Home charge points (purchase/problems/questions) (See mod note post#1)

zg3409

slave1 wrote: »

Has anyone got a Tesla charger with the dip switch changed to allow any Type 2 to charge off it.
Interested as I want to change my untethered to a Tesla tethered but need to charge our Gen 1 Leaf also (type 1).
I've read that once the dip switch is changed then okay to charge a Leaf but also seeing conflicting reports...

By default home chargers from Tesla will charge any type 2 car as far as I know.

The switch is not only set on destination chargers and then only some of them. You would be best to confirm with an Irish Tesla owner who has charged a non Tesla on a home charger.

HOWEVER the type 1 to type 2 adapters to charge an old leaf from a type 2 cable DO NOT work with Tesla chargers. Someone tested one at wooden bridge hotel on a trsla charger that charges any type 2 car and it would not work and there is other reports too. .

Tesla only sell chargers to Tesla owners too.

So if you have a leaf with a type 1 port, stick to non Tesla chargers or install 2 chargers.

zg3409

xboxdad wrote: »

I found this in our meter box: 60/80A, Series 7, Type II a., 415V. B.S. 88.

Is it expensive to upgrade to a 100A fuse?
Who does it? The 3rd party installer or I need to contact Electric Ireland or ESB?


Thanks.

Nearly every house has a 60/63 amp main fuse. In order to go higher then the wires from the nearest street box will need to be replaced to the house, then the tails from the Meter to the inside fuseboard, then possibly new or bigger fuseboard. Unless you get 3 phase (very rarely available) then you are still limited to 32amp or 7kW charging rate.

Here is where to apply from esb
https://www.esbnetworks.ie/existing-connection/increasing-decreasing-supply/domestic-user

You might need to do reverse order, upgrade inside then upgrade supply, but the costs might be enormous, mostly dependant on above ground wire to house or buried wire or conduit trunking. Length affects quote too along with local limitations. Not worth it unless you really need it

xboxdad

zg3409 wrote: »

Nearly every house has a 60/63 amp main fuse. In order to go higher then the wires from the nearest street box will need to be replaced to the house, then the tails from the Meter to the inside fuseboard, then possibly new or bigger fuseboard. Unless you get 3 phase (very rarely available) then you are still limited to 32amp or 7kW charging rate.

Here is where to apply from esb
https://www.esbnetworks.ie/existing-connection/increasing-decreasing-supply/domestic-user

You might need to do reverse order, upgrade inside then upgrade supply, but the costs might be enormous, mostly dependant on above ground wire to house or buried wire or conduit trunking. Length affects quote too along with local limitations. Not worth it unless you really need it

Thank you for your help!

Well, I ordered an Andersen A2 unit and they said 100A is ideal, 60/80A is so-so and that I need to get it confirmed with my supplier if it's 60 or 80.

I don't think I want to go through the 100A upgrade you described.

I presume I can still get the unit installed using a load-balancer add-on.
What do you think?

AndyBoBandy

zg3409 wrote: »

Tesla only sell chargers to Tesla owners too.

I'd say it'd be easy enough to find a Tesla owner, and say here's €530 cash, would you mind ordering me a Tesla Wall Connecter?, and when it's delivered, I'll come and pick it up

KCross

xboxdad wrote: »

I found this in our meter box: 60/80A, Series 7, Type II a., 415V. B.S. 88.

Is it expensive to upgrade to a 100A fuse?
Who does it? The 3rd party installer or I need to contact Electric Ireland or ESB?


Thanks.

"Every" house has that on their meter box. Its the same box for everyone which can take a 60A or 80A fuse.

It is likely to be a 60A fuse but could be 80A. The thing is that you dont know unless you open it and look at it.... which technically you are not allowed do as its ESB's property.

If your house is just a standard house it likely has a 60A fuse in there.
Upgrading it to 80A costs money.... ~€1100 to the ESB(iirc) and then you need to get an electrician to check your house wiring and ensure it is capable of taking 80A... its not just a case of swap the fuse in that box. The ESB wont do that until they get a cert from an electrician to say its OK and you've paid them their money!


I doubt you need 100A anyway. 80A is enough to charge two EV's and run heat pumps etc. 60A would be tight.

It depends really on what you have running.

zg3409

xboxdad wrote: »

Thank you for your help!

Well, I ordered an Andersen A2 unit and they said 100A is ideal, 60/80A is so-so and that I need to get it confirmed with my supplier if it's 60 or 80.

