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HR refuse to meet with group of employees affect by same issue

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  • 26-02-2018 3:04pm
    #1
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭


    Hi,

    An issue has happened in work that affects a group of employees. The group of employees has raised the issue as a group. HR will not meet with the people as a group. Instead HR want to meet with the people individually and are insisting that HR issues must be dealt with individually.

    The group of people would prefer a group meeting with HR.

    Can anyone answer the following questions,
    Can HR meet with a group of people to discuss an issue that affects the group of people equally?
    or if HR can only meet with individuals to discuss an issue that affects the group of people equally?

    There may be some follow up questions, please ask. I do not want to give a full outline of the issue, etc, for obvious reasons.
    Regards


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    #2
    Misguided1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 215 ✭✭Misguided1


    I would think that the approach proposed by HR in this instance is sensible.
    it would be very important to get each individuals perspective.

    Even if the issue is the same (say its a managers treatment of their team), each individual needs to explain what their specific concerns are and the impact it is having on them. When HR deal with it (with the manager in my example), they will most likely present it as a group of complaints.

    Is there any particular reason why they would prefer a 'group' meeting with HR?


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    #3
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    Group issues are usually dealt with by union representatives/shop stewert. Have you spoken spoken to your union?


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    #4
    sheesh
    Registered Users Posts: 4,081 ✭✭✭sheesh


    It is a sensible way to do it from HR's point of view. It really depends on the issue (no, do not tell us what the issue is) and you are right to be suspicious but let them go through their process and see how they handle it. basically they will be covering the companies asses if there is a chance they are liable and trying to stop valuable staff members from leaving. they might mediate between staff members if it is a inter personal issue between 2 groups.

    In fairness to HR they would need to get every individuals own view before they could move on an issue too. So it seems sensible.


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    #5
    Gaillimh1976
    Registered Users Posts: 738 ✭✭✭Gaillimh1976


    HR may be afraid that the quieter members of the group might not speak up in a group setting, or that 1 or 2 vocal members may dominate proceeedings.

    Makes sense to get everybody's individual viewpoint, and then have a group meeting as the next step if deemed necessary.


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    #6
    Hasmunch
    Registered Users Posts: 929 ✭✭✭Hasmunch


    Just remember HR are there to protect the company and not the employees


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    #7
    Billgirlylegs
    Registered Users Posts: 494 ✭✭Billgirlylegs


    Group session tends to get "steered" by one or more people, and could tend to get off the point.
    One to one allows HR to hear what everyone's issue is and assess the situation a bit better.

    I'm not HR (and frankly not convinced about whatever "competencies" they bring to the party or how important they are to operating a place generally) but as they are conducting an investigation - I agree that a series of one to one conversations is more informative than a group discussion.


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    #8
    Kristopherus
    Registered Users Posts: 11,907 ✭✭✭✭Kristopherus


    Gaillimh1976 wrote: »
    HR may be afraid that the quieter members of the group might not speak up in a group setting, or that 1 or 2 vocal members may dominate proceeedings.

    Makes sense to get everybody's individual viewpoint, and then have a group meeting as the next step if deemed necessary.

    Well, it's a well-known ruse used by HR depts. The real intent is the old adage "divide and conquer"


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    #9
    Hoboo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,565 ✭✭✭Hoboo


    anonymous71 wrote: »
    Hi,
    Can HR meet with a group of people to discuss an issue that affects the group of people equally?

    Can they? Yes of course, but depending on the grievance, it may not be plausible or the correct course of action. It sounds like you don't want to meet individually, for reasons I can guess but without further information.

    Are you part of a union, have employee representation or is HR the sole employee rep?

    If the former two, then consult with them. Im guessing HR is your sole port of call or you'd already have contacted them, so I would suggest that two people from the group outline the groups grievances on behalf of the group, and discuss the best plan to move forward. HR may be able to solve any issues at this stage, or at the very least outline why individual meetings are necessary, which you can relay to the group.

    Without further info, Im guessing. But in answer to your first questions, there's no reason why HR can't have individual meetings for reasons outlined by others.


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    #10
    Del2005
    Registered Users Posts: 18,992 ✭✭✭✭Del2005


    While they might not want to meet the whole group, there's nothing to stop a co worker attending the interview if invited by the person HR want to talk to.


