Landlord complaint to homeowner.

Dial Hard

Donutz wrote: »

That is exactly what's been happening for the last year. LL was dismissive of our concerns on the few occasions that he bothered to return our messages. Fast forward to an RTB hearing, LL being extremely apologetic, and signing an agreement to fully investigate and respond in writing to any complaints we may have.

Ok, so the landlord is upholding his part of an RTB-heard bargain, and now you have an issue with it???

I honestly don't know what you want, here, OP. The landlord is between a rock and a hard place. He has to deal with his tenant's complaints, no matter how ill-founded you (or he) thinks they are and he also has to uphold his end of the agreement made at the RTB hearing.

What exactly is it you want/expect him to do here???

Donutz

Dial Hard wrote:

Ok, so the landlord is upholding his part of an RTB-heard bargain, and now you have an issue with it???

Dial Hard wrote:

I honestly don't know what you want, here, OP. The landlord is between a rock and a hard place. He has to deal with his tenant's complaints, no matter how ill-founded you (or he) thinks they are and he also has to uphold his end of the agreement made at the RTB hearing.

Dial Hard wrote:

What exactly is it you want/expect him to do here???

We haven't had any issues since RTB hearing so no need to contact the LL.

I agree that he is probably stuck between a rock and a hard place and from what is being said here, that he has an obligation to the tennants to investigate the complaints so I am gonna take that on board. But I am also aware that I am under no obligation to respond to any complaints that the tennants make about me to their LL. I will of course respond to them in an effort to clear my name but I don't want it to become a weekly thing.

I just don't fancy spending the next few months responding to ridiculous claims. It took a lot of my time yesterday responding to texts and driving to Garda stations when I could have been spending that time with my family.

Dermo

Donutz wrote: »

I just don't fancy spending the next few months responding to ridiculous claims. It took a lot of my time yesterday responding to texts and driving to Garda stations when I could have been spending that time with my family.

You will spend the next few months responding to ridiculous claims if you continue to respond! Just keep a record of all communication and let it be.

spaceHopper

Dermo wrote: »

You will spend the next few months responding to ridiculous claims if you continue to respond! Just keep a record of all communication and let it be.

This is good advice, stop responding if you do have to respond leave a few days then give the bear minimum response the less you engage with them the better for you and the LL

Donutz

Donutz wrote: »

Most of my annoyance is that the tennant is using the landlord to make a complaint when in fact if they had a real concern I would have imagined it would be a matter for the Gardai.

If they went straight to the Gardai, the first thing the Gardai would say is that it sounds like a civil matter and none of their business but then even if they took up the complaint the next thing they would ask is what did you say when the neighbours or the house owner approached you.

Del2005

Caliden wrote: »

The Gardai looked at the CCTV, found no issue and logged it in pulse.

Why should the landlord's opinion hold any bearing on the matter?

The Gardai aren't the data protection commissioner and as I said its easy to move a camera. Once the camera is looking towards another person's or public property its a breach of the data protection legislation. So you need to physically make it impossible for the camera to see their property and public property or you'll be getting more hassle.

The landlord has no opinion. His tenants have made a complaint about data protection and he has to action it or else the tenant will take him to the RTB and get a payout. Until you move or permanently obscure the camera view the neighbours you complained about will return the favour, unfortunately even if you do they'll probably find something else to complain about.

Ashbx

Donutz wrote: »

We've only just had an RTB hearing against this landlord for not dealing with complaints we've made to him. In that hearing he made an agreement in writing to deal with all complaints we make in writing within certain timeframes. Think he was scared the RTB were gonna throw the book at him. Seriously considering backing out of the agreement and sending it to tribunal now.
.

Who's being bitter against who here OP? "Seriously considering backing out of the agreement and sending it to tribunal now"....why? Just because he is doing his job as a landlord and investigating complaints that were brought to his attention but you seem to think they are all out to get you?

You brought him to the PTRB because he wasn't dealing with complaints against him. But yet you are proposing to do the same thing (i.e. telling him to F off, that you are not obliged to reply etc). No you aren't obliged to reply, but he wasn't the last time either and you brought him to the PTRB. No wonder he is scared of you and doesn't want to get involved with the screen grab etc.

Im not sure what can be done here as the LL isn't being the most helpful by not accepting the screen grab from you but he's doing everything he is supposed to be doing. And I think you may be overthinking if you think he is intentionally being a nuisance to you. I am sure he has more important things to be doing than spending his day being a hindrance to you.

Make life easy for yourself. I would do what post No 61 suggests. Give them all the info they need and back out gracefully telling them that's all they can do and if they like to take it further, by all means.

BTW, it does say in my lease if I have any issues with my neighbours to contact my LL or letting agent.

Donutz

Ashbx wrote:

Who's being bitter against who here OP? "Seriously considering backing out of the agreement and sending it to tribunal now"....why? Just because he is doing his job as a landlord and investigating complaints that were brought to his attention but you seem to think they are all out to get you?

