Ireland vs Wales 24th Feb 2:15

Burkie1203

Bridge93 wrote: »

Saw on Twitter:

Wales have conceded 4 tries or more in the 6N 7 times. Last time was 2006 to England. 4 times to same, 3 times to Ireland.

With Garland in charge Wales have conceded 3 tries in the 6N 5 times. 3 times to Ireland including the last time, 5 years ago.

Stands 11-7 in the head to head in six nations games.

Yet it was repeatedly said Wales were our bogey team and have our number.


Interestingly yesterday was irelands narrowest home victory over Wales in the 6/5N since 1990. We either lose or beat them well.

Since Gatland took over wales, they have only shipped 30+ points in 6n on three occasions.

2013 v Ireland (22-30) *Howley was in charge due to Lions tour.
2010 v England (30-17)
2018 v Ireland (37-27)

Rezident

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

Sexton had a poor game today....we should be grateful that the Scottish game is next and he can get over his yips before the England game.

No he didn't, he had a great game and played some great rugby, made some great runs and brilliant passes and offloads. He missed two straight-forward kicks that ultimately did not matter, he's not a robot.

.ak

Yeah, even the Welsh lads we were sitting with thought he was brilliant and the difference in the sides.

Kicks from the Tee aside, he was brilliant, one of our best players.

irishbucsfan

I wonder if it's possible that Sexton wasn't either absolutely brilliant or unbelievably terrible?

.ak

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I wonder if it's possible that Sexton wasn't either absolutely brilliant or unbelievably terrible?

Get off the fence IBF!!

BBDBB

Maybe he is both and as such is finally proof of alternative dimensions

Jack Kanoff

Rezident wrote: »

No he didn't, he had a great game and played some great rugby, made some great runs and brilliant passes and offloads. He missed two straight-forward kicks that ultimately did not matter, he's not a robot.

He missed 3 easy ones and I was referring to his kicking in that post as you already knew

stephen_n

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

He missed 3 easy ones and I was referring to his kicking in that post as you already knew

2, if you’re counting the conversion of Stockdale’s try as easy, you’re taking the piss.

Gonad

People giving out about Sexton would realize what he brings if we gets injured as cannot play in the next two games .

With Sexton a grand slam if 50/50

Without him I would say we have no chance

Burkie1203

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

He missed 3 easy ones and I was referring to his kicking in that post as you already knew

He missed a few kicks but that shouldnt take away from the rest of his performance which was excellent. Its also clear he had a minor knock which impacted his kicking.


On another note, Earls put in a fantastic clear out at a ruck just before Healys try. It was was followed by Sexton running over Steff Evans

leakyboots

Great game of rugby, pulsating.

Sexton had a bit of a horror show with the boot and some questionable decisions like the quick penalty but I thought he was good in play for us, he gets the backline going off structured ball like lineouts.

Earls was superb again, he's unplayable lately but he's been doing that for his whole career, shame that he gets injured so often and hopefully he'll be okay for the rest of the tournament - he's one of the only ones in the backline who can create something out of nothing. We needed him on the ball more yesterday I thought.

Farrell went very well and hopefully answered some doubters writing him off before he was even capped. I think we're quick to anoint or condemn here based on a couple of games. Would like to see more of him in the summer tour to tighten things up defensively but he seems to have the goods for this level, he's a huge lump with pass and passing - totally different animal to Henshaw who I don't think distributes as well but is more solid defensively. Same for Porter, early days but he's looking good. John Ryan minced their scrum too when he came on. And how good is it to see Cian Healy back to his bullocking best?

Kearney turned in the sort of performance he's been doing for several years now, sadly. I've said my piece on him numerous times before so I'll leave it there. I'm not sure Ferg McFadden is who you want coming on at this level anymore either. It's a pity Conway got injured.

Backrow as a unit were superb - Stander just.does.not.stop. Incredible workrate through to the last minute. Ditto POM, you want him in these sorts of games - he'll be invaluable in the England match should we overcome the Scots. Leavy was superb too, pick of the backrow. I think he could link play a bit better sometimes like a traditional 7 but he's invaluable on the ground and disrupting ball, love watching him play.

