What to do about Walsh Park?

Deiseen

Christy Browne wrote: »

People in this thread are laughably ignorant to the sheer amount of games that take place in Walsh Park every year.

Add in soccer and rugby and whatever other sport you can throw a stick at and the pitch would be in absolutely terrible condition for a lot of these games.

Been trying to say this for hours now. People saying ya can just move all the games out of Walsh Park are not getting the message that players want to play in the stadiums and its huge for kids. Cant lose that for the sake of facilitating other sports just because they dont have the facilities! And clubs wont allow it.

914

Deiseen wrote: »

Can you tell me what benefit it would be to the GAA? Why is the onus on them, to share out what they have created, just because the FAI and IRFU don't have the same level of facilities? Its up to them invest, not for the GAA to hand out. Simple as that.

Revenue! The very same reason Croke Park was opened!

Locally in Waterford we have very few ways of generating revenue. Club games is one way which unfortunately have very poor attendances over the past few years.

It also wouldn't be the GAA creating the RSC. As it would be a combined effort by council, fai, irfu and athletics Ireland.

Currently the facilities at the RSC are far superior than any GAA ground in our county other than WIT Arena. So this is not a case of the GAA handing over their facilities.

This would be about unifying sport across Waterford, bringing a 21st century stadium to Waterford one that we can all be proud of.

Deiseen

914 wrote: »

Deiseen wrote: »

Can you tell me what benefit it would be to the GAA? Why is the onus on them, to share out what they have created, just because the FAI and IRFU don't have the same level of facilities? Its up to them invest, not for the GAA to hand out. Simple as that.

Revenue! The very same reason Croke Park was opened!

Locally in Waterford we have very few ways of generating revenue. Club games is one way which unfortunately have very poor attendances over the past few years.

It also wouldn't be the GAA creating the RSC. As