I am not bitter, just stressed out with all the trouble this has brought over the last couple of years. All I want is a bit of peace and quiet to be able to enjoy my home the way anybody else is entitled to enjoy theirs. I have my own reasons to suspect that this tennant is gonna try and upset this in every way that they can.

Ashbx wrote:

You brought him to the PTRB because he wasn't dealing with complaints against him. But yet you are proposing to do the same thing (i.e. telling him to F off, that you are not obliged to reply etc). No you aren't obliged to reply, but he wasn't the last time either and you brought him to the PTRB. No wonder he is scared of you and doesn't want to get involved with the screen grab etc.

To be honest I think that he feels stuck in the middle between us and his tennants but that is not my concern. All I want is a bit of peace and quiet.

Ashbx wrote:

Im not sure what can be done here as the LL isn't being the most helpful by not accepting the screen grab from you but he's doing everything he is supposed to be doing. And I think you may be overthinking if you think he is intentionally being a nuisance to you. I am sure he has more important things to be doing than spending his day being a hindrance to you.

I think the way forward is to ignore any complaints we feel are bogus, but actually engage with him on complaints we feel we can resolve.

Ashbx wrote:

BTW, it does say in my lease if I have any issues with my neighbours to contact my LL or letting agent.

It seems from this thread the landlord has an obligation to his tennants with regards complaints made towards other neighbours, which answers one of the questions I had in one of my opening posts.

Donutz

Del2005 wrote:

The Gardai aren't the data protection commissioner and as I said its easy to move a camera.

This is correct but I don't see why I should go to the data protection commissioner to prove my cameras aren't in breach. If everybody who ever bought a camera had to do this, they would need a LOT more staff. I feel I went further that what I needed to in going to the Gardai.

Your also right about being able to move cameras but to police this would be next to impossible.

hawkelady

Donutz wrote: »

Del2005 wrote:

The Gardai aren't the data protection commissioner and as I said its easy to move a camera.

This is correct but I don't see why I should go to the data protection commissioner to prove my cameras aren't in breach. If everybody who ever bought a camera had to do this, they would need a LOT more staff. I feel I went further that what I needed to in going to the Gardai.

Your also right about being able to move cameras but to police this would be next to impossible.

You're right , it's not as if the data commissioner himself will knock on your door. Jesus some of the replies here are mental !!! Op , just carry on living .... im surprised you even went to the guards yourself to clarify your position.

Just carry on

Donutz

hawkelady wrote:

You're right , it's not as if the data commissioner himself will knock on your door. Jesus some of the replies here are mental !!! Op , just carry on living .... im surprised you even went to the guards yourself to clarify your position.

hawkelady wrote:

Just carry on

Thanks hawkelady. We were hoping these cameras would give us some peace and quite but looks like they've brought on more stress. Hopefully it's just a minor blip and we might get some enjoyment out of our property eventually.

Ashbx

hawkelady wrote: »

You're right , it's not as if the data commissioner himself will knock on your door. Jesus some of the replies here are mental !!! Op , just carry on living .... im surprised you even went to the guards yourself to clarify your position.

Just carry on

Its a tad bit hypocritical of the OP though. They drag the landlord to the PRTB (and now are considering a tribunal over it) because the LL was not addressing complaints that the OP had.

Now the tables are turned and suddenly the OP wants to ignore the complaints that the LL has.

I understand the OP is trying to help with offering screen grabs etc and probably not much more they can do. But just ignoring the complaints is going to get the OP nowhere and will most likely just piss the LL and tenants off more.

Donutz

Ashbx wrote:

Its a tad bit hypocritical of the OP though. They drag the landlord to the PRTB (and now are considering a tribunal over it) because the LL was not addressing complaints that the OP had.

Ashbx wrote:

Now the tables are turned and suddenly the OP wants to ignore the complaints that the LL has.

Ashbx wrote:

I understand the OP is trying to help with offering screen grabs etc and probably not much more they can do. But just ignoring the complaints is going to get the OP nowhere and will most likely just piss the LL and tenants off more.

With all due respect, we didn't drag the LL through the RTB. We made a complaint that we felt he didint deal with, then another, then another, then another and so on. The LL by his own admissions at the hearing said that he didn't take our complaints seriously. The last thing we wanted to do was go the RTB route but we felt we were all out of options.

We came to a fair and reasonable agreement with him when we could have let it go the full hearing and quite possibly have him suffer a financial fine.

Yesterday I received a complaint that my CCTV was pointing towards his property. I told him it wasn't. He wasn't happy with this. I offered him a screen grab. He wasn't happy with this. I had to go to the Gardai to verify that my cameras were in fact fine. What more could I do?

If this is what it's going to be like going forward, I neither have the time or energy to be dealing with this.

Henry Ford III

If you live in a place where it's necessary to have cctv installed and you have a very bad relationship with your neighbours perhaps it's time to consider relocating?

Del2005

Donutz wrote: »

This is correct but I don't see why I should go to the data protection commissioner to prove my cameras aren't in breach. If everybody who ever bought a camera had to do this, they would need a LOT more staff. I feel I went further that what I needed to in going to the Gardai.

