What to do about Walsh Park?

914

JourneyMan8 wrote: »

so the capacity is gonna be like 17k or something but the guy up there saying average attendances are 7k for a gaa league match and 2k for a county final, why is this upgrade in capacity happening exactly? what do the local clubs think about it, seeing as though they have to find ways to come up with cash for it?

In order to host munster championship games walsh park needs to be upgraded to a safe standard while allowing extra capacity for Munster fixtures. Ita fairly straight forward actually.

914

JourneyMan8 wrote: »

7m for a increase in capacity and a few new additions. i mean i know the gaa folk are hardcore and very territorial on any issue relating to to them, but it's a a lot of money just to host a few extra gaa matches? the junior soccer league should request funding for the upgrade of ozier park for the craic.

and why can't waterford develop into an area that hosts concerts or events such as this, everyone loves saying we can't do this, we can't do that. why not?

I presume the junior league can use the RSC if extra capacity is needed?

Its not about hosting extra matches, in order to host muster championship fixtures walsh park needs to be upgraded to Munster fixture standards. Ensuring the safety of spectators, with required facilities for players such as proper dressing rooms/physio rooms etc.

A bit like how the RSC has to be at a certain standard to host LOI premier games.

If waterford is such a concert mecca why hasn't the RSC hosted more than two concerts?

With the exception of Ed Sheeran we see very few concerts outside of dublin and cork.

Pearse stadium galway little or no concerts
Gaelic grounds limerick little or no concerts
Nowlan park kilkenny 8 concerts in 18 years.

Why should the GAA, Munster council and Waterford county board increase their debt to be able to host concerts that they may never get instead of using money to fund development squads and county teams?

JourneyMan8

914 wrote: »

I presume the junior league can use the RSC if extra capacity is needed?

Its not about hosting extra matches, in order to host muster championship fixtures walsh park needs to be upgraded to Munster fixture standards. Ensuring the safety of spectators, with required facilities for players such as proper dressing rooms/physio rooms etc.

A bit like how the RSC has to be at a certain standard to host LOI premier games.

okay there's one valid adult response, thanks that makes more sense.

Road-Hog

Looks like the Re-development works have been delt a blow......council gave planning permission with conditions (no surprise Re conditions) but subsequently 2 parties have decided to appeal the councils decision to an bord pleanala which means at best a possible lengthy delay to works commencing and at worst the whole project is doomed.....basis of both appellants is surprise surprise parking related issues......one suggestion is to use former crystal site as a car park...refer to links below for details

http://www.eplanning.ie/WaterfordCCC/AppFileRefDetails/18448/0

Wanderer78

Road-Hog wrote:

Looks like the Re-development works have been delt a blow......council gave planning permission with conditions (no surprise Re conditions) but subsequently 2 parties have decided to appeal the councils decision to an bord pleanala which means at best a possible lengthy delay to works commencing and at worst the whole project is doomed.....basis of both appellants is surprise surprise parking related issues......one suggestion is to use former crystal site as a car park...refer to link below for details......

Since moving the facility is out of the question, maybe the next 'logical' thing to do is move the houses?

engiweirdo

Raze the dump to the ground and build something modern at Carriganore, put something useful in Slievekeale. Dinosaurs. Its like there's even a fantastic record at Walsh Park or reasoning to keep it. Too small, doesnt tend to suit Waterford teams and I seem to recall a lot of horrendous beatings dished out in championship openers there, including at one point to Kerry! Time to get rid and move on. Place is a disaster.

Road-Hog

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Since moving the facility is out of the question, maybe the next 'logical' thing to do is move the houses?

My hyper links not working above but anyone who can navigate the councils online eplanning section of their website should be able to get to the details of the appeals......even if the gaa managed to buy up all the houses on the adjacent streets that surround the pitch ie those along Keane’s rd Griffith place etc the parking issue would still remain.......as Walsh park is going to remain where it is, surely large organized street closures on big match days (3-4 per year) should quell the majority of the objections that is of course if they are truest genuine objections....? As has been pointed out on this post previously Waterford fans happily walk 2/3 miles on match days in thurles......walking to Walsh park from quay is probably less than a mile

Road-Hog

engiweirdo wrote: »

Raze the dump to the ground and build something modern at Carriganore, put something useful in Slievekeale. Dinosaurs. Its like there's even a fantastic record at Walsh Park or reasoning to keep it. Too small, doesnt tend to suit Waterford teams and I seem to recall a lot of horrendous beatings dished out in championship openers there, including at one point to Kerry! Time to get rid and move on. Place is a disaster.

