Home charge points (purchase/problems/questions) (See mod note post#1)

tart29016

KCross wrote: »

They are talking about the "tails" which is the cable going from your meter box outside to your consumer unit in the house.... it takes ALL the load of the house so has to be able to take the full 60A on its own.


So assuming that the cable is 10mm² they are absolutely correct. That is too low to cover all the house and an EV charge point.

16mm² would be the norm these days for a standard 12kVA domestic supply and 25mm² if you go for the enhanced 16kVA suppy.


You may need to get your electrician AND the ESB to sort it out as the electrician will need to put in the new cable and certify it and he may have the get the ESB to pull the power at the meter box while he is doing it.

If you have an electrician onsite already to do that work he will be providing a cert for it so you might as well get him to do the EV charge point as well otherwise you will be paying for two certs and two electricians.


EDIT: And not to put a dampener on it but you could also find that the electrician will find other things wrong when he looks at the tails and may insist you upgrade other things (like earthing etc) which will involve spending more money.... it will really depend on the the state of the rest of your electrics.
i.e. It may not be a case of just upgrading the tails and then everything is fine from there. He has to certify the whole board, AFAIK, so the job could grow legs.

Thanks very much for the detailed explanation.

I do not have an electrician onsite and I was thinking to ring ESB and get them to come out and do it for me. Would this be a good idea to ring them and explain to them what I need to get done? Assuming this will be a common enough query these days.

Thanks

KCross

tart29016 wrote: »

Thanks very much for the detailed explanation.

I do not have an electrician onsite and I was thinking to ring ESB and get them to come out and do it for me. Would this be a good idea to ring them and explain to them what I need to get done? Assuming this will be a common enough query these days.

Thanks

ESB wont do it for you. They only work upto the meter point. Any cabling from that point on (e.g. the tails) is yours and they will not touch it.

You need an electrician and he may need to call on ESB to pull the fuse on your supply while he is upgrading it and then ESB put the fuse back in and seal it.

Bottomline, its an electrician you need to get onsite first. Forget ESB until an electrician assesses it and tells you what needs doing.

KCross

A plan B might be to install a 16A charge point rather than a 32A. An electrician might install that without upgrading everything, but again you'd need him to come onsite and make that assessment.

tart29016

KCross wrote: »

A plan B might be to install a 16A charge point rather than a 32A. An electrician might install that without upgrading everything, but again you'd need him to come onsite and make that assessment.

Interesting....I am having the Electric Ireland charger installed so not sure if it is a 16A or 32A?

Below is what I got of them.
We can supply and install the 7.4kw Circontrol eNext charger with an untethered Type 2 charging socket as well as the 7.4kw Circontrol eHome charger which has a 5m tethered type 2 cabel,and we can offer then for €749 each including VAT.

KCross

tart29016 wrote: »

Interesting....I am having the Electric Ireland charger installed so not sure if it is a 16A or 32A?

Below is what I got of them.
We can supply and install the 7.4kw Circontrol eNext charger with an untethered Type 2 charging socket as well as the 7.4kw Circontrol eHome charger which has a 5m tethered type 2 cabel,and we can offer then for €749 each including VAT.

Thats a 32A.

Alun

KCross wrote: »

Thats a 32A.

I'm not sure how other chargepoints work, but the one I have, an EO Mini, can be configured via a small internal rotary switch for a variety of different maximum charging currents from 11A to 32A.

KCross

Alun wrote: »

I'm not sure how other chargepoints work, but the one I have, an EO Mini, can be configured via a small internal rotary switch for a variety of different maximum charging currents from 11A to 32A.

Yea, some can do that but usually you cant.

I think you can change the max current in the Circontrol one too but its too easily done via the app and Im not sure an electrician would sign off on it being installed say as a 16A charge point when someone could easily change it to 32A (on purpose or otherwise) and burn the house down.

Dip switches inside the unit would be OK. Im sure they'd sign that off. An app is too easy for the user to make a mistake though.

