Looking for ideas for an electric folding bike

Calahonda52

I know they are pricey but just wonder if anyone has any ideas please?
Thanks as always

Joe1919

Argos do a folding electric hybrid for 699?

http://www.argos.co.uk/product/8019378

http://www.argos.ie/static/Product/partNumber/8019378/c_1/1%7Ccategory_root%7CSports+and+leisure%7C14419152/c_2/3%7C19719011%7CBikes%2C+cycling+and+accessories%7C14419153/c_3/4%7Ccat_14419153%7CElectric+bikes%7C50000787.htm

tomasrojo

Brompton have quite recently launched its electric folder. It seems to be excellent, but it's really expensive. The front luggage contains the battery, which drives a motor in the front hub. It looks clever, but I really wonder how big a market it will find, given the price.

homer911

There is also this one from Halfords: http://www.halfords.ie/cycling/bikes/electric-bikes/carrera-crosscity-electric-bike

8.7aH is quite small for a battery. My Bosch battery is 11aH and I wouldn't consider it big.

rubadub

homer911 wrote: »

8.7aH is quite small for a battery. My Bosch battery is 11aH and I wouldn't consider it big.

if someone is getting a foldable bike I expect they are not doing a full commute, rather going to the point of transport, and then from there to work.

So it could be plenty.

Ferris

No personal experience of a folding ebike but the following threads are full of info:

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/looking-for-a-lightweight-folding-e-bike.27384/

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/cheap-electric-folder-help-me-choose-x.30642/

Calahonda52

Thanks for all the insights and links... much appreciated.

Will have a look at the Halfords rig, I would prefer a full size bike but I have a Nissan leaf EV and cannot add a tower for a proper bike rack.
Need to see will it go in the boot, folded.
I looked at the Bromptons but there is an 8 week wait..
Thanks again

Calahonda52

OK, so went to halyards in Blanch day for a look see at the
http://www.halfords.ie/cycling/bikes/electric-bikes/carrera-crosscity-electric-bike

Got the guy to show me how it folded up" : neat enough but does not clip together like the Brompton, neither has it the little wheels to pull it, so they suggest a " gear bag" that it goes into that you can then carry: however that would be a PITA to have to stow once you start cycling.
I asked about the battery and where it was: no clue
However I figured out that it is enclosed in the frame just where it folds: so it comes out to charge.
I asked to see the battery, did not have one, could only show it to me if I were going to buy it

I did cycle it around the shop, very manoeuverable, however at 6' 1" I think I could do with a longer saddle post.

I would also put a Brooks saddle on it as since my prostate cancer surgery the racing type saddle is a bit hard on the pelvic floor muscles and the plumbing valves.
[https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=99715710#post99715710 ]


Will try Carrickmines later today to see can I get a better experience.

Etc

Can't recommend these guys highly enough, you get a comprehensive service and they let you take the bike out on the streets for a test cycle. I bought mine there (not a folder) before Christmas and would give them my business again,

http://www.greenaer.ie/product-category/electric-bikes/foldable-e-bikes/

Calahonda52

Etc wrote: »

Can't recommend these guys highly enough, you get a comprehensive service and they let you take the bike out on the streets for a test cycle. I bought mine there (not a folder) before Christmas and would give them my business again,

http://www.greenaer.ie/product-category/electric-bikes/foldable-e-bikes/

Thanks for that:
this one: http://www.greenaer.ie/product/a2b-kuo-folding-ebike/

is 1,799, which is a 1,000 more than the Halfords offering so the question must be is it worth that, especially when you are now in Brompton price range, the three below range from 1,250 to 1,450 for foldable only, not EV as pointed out by Tom below: still nice pics

tomasrojo

The Brompton Electric is about €3k, I think. 80km range though, and superb engineering. I do wonder how many they'll sell, but the good electric bike market is pricey, even for non-folders (or "cumbersomes", as I understand some people in the folding community call them).

Ferris

Calahonda52 wrote: »

Thanks for that:
this one: http://www.greenaer.ie/product/a2b-kuo-folding-ebike/

is 1,799, which is a 1,000 more than the Halfords offering so the question must be is it worth that, especially when you are now in Brompton price range, the three below range from 1,250 to 1,450 for foldable only, not EV as pointed out by Tom below: still nice pics

Same bike online is £1300 https://www.e-bikesdirect.co.uk/electric-bikes/folding-electric-bikes/a2b-kuo-plus-folding-electric-bike
Also, it seems to beimpressively light. Check if Greenaer can service these bikes long term as A2B have had dealer issues in the UK.

