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Sold an Ex Rental Car without knowing

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    #32
    daheff
    Registered Users Posts: 5,866 ✭✭✭daheff


    davo10 wrote: »
    This is why I suspect it was as the dealer described. A friend is an MD of a car rental company and he told me in the past that they lease cars for a year rather than buying them and having depreciating assets on their books. At 20k, I doubt this was a rental used often.

    I think you misunderstood me. I meant do SIXT lease the car for a year (to a sales rep or something).

    It might not have been a car for general rental


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    #33
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    daheff wrote: »
    I think you misunderstood me. I meant do SIXT lease the car for a year (to a sales rep or something).

    It might not have been a car for general rental

    Sorry, my mistake.


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    #34
    dingding
    Registered Users Posts: 4,931 ✭✭✭dingding


    Patww79 wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    That is what I meant not worth as much :D:D:D:D:D:D


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    #35
    dingding
    Registered Users Posts: 4,931 ✭✭✭dingding


    daheff wrote: »
    I think you misunderstood me. I meant do SIXT lease the car for a year (to a sales rep or something).

    It might not have been a car for general rental
    '

    I found a rental doc in the car which shows it was rented at about 6K Km, So it looks that it was part of their rental fleet.


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    #36
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    Just had a quick look through the other thread, it's an automatic, what are you worried about. You said there are paddles on the steering wheel, dear God, if only we had the roads to use them.


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    #37
    daheff
    Registered Users Posts: 5,866 ✭✭✭daheff


    dingding wrote: »
    '

    I found a rental doc in the car which shows it was rented at about 6K Km, So it looks that it was part of their rental fleet.

    So sounds like you were lied to in buying it. I think a key question here is would you still have bought it if you knew it was a rental before agreeing the sale?

    Or would it have affected what you were willing to pay for it?

    Was the car cheaper than you would have expected normally?


    Personally I bought an ex rental 3 years ago in similar circumstances. Its been an ok buy. Not given me much more hassle than expected (did have a coil box go).

    So I wouldnt be overly upset on it.


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    #38
    OldMrBrennan83
    Closed Accounts Posts: 26,658 ✭✭✭✭OldMrBrennan83


    This post has been deleted.


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    #39
    iamtony
    Registered Users Posts: 3,801 ✭✭✭iamtony


    I've an ex rental. Same circumstances. Only realised when I looked through the manual and it had paperwork from hertz on someone like that. It's now a taxi. Had similar milage as yours. I've had it two years and no problems.
    My only concern is when they were bought new the manufacturer probably made very little profit on each one as they probably bought a few thousand at the same time. That makes me think if it's a few months out of warranty they wouldn't be giving you much good will if anything goes because they want to make the profit at that stage I'm the cars life. But unless your a professional driver your not going to have any problems with a modern car that's worth mentioning unless your very unlucky. They are all grand these days.


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    #40
    CeilingFly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭CeilingFly


    Wife bought ex rental 4 years ago. We saw it as a positive We don't believe the myth that rentals are driven hard because I've never seen a rental car driven hard, if anything rentals are driven extremely carefully.

    Where the myth comes from is American renters renting manual cars and not knowing how to drive them - hence a huge number of rentals are auto.

    Simply can't see the issue


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    #41
    CeilingFly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,378 ✭✭✭CeilingFly


    davo10 wrote: »
    This is why I suspect it was as the dealer described. A friend is an MD of a car rental company and he told me in the past that they lease cars for a year rather than buying them and having depreciating assets on their books. At 20k, I doubt this was a rental used often.

    There is a special vrt system for rentals - they buy the cars excluding vrt and the vrt is only applied when they sell them on, on condition they are sold on within a certain time frame (i think 6 months)


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    #42
    iamtony
    Registered Users Posts: 3,801 ✭✭✭iamtony


    CeilingFly wrote: »
    There is a special vrt system for rentals - they buy the cars excluding vrt and the vrt is only applied when they sell them on, on condition they are sold on within a certain time frame (i think 6 months)
    That could explain why my one year old car hadn't been taxed in 6 months, and the low milage.


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    #43
    fritzelly
    Registered Users Posts: 17,533 ✭✭✭✭fritzelly


    Could very well be that a company had it under constant hire
    Seems to be looking for a reason to return it even though the car is fine


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    #44
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    CeilingFly wrote: »
    Wife bought ex rental 4 years ago. We saw it as a positive We don't believe the myth that rentals are driven hard because I've never seen a rental car driven hard, if anything rentals are driven extremely carefully.

    Where the myth comes from is American renters renting manual cars and not knowing how to drive them - hence a huge number of rentals are auto.

