Home charge points (purchase/problems/questions) (See mod note post#1)

Sequencing question.

Am currently sale agreed on a new build, house not looking likely to be finished until March / April.
Electrician is there for the next week or two - and I'd like them to fit a charge point now, before all of the plastering etc is done. Have no interest in retro-fitting if at all possible!

However, how can/will this work with regards to the SEAI grant? I own an electric car, but I don't yet own the house. Obviously them laying cable adequately to a good location is all that needs doing today, but is there anything else that I should ask them to cater for?

How can / should I organise this?

slave1

I could be confusing it with the PV grant but I'm pretty sure you need MPRN number from your electricity bill and this alone will stop you, you also need approval prior to any work being carried out.
Laying the appropriate cable is about all you can do.
Make sure you run AT LEAST two Cat6 cables to the charge point so you can have the option to remotely monitor in the future, these should run back to your Consumer Unit although no harm in two to the attic in case of PV/battery in the future

the_amazing_raisin

You can do the work now, in fact I'd recommend it as retrofitting later is a hassle

You probably won't be able to get the grant for the installation costs however, since you won't be able to apply for the grant until you own the house

So simple solution:

1. cable for a charger now
2. apply for the grant after you buy the house
3. once the grant letter comes through buy a charger and get it wired to the existing cable
4. claim for the charger and the fitting to the cable for up to €600

In terms of other stuff, some folks here recommend running cat-6 networking cable to the charge point and to the meter for adding energy monitors later. This might be worth doing, especially if you're getting the house fitted for networking cables

As slave1 said, if there's any chance of installing PV in the future, then run cat-6 to the attic (or garage if you have one) to monitor the battery. In fact, I'd almost ask them to install a 63A rated cable into the attic from the consumer unit, so you won't have to add that if you get PV installed

Risteard81

Gumbo wrote: »

Same old argument.

I posted the type of RCBO my electrician put it before and another poster said it was the wrong one. Yet mine was installed and certified by a electrician for the grant.

Some say an isolation switch required, some don’t. Again, interpretation.

Only recently we had KN saying they didn’t require an isolation switch outside on here as there interpretation differed from another.

Non-compliance with the Technical Rules is not a matter of interpretation. It is a breach pure and simple, and a RECI Inspector would force them to correct it at their cost if discovered.

Gumbo

Deleted User wrote: »

Sequencing question.

Am currently sale agreed on a new build, house not looking likely to be finished until March / April.
Electrician is there for the next week or two - and I'd like them to fit a charge point now, before all of the plastering etc is done. Have no interest in retro-fitting if at all possible!

However, how can/will this work with regards to the SEAI grant? I own an electric car, but I don't yet own the house. Obviously them laying cable adequately to a good location is all that needs doing today, but is there anything else that I should ask them to cater for?

How can / should I organise this?

You cant do any of the work now without an MPRN to avail of the grant.

This is what id do;

Get the sparks to run the 6mm Sq. cable or 10mm if theres any benefit but i dont think there is. Also run an Ethernet cable. Run both of these from the consumer unit to the point where you will install the charger. Leave some slack.

The Ethernet cable may need to be ran from where your broadband router will be so double check that.

Then when you get the house, it will be so easy.
Even better if you get the 40a RCBO or whats required fitted to the Consumer unit now, and just fit an external socket outside until you get the charger.

liamog

Risteard81 wrote: »

Non-compliance with the Technical Rules is not a matter of interpretation. It is a breach pure and simple, and a RECI Inspector would force them to correct it at their cost if discovered.

Mod Note: Can we end the back and forth on the regulations, from a consumer point of view, the requirement is for an installation to be signed of by a Registered Electrical Contractor (RECI), more detailed discussion is out side the scope of this board

Thanks all.

Laying 6mm cables and Cat6 to front of house seems like all I can be doing at moment. Second I get MRPN details I get applying for SEAI and then 'bring back' same electrician to install the chargepoint?

Dohvolle

I think any RECI electrician should be able to install one, but the SEAI have a list of approved sparks, make sure your guy is one of them.

graememk

Dohvolle wrote: »

I think any RECI electrician should be able to install one, but the SEAI have a list of approved sparks, make sure your guy is one of them.

the seai list for car chargers installs and RECI registered is the same list.