Money and time scale I would think are the main problems with moving to a new site.....could be 5 years before a green field site could be developed......then there is the cost. I know you will say that sale of Walsh park would cover the costs of new stadium but wouldn’t be so sure of that.

Deiseen

engiweirdo wrote: »

Raze the dump to the ground and build something modern at Carriganore, put something useful in Slievekeale. Dinosaurs. Its like there's even a fantastic record at Walsh Park or reasoning to keep it. Too small, doesnt tend to suit Waterford teams and I seem to recall a lot of horrendous beatings dished out in championship openers there, including at one point to Kerry! Time to get rid and move on. Place is a disaster.

Oh dear lord, carrignore again.... Its been debunked time and time again, and then some more.

Please stop, please

thesaturdayman

Deiseen wrote: »

Oh dear lord, carrignore again.... Its been debunked time and time again, and then some more.

Please stop, please

Debunked? Or fed a pack of contrived ****e from county board people haven’t the where with all to tie their laces not to mind properly fundraise to make something like that achievable.

Deiseen

thesaturdayman wrote: »

Deiseen wrote: »

Oh dear lord, carrignore again.... Its been debunked time and time again, and then some more.

Please stop, please

Debunked? Or fed a pack of contrived ****e from county board people haven’t the where with all to tie their laces not to mind properly fundraise to make something like that achievable.

Debunked.

No land ownership out there.
No public transport access.
No money to build a proper big modern stadium.
Its 7km outside of the city!

Couldn't be a worse location for it. Every single person would have to drive out there. Imagine 20/25,000 trying to drive to a stadium. My lord, if you think PUC, WP, Semple are bad then wait til you see that!

thesaturdayman

Deiseen wrote: »

Debunked.

No land ownership out there.
No public transport access.
No money to build a proper big modern stadium.
Its 7km outside of the city!

Couldn't be a worse location for it. Every single person would have to drive out there. Imagine 20/25,000 trying to drive to a stadium. My lord, if you think PUC, WP, Semple are bad then wait til you see that!

On the main infrastructure artery? Buses easily organized to link up to train & city centre? 7km? It’s nearly 7km to tramore man! Get the compass out & put your agenda away.

Re 20-25k; walsh Park can’t hold 2500 without games being delayed and absolute bedlam! About 15k is the right number

Wanderer78

the only logical thing to do is move all the houses, that can be done with cranes, cant it?

Deiseen

thesaturdayman wrote: »

Deiseen wrote: »

Debunked.

No land ownership out there.
No public transport access.
No money to build a proper big modern stadium.
Its 7km outside of the city!

Couldn't be a worse location for it. Every single person would have to drive out there. Imagine 20/25,000 trying to drive to a stadium. My lord, if you think PUC, WP, Semple are bad then wait til you see that!

On the main infrastructure artery? Buses easily organized to link up to train & city centre? 7km? It’s nearly 7km to tramore man! Get the compass out & put your agenda away.

Re 20-25k; walsh Park can’t hold 2500 without games being delayed and absolute bedlam! About 15k is the right number

How many buses will you need?

Check it on googlemaps, its 7km from the centre of town.

Road-Hog

Wanderer78 wrote: »

the only logical thing to do is move all the houses, that can be done with cranes, cant it?[/

Yeah.....with the owners in them, hire in the crane throw a few slings around them and transport them to a big field out in the country....!!

As I said above moving/buying up all the houses around the perimeter of Walsh park will still not find solve the parking issue that so many locals are so passionate about......

dzilla

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Since moving the facility is out of the question, maybe the next 'logical' thing to do is move the houses?

I'm pretty sure the local residents would have something to say about that.

Wanderer78

dzilla wrote: »

I'm pretty sure the local residents would have something to say about that.

its the only solution im afraid, and shur they ll get a free ride in crane to, win win

engiweirdo

Deiseen wrote: »

Debunked.

