The European obsession about why the US is not obsessed with "soccer"/"football"

Fr Tod Umptious

What is the obsession here in Europe with whether soccer becomes a major force in America or not.

I found this most recent video on the BBC

The presenter gets off to a bad start by having this “soccer” v “football” silliness.

Calling “football” “soccer” in the UK or Europe should not be looked down on.

“Soccer” is not an Americanization.

The term “soccer” was used to describe “football” from the start, is a derivation of the word “Association”, and it was widely used in England up to a few decades ago.

Then she suggests that the gateway to making the game popular in the US is women’s soccer.

It’s not, if it was it would have done so years ago. Women’s soccer has been a big deal in the US for decades, yet this popularity has never been reflected in the overall sporting psyche.

And just this week The Boston Breakers of the National Women’s Soccer League folded.

Then she goes on to the health issue and it’s obvious that there is a major problem with head trauma in the NFL , but heading the ball in soccer has been banned at underage level in the US, so soccer is not totally safe in that area also.

It’s true that soccer is much bigger in the US than it was 20 years ago, the big European league are on network TV, the ticker on ESPN etc show soccer scores on a Saturday afternoon, but it’s still a million miles from having the same penetration level of the overall population that the NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL, NCAA Football and NCAA Basketball have and people should stop obsessing about that.

Omackeral

The less of this the better

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdUEEp2oA0o

bucketybuck

Thread fails at the title, there is no obsession, regardless of some random video on the BBC.

razorblunt

My issue is that some fans expect it to be as big as European football, right now.
It can't, it probably won't ever get that big but it needs time to grow. The MLS seems to be doing a decent job crowd wise.
But they're attempts are always ridiculed:
- "oh its a retirement home for players"
- let's laugh at chants because they're not screaming "shall we sing a song for you" or "you scouse bastard" or "Wenger is a paedo".

The other issue is that away from the cities the game can't get the fanbase.
College sports become the "my team" in those scenarios. Live in Michigan, miles away from the city but an hour from Ann Arbour? Go Blue up you're a Michigan fan.

MD1990

It is a bit strange football the biggest sport in the world is not more popular in the biggest Country in the world.

osarusan

All is well as long as nobody uses the word 'soccerball'.

Mushy

MD1990 wrote: »

It is a bit strange football the biggest sport in the world is not more popular in the biggest Country in the world.

Seems popular enough in Russia

Omackeral

MD1990 wrote: »

It is a bit strange football the biggest sport in the world is not more popular in the biggest Country in the world.

You might wanna look at your atlas again there fella

Omackeral

osarusan wrote: »

All is well as long as nobody uses the word 'soccerball'.

Footy is worse.

osarusan

I didn't think there was any obsession with why football is not popular in the USA, rather an understanding that they already have their own sports that feed the domestic market, as well as being utterly utterly dominant at school and college levels.

I actually think the MSL has done pretty well, considering what it is up against.

Fr Tod Umptious

bucketybuck wrote: »

Thread fails at the title, there is no obsession, regardless of some random video on the BBC.

Obsession may be too strong a word but it's not uncommon to find people this side of the world bemoaning the fact that soccer has never taken off in the US.

It's as if indeginous US sports, because of things like the stop/start nature of the play and "top down" franchise structure, lack the authenticity that European sports have.

The same is true in politics.

Just read any of the polotics threads about the US here and you will find that a common theme is why does the US not have, and why don't the US people want, a social democratic political structure like exists in Europe.

citytillidie

Because Europe is worried if the US do take football seriously then it would be a major power with the money it pumps into sports

Jimbob1977

Soccer is hugely popular until university level.

Then universities throw huge money at American Football and Basketball scholarships. It's a money thing. Soccer would get the crumbs. The next stage is the megabucks of NFL and NBA.

Not so much baseball. Baseball seems to survive by tradition and sheer love of the game.

Soccer is hugely popular in the Latino community, hence The emergence of Futbol Miami for Beckham et al. Once the demographics change, soccer will continue to prosper.

The toughest nut to crack will be the African American community, who adore NFL and NBA. Approx 72% and 90% of the professionals respectively would be black.

gucci

Omackeral wrote: »

You might wanna look at your atlas again there fella

Whaaaa...? Clearly the biggest, and obviously the best :D

764dak

The 1920s American Soccer League had some of the world's best players and its popularity exceeded the NFL. FIFA and USFA conspired against the league and soccer's popularity in the US fell.

http://www.slate.com/articles/sports/sports_nut/2010/06/the_secret_history_of_american_soccer.html

Zaph

India has a population three times the size of the US and nobody ever mentions how little impact football has made there compared to cricket. Some sports are just more popular than football in certain countries, it's hardly a great mystery.

eagle eye

The game is growing in the US but they have other sports and it takes years for people to move from one sport to another. Younger people might like soccer more than the other big sports over there as they get to play underage soccer and they have the MLS to help them stay in touch.

