukaku, Jesse Lingard, Marcus Rashford, Zlatan Ibrahimovic
If there are no players in that above list that would be classified as a 'fine' footballer or capable of playing "nicer stuff" then I don't know what this sport is anymore.
There are many factors affecting our performances but the idea that José has been cursed with a squad that isn't capable of playing attacking/nicer football I don't buy for one second.0 -
IamtheWalrus wrote: »I wonder is Jose doing a Trapattoni; knows his side is weak and limited and is trying to grind out results until he has built a side capable of playing nice stuff. I don't think the current squad is capable of playing nicer stuff. There's no one (non-GK) you'd call a 'fine' footballer.
Weak? Not sure if you are serious. Our tactics are poor. Full backs dont overlap, defenders dont pass the ball out, midfield is by passed and we take stupid short corners. This is all on the manager0 -
Adamocovic wrote: »Obviously if we finish top 4 this season it will be seen as another step closer to being back at the top, with focus on improving again next season. I get this, and maybe I lack patience, but it just frustrates me that for all the creative attacking players we have we are resulting to long balls and slow build-up.
Listen, it's not that I'm thrilled with the football.
I'm accepting there's been progression this season, while also feeling that as the season has gone on, there's been problems developing. Or maybe, more accurately, the problems that have existed all season have grown a bit more obvious.
Our defensive line up is abysmal considering the investment elsewhere. When we're playing games with a backline of Val - Smalling - Jones - Young, 4 players who were all first teamers 4 managers ago, we're always going to be giving out about things. The defense are shakey as hell, and also can't bring a ball out to attack. Does anyone ever think Valencia, when he gets into space, is going to whip in a decent cross?
The midfield, likewise, is unbalanced; Herrera and Fellaini both being sick notes is incredibly frustrating, and I'll go back to what I said a few days ago. We need two midfielders, regardless of whoever is manager or whatever tactics we're playing. We've been relying entirely on Pogba and Matic this season, and when one has a bad game, or a bad run of form, we're in trouble.
I stick by Jose. I always said I'd stick by any manager who shows clear signs of progress, and there have been signs of progress when you compare this year to previous ones. Is it perfect yet? no. But on the spectrum, we're moving in the right direction.
If we're still stuck in 2-3rd next season, still playing poor football cause we've not properly enforced defense and midfield, I'd be getting worried. But considering the issues now are ones that have existed for a few weeks, and I don't believe they are all tactics related or manager issues, I've no intention of losing patience this year.
There are people calling for Jose's head. Many of whom were doing so the second he got in the door. Words like "disgraceful" or whatever are hyperbolic. We all want better football, but given there has been progression, even if its less than we want, I'm willing to see how the season goes overall, how the transfer window goes and then I'll "Pull my head from the sand", blah blah.0 -
In extreme isolation, I could take that performance last night. As a one-off, 'job done', European away result, I could stomach that result and performance.
It's when you pile it upon the rest of the performances we've seen lately, that's when it becomes frustrating and 'isolation' goes out the window. There's a negative pattern emerging in these last 2 months, and 'parking the bus' has nothing to do with it.
I fúcking wish we were parking the bus. At this stage, I'd take that, because it would be some semblance of a plan and cohesion. As it is now, I can't see a plan, I honestly can't describe what our style is or what it's supposed to be. I see a different 11 going out in each game and nothing really developing or clicking for this last few months. There was progress up until recently. Now it seems to have slowed or even regressed slightly.
If there is a plan or style to our play, it's not that of a counter-attacking nature. Maybe that's what it's supposed to be ideally, but we're failing there for the most part. For every successful counter-attack you see like Lukaku's second goal last weekend, we see dozens of failed counter-attacks where our players sprint forward with the ball only to pull-up when they get near the opposition's 18 yard box. Then we stall and allow the opponent to get back and set their lines as we struggle to break-through, eventually surrendering possession. Rinse and repeat.
Yes, as of now we're still second, still in the CL and FA Cup, but the last 2 months have been concerning...
In the last 5 games counting the Spurs defeat, we have 2 wins against Huddersfield to feel good about, plus 2 defeats and now last night's draw. The manner of those defeats was dejecting, and the manner of the wins not exactly inspiring.
Before the Spurs game, we had a run of 5 wins in January against some truly awful opposition - Derby, Yeovil, Stoke. The other two teams were decent, at best, Everton and Burnley. Nice run though, if we could have kept it going against a good team in Spurs.
Before that there was a poor Christmas run starting with the Bristol defeat in the EFL, followed by 3 league draws to Leicester, Burnley and Southampton.
That's the last 2 months of results, a very mixed bag. Before that Bristol defeat, sure we had unexpected losses to Basel and Huddersfield, but we were winning more often and with much more convincing performances. Draws were at a minimum too, with 2 in our first 26 games. Since then, we've had 4 in 13, twice the amount of draws in half the amount of games.