    Simply can't see the issue

    I've seen lots of people drive the brains out of rentals. Especially younger drivers. Also they get a harder life in general, people adjusting to driving a different car, and high mileage. That's why they don't keep them long.

    But as others have said. Judge a car on condition. Not on guesses.

    They are generally cheaper to buy though. So if someone didn't mention that, it's likely because of that reason.


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    #45
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Demo and ex garage cars are the same.

    We bought one once. Had problems but they weren't caused by it being a demo car.


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    #46
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    beauf wrote: »
    I've seen lots of people drive the brains out of rentals. Especially younger drivers. Also they get a harder life in general, people adjusting to driving a different car, and high mileage. That's why they don't keep them long.

    But as others have said. Judge a car on condition. Not on guesses.

    They are generally cheaper to buy though. So if someone didn't mention that, it's likely because of that reason.

    With a manual gearbox I can see how you could do it, but an auto? Beside which, even if it was driven hard, it's only got 20k on the clock, it is unheard of nowadays for cars to have problems at that mileage. If it was 100k on the clock after 2 years, I'd be a bit more concerned.


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    #47
    Hellrazer
    Moderators, Arts Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 10,679 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hellrazer


    OP-I also posted this in your other thread.

    You need to be careful with ex-rentals.
    The manufacturers warranties on some makes are lower than a retail sales vehicle.


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    #48
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    Hellrazer wrote: »
    OP-I also posted this in your other thread.

    You need to be careful with ex-rentals.
    The manufacturers warranties on some makes are lower than a retail sales vehicle.

    But the main dealer who provides repairs under warranty told the op is wasn't a rental, how is this relevant?


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    #49
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    davo10 wrote: »
    ...
    With a manual gearbox I can see how you could do it, but an auto? Beside which, even if it was driven hard, it's only got 20k on the clock, it is unheard of nowadays for cars to have problems at that mileage. If it was 100k on the clock after 2 years, I'd be a bit more concerned...

    I dunno if I agree with all of that. But certainly 20k isn't a lot of mileage these days. But it's not nothing either. Again you'd have to judge it on condition. But ex rental generally means you'll get it cheaper.


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    #50
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    That said I think it would be hard to get anything out of this situation...


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    #51
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    beauf wrote: »
    That said I think it would be hard to get anything out of this situation...

    Have to agree, did anyone ask, op what do you actually want out of this?


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    #52
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    OmegaGene wrote: »
    Best case scenario they get a refund and start the search again, could end up with a car owned by someone on pcp that didn’t car about it and red lined it every time and gave it back
    If you worry too much about previous owners and how they drove the car you will never find the used right car

    Hertz are selling their own ex rentals now I see

    This thread is pretty much a copy of other thread op has, same questions, same advice. I suspect the op is waiting for someone to post that he has a right to return it and get money back. I really can't see the logic, it's a main dealer BMW X1 in perfect condition inside and out, with 20k on it.


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    #53
    Del2005
    Registered Users Posts: 18,994 ✭✭✭✭Del2005


    veetwin wrote: »
    The issue I would have with buying an ex rental is not the way customers horse them but the way rental staff absolutely abuse and rally them when the engine is cold and brand new. I worked in the Dublin Airport for 10 years and saw it on a daily basis. One even ended up on its roof at the entrance to T2 short term car park a few years back. They race them from the depot to the terminal with zero mechanical sympathy.

    If you stand in a shopping centre or outside a school you'll see the same if not worse from owners, though on the roof is not as often. My Sister in law got a brand new car last year, full throttle from the off time every time with zero mechanical sympathy for the car.

    A 1 year old auto rental has probably been better looked after than the majority of cars on the road. It's valeted and fluids checked every few days, how many people do that with their own car?


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    #54
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Del2005 wrote: »
    ...

    If you stand in a shopping centre or outside a school you'll see the same if not worse from owners, though on the roof is not as often. My Sister in law got a brand new car last year, full throttle from the off time every time with zero mechanical sympathy for the car.

    A 1 year old auto rental has probably been better looked after than the majority of cars on the road. It's valeted and fluids checked every few days, how many people do that with their own car?

    Most people don't need to do that with their own car. A rental gets it because it needs it.

    None of this is really the issue. The only issue is does the OP have any options. Really it's about proving the difference in value between an ex rental and a non rental. Then how to get redress on that.

    Cant really say there is a problem with the car itself if there isn't.


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    #55
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,458 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    Have you talked to the dealer yet?


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    #56
    dingding
    Registered Users Posts: 4,931 ✭✭✭dingding


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    Have you talked to the dealer yet?

    No they were closed Saturday with the storms.