Your also right about being able to move cameras but to police this would be next to impossible.

Did you read the link I posted from the data commissioner? You suspect that the people that you complained about are going to keep hassling you and yet you installed cameras which they suspect are looking at their property. I wouldn't be surprised if you don't get a civil action soon.


"It should be noted that recording of a public space, even partially, or when recording is directed outwards from the private setting, it may not be regarded as a ‘personal or household’ activity for the purposes of the Data Protection Acts, and this may have immediate and particular interest to drone operators and data controllers."

Are your cameras compliant with the above?

Donutz

Henry Ford III wrote:

If you live in a place where it's necessary to have cctv installed and you have a very bad relationship with your neighbours perhaps it's time to consider relocating?

We would if we could afford to.

Donutz

Del2005 wrote:

Did you read the link I posted from the data commissioner? You suspect that the people that you complained about are going to keep hassling you and yet you installed cameras which they suspect are looking at their property. I wouldn't be surprised if you don't get a civil action soon.

I don't think they suspect that it's looking at their property. I suspect they made the complaint just to annoy me. They can fire ahead with the a civil suit if they like. I have nothing to hide.

Del2005 wrote:

"It should be noted that recording of a public space, even partially, or when recording is directed outwards from the private setting, it may not be regarded as a ‘personal or household’ activity for the purposes of the Data Protection Acts, and this may have immediate and particular interest to drone operators and data controllers."

Does this mean that all dash cams, retail stores CCTV systems, and anybody recording on their mobile phones are all in breach of data protection?

Del2005 wrote:

Are your cameras compliant with the above?

Yes.

Greaney

Donutz wrote: »

I've installed CCTV (which these neighbours also have) and they have claimed to the landlord that I am pretty much spying on them. Offered to send him a screen grab of the cameras but he declined.




The complaint is from the tennants next door. They complained to their landlord about us. We are homeowners so don't have a landlord.

You offered a screen grab so I imagine that's the end of it. As for having rights, och, folk just pull people into their dramas all the time. Your offer of the screen grab was very reasonable IMO

surrender monkey

In the op's second post in the thread they have stated that the rented house next door also hasCCTV installed. I'm not sure if people have missed this fact but the tenants are obviously making vexatious claims here. This is a bit hippocritical of the tenant and landlord.

It is perfectly legal to install CCTV on your property provided that you are filming your property only. You have satisfied yourself by contacting and clarifying things with the gardai. Send the landlord the screen shots so that he can placate the tenants and let that be the end of the matter. Do not engage any further with either party on the matter and leave the RTB out of it. If the tenant has further issues with your CCTV remind the landlord of the agreement he has signed in respect of the tenancy and that you have proved to him you are not recording his property.

No one can do anything here to you as long as you act within the law. The people next door are renting so luckily they will move on sooner or later.

hawkelady

Hey del ...... you have any comeback regarding your data protection jargon ? I believe dash cams are used by insurance companies all the time and no one has got the data protection commissioner on the case.
Op , don't pander to your neighbours , they might even ask you for help (providing video evidence) if one of their cars is robbed from outside their house !!

Del2005

hawkelady wrote: »

Hey del ...... you have any comeback regarding your data protection jargon ? I believe dash cams are used by insurance companies all the time and no one has got the data protection commissioner on the case.
Op , don't pander to your neighbours , they might even ask you for help (providing video evidence) if one of their cars is robbed from outside their house !!

I'm only pointing out the data protection commissioner stance on CCTV. What will happen to dash cams and incorrectly installed systems is not my problem. But personal data is becoming a big issue.

Thousands of people break the law every day, running red lights or illegal dumping etc , it doesn't mean that they are OK to continue to break the law they just haven't get caught.

Ashbx

surrender monkey wrote: »

In the op's second post in the thread they have stated that the rented house next door also hasCCTV installed. I'm not sure if people have missed this fact but the tenants are obviously making vexatious claims here. This is a bit hippocritical of the tenant and landlord.

Yes but the OP said "the neighbours have cameras also" which you would assume means the neighbours on the other side of the OP which means their camera would not affect the LL who is complaining at all!

I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that the tenant is making vexatious claims just because the OP is getting annoyed by it.

OP I feel like I am picking on you a bit....im not. I trust you have done all you can to help the LL here and they dont seem to be the most easy person to deal with either but ignoring the complaints or getting bothered or paranoid that its a personal attack is not going to help your situation at all.

surrender monkey

Ashbx wrote: »

Yes but the OP said "the neighbours have cameras also" which you would assume means the neighbours on the other side of the OP which means their camera would not affect the LL who is complaining at all!

I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that the tenant is making vexatious claims just because the OP is getting annoyed by it.

OP I feel like I am picking on you a bit....im not. I trust you have done all you can to help the LL here and they dont seem to be the most easy person to deal with either but ignoring the complaints or getting bothered or paranoid that its a personal attack is not going to help your situation at all.

The op's second post says "these neighbours" not "the neighbours" !!!.

Ignore them op they are playing silly beggars, they are renting just leave them to their games and they will be gone sooner or later.