Stockdale still has defensive flaws, Earls had them too in his early days - but when you're finishing tries like he is I think that can make up for it. The defensive mistakes doesn't seem to be just down to him, more of a systemic thing which is a worry. As is the constant 1-out, we had Earls screaming for ball with half a pitch and one man against him and we were still hammering away under the post. Now, we got over, but jaysis take the better option!

Great stat on Stockdale - he has as many international tries as Luke Fitz and Dave Kearney combined already!

edit: another stat on Stockdale, Earls hold the record for most international tries in a season for Ireland with 9... wonder will Stockdale eclipse/smash that!

Jack Kanoff

stephen_n wrote: »

2, if you’re counting the conversion of Stockdale’s try as easy, you’re taking the piss.

I hold Sexton to a higher standard as he's normally lethal.

leakyboots

Edit to add I'm mystified the criticism of Sexton's kicking - he's shown in recent years he's a top notch kicker and they can all have their off days. Plus given the concerns over his back that's been rumoured, it sort of makes sense.

punisher5112

From what I seen he played some very good runs and tackles just his kicks at goal were off that day.

Only he knows why, wind or maybe even his legs or foot wasn't a 100%

Not just saying cause we one but it was a great game.

On the Scotland game it was an outcome I don't think anyone seen coming in the way they played.

They done a fantastic job and gave it all.

irishbucsfan

irishbucsfan wrote: »

I wonder if it's possible that Sexton wasn't either absolutely brilliant or unbelievably terrible?

He was sort of both.

Jack Kanoff

Burkie1203 wrote: »

He missed a few kicks but that shouldnt take away from the rest of his performance which was excellent. Its also clear he had a minor knock which impacted his kicking.


On another note, Earls put in a fantastic clear out at a ruck just before Healys try. It was was followed by Sexton running over Steff Evans

I made no reference to his running of the game...I referred to his yips...his kicking was off and even at the start of the game I referenced an injury....this over protection of Sexton by some is a bit laughable.

Former Former

Buer wrote: »

People were criticising the call to take Earls off before knowing he was struggling with cramp. And that was when there's an experienced member of the squad available to come in for Earls.

The backlash against removing Murray or Sexton prematurely for the likes of Carbery would have been much stronger. Damned if you do, damned of you don't.

It's not even a case of trust in Marmion/McGrath or Carbery.

Reddan, Madigan and Jackson were all more established and experienced than the current options and they never got more than a brief cameo in big games.

The point is that Murray and Sexton are utterly critical to the game plan and much better than their replacements. They have to stay on the pitch while there's any doubt over the outcome.

This isn't under-9s rugby, there's no obligation to give everyone a run.

Jack Kanoff

Former Former wrote: »

It's not even a case of trust in Marmion/McGrath or Carbery.

Reddan, Madigan and Jackson were all more established and experienced than the current options and they never got more than a brief cameo in big games.

The point is that Murray and Sexton are utterly critical to the game plan and much better than their replacements. They have to stay on the pitch while there's any doubt over the outcome.

This isn't under-9s rugby, there's no obligation to give everyone a run.

Last line made me snort

stephen_n

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

I hold Sexton to a higher standard as he's normally lethal.

A touchine kick at the havelock square end isn’t easy for any kicker. I will say that on most days I’d expect him to nail it. There was something not right yesterday with his standing leg, you could see it each time he kicked. Which probably motivated the choice to run that penalty. Strange thing is why wasn’t he pulled from kicking duties if there was a problem.

Birdie Num Num

Gonad wrote: »

People giving out about Sexton would realize what he brings if we gets injured as cannot play in the next two games .

With Sexton a grand slam if 50/50

Without him I would say we have no chance

Sexton was excellent but we can win without him too. We have great depth but with him or without we can win or lose. We are a better side with him of course.

If we give away possession/territory to Scotland we’ll be punished. We are a better team and probably better than England right now but those trys against us so far were all too easy.