KCross

Dohvolle wrote: »

I think any RECI electrician should be able to install one, but the SEAI have a list of approved sparks, make sure your guy is one of them.

I think you are confusing it with SolsPV grant which is an approved list of installers as its more than just electrical requirements.

AFAIK all you need for the car charge point grant is any RECI.

KCross

Deleted User wrote: »

Laying 6mm cables and Cat6 to front of house seems like all I can be doing at moment.

Throwing standard cat5/6 cable in may not stand the test of time if it is exposed to the elements outdoors and ideally it needs to be shielded data cable to ensure accuracy as it will be running alongside a power cable.... you can get 6mm cable which also has shielded twisted pair cable built in so you only have one cable run.

Might be worth asking for that. Not cheap though!

Here is an example of it.
https://www.expertelectrical.co.uk/doncaster-cables-ev-ultra-cable


This guy in the UK does alot of EV installs and knows his stuff. He shows the cable in this video and it will generally give you an idea of whats involved in getting a charge point installed.

Gumbo

Dohvolle wrote: »

I think any RECI electrician should be able to install one, but the SEAI have a list of approved sparks, make sure your guy is one of them.

Any registered electrician can do it.
They don’t need to be on any list other than a Safe Electric list

yannakis

Looking for a small-ish and not necessarily smart home charger. Some of the options I've seen around are Wallbox Pulsar, EO Mini (or the Pro 2), QUBEV but I can't find any Irish installers. Has anyone had any experience with any of the above? Any suggestions for where to source and who to get to install it? I'm located around Dublin.

Risteard81

I install both of those brands/units. You shouldn't have any difficulty finding someone.

Cyrus

yannakis wrote: »

Looking for a small-ish and not necessarily smart home charger. Some of the options I've seen around are Wallbox Pulsar, EO Mini (or the Pro 2), QUBEV but I can't find any Irish installers. Has anyone had any experience with any of the above? Any suggestions for where to source and who to get to install it? I'm located around Dublin.

electric ireland do the eo mini

rx8

So my application was resubmitted on 20th November and the money is in my account this morning. Less than 4 weeks since posting. They must have had a guilty feeling after telling me the first application was incomplete.

yannakis

Risteard81 wrote: »

I install both of those brands/units. You shouldn't have any difficulty finding someone.

Alright, I can pat my back too. Any pointers though? :pac:

Cyrus wrote: »

electric ireland do the eo mini

I thought that's for their customers only - do they do it for customers of other providers too?

Cyrus

yannakis wrote: »

I thought that's for their customers only - do they do it for customers of other providers too?

no anyone.

AndyBoBandy

EI are just taking your money and paying someone else to install it, so they'll do it for anyone.

yannakis

Spoke with Electric Ireland so I'll just leave this here for anyone that might be interested.

Their prices are fixed no matter what. Price doesn't increase no matter how far your fusebox is, but price also doesn't reduce if you have the cable already in (like myself). So they might be easy to deal with and reliable bla bla but I'm looking to save what I've already spent on running the cable so, not for me.

TitianGerm

rx8 wrote: »

So my application was resubmitted on 20th November and the money is in my account this morning. Less than 4 weeks since posting. They must have had a guilty feeling after telling me the first application was incomplete.

Just checked mine and it was lodged today as well. I got the approval email on the 17th November so exactly 4 weeks.

They must have wanted to get everyone paid before finishing up for Christmas.

Felexicon

yannakis wrote: »

Spoke with Electric Ireland so I'll just leave this here for anyone that might be interested.

Their prices are fixed no matter what. Price doesn't increase no matter how far your fusebox is, but price also doesn't reduce if you have the cable already in (like myself). So they might be easy to deal with and reliable bla bla but I'm looking to save what I've already spent on running the cable so, not for me.

Don't think recommendations are allowed in thread unfortunately

Cyrus

yannakis wrote: »

Spoke with Electric Ireland so I'll just leave this here for anyone that might be interested.