I need to see more cohesion and stability in the team going into this final third of the season. Unfortunately though, I'm seeing little to signify that those things are going to come. With no apparent plan, the players struggling to put a run of effective passes together being the norm, there has been a slump, stagnation, whatever you want to call it.
I have no interest in seeing the manager replaced and won't unless the current trend worsens to the end of the season. In that case, we will be surely out of all competitions and well out of the Top 4. In that case, I wouldn't even know where to start looking. I have faith in Jose, if he doesn't get us back to success I honestly don't know who could. I've never actually looked 'beyond' him and am not at the point now where I start.
However, I have to acknowledge that the honeymoon period is well over at this stage - We are almost 2 full seasons into Jose's reign. 4 transfer windows. Hundreds of millions spent. The manager has to be able to make these players perform better than they currently are, make them perform as a team. An excuse/reason of "The 'new' manager still needs £300m and 4/5 first team players to make it his own team", those days are gone for me. The current squad is capable of far more than it is currently producing.0 -
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Weak? Not sure if you are serious. Our tactics are poor. Full backs dont overlap, defenders dont pass the ball out, midfield is by passed and we take stupid short corners. This is all on the manager
This is what I'm postulating; maybe Jose doesn't trust them to be capable of said play. I don't know many Utd outfielders comfortable on the ball.0 -
IamtheWalrus wrote: »This is what I'm postulating; maybe Jose doesn't trust them to be capable of said play. I don't know many Utd outfielders comfortable on the ball.
Valencia, shaw, bailly, matic, pogba, Herrera, zlatan, sanchez, martial, rashford, lukaku, blind are all easily comfortable on the ball. Attack as a team, defend as a team we do neither. Im sick of watching us play, it has almost become a chore. Dreading the game sunday and especially the liverpool game that is coming up0 -
United at the moment is like being with the sexiest woman in the room then getting her home and all she wants is the missionary position with the lights off.0
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They are highly paid footballers at the top of their field.IamtheWalrus wrote: »This is what I'm postulating; maybe Jose doesn't trust them to be capable of said play. I don't know many Utd outfielders comfortable on the ball.
They may not all be Zidane (or all even Pogba) but they are not a bunch of sunday league players playing on a bog.
There are plenty of teams with 'lesser' players that show more ambition on the ball than United do - its a problem with the mentality and set up the side, imo.
The distance between the players is too much, the distance between the lines is too much, we play a poor direct football style. We don't look to get players in position to support each other short, so the players have to play long.0 -
Our football is just gone meh at the moment, Johnny Giles always said of players,"have courage on the ball". Our players don't seem to have that or we just see flashes of it. Our defenders simply aren't ball players,they can dive in front of a shot or throw in a last ditch tackle but ask them to pass and move and they fall to pieces. Ashley Young has reverted to simply lashing the ball as far down the field as he can.
We have the attacking talent that other teams can only dream of yet at times it's as if they are a separate entity to the rest of the team.0 -
Listen, it's not that I'm thrilled with the football.
I'm accepting there's been progression this season, while also feeling that as the season has gone on, there's been problems developing. Or maybe, more accurately, the problems that have existed all season have grown a bit more obvious.
Our defensive line up is abysmal considering the investment elsewhere. When we're playing games with a backline of Val - Smalling - Jones - Young, 4 players who were all first teamers 4 managers ago, we're always going to be giving out about things. The defense are shakey as hell, and also can't bring a ball out to attack. Does anyone ever think Valencia, when he gets into space, is going to whip in a decent cross?
The midfield, likewise, is unbalanced; Herrera and Fellaini both being sick notes is incredibly frustrating, and I'll go back to what I said a few days ago. We need two midfielders, regardless of whoever is manager or whatever tactics we're playing. We've been relying entirely on Pogba and Matic this season, and when one has a bad game, or a bad run of form, we're in trouble.
I stick by Jose. I always said I'd stick by any manager who shows clear signs of progress, and there have been signs of progress when you compare this year to previous ones. Is it perfect yet? no. But on the spectrum, we're moving in the right direction.
If we're still stuck in 2-3rd next season, still playing poor football cause we've not properly enforced defense and midfield, I'd be getting worried. But considering the issues now are ones that have existed for a few weeks, and I don't believe they are all tactics related or manager issues, I've no intention of losing patience this year.
There are people calling for Jose's head. Many of whom were doing so the second he got in the door. Words like "disgraceful" or whatever are hyperbolic. We all want better football, but given there has been progression, even if its less than we want, I'm willing to see how the season goes overall, how the transfer window goes and then I'll "Pull my head from the sand", blah blah.
I've already stated today how much I hate that saying, didn't use it towards you. I've already said I get that idea of your thinking, and have acknowledged the improvements and have highlighted a lot of my views may be down to my impatience.
Likewise I've stated how it's the attacking aspect of our game that frustrates me more than the defensive side. A lot of people are obsessed with the CB position, something José has already spent around €75million on in the form of Bailly and Lindelof, but personally I don't see the individual ability of our defensive players as a reason to why our attacking players are underperforming.