I don't think I want to go through the 100A upgrade you described.

I presume I can still get the unit installed using a load-balancer add-on.
What do you think?

In the UK 80 amp is normal. Assuming you intend 32 Amp 7kW system then you will only have an issue if you have an instant shower like triton, a heat pump or other heavy load. If you have such an item the charger needs to have built in load sensing or you need an external priority unit typically 200 euro extra + install. When your shower is on, the car will stop charging until the shower stops.

eoferrall

xboxdad wrote: »

Thank you for your help!

Well, I ordered an Andersen A2 unit and they said 100A is ideal, 60/80A is so-so and that I need to get it confirmed with my supplier if it's 60 or 80.

I don't think I want to go through the 100A upgrade you described.

I presume I can still get the unit installed using a load-balancer add-on.
What do you think?

nice one! where did you get it if you don't mind me asking? their website has them at crazy prices.

shanec1928

zg3409 wrote: »

Nearly every house has a 60/63 amp main fuse. In order to go higher then the wires from the nearest street box will need to be replaced to the house, then the tails from the Meter to the inside fuseboard, then possibly new or bigger fuseboard. Unless you get 3 phase (very rarely available) then you are still limited to 32amp or 7kW charging rate.

Here is where to apply from esb
https://www.esbnetworks.ie/existing-connection/increasing-decreasing-supply/domestic-user

You might need to do reverse order, upgrade inside then upgrade supply, but the costs might be enormous, mostly dependant on above ground wire to house or buried wire or conduit trunking. Length affects quote too along with local limitations. Not worth it unless you really need it

to piggy back on this we plan on having an electric car within the next 18 months so keeping an eye in here, what i cant seem to see is we have a house with MIC 9kVA would we be able to charge a car off this have electric shower too? is it much of an ordeal to get upgraded to 12kVA which appears to be standard now. cant see anything cost wise either

xboxdad

Thanks for the advice everyone!

eoferrall wrote: »

nice one! where did you get it if you don't mind me asking? their website has them at crazy prices.

I had to buy it form their web site straight. I didn't find it sold in Ireland so far and it's approx 6 weeks for them to send it out form the date of ordering.
So I didn't want to waste more time looking.


The reason I'm going for this is not because it's smart or anything. I don't care about apps/etc... I picked this one because I don't want to see cables when not in use and I also don't want to pack the cable away every time into the car after use. I didn't find any other option for these requirements.

KCross

shanec1928 wrote: »

to piggy back on this we plan on having an electric car within the next 18 months so keeping an eye in here, what i cant seem to see is we have a house with MIC 9kVA would we be able to charge a car off this have electric shower too? is it much of an ordeal to get upgraded to 12kVA which appears to be standard now. cant see anything cost wise either

Are you sure its 9kVA? That must be a really old house?
What fuse rating do you have in your fuse board?

You'd need to call ESB to see what it would cost to upgrade to a 12kVA. You'd also have to have a full house wiring inspection so you'd probably hit multiple snags there too if the house is as old as it sounds so that could cost more than the ESB side of the upgrade as they would have to bring it up to current regulations.


You wont be able to charge an EV and have an electric shower on at the same time. You would have what they call a priority device which will only allow one of them to be on at any one time. Its automatic and the shower would usually stop the charge point and then when you turn off the shower the car starts charging again.

darrenheaphy

xboxdad wrote: »

Thanks for the advice everyone!





I had to buy it form their web site straight. I didn't find it sold in Ireland so far and it's approx 6 weeks for them to send it out form the date of ordering.
So I didn't want to waste more time looking.


The reason I'm going for this is not because it's smart or anything. I don't care about apps/etc... I picked this one because I don't want to see cables when not in use and I also don't want to pack the cable away every time into the car after use. I didn't find any other option for these requirements.

Nice, it's a beautiful looking charger. Are you booking any typical registered Electrician to install it or do you still book someone who specialises in EV charges?

ClareGirl70

MJohnston wrote: »

If your car's app has scheduled charging and it can show the level of charge in your vehicle then you do not need a smart charger at all imo.

There may be some smart chargers with real power user features like historical usage charts or something, but they're not worth it (and you can get an energy monitor for your entire house that would be better value).

The EO Mini (not the Pro version) for that price is an absolute bargain. I have one for my i3 and it looks really clean and tidy and works excellently.