Jack Kanoff

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

I made no reference to his running of the game...I referred to his yips...his kicking was off and even at the start of the game I referenced an injury....this over protection of Sexton by some is a bit laughable.

It's obvious his goal kicking wasn't very good. You're not really making any point that isn't blindingly obvious there. But when you say things like:

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

Sexton had a poor game today.

No he didn't. He goal-kicked poorly. Two of the conversions were very difficult anyway and you wouldn't really blame any kicker for missing them but the two penalty misses were just bad.

Jack Kanoff

stephen_n wrote: »

A touchine kick at the havelock square end isn’t easy for any kicker. I will say that on most days I’d expect him to nail it. There was something not right yesterday with his standing leg, you could see it each time he kicked. Which probably motivated the choice to run that penalty. Strange thing is why wasn’t he pulled from kicking duties if there was a problem.

I only caught the tail end of an interview, but it seems he didn't have an injury going into the game...but got a kick in the arse at some stage

Burkie1203

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

I made no reference to his running of the game...I referred to his yips...his kicking was off and even at the start of the game I referenced an injury....this over protection of Sexton by some is a bit laughable.

But it wasnt yips. He clearly had an issue which you referenced which impacted his kicking off the tee. But now your saying he had the yips. Your criticising him for the sake of it

Jack Kanoff

Kenzie Harsh Volleyball wrote: »

It's obvious his goal kicking wasn't very good. You're not really making any point that isn't blindingly obvious there. But when you say things like:



No he didn't. He goal-kicked poorly. Two of the conversions were very difficult anyway and you wouldn't really blame any kicker for missing them but the two penalty misses were just bad.

You'll have to learn to quote the whole post

Jack Kanoff

Burkie1203 wrote: »

But it wasnt yips. He clearly had an issue which you referenced which impacted his kicking off the tee. But now your saying he had the yips. Your criticising him for the sake of it

I thought at the start of the game he might have an injury... There was no reference to an existing injury in the post match interview..
I thought it was the yips yesterday...still do tbh.

Burkie1203

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

I thought at the start of the game he might have an injury... There was no reference to an existing injury in the post match interview..
I thought it was the yips yesterday...still do tbh.

All his missed kicks drifted to the right IIRC. That suggests to me he wasnt kicking through the ball fully. He was seen getting physio on his lower back on Friday at the captains run.

Joe mentioned he had a glute issue but not when it happened. That will impact his kicking to some extent.

Burkie1203

Burkie1203 wrote: »

All his missed kicks drifted to the right IIRC. That suggests to me he wasnt kicking through the ball fully. He was seen getting physio on his lower back on Friday at the captains run.

Joe mentioned he had a glute issue but not when it happened. That will impact his kicking to some extent.

Murray Kinsella also posted a video on twitter of him during the warmup in which he was kicking in the exact same fashion, slicing it left to right with not much power at all in it. He clearly had a physical issue of some sort.

Edit - here it is. https://twitter.com/Murray_Kinsella/status/967392988732297216

Bridge93

He had something up with the lower right side of his back from what I've heard

irishbucsfan

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

I thought at the start of the game he might have an injury... There was no reference to an existing injury in the post match interview..
I thought it was the yips yesterday...still do tbh.

There absolutely was mention of an existing injury in the media. He sat out the most of the captain's run yesterday to get work done on his back.

Jack Kanoff

irishbucsfan wrote: »

There absolutely was mention of an existing injury in the media. He sat out the most of the captain's run yesterday to get work done on his back.

Not by Joe in his aftermatch interview...he referenced a kick in the glute

.ak

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

I thought at the start of the game he might have an injury... There was no reference to an existing injury in the post match interview..
I thought it was the yips yesterday...still do tbh.

The "yips"? The same lad who slotted a 45m dropgoal without any advantage in injury time in the pissings of rain in Paris? Come off it. There seems to be some culture from certain posters that Sexton is some sort of 'bottler' under pressure when truth being told nobody knows what's going on inside his head and the only truth is that kicking an oval shaped ball between two sticks isn't a science and nobody has a 100% record.