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    #11
    Hoboo
    Registered Users Posts: 3,565 ✭✭✭Hoboo


    Del2005 wrote: »
    While they might not want to meet the whole group, there's nothing to stop a co worker attending the interview if invited by the person HR want to talk to.


    Well there is, HR aren't obliged, only under grievance procedure. For initial investigative meetings, employees may ask to bring 'support' but are not entitled to do so.


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    #12
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    Misguided1 wrote: »
    I would think that the approach proposed by HR in this instance is sensible.
    it would be very important to get each individuals perspective.

    Even if the issue is the same (say its a managers treatment of their team), each individual needs to explain what their specific concerns are and the impact it is having on them. When HR deal with it (with the manager in my example), they will most likely present it as a group of complaints.

    Is there any particular reason why they would prefer a 'group' meeting with HR?

    The reason to meet as a group is because the issue is not subjective, it's not interpersonal and the people in the group have been affected the same by what has happened. The issue is very simple but very serious, but I'm sure HR may tell us that its not as simple as we see it.

    From our point of view the meeting is not to explain anything from our side, it's to be informed of what should happen and will happen in the situation we find ourselves in. By meeting as a group, HR and the company will realise that the issue needs to be dealt with properly.


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    #13
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    Misguided1 wrote: »
    I would think that the approach proposed by HR in this instance is sensible.
    it would be very important to get each individuals perspective.

    Even if the issue is the same (say its a managers treatment of their team), each individual needs to explain what their specific concerns are and the impact it is having on them. When HR deal with it (with the manager in my example), they will most likely present it as a group of complaints.

    Is there any particular reason why they would prefer a 'group' meeting with HR?

    The reason to meet as a group is because the issue is not subjective, its not interpersonel and the people in the group have been affetced the same way by what has happened. This issue is very simple but very serious, but I'm sure HR may tell us that it is not as simple as we see it.

    From our point of view the meeting is not to explain anything from our side, its to be informed of what should happen and will happen in the situation we find ourselves in. HR are aware of the facts of the complaint, which as I said before is simple and straight forward. By meeting as a group, hopefully HR and the company will realise that the issue needs to be dealt with properly.


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    #14
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    davo10 wrote: »
    Group issues are usually dealt with by union representatives/shop stewert. Have you spoken spoken to your union?

    We do not have a union. Thanks


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    #15
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    Gaillimh1976 wrote: »
    HR may be afraid that the quieter members of the group might not speak up in a group setting, or that 1 or 2 vocal members may dominate proceeedings.

    Makes sense to get everybody's individual viewpoint, and then have a group meeting as the next step if deemed necessary.

    The group is not big, lets say its less than 6 and we are all very vocal about what has happened, but with a larger group I can see how this may be an issue.

    As it is a small group and as the issue is straight forward we feel that it should move straight to the group meeting as it will be necessary.


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    #16
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    Hoboo wrote: »
    Can they? Yes of course, but depending on the grievance, it may not be plausible or the correct course of action. It sounds like you don't want to meet individually, for reasons I can guess but without further information.

    Are you part of a union, have employee representation or is HR the sole employee rep?

    If the former two, then consult with them. Im guessing HR is your sole port of call or you'd already have contacted them, so I would suggest that two people from the group outline the groups grievances on behalf of the group, and discuss the best plan to move forward. HR may be able to solve any issues at this stage, or at the very least outline why individual meetings are necessary, which you can relay to the group.

    Without further info, Im guessing. But in answer to your first questions, there's no reason why HR can't have individual meetings for reasons outlined by others.

    Thanks for this answer, this is the information I was looking for. We have been told that individual meetings are required because of confidentiality. We think this is not a valid reason as it is not an interpersonal issue, and we as a group are happy that there is a group meeting held. It is HR that wish to have the individual meetings for obvious reasons.

    There is no union to consult with.


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    #17
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    Hoboo wrote: »
    Well there is, HR aren't obliged, only under grievance procedure. For initial investigative meetings, employees may ask to bring 'support' but are not entitled to do so.

    Thannks for clarification about grievance procedure. If the group meeting is refused and the request to invite someone to the meeting is also refuesed, it might be time to look at other ways to get the issue resolved.


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    #18
    bobbysands81
    Registered Users Posts: 7,211 ✭✭✭bobbysands81


    anonymous71 wrote: »
    Hi,

    An issue has happened in work that affects a group of employees. The group of employees has raised the issue as a group. HR will not meet with the people as a group. Instead HR want to meet with the people individually and are insisting that HR issues must be dealt with individually.