Thank you! That’s how I’m thinking too.....I can’t think of what extra a smart charger might offer that’s worth the additional €300.
Good to hear that you’re happy with the EO Mini. Do you have the tethered version? If yes, is there a holder for the cable when it’s not in use? I can’t find images showing the unit with the tethered cable when not I use. I don’t want it lying on the ground.

slave1

xboxdad wrote: »

Thank you for your help!

Well, I ordered an Andersen A2 unit and they said 100A is ideal, 60/80A is so-so and that I need to get it confirmed with my supplier if it's 60 or 80.

I don't think I want to go through the 100A upgrade you described.

I presume I can still get the unit installed using a load-balancer add-on.
What do you think?

Jesus, that's one damn expensive charge point, that's a lot of dollar for what is essentially a smart plug and looks priced for grants.
Shame the days of no-grants and low demand are gone, basic charge points for €200 no probs back then.
Good luck with it though, nice looking and neat cable solution

shanec1928

KCross wrote: »

Are you sure its 9kVA? That must be a really old house?
What fuse rating do you have in your fuse board?

You'd need to call ESB to see what it would cost to upgrade to a 12kVA. You'd also have to have a full house wiring inspection so you'd probably hit multiple snags there too if the house is as old as it sounds so that could cost more than the ESB side of the upgrade as they would have to bring it up to current regulations.


You wont be able to charge an EV and have an electric shower on at the same time. You would have what they call a priority device which will only allow one of them to be on at any one time. Its automatic and the shower would usually stop the charge point and then when you turn off the shower the car starts charging again.

positive have the supply letter from esb when you move in. edit dug out the letter its actually 8kVA



20 - 30 years old, were give or take 400m off the main road up a country lane.


not sure on fuse rating https://imgur.com/a/AEGZ6VC is that any good to get the info?


good to hear that it is possible.

xboxdad

darrenheaphy wrote: »

Nice, it's a beautiful looking charger. Are you booking any typical registered Electrician to install it or do you still book someone who specialises in EV charges?

I think I'll still book an EV specialist. I have at least 6 weeks to figure that one out

Bella Bee

Would also love to hear some recommendations for a charge-point install (in Limerick). Thanks

liamog

MJohnston wrote: »

Just wondering - why isn't there a Home Charging FAQ pinned in this forum? There's so much of this thread that is re-asking the same questions that I think it'd be very useful.

If you want to come up with the content, I'll happily sticky it.

Cyrus

xboxdad wrote: »

Thanks for the advice everyone!





I had to buy it form their web site straight. I didn't find it sold in Ireland so far and it's approx 6 weeks for them to send it out form the date of ordering.
So I didn't want to waste more time looking.


The reason I'm going for this is not because it's smart or anything. I don't care about apps/etc... I picked this one because I don't want to see cables when not in use and I also don't want to pack the cable away every time into the car after use. I didn't find any other option for these requirements.

nice charger that, i went with the EO as i can hide it behind a drain on the gable end of my house so it will be unseen but if i was going to have something that would be visible anywhere id have gone for this.

xboxdad

Cyrus wrote: »

nice charger that, i went with the EO as i can hide it behind a drain on the gable end of my house so it will be unseen but if i was going to have something that would be visible anywhere id have gone for this.

Yeah, for me it's going to be very visible. If it was on the side of the house, I wouldn't care.

MJohnston

ClareGirl70 wrote: »

Thank you! That’s how I’m thinking too.....I can’t think of what extra a smart charger might offer that’s worth the additional €300.
Good to hear that you’re happy with the EO Mini. Do you have the tethered version? If yes, is there a holder for the cable when it’s not in use? I can’t find images showing the unit with the tethered cable when not I use. I don’t want it lying on the ground.

No I got an untethered version because I didn't want a cable ruining the look of my house and also making our side entrance too narrow. It doesn't look like the tethered version has a holder, but you could probably fix that very cheaply and easily like this:

ClareGirl70

MJohnston wrote: »

No I got an untethered version because I didn't want a cable ruining the look of my house and also making our side entrance too narrow. It doesn't look like the tethered version has a holder, but you could probably fix that very cheaply and easily like this:

Thank you! That is indeed a neat and inexpensive solution. My charger will be at the side of the house and having a cable there won’t be an issue......that and I want the convenience of tethered

FixdePitchmark

slave1 wrote: »

Jesus, that's one damn expensive charge point, that's a lot of dollar for what is essentially a smart plug and looks priced for grants.
Shame the days of no-grants and low demand are gone, basic charge points for €200 no probs back then.
Good luck with it though, nice looking and neat cable solution

I'm new to this - and seai should review the whole thing. If we are trying to go to a smart grid / encourage people to go for an electric charger - how on earth is it ending up at 1100 euro +.