AndyBoBandy

KCross wrote: »

Dip switches inside the unit would be OK. Im sure they'd sign that off. An app is too easy for the user to make a mistake though.

The Tesla Wall Connector has internal DIP switches, but again, doubtful if an electrician would sign off on it.

Another option could be a new 'Primary' fuse box installed out at the ESB meter, thus relegating the original fuse box inside the house to a secondary fuse box. This way the EV charge point gets it's power direct from the new fuse box at the meter, meaning the existing house wiring can remain as is as no additional load will be placed on it.

mp3guy

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

The Tesla Wall Connector has internal DIP switches, but again, doubtful if an electrician would sign off on it.

Another option could be a new 'Primary' fuse box installed out at the ESB meter, thus relegating the original fuse box inside the house to a secondary fuse box. This way the EV charge point gets it's power direct from the new fuse box at the meter, meaning the existing house wiring can remain as is as no additional load will be placed on it.

Same with the Garo, also has DIP switches inside.

How can you manage total load with that setup? You can't put the entire secondary fuse box on a priority switch, can you? Or otherwise you'd need to install a dynamic load monitor and scalable charger.

Guys,
I'm hoping to order a leaf this week.
What's the best/quickest way to get a charger installed?
Keeping in mind I need to get the grant.

mp3guy

BrownFinger wrote: »

Guys,
I'm hoping to order a leaf this week.
What's the best/quickest way to get a charger installed?
Keeping in mind I need to get the grant.

It will take weeks.

First, when you order the leaf, you need to wait for the grant to approve (if you're buying private at least). That'll be at least two weeks.

You need to have the car before you apply for the charger grant. That'll be another week or so waiting. Then you can finally have an electrician install it and fill out the paper work they send you.

eagerv

BrownFinger wrote: »

Guys,
I'm hoping to order a leaf this week.
What's the best/quickest way to get a charger installed?
Keeping in mind I need to get the grant.

We applied for grant last Monday on line and received letter of approval on the Friday, so pretty quick. Electrician coming to install next Mon, so hopefully only two weeks of using Granny charger (Which hasn't been too much hassle).


Not sure how long it will take to receive grant, but expecting a bit of a wait after job completed.

MJohnston

mp3guy wrote: »

It will take weeks.

First, when you order the leaf, you need to wait for the grant to approve (if you're buying private at least). That'll be at least two weeks.

You need to have the car before you apply for the charger grant. That'll be another week or so waiting. Then you can finally have an electrician install it and fill out the paper work they send you.

You don't need to have the car to apply for the grant, you can ask the dealer for the SEAI application number or whatever it is ahead of delivery.

KCross

eagerv wrote: »

Not sure how long it will take to receive grant, but expecting a bit of a wait after job completed.

4-6 weeks

Felexicon

KCross wrote: »

Yea, some can do that but usually you cant.

I think you can change the max current in the Circontrol one too but its too easily done via the app and Im not sure an electrician would sign off on it being installed say as a 16A charge point when someone could easily change it to 32A (on purpose or otherwise) and burn the house down.

Dip switches inside the unit would be OK. Im sure they'd sign that off. An app is too easy for the user to make a mistake though.

Dip switches over ride the app on any units I've installed that have the option to change max current via an app.

Thanks for the info.
Dealer gave me the number of their sparks.
I'll have a chat with him tomorrow.

Alun

Felexicon wrote: »

Dip switches over ride the app on any units I've installed that have the option to change max current via an app.

That's what I would have assumed.

KCross

Felexicon wrote: »

Dip switches over ride the app on any units I've installed that have the option to change max current via an app.

Doesn’t look like it in the circontrol one that they were quoted for.

When you increase it via the app it says you need to do it with guidance from your electrician via a pop up on the app. It didn’t mention dip switches but I haven’t used one of those myself so maybe it does.

The cheaper units don’t have an app or dip switches. All or nothing.

Felexicon

KCross wrote: »

Doesn’t look like it in the circontrol one that they were quoted for.