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    #57
    dingding
    Registered Users Posts: 4,931 ✭✭✭dingding


    beauf wrote: »

    None of this is really the issue. The only issue is does the OP have any options. Really it's about proving the difference in value between an ex rental and a non rental. Then how to get redress on that.

    Cant really say there is a problem with the car itself if there isn't.

    Agreed. The issue is why was I not told and does it impact on the value. If there was no difference then there was no reason to lie.

    At the moment the car is very good. Just not sure how it will pan out in time.

    Just annoyed about how I was treated by the sales person.

    Posters seem divided on how rentals are driven so possibly no worse off.


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    #58
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Judge on condition. If it's immaculate then it's probably not been abused.

    I don't think I've ever had a dealer experience that was trouble free.


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    #59
    dingding
    Registered Users Posts: 4,931 ✭✭✭dingding


    Hi,


    I made a couple of attempts to contact the salesman, the message was passed on internally within the company both Monday and Thursday.

    He has not got back to me yet.

    I got a letter from the company with a senior persons name on it thanking me for the purchase and asked me to contact them if I had any difficulty.

    Of course they had no convenient contact details such as email.

    I will probably write to him next week expressing my disappointment with the sales process, in particular misleading about the vehicles history, and lack of follow up to raising this issue. I also requested the car manual and the service history book, neither of which were with the car.

    I also have the BMW survey and the salesman was keen that I fill this out positively when purchasing the car and at that point I was very satisfied.

    I will also report honestly on my experience on the online feedback form.

    I will give the benefit of the doubt to the salesman and wait till Monday evening before drafting the letter and returning the on-line survey.

    In all other respects I am very happy with the car and the service received.

    I see that the car I traded in is up for auction with Merlin.

    I am not sure at this stage what the resolution will be. I like the spec and colour and the extras fitted.

    The posts here and the other thread would have points where I would be disadvantaged or not disadvantaged as a result of the process.

    The main issues for me at the moment are:-

    1. The treatment of cars by the hire company staff, high revs when cold etc...
    The car manual talks about not using some of the features of the car such as launch control when the engine is new. I would be worried about the long term stress on the engine / gearbox.

    2. The regular washing with brush washes and the impact on it.

    3. There are a couple of rattles and in the rear seating area which could be easily repaired.

    4. Worry about future trade in values if its history as a rental car comes against it, there are various figures for this in the UK.

    To sort out the issue.

    1. Some sort of extended warranty and perhaps the enhanced maintenance package to cover wear and tear on the brakes etc.

    2. Not sure about the washing

    3. Have a look at the rattles and repair them

    4. Give some discount in lieu of loss of future value say 10%. As the last poster said. This is the nub of the issue, is it worth less, if not why did the salesperson conceal the fact.

    From my discussions with the sales person, he seemed to have many years experience across a number of marques, so he would have released what he had done in misrepresenting the car.




    I will update you when I get further with the garage.


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    #60
    ytpe2r5bxkn0c1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 32,688 ✭✭✭✭ytpe2r5bxkn0c1


    dingding wrote: »
    Hi,




    The main issues for me at the moment are:-

    1. The treatment of cars by the hire company staff, high revs when cold etc...
    The car manual talks about not using some of the features of the car such as launch control when the engine is new. I would be worried about the long term stress on the engine / gearbox.

    2. The regular washing with brush washes and the impact on it.

    3. There are a couple of rattles and in the rear seating area which could be easily repaired.

    4. Worry about future trade in values if its history as a rental car comes against it, there are various figures for this in the UK.

    To sort out the issue.

    1. Some sort of extended warranty and perhaps the enhanced maintenance package to cover wear and tear on the brakes etc.

    2. Not sure about the washing

    3. Have a look at the rattles and repair them

    4. Give some discount in lieu of loss of future value say 10%. As the last poster said. This is the nub of the issue, is it worth less, if not why did the salesperson conceal the fact.

    From my discussions with the sales person, he seemed to have many years experience across a number of marques, so he would have released what he had done in misrepresenting the car.




    I will update you when I get further with the garage.
    To be honest with you, most of the issues you list could be issues with a car from any previous owner, for example I know a man who changes his car every two years and put his car through a brush wash at least once a week and a young guy near me races his car from cold every morning. The suspicion of hard driving as a hire car doesn't negate that any previous owner could have abused the car. For every person who says a hire car is abused there is someone who says quite the opposite.


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    #61
    iamtony
    Registered Users Posts: 3,801 ✭✭✭iamtony


    Modern brush washes are better than manual washes now days. It's the old nylon ones that caused swirling. The new spounge bristles are fine.


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