Their prices are fixed no matter what. Price doesn't increase no matter how far your fusebox is, but price also doesn't reduce if you have the cable already in (like myself). So they might be easy to deal with and reliable bla bla but I'm looking to save what I've already spent on running the cable so, not for me.

That’s not quite true I paid extra as my install was unusual, anyway you may find their price is competitive in any event ! Installation costs are mental

Risteard81

yannakis wrote: »

Spoke with Electric Ireland so I'll just leave this here for anyone that might be interested.

Their prices are fixed no matter what. Price doesn't increase no matter how far your fusebox is, but price also doesn't reduce if you have the cable already in (like myself). So they might be easy to deal with and reliable bla bla but I'm looking to save what I've already spent on running the cable so, not for me.

Like I told someone looking an OLEV grant install who was saying they'd had a cable run and RCBO installed I won't reduce price for that as there's usually more work correcting incorrect work.

<<snip>>

Mod Note: Snipping technical details, as per https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=115629125&postcount=2852, this is not the audience or board for the minutia of EVSE installation compliance

Risteard81

yannakis wrote: »

Spoke with Electric Ireland so I'll just leave this here for anyone that might be interested.

Their prices are fixed no matter what. Price doesn't increase no matter how far your fusebox is, but price also doesn't reduce if you have the cable already in (like myself). So they might be easy to deal with and reliable bla bla but I'm looking to save what I've already spent on running the cable so, not for me.

No good Electrician will discount you for running a cable (which you shouldn't have run). These are Restricted Electrical Works.

slave1

slave1 wrote: »

So posted off my completed form and attachments today for the home chargepoint grant.
Tick tock, let's see how long it takes....

..and letter today, checked account and money hit it yesterday so 5 weeks exactly.
Not bad, my PV grant was 18 calendar days for payment by comparison

rx8

Good that we all got paid before Christmas. I think I won though, as it took less than 4 weeks for mine to come through.

finneys13

Hi. I already have a Tesla Wall Charger for my Tesla. My girlfriend is planning to get a Peugeot e208 now.

Is the sensible option to get a second Tesla Wall Charger and daisy chain them together and they share the load? Or install a 13A or even 16A outdoor plug for granny charger, either via the Tesla Wall Charger (is that even possible?) or directly back to the fuseboard (pretty new 80A one).

Any other ideas for charging?

the_amazing_raisin

finneys13 wrote: »

Hi. I already have a Tesla Wall Charger for my Tesla. My girlfriend is planning to get a Peugeot e208 now.

Is the sensible option to get a second Tesla Wall Charger and daisy chain them together and they share the load? Or install a 13A or even 16A outdoor plug for granny charger, either via the Tesla Wall Charger (is that even possible?) or directly back to the fuseboard (pretty new 80A one).

Any other ideas for charging?

You'll need a charger that supports load balancing or sharing to daisy chain 2 chargers the way you described

For example if the existing charger is connected to a 32A fuse, then it'll charge at the full 32A.

Connecting a second charger to the same circuit would put a 64A load and cause the circuit to overload

Similarly, you probably can't support a second 32A charger, because typically a house would only have 64A available, so you'd have none left over

Chargers that support load sharing will reduce charging speed to share the available power, or prioritise one charger over the other. I don't think the Tesla wall charger supports this type of charging. The Zappi supports this and I think the EO Mini Pro does as well if you add the ALM module

Unfortunately, you'll need something similar for using the granny lead, as this will presumably be using power from the same circuit as your charger (unless you plug it into a socket on a different circuit)

There is a fairly easy short term solution, just take turns on the charger. Both cars have decent range so unless you both use more than 50% charge every day then you'll probably get away with taking turns each day

EDIT: There's one other option, you could set your charger to charge at 16A instead, and install another 16A charger so you can share the 32A circuit safely. You'll permanently be reducing the charging power to 3.6kW in this case, so of you don't need quicker charging them this might work

KCross

cruisey1987 wrote: »

Chargers that support load sharing will reduce charging speed to share the available power, or prioritise one charger over the other. I don't think the Tesla wall charger supports this type of charging.

It does but only if its used between two Tesla wall chargers. They share a set amount of amps between them.