Mad stuff - the price has just adjusted up to match the free money from grant.

You could do it all cheaper yourself - without a grant.

Sheep Shagger

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

I'm new to this - and seai should review the whole thing. If we are trying to go to a smart grid / encourage people to go for an electric charger - how on earth is it ending up at 1100 euro +.

Mad stuff - the price has just adjusted up to match the free money from grant.

Like anything when the government gets involved with subsidies etc whether it be housing or EV home chargers. We don't have a lot of choice though and given they should last a good while we just have to suck it up.

FixdePitchmark

Sheep Shagger wrote: »

Like anything when the government gets involved with subsidies etc whether it be housing or EV home chargers. We don't have a lot of choice though and given they should last a good while we just have to suck it up.

For anyone living in a city - doing small km - the perfect candidate for an EV - the payback time on the charger is another factor.

Sheep Shagger

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

For anyone living in a city - doing small km - the perfect candidate for an EV - the payback time on the charger is another factor.

That's us and while we could go without a home charger and charge for free at Lidl or wherever, my time over the next X amount of years is worth more than the €500 net cost the charger we are getting installed from Electric Ireland in a couple of weeks is.

We factored it in to the price of the car TBH.

KCross

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

I'm new to this - and seai should review the whole thing. If we are trying to go to a smart grid / encourage people to go for an electric charger - how on earth is it ending up at 1100 euro +.

Mad stuff - the price has just adjusted up to match the free money from grant.

You could do it all cheaper yourself - without a grant.

The charge point itself is anything from €450-€800+. The electrician, whether grant aid or not, needs to be paid so its easy to see how it is €1k+

Removing the grant isnt going to significantly reduce the price. You just need to get a spark who isnt asking for ridiculous money and you might just scrape it inside the current grant amount.

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

For anyone living in a city - doing small km - the perfect candidate for an EV - the payback time on the charger is another factor.

Indeed, but its not something you buy for each EV. If you sell your car in 5yrs time and buy another one you can still use the same charge point so its cost is spread over decades, which makes it less of a burden if thats how you want to calculate payback.

FixdePitchmark

KCross wrote: »

The charge point itself is anything from €450-€800+. The electrician, whether grant aid or not, needs to be paid so its easy to see how it is €1k+

Removing the grant isnt going to significantly reduce the price. You just need to get a spark who isnt asking for ridiculous money and you might just scrape it inside the current grant amount.





Indeed, but its not something you buy for each EV. If you sell your car in 5yrs time and buy another one you can still use the same charge point so its cost is spread over decades, which makes it less of a burden if thats how you want to calculate payback.

How much should an electrician charge for this work ?

Also - I don't buy decades - the technology has already changed a few times in a 10 years.

KCross

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

How much should an electrician charge for this work ?

Depends on the job. They usually go on call out and per hour.
It could be a simple job with the charge point and fuse board at either side of a gable wall (like in a 3-bed semi) or it could be a difficult job with fishing cables through attics and digging footpaths etc... it all depends.

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Also - I don't buy decades - the technology has already changed a few times in a 10 years.

What technology?
The charge points havent changed at all really. I think you are referring to DC charge points or car batteries or something?


What they have done is added some smarts like Solar integration and app support etc but the charge point from 10 years ago is much the same as the new ones under the hood.
i.e. Buying a new car doesnt mean you need to buy a new charge point unless you want the latest gadgetry.

digiman

Got the Zappi installed this week. Was a difficult enough install as the dist board was at the party wall in a semi-D house and right in the centre of the house so options were to take the cable out through the kitchen and around the back of the house and up the whole length of the gable wall out to the front or take it through the sitting room and go directly to the front.

What I got done was to take it up through the attic and out the front of the house and hide the cable by the downpipe. Installer done a very neat job on it, cable is not going through any room in the house and well hidden at the front, there was an electrician and an apprentice who were there from 10:30 to 5:30 and came back the next day to get the Zappi programmed up, it's probably a trickier install than most electrical chargers as CT clamps are also required which they ran cat5e cable for also. Was E700 plus VAT, not cheap but they done a very good job so didn't mind, but another 800 plus VAT for the charger makes it very expensive all together.

slave1

Charge points don’t need to cost a grand if you’ve no need for all the extra features, I posted a £200 used 5m tethered type 2 a week or so ago on this thread