Valencia and Young are both converted midfielders playing in defensive roles, if anything should aid our attack and make us more worried about the defending side of things. The defense should not be able to fully dictate the success of our attacking football and the fact that the defensive line doesn't appear to drop short for the ball off DDG suggests to me that this is a tactic imposed by José, you could argue he doesn't trust them on the ball and wants to bypass them if you wish to relate it to the skill of our defence.
I haven't lost faith in José. I'm frustrated. Like you mention some fans out against José I think there are some who would defend him no matter what and ship the blame from him. I'm not saying you are one of them but a lot of people tend to give José a pass because "he hasn't the team". The man has spent roughly €350million on bringing in 8 players of his choice to the squad. It's as if for some people while there are still players he inherited in that squad will use it as an excuse.
Also for how much our defence and defensive midfielder get targeted for criticism I still believe the attacking players have been the most underwhelming this season. I can't really agree with the idea that the defensive players are the reason our attacking play has been poor, as it seems they have been following orders and, while individually are talented, it just isn't working out.
As I said. I'm still supporting José and haven't lost faith in him, but I'm frustrated. Frustrated with a lot of things. The style of our play. The idea that we shouldn't expect more given the investment we've seen. The fact that so many excuses are made to try avoid criticising José. The fact that when you highlight any problems people will remind you of how bad things used to be as some sort of reasoning not to be unhappy. The argument that players aren't at this bizarre "United Standard". The opinion people have that we need to go out and break the bank every transfer window on a big name player in the hope that it will turn the tide.
Apologies for the long rant. I know the majority will disagree with how I'm feeling over the whole thing but anyway....yeah roll on Chelsea.0 -
Feels like we're in one of the Mourinho cycles I've been seeing over the last few years when he was with other clubs. Players aren't going that little extra for him. Hope I'm wrong0
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One thing that annoyed me last night, not related to the play, was the RTE panel continually going on about José sideline behaviour.
They were questioning whether his silent, emotionless conduct on the sideline was some sort of hint that he is unhappy or disinterested. Like have they not been keeping up to date at all? I can't remember exactly but has he not commented about being more reserved on the sideline these days and now has begun criticising his previous carry on and that of other managers for fiery, animatic sideline behaviour.
Was getting on my nerves every time the camera panned to him and they'd bring it up.0 -
IamtheWalrus wrote: »This is what I'm postulating; maybe Jose doesn't trust them to be capable of said play. I don't know many Utd outfielders comfortable on the ball.
the players we have should be able to preform better than we have been since the end of september. pogba and matic are both good on the ball, sanchez, mata too are excellent on the ball. young and valencia as former wingers should both be comfortable on the ball and be demanding it to bring the play forward, smalling and lindelof when brought in both were known as passers but the 4 of them last night looked lost for ideas when they got it.
the opening 7 pl games we scored 21 goals and in the following 20 pl games we have scored 30 which is substantial drop off in goals to game ratio.
as it stands at 27 games played we have 56 points with chelsea next where i cant see us getting a win. after 28 games last year we had 53 points so is it really a massive improvement from his first season? or is it made look all the better by chelsea and spurs dropping well off the pace from where they stood at the same period last year?
joses teams were always hard to watch but you feared playing them cause you knew you were not going to create many chances as they protected their keeper and goal with every bit of their energy and when you had chances you had to take them if you wanted anything from the games but what we have played like since september is far from that in the vast majority of games.0 -
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IamtheWalrus wrote: »I wonder is Jose doing a Trapattoni; knows his side is weak and limited and is trying to grind out results until he has built a side capable of playing nice stuff. I don't think the current squad is capable of playing nicer stuff. There's no one (non-GK) you'd call a 'fine' footballer.
Sanchez, Pogba, Rashford, Martial, Mata (in a functioning team).
The first four of those are all fine footballers, and would be a regular feature in almost all of the top 6 teams in the league.IamtheWalrus wrote: »This is what I'm postulating; maybe Jose doesn't trust them to be capable of said play. I don't know many Utd outfielders comfortable on the ball.
All of the above. Plus the comment about Josot trusting players to play out, overlap fullbacks etc, this is something encouraged from amateur levels up. If the team in second in the PL is not trusted to perform the most basic tasks of football, the rest of the teams playing the game are in serious trouble.Adamocovic wrote: »One thing that annoyed me last night, not related to the play, was the RTE panel continually going on about Josideline behaviour.
They were questioning whether his silent, emotionless conduct on the sideline was some sort of hint that he is unhappy or disinterested. Like have they not been keeping up to date at all? I can't remember exactly but has he not commented about being more reserved on the sideline these days and now has begun criticising his previous carry on and that of other managers for fiery, animatic sideline behaviour.
Was getting on my nerves every time the camera panned to him and they'd bring it up.
I was listening to the first half on BT, decided I could take no more of McManaman and flicked to RTE to be greeted by Whelan's dulcet tones.
If only there was an alternative commentary or a selection available to viewers via a red button or some such method.0
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