    The group of people would prefer a group meeting with HR.

    Can anyone answer the following questions,
    Can HR meet with a group of people to discuss an issue that affects the group of people equally?
    or if HR can only meet with individuals to discuss an issue that affects the group of people equally?

    There may be some follow up questions, please ask. I do not want to give a full outline of the issue, etc, for obvious reasons.
    Regards

    Always a difficult one to manage.

    From HRs point of view it is completely understandable that they would want to meet with all people affected by an issue to ensure they have a compete picture of the problem and so can help resolve it.

    From an employees point of view it’s completely understandable that they would be suspicious of HR and would think that they’re trying to divide and conquer.

    I’ve met with groups to help them resolve issues (but not as a HR rep) and I’ve always found that what some individuals say in a group setting can be completely different to what they say when meeting one on one.


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    #19
    _Brian
    Registered Users Posts: 18,574 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    Every employee is hired individually and dealt with individually from a HR perspective.
    The company have no obligation to start meeting groups about hr issues if it doesn’t not want to.


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    #20
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    _Brian wrote: »
    Every employee is hired individually and dealt with individually from a HR perspective.
    The company have no obligation to start meeting groups about hr issues if it doesn’t not want to.

    Especially in a non unionised environment with no collective representation where they can intimidate employees individually.

    The OP clearly stated that "The group of employees has raised the issue as a group".

    This has nothing to do with confidentiality. Its divide and conquer.


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    #21
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,339 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    STB. wrote: »
    Especially in a non unionised environment with no collective representation where they can intimidate employees individually.

    The OP clearly stated that "The group of employees has raised the issue as a group".

    This has nothing to do with confidentiality. Its divide and conquer.

    HR have no obligation to deal with the matter on a group basis.

    Each employee should go in to HR and either record the meeting or take notes. they should also state that they are waiving any confidentiality regarding the matter as confidentiality isn't required. There is nothing stopping them subsequently talking to the people before their meetings who can then reiterate the point that they will discuss what is being said as a group.

    Under no circumstances should they agree with HR that the meeting is confidential. Let HR waste their time doing it individually.


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    #22
    _Brian
    Registered Users Posts: 18,574 ✭✭✭✭_Brian


    jimmycrackcorm wrote: »
    HR have no obligation to deal with the matter on a group basis.

    Each employee should go in to HR and either record the meeting or take notes. they should also state that they are waiving any confidentiality regarding the matter as confidentiality isn't required. There is nothing stopping them subsequently talking to the people before their meetings who can then reiterate the point that they will discuss what is being said as a group.

    Under no circumstances should they agree with HR that the meeting is confidential. Let HR waste their time doing it individually.
    This is good advice.


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    #23
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    jimmycrackcorm wrote: »
    HR have no obligation to deal with the matter on a group basis.

    Each employee should go in to HR and either record the meeting or take notes. they should also state that they are waiving any confidentiality regarding the matter as confidentiality isn't required. There is nothing stopping them subsequently talking to the people before their meetings who can then reiterate the point that they will discuss what is being said as a group.

    Under no circumstances should they agree with HR that the meeting is confidential. Let HR waste their time doing it individually.

    Is it the case that a meeting with HR is treated as being confidential unless the employee states they are waiving their right to confidentiality?

    I would have thought that I would be able to discussee, any dealings I may have with HR with other people , unless HR got my agreement that the discussion was confidential. Please forgive my ignorance on these issues.


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    #24
    LegacyUser
    Registered Users Posts: 166,026 ✭✭✭✭LegacyUser


    jimmycrackcorm wrote: »
    HR have no obligation to deal with the matter on a group basis.

    Each employee should go in to HR and either record the meeting or take notes. they should also state that they are waiving any confidentiality regarding the matter as confidentiality isn't required. There is nothing stopping them subsequently talking to the people before their meetings who can then reiterate the point that they will discuss what is being said as a group.

    Under no circumstances should they agree with HR that the meeting is confidential. Let HR waste their time doing it individually.

    Is it the case that a meeting with HR is treated as being confidential unless the employee states they are waiving their right to confidentiality?

    Can a person not have a discussion with another person/employee about their HR meeting?

    Please forgive my ignorance on these issues.


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