When you increase it via the app it says you need to do it with guidance from your electrician via a pop up on the app. It didn’t mention dip switches but I haven’t used one of those myself so maybe it does.

Being honest I haven't used one either. If that is the case I wouldn't be trusting someone to leave it at 16 amps

Krusty_Clown

MJohnston wrote: »

You don't need to have the car to apply for the grant, you can ask the dealer for the SEAI application number or whatever it is ahead of delivery.

Is that the case? I've been told my vehicle grant has been approved, and I understand the Zappi2 is in short supply, so has a lead time, so if I could get the EV grant Application ID, I could order it ahead of receiving my vehicle (another few weeks to wait).

JohnC.

Are you getting the Zappi direct or from your installer? If you’re getting it direct, you can order whenever you want. It’s the installation that needs the details, not buying the unit, if you’re doing that separate.

Krusty_Clown

JohnC. wrote: »

Are you getting the Zappi direct or from your installer? If you’re getting it direct, you can order whenever you want. It’s the installation that needs the details, not buying the unit, if you’re doing that separate.

I was going to order it from an installer. I've read through the T&Cs from the SEAI site, and it certainly seems that you need only have been approved for the vehicle grant and have an associated application ID. Will see how it goes.

MJohnston

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

Is that the case? I've been told my vehicle grant has been approved, and I understand the Zappi2 is in short supply, so has a lead time, so if I could get the EV grant Application ID, I could order it ahead of receiving my vehicle (another few weeks to wait).

Twas certainly the case for me when buying an i3, I just emailed my sales rep and asked for it.

graememk

Krusty_Clown wrote: »

I was going to order it from an installer. I've read through the T&Cs from the SEAI site, and it certainly seems that you need only have been approved for the vehicle grant and have an associated application ID. Will see how it goes.

Yep I have done the same thing, I've got my approval since Jan, but I can't claim the grant until I get the car, so if you can handle the cash flow you can have it installed and ready to go before you get a car.

whit regards to the zappi charge points.

Whats the different beteen a 7KW Type 2 tethered
and a 7kw untethered ?

Point is for a 40kwh leaf, I think untethered is the type for me.

Is the hub worth it?

Thanks

AndyBoBandy

BrownFinger wrote: »

whit regards to the zappi charge points.

Whats the different beteen a 7KW Type 2 tethered
and a 7kw untethered ?

Tethered means it has a charging cable permanently attached to it, so when you get home, you simply uncoil it and plug it into your car.

Untethered means there is no cable attached to it, so when you get home you have to take your cable out of your car and attach 1 end to the charge unit, and the other end to the car. (double the work).

Tethered;


Untethered;

Cyrus

hi folks have been reading through the thread, all very interesting!

my house is a new build (built in the last 3 years) so hoping this will be relatively straightforward.

whats the best charger to buy at the moment, ideally want something black. Also presume tethered makes more sense and finally, are most charges compatible with msot cars, i.e. if i was getting a model 3, or an EQC or an etron its all the same?

Alkers

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

Tethered means it has a charging cable permanently attached to it, so when you get home, you simply uncoil it and plug it into your car.

Untethered means there is no cable attached to it, so when you get home you have to take your cable out of your car and attach 1 end to the charge unit, and the other end to the car. (double the work).

You can also leave your cable plugged into the untethered unit.

The only reason to get an untethered unit is if you have (or are likely to get) a car with a type 1 socket and you want to be able to charge this as well as cars with type 2 sockets (which all new cars will have).

dec2000

Does anyone know if you actually have to purchase a charger? I'm looking at the Tesla charger but there is a new version imminent (already out in the US). I have grant approval until June but wondering if I got hte Electrician out to install a 32A commando socket, would this suffice and then swap it out with the charger whenever it becomes available - does anyone know?

AndyBoBandy

dec2000 wrote: »

I'm looking at the Tesla charger but there is a new version imminent (already out in the US). I have grant approval until June

I would highly doubt the Version 3 Tesla charger will be available to purchase before June.

The word on the street is they'll not release it here until all version 2 stock has been sold.