Looking at them generally folding ebikes seem to be a bit of a conundrum, they are folders, yet weigh 19-24kg generally (my eMTB is in that range :eek:). Also anything with a smaller than 20" wheel is not something that you want to be pushed by a 250w hub motor imo but that then obviously impacts the folded size.

From a quick review of the spec I think that the Wisper 805 has a lot going for it. Heavier than the A2B but with a much larger battery, and hence range. There are different spec levels, the 'Torque' seems to be the top of the range.

https://www.e-bikesdirect.co.uk/electric-bikes/folding-electric-bikes/wisper-806-torque-folding-electric-bike#reviews

Calahonda52

Okay, took the Kuo for a spin today in the rain: nice piece of kit.

Halford's are a bit of a pain, no battery in Blanch and only bought in to order in other shops, so I would worry about service etc.
They are both pretty similar and the spec look similar to the uneducated eye
and so my question is,
Cross city is 810 euro, Kuo is 1,800 euro

[Kuo has lights and an electronic display for kms etc as well as for battery and longer warranty on frame and electrics]

Is the Kuo worth the extra 1,000?
http://www.greenaer.ie/product/a2b-kuo-folding-ebike/

http://www.halfords.ie/cycling/bikes/electric-bikes/carrera-crosscity-electric-bike

Thanks as always.

magicbastarder

Also worth bearing in mind that Halfords do not have a good reputation for service, in terms of the technical experience of their staff.

Bigus

I'd be up to Belfast and buy one of these , I've used there non electric bikes which are great value and very well built in Romania . I think they can do bike to work with a bit of hassle .


https://www.decathlon.co.uk/tilt-500-folding-electric-bike-white-id_8500548.html

homer911

Bigus wrote: »

I'd be up to Belfast and buy one of these , I've used there non electric bikes which are great value and very well built in Romania . I think they can do bike to work with a bit of hassle .


https://www.decathlon.co.uk/tilt-500-folding-electric-bike-white-id_8500548.html

Decathlon.ie is part of the Bike to work scheme: https://www.decathlon.ie/cycle-to-work

beauf

Calahonda52 wrote: »

I know they are pricey but just wonder if anyone has any ideas please?
Thanks as always

Why do you want an electric folder.

You are adding a lot of weight.

Calahonda52

beauf wrote: »

Why do you want an electric folder.

You are adding a lot of weight.

I have a nissan leaf which cannot be fitted with a towbar.

As I am this side of prostate cancer surgery, I want some comfort in my remaining years on this planet so as well as a Brooks saddle, I want a bit of assistance.


Originally Posted by Bigus
I'd be up to Belfast and buy one of these , I've used there non electric bikes which are great value and very well built in Romania . I think they can do bike to work with a bit of hassle .



Now there is an idea: thank you, its 24V as opposed to 36 V for the KUO but I had not thought of up North

beauf

Only you will know, but most folders are only just about luggable without the weight of motor. I assume you'll carry the battery separately.
Lifting bit is the hardest bit. Even if its in and out of the boot. Cycling any short moderate distance is easy compared to the lifting.
The electric assistance really comes into its own when cycling longer distances frequently, or hills.
For comfort consider the tyres. A 2" wide tyre is a lot more forgiving, (softer) than a narrower tyre. But larger wheels and tyres add weight.

Maybe you've already tried cycling and know what you want exactly.

Calahonda52

beauf wrote: »

Only you will know, but most folders are only just about luggable without the weight of motor. I assume you'll carry the battery separately.
Lifting bit is the hardest bit. Even if its in and out of the boot. Cycling any short moderate distance is easy compared to the lifting.
The electric assistance really comes into its own when cycling longer distances frequently, or hills.
For comfort consider the tyres. A 2" wide tyre is a lot more forgiving, (softer) than a narrower tyre. But larger wheels and tyres add weight.

Maybe you've already tried cycling and know what you want exactly.

Thank you.
I have done a bit of cycling in my day, including to and from Calgary to Banff for weekends when I worked in Calgary.
I have also been up and down the Sally Gap and the environs when I lived in Dundrum so I do really like cycling
I rented several moped type e-bikes in the states and really liked the elec acceleration from the lights, without pedalling, however, the ped-elecs on offer here don't offer that so, as of now I don't really know what I want to buy, given the no tow bar constraint/ cost and available selection.
So I appreciate the feedback: I just can't see the 1,000 euro extra value in the KUO vs the Halfords kit:
Thanks again

beauf

You'd have to try the fold and then ride one.