No land ownership out there.
No public transport access.
No money to build a proper big modern stadium.
Its 7km outside of the city!

Couldn't be a worse location for it. Every single person would have to drive out there. Imagine 20/25,000 trying to drive to a stadium. My lord, if you think PUC, WP, Semple are bad then wait til you see that!

Public transport access is easily fixed in fairness. Just make BE pull their finger out for once. Sort that and you'd remove half the problems highlighted.

thesaturdayman

7km from where? the centre of the city? is that where everyone lives?

Cos last time I checked about 25k people live on the dunmore road and a further 20k in tramore! which both are connected to carriganore via the link road!!

Also there is ample parking on site & can be developed further if needed.

Look, in the name of all that is good and holy. It is totally illogical to develop Walsh Park. Residents should be rightly up in arms. I dunno the details of the objections.

But to future proof Waterford GAA & to stop hammering the clubs with levies, an alternative ambition and vision for Waterford needs to be in place - one that is beyond the realms of the small minded Gaa man!

thesaturdayman

thesaturdayman wrote: »

7km from where? the centre of the city? is that where everyone lives?

Cos last time I checked about 25k people live on the dunmore road and a further 20k in tramore! which both are connected to carriganore via the link road!!

Also there is ample parking on site & can be developed further if needed.

Look, in the name of all that is good and holy. It is totally illogical to develop Walsh Park. Residents should be rightly up in arms. I dunno the details of the objections.

But to future proof Waterford GAA & to stop hammering the clubs with levies, an alternative ambition and vision for Waterford needs to be in place - one that is beyond the realms of the small minded Gaa man!

Furthermore! You are aware carriganore house is not where carriganore Gaa complex is! Further poetic licence!

If people are feeling so inclined, I’m sure they could take the healthy route to the stadium via our fantastic greenway right up to it!

What a plus that would be!!

It is almost 4km from top of Washington street to PUC

and over 2km from the square to Thurles!

There are loads of viable alternatives to the city centre pub drinking. What about the tented village like they do in Cheltenham / Galway Racing festivals!!

Come on man, come in out of the fog is 2018, not 1988

Wanderer78

engiweirdo wrote:

Public transport access is easily fixed in fairness. Just make BE pull their finger out for once. Sort that and you'd remove half the problems highlighted.

Another round of austerity should solve that one

deiseach

engiweirdo wrote: »

Public transport access is easily fixed in fairness. Just make BE pull their finger out for once. Sort that and you'd remove half the problems highlighted.

So something can be easily fixed by an organisation doing something that you think it has never done before :rolleyes:

thesaturdayman

deiseach wrote: »

So something can be easily fixed by an organisation doing something that you think it has never done before :rolleyes:

match day special buses? Like match day special trains?

and if they don't want to do it, I'm sure JJ Kav, Dublin Coach or a few private operators will!

Deiseen

thesaturdayman wrote: »

deiseach wrote: »

So something can be easily fixed by an organisation doing something that you think it has never done before :rolleyes:

match day special buses? Like match day special trains?

and if they don't want to do it, I'm sure JJ Kav, Dublin Coach or a few private operators will!

How would these buses navigate their way efficiently to a stadium where everyone has to drive in order to reach it?

You think there would be no traffic, there would be an unbelievably insane amount of traffic and it would be chaos. The buses wouldn't be able to get within an arses roar of the stadium.

Add that to the fact that if we have the stadium in the city then it brings almost 20,000 people in. If they all spent €20 each then that would be €400,000 into the economy of the city. Out carriganore, theyd arrive in and then leave straight after, spending nothing.

Also, if you take the ring road from dunmore road to carriganore then its 9.4km. who is going to walk that!!?!

thesaturdayman

Deiseen wrote: »

How would these buses navigate their way efficiently to a stadium where everyone has to drive in order to reach it?

You think there would be no traffic, there would be an unbelievably insane amount of traffic and it would be chaos. The buses wouldn't be able to get within an arses roar of the stadium.

Add that to the fact that if we have the stadium in the city then it brings almost 20,000 people in. If they all spent €20 each then that would be €400,000 into the economy of the city. Out carriganore, theyd arrive in and then leave straight after, spending nothing.

Also, if you take the ring road from dunmore road to carriganore then its 9.4km. who is going to walk that!!?!

name a sporting event in the world there isn't traffic at?