Missing a sitter infront of the posts for one of, if not currently the best goal kicker in international rugby is not someone getting the jitters. Something was obviously up with his glute/back which he got treatment for before the match and is the exact thing he went off for also.

Burkie1203

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

Not by Joe in his aftermatch interview...he referenced a kick in the glute

He didnt say when though. Could easily have happened in training hence the physio work on friday.

.ak

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

Not by Joe in his aftermatch interview...he referenced a kick in the glute

Coach not mentioning/downplaying a players injury to the world shocker. :eek: :pac:

Jack Kanoff

People seem to be reading some huge anti Sexton bias in my posts...that frankly isn't there ...
But Sexton is one of the finest 10's in the world now...and I was surprised at his kicking yesterday.
As I asked during the game, was there an issue with an injury...I thought it was the yips...all kickers get them...bad day at the office and put it behind you....if he was carrying an injury that prevented him from kicking...well frankly he shouldn't have been kicking... that's my only gripe

irishbucsfan

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

Not by Joe in his aftermatch interview...he referenced a kick in the glute

It was known before the match even started, it was reported on Friday, during the captain's run. So we don't need Joe to talk about it post-match.

That's why Murray was tweeting about it during the warmup, not just for the craic.

Jack Kanoff

irishbucsfan wrote: »

It was known before the match even started, it was reported on Friday, during the captain's run. So we don't need Joe to talk about it post-match.

That's why Murray was tweeting about it during the warmup, not just for the craic.

We saw Sexton getting his back massaged...it could have been anything or nothing.
But...if it impacted his kicking...they would have known by 2pm Saturday ?

irishbucsfan

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

We saw Sexton getting his back massaged...it could have been anything or nothing.
But...if it impacted his kicking...they would have known by 2pm Saturday ?

No. We knew it was not nothing.

I assume they didn't think it was going to affect his kicking at all. He's the only decent kicker in the starting 23, that's just a risk we always take.

.ak

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

People seem to be reading some huge anti Sexton bias in my posts...that frankly isn't there ...
But Sexton is one of the finest 10's in the world now...and I was surprised at his kicking yesterday.
As I asked during the game, was there an issue with an injury...I thought it was the yips...all kickers get them...bad day at the office and put it behind you....if he was carrying an injury that prevented him from kicking...well frankly he shouldn't have been kicking... that's my only gripe

Probably agree with you there, especially as he was missing them in the warm up.

But we don't have any other established kickers. And they have taken gambles on him before. I presume he's pulled through injuries with 80% kicking rate before.

Jack Kanoff

irishbucsfan wrote: »

No. We knew it was not nothing.

I assume they didn't think it was going to affect his kicking at all. He's the only decent kicker in the starting 23, that's just a risk we always take.

I'd be concerned if "we knew it was not nothing'
And the coaching team didn't think it would affect his kicking

Jack Kanoff

.ak wrote: »

Probably agree with you there, especially as he was missing them in the warm up.

But we don't have any other established kickers. And they have taken gambles on him before. I presume he's pulled through injuries with 80% kicking rate before.

Murray loves kicking... granted it's a different ball game in a 6n match against Wales...but we've seen him do it before...should have had a kick or 2 yesterday I thought...but look, that's the only fault I can find in yesterday's performance

Stheno

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

Murray loves kicking... granted it's a different ball game in a 6n match against Wales...but we've seen him do it before...should have had a kick or 2 yesterday I thought...but look, that's the only fault I can find in yesterday's performance

Murray eventually did take over the goal kicking

irishbucsfan

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

I'd be concerned if "we knew it was not nothing'
And the coaching team didn't think it would affect his kicking

Well, if I see any of them I'll be sure to pass on your concerns

Burkie1203

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

People seem to be reading some huge anti Sexton bias in my posts...that frankly isn't there ...
But Sexton is one of the finest 10's in the world now...and I was surprised at his kicking yesterday.
As I asked during the game, was there an issue with an injury...I thought it was the yips...all kickers get them...bad day at the office and put it behind you....if he was carrying an injury that prevented him from kicking...well frankly he shouldn't have been kicking... that's my only gripe

You said earlier in the thread "sexton had a poor game"

Now your only gripe is he was kicking when he shouldnt have been.