Calahonda52

beauf wrote: »

You'd have to try the fold and then ride one.

Have done that with the Kuo, and lifted it into the boot of the leaf, as well as take it for a spin
Cycling the Cross city around the shop in Blanch, sans battery

beauf

Which did you prefer...

Calahonda52

beauf wrote: »

Which did you prefer...

Without the battery in the Cross city difficult to compare the performance, comfort wise they both seem identical as the frame configuration looks very similar. Am going to explore cycle to work with the employer:
If I understand the link below correctly, employer can spend up to 1,000 every 5 years without a BIK issue.
https://www.revenue.ie/en/employing-people/what-constitutes-pay/items-not-treated-as-pay/provision-of-bicycles-for-directors-and-employees.aspx

Is there another scheme where the employee pays for the bike through payroll, with some tax break?
Thanks.

beauf

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/money_and_tax/tax/income_tax_credits_and_reliefs/cycle_to_work_scheme.html

Do you mean the cycle to work scheme?

Calahonda52

beauf wrote: »

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/money_and_tax/tax/income_tax_credits_and_reliefs/cycle_to_work_scheme.html

Do you mean the cycle to work scheme?

Yes: I see two options:
1: employee pays for full cost of bike over 12 months from gross salary so if he is on top rate of tax etc, it comes at approx half price.
The KUO would cost 900 under this option

1,800 by 50% BIK = 900 over 12 months

2: Employer can pay up to euro 1,000 for a bike for employee, without any need to repay.
Any excess is treated as BIK so if I can get them onside for the Kuo under this option, it will cost me 400 euro in month one
1,800 minus 1,000 = 800 by 50% BIK = 400

If they wont do the excess over 1,000 then it costs me 800 on purchase

homer911

Calahonda52 wrote: »

Yes: I see two options:
1: employee pays for full cost of bike over 12 months from gross salary so if he is on top rate of tax etc, it comes at approx half price.
The KUO would cost 900 under this option

1,800 by 50% BIK = 900 over 12 months

2: Employer can pay up to euro 1,000 for a bike for employee, without any need to repay.
Any excess is treated as BIK so if I can get them onside for the Kuo under this option, it will cost me 400 euro in month one
1,800 minus 1,000 = 800 by 50% BIK = 400

If they wont do the excess over 1,000 then it costs me 800 on purchase

?? I think you are getting confused. Neither of these options exist
Option #1 - the threshold is €1000 on the bike to work scheme. Relief is by way of a tax credit. BIK only applies where the employer owns the asset, typically a car, and a % of the cost is deemed to be income, which you pay tax on


Optiion #2 - the cost of the bike must always be reimbursed by the employee. On an €1,800 bike, assuming you pay top rates of tax, the net cost to you would be (1000*.48)+800=€1,280

Calahonda52

homer911 wrote: »

?? I think you are getting confused. Neither of these options exist
Option #1 - the threshold is €1000 on the bike to work scheme. Relief is by way of a tax credit. BIK only applies where the employer owns the asset, typically a car, and a % of the cost is deemed to be income, which you pay tax on


Optiion #2 - the cost of the bike must always be reimbursed by the employee. On an €1,800 bike, assuming you pay top rates of tax, the net cost to you would be (1000*.48)+800=€1,280

from the CI link
" ....Your employer can also buy the bicycle on your behalf and not require you to pay for it. In this instance, you will be exempt from benefit-in-kind taxation to a cost of €1,000. If the cost of the bicycle exceeds this amount a benefit-in-kind charge will apply to the balance...."

Calahonda52

http://wearea2b.com/assets/files/uploads/Datasheet_A2B_Kuo_Boost_2017_US.PDF

weight 20 kg

homer911

Calahonda52 wrote: »

from the CI link
" ....Your employer can also buy the bicycle on your behalf and not require you to pay for it. In this instance, you will be exempt from benefit-in-kind taxation to a cost of €1,000. If the cost of the bicycle exceeds this amount a benefit-in-kind charge will apply to the balance...."

Perhaps in theory, because the effect from a Revenue POV will be the same. In reality, you will be very lucky if your employer agrees to this

Calahonda52

homer911 wrote: »

Perhaps in theory, because the effect from a Revenue POV will be the same. In reality, you will be very lucky if your employer agrees to this

http://bikes4work.ie