It is accessible from all angles.

tbh you are arguing for the sake of arguing. Nothing you are saying cannot be over come with proper planning. Its just a typical no we can't do that Waterford mentality.

So you are saying that supporters wouldn't stay over a night in cases of Clare and lim fans?

Or that there wouldn't be supporters buses that would stop in pubs and hotels on the way to the game?

There would be no multiplier effect at all in the local economy??

Is this a unique phenomenon that would only happen in carriganore?

There is no way us Waterford people could come up with the unique idea of a tented village with local suppliers like metal man, dungarvan brewery etc doing beers on the day? Local suppliers on site? Na??? we couldn't think of that could we?

Deiseen

thesaturdayman wrote: »

Deiseen wrote: »

How would these buses navigate their way efficiently to a stadium where everyone has to drive in order to reach it?

You think there would be no traffic, there would be an unbelievably insane amount of traffic and it would be chaos. The buses wouldn't be able to get within an arses roar of the stadium.

Add that to the fact that if we have the stadium in the city then it brings almost 20,000 people in. If they all spent €20 each then that would be €400,000 into the economy of the city. Out carriganore, theyd arrive in and then leave straight after, spending nothing.

Also, if you take the ring road from dunmore road to carriganore then its 9.4km. who is going to walk that!!?!

name a sporting event in the world there isn't traffic at?

It is accessible from all angles.

tbh you are arguing for the sake of arguing. Nothing you are saying cannot be over come with proper planning. Its just a typical no we can't do that Waterford mentality.

So you are saying that supporters wouldn't stay over a night in cases of Clare and lim fans?

Or that there wouldn't be supporters buses that would stop in pubs and hotels on the way to the game?

There would be no multiplier effect at all in the local economy??

Is this a unique phenomenon that would only happen in carriganore?

There is no way us Waterford people could come up with the unique idea of a tented village with local suppliers like metal man, dungarvan brewery etc doing beers on the day? Local suppliers on site? Na??? we couldn't think of that could we?

Every thing you mention requires additional measures. Measures that the city has as standard, without planning/further money spent...

If you have a stadium out there you'll have no atmosphere like Thurles, Kilkenny or Dublin before a game.

Its not good planning practice to have a stadium out there in any shape or form. Just dont know how you are getting it. Dungarvan would be a better choice than there.

thesaturdayman

Deiseen wrote: »

Every thing you mention requires additional measures. Measures that the city has as standard, without planning/further money spent...

If you have a stadium out there you'll have no atmosphere like Thurles, Kilkenny or Dublin before a game.

Its not good planning practice to have a stadium out there in any shape or form. Just dont know how you are getting it. Dungarvan would be a better choice than there.

how can you say any of that, when you haven't attended a championship game with all of the above in place!

Deiseen

thesaturdayman wrote: »

Deiseen wrote: »

Every thing you mention requires additional measures. Measures that the city has as standard, without planning/further money spent...

If you have a stadium out there you'll have no atmosphere like Thurles, Kilkenny or Dublin before a game.

Its not good planning practice to have a stadium out there in any shape or form. Just dont know how you are getting it. Dungarvan would be a better choice than there.

how can you say any of that, when you haven't attended a championship game with all of the above in place!

Because this is Ireland and nobody will ever be able to adequately plan everything that you are asking for, for two championship games per year.

Even if they could, it would be so wasteful and unnecessary because we have all that in the city.

thesaturdayman

Deiseen wrote: »

Because this is Ireland and nobody will ever be able to adequately plan everything that you are asking for, for two championship games per year.

Even if they could, it would be so wasteful and unnecessary because we have all that in the city.

yes, but of course you know a stadium can do more then just GAA games?

Rugby, Soccer, Concerts....!

Deiseen

thesaturdayman wrote: »

Deiseen wrote: »

Because this is Ireland and nobody will ever be able to adequately plan everything that you are asking for, for two championship games per year.

Even if they could, it would be so wasteful and unnecessary because we have all that in the city.

yes, but of course you know a stadium can do more then just GAA games?

Rugby, Soccer, Concerts....!

Ahhhh here we go....

So how many GAA stadiums do rugby and soccer can you tell me?