The other thing which is going to help it grow even more is the brain studies which are making parents think a lot about whether their kids should ever player American football.

It's going to take a long time before the USA is a world power in soccer but it will happen.

gimli2112

I don't think there is a more sport obsessed nation, it's an integral part of their culture. AF, Baseball and Basketball are huge both at pro and college level (except baseball at college level). When they win something the fans tear their home cities apart.

There's also a myriad of other sports including soccerfootball vying for attention. Athletics, golf, motorsports, Hockey, Tennis...
There's none of this it's not about the winning but the taking part nonsense either.

Mr.H

Fr Tod Umptious wrote:

Just read any of the polotics threads about the US here and you will find that a common theme is why does the US not have, and why don't the US people want, a social democratic political structure like exists in Europe.

And jelly is not jam ffs

Osmosis Jones

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Obsession may be too strong a word but it's not uncommon to find people this side of the world bemoaning the fact that soccer has never taken off in the US.

I talk about football a lot and with a lot of different people but I've never heard anyone crying about the US not being that into it, no one cares.

Laois_Man

Mr.H wrote: »

And jelly is not jam ffs

While you're at it.....stop calling it a hamburger. There's no ham in it!!

Big Ears

Seems a bit of a silly time to make this thread. Soccer is more popular than ever in the US.
The MLS is growing substantially, and American TV companies are even paying big money for foreign soccer rights.

NBC paid around $1 billion for rights to show 6 years of the Premier League. That was in 2015 and was twice what they previously paid ($250 million for 3 years).
There was also a major backlash from the fact the National team didn't make the World Cup, something they probably wouldn't have cared about some time ago.

The sport is definitely growing over there, and quite rapidly imo !

Fr Tod Umptious

Big Ears wrote: »

Seems a bit of a silly time to make this thread. Soccer is more popular than ever in the US.
The MLS is growing substantially, and American TV companies are even paying big money for foreign soccer rights.

NBC paid around $1 billion for rights to show 6 years of the Premier League. That was in 2015 and was twice what they previously paid ($250 million for 3 years).
There was also a major backlash from the fact the National team didn't make the World Cup, something they probably wouldn't have cared about some time ago.

The sport is definitely growing over there, and quite rapidly imo !

Started the thread because I saw the video on the BBC app.

No matter what way people look at it soccer will never break into the big 4 in the general US consciousness.

It will always and ever be niche, just like lacrosse, tennis, track and field etc.

I personally thought the US national team was on the cusp of making a big impact at the world cup from 2002 onwards, but seem to have regressed.

Fr Tod Umptious

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

Started the thread because I saw the video on the BBC app.

No matter what way people look at it soccer will never break into the big 4 in the general US consciousness.

It will always and ever be niche, just like lacrosse, tennis, track and field etc.

I personally thought the US national team was on the cusp of making a big impact at the world cup from 2002 onwards, but seem to have regressed.

I dunno, it's now the third most-played team sport with American Football losing a lot of numbers. The MLS also increased its TV ratings last year (despite being on pay-TV) while the big 4 all went down.
People seem to expect the player numbers at youth level to have an impact once those people hit adulthood but that's ridiculous with how pervasive Football and Basketball are in colleges. However the numbers keep going up and it only takes a slightly increasing percentage of those to keep at it for a long-term impact to happen.
Whether it'll ever hit the tipping point I don't know. But it looks healthy for the future.

Ulysses Gaze

gucci wrote: »

Whaaaa...? Clearly the biggest, and obviously the best :D

Where has Africa gone?

:eek:

Arghus

It'll get there eventually, but the national side not qualifying for The World Cup is going to hurt it a bit in terms of mainstream visibility, at least for a few years.

Richard Hillman

You're essentially trying to sell a sport where the majority of games are bad. Football became popular in Europe as a mode of entertainment when there was little else to compete and not as a TV sport. It survives/thrives due to Tradition, Tribal loyalties and FOMO by the TV companies. If you tried to sell football to Europe now, it wouldn't take off.

Minderbinder

People, usually American football enthusiasts or Europeans living in the states love stating how the game is expanding there and given time it’ll compete. I don’t see any noticeable difference in the last ten years for example, and if there is a difference it is a decline if anything.

Using increasing subscribers to EPL as proof of the game growing in the USA is nonsense. That actually means the game is growing in England.

I think football, and the USA’s position within football will remain roughly the same as it now, for a long, long time and I don’t see what could possibly happen to enable it to compete with their other sports.