Make up your mind

Based on what we know, he had a minor issue of some sort on friday and if it was on his lower back then it is viable that will impact kicking from the tee. Given all his kicks drifted left to right then its more likely an issue rather then the yips.

antietam

Ireland need a full back double quick as Kearney is appalling.

Jack Kanoff

Burkie1203 wrote: »

You said earlier in the thread "sexton had a poor game"

Now your only gripe is he was kicking when he shouldnt have been.

Make up your mind

Based on what we know, he had a minor issue of some sort on friday and if it was on his lower back then it is viable that will impact kicking from the tee. Given all his kicks drifted left to right then its more likely an issue rather then the yips.

He had a poor game with in regards to his kicking... which was what my post said....try reading it.

Birdie Num Num

antietam wrote: »

Ireland need a full back double quick as Kearney is appalling.

I think that this is just becoming something that is too easy for many to say now. He’s certainly not as good as he was but we wasn’t that bad yesterday. We do have options anyhow. Think Schmidt probably can make a better call on it than you or I.

Burkie1203

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

He had a poor game with in regards to his kicking... which was what my post said....try reading it.

I did. But your refusing to look at the evidence if a reason behind his misses other then the yips. He slotted the close range kicks because he didnt have to put too much force into them but he missed the longer ones. Everything points to an issue. But hey whatever you get your kicks from

Birdie Num Num

Jack Kanoff wrote: »

He had a poor game with in regards to his kicking... which was what my post said....try reading it.

Here’s a question. If Sexton had landed that first kick would we have won the game? Wales were shaping up to a kicking game for the first half. The missed kick lead to the first try!

.ak

antietam wrote: »

Ireland need a full back double quick as Kearney is appalling.

I've seen a few comments like this bandied about. So much confirmation bias going on with Kearney. Thought he had one of his better games yesterday, support running was really good, very physical, made yards with most of his carries, that burst through off Sexton's shoulder was lovely, under pressure from 3 defenders and still gets a peach of a pass away.

What are people thinking he did wrong exactly yesterday? Been stood up by George North? Hardly a big issue, we saw players get stood up by worst Italian players two weeks ago and nobody is calling for heads. Was it because he lost a few 50/50 high balls? Do people think we have some automatic right to them? He got hands on the ball every time but got outmuscled on a few, that's the luck of the oval ball for you.

I heard in the stands a bunch of lads giving out about him before the game even started, and then EVERYTHING he did they lambasted. Even the one time when he got handed crap ball in the back field, had three red jerseys hounding him down, and decided to run it back and made a break on the outside. The lads said 'Ah ****s sake Kearney, you're paid to kick that' ... with three chasers breathing down his neck?! If he kicked it 14 players would be offside and if the ball didn't go far enough they'd all be taken out of the game.

Just madness the stick he gets. Thought he had a fine game yesterday, not perfect, but he worked hard and helped the side with more positives than negatives.

Larmour or Zebo are the only other real options and neither of them would've offered more IMO. He's our best fullback by a country mile and is in good shape, his form is getting better game by game. Anyone sharpening their knives for his demise will have to wait a while longer.

Jack Kanoff

Burkie1203 wrote: »

I did. But your refusing to look at the evidence if a reason behind his misses other then the yips. He slotted the close range kicks because he didnt have to put too much force into them but he missed the longer ones. Everything points to an issue. But hey whatever you get your kicks from

And, as I said during the game...did he have an issue?
It wasn't plainly apparent if it was the yips or a physical issue... yips... ok..they pass .. physical issue.... don't kick let someone else do it.
You see to have a problem with someone asking questions...does it offend you personally or something? I'll stop if so