HalloweenJack

I don't think I've ever met anyone who's obsessed about the States and football. If it's come up in conversation, people have points to make but I don't see people who have a chip on the shoulder about it.

If it's growing, fair play to them. I'm not too bothered either way.

Fr Tod Umptious

Minderbinder wrote: »

People, usually American football enthusiasts or Europeans living in the states love stating how the game is expanding there and given time it’ll compete. I don’t see any noticeable difference in the last ten years for example, and if there is a difference it is a decline if anything.

Using increasing subscribers to EPL as proof of the game growing in the USA is nonsense. That actually means the game is growing in England.

I think football, and the USA’s position within football will remain roughly the same as it now, for a long, long time and I don’t see what could possibly happen to enable it to compete with their other sports.

US soccer enthusiasts are like vegans. The only people who really care what vegans have to say are other vegans, just like the only ones who care what US soccer enthusiasts have to say is other US soccer enthusiasts.

People over 50 in the US will tell you that all their lives they have been told that two things will definitely happen.

The US will adopt the metric system and soccer will become popular.

Both have yet to happen.

Lord TSC

I read some comments from American fans on Reddit a few weeks back. Will try to remember the two main points as best I can.

Basically, they said that Soccer is effectively a "rich person sport" at the moment, due to the fact not many people play it, and the distance you need to travel to play games against other teams. Everyone plays American football, and there's funding to transport the teams across the huge distances between towns and schools. But that funding isn't there for soccer, so parents need to fork out huge amounts of cash to get their team travels funded. As it develops, most of the teams ask for more and more cash. I've seen stories of parents being asked to pay thousands of dollars a year to get their kids into teams.

You also have an issue that the American college system means most of its professional sports players aren't going professional till 21 or so. Their sports stars are expected to be amateurs in high school and college, and then go professional once they finish up college. Compare that to soccer, especially modern day, where the players who are 20-23 have probably been professional for years, and enjoying all the benefits of such. The Americans physically aren't getting properly started until a stage when some European players are already being written off....

Lord TSC

Lord TSC wrote: »

I read some comments from American fans on Reddit a few weeks back. Will try to remember the two main points as best I can.

Basically, they said that Soccer is effectively a "rich person sport" at the moment, due to the fact not many people play it, and the distance you need to travel to play games against other teams. Everyone plays American football, and there's funding to transport the teams across the huge distances between towns and schools. But that funding isn't there for soccer, so parents need to fork out huge amounts of cash to get their team travels funded. As it develops, most of the teams ask for more and more cash. I've seen stories of parents being asked to pay thousands of dollars a year to get their kids into teams.

You also have an issue that the American college system means most of its professional sports players aren't going professional till 21 or so. Their sports stars are expected to be amateurs in high school and college, and then go professional once they finish up college. Compare that to soccer, especially modern day, where the players who are 20-23 have probably been professional for years, and enjoying all the benefits of such. The Americans physically aren't getting properly started until a stage when some European players are already being written off....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sports_in_the_United_States#Popular_team_sports

Omackeral

Minderbinder wrote: »

Using increasing subscribers to EPL as proof of the game growing in the USA is nonsense. That actually means the game is growing in England.

I think a lot people over here sneer at US fans and slag them for following Man City, Chelsea or Liverpool while doing the exact same themselves.

Ulysses Gaze

Minderbinder wrote: »

I think football, and the USA’s position within football will remain roughly the same as it now, for a long, long time and I don’t see what could possibly happen to enable it to compete with their other sports.

Unless the US produces a Pele/Messi/Maradona level player and/or wins the World Cup then I would agree with you on this.

Minderbinder

Omackeral wrote: »

Minderbinder wrote: »

Using increasing subscribers to EPL as proof of the game growing in the USA is nonsense. That actually means the game is growing in England.

I think a lot people over here sneer at US fans and slag them for following Man City, Chelsea or Liverpool while doing the exact same themselves.

I don’t think a lot of Irish people would sneer at Americans for supporting those teams. That would be stupid.

I’m not sure what point you’re making unless you think I’m sneering, which I’m not. I’m simply stating that more people watching EPL in the states does not mean the game is growing there, and if it’s anything like Ireland it will probably have a negative effect.

Omackeral

Not saying you're sneering at all. I'm saying I've heard plenty of lads deriding American fellas for following the likes of City or Chelsea passionately but thinking it's plastic because they're too far away. These same chaps doing the slagging have probably never been to the Emirates or Elland Road or wherever themselves!

Guy:Incognito

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Unless the US produces a Pele/Messi/Maradona level player and/or wins the World Cup then I would agree with you on this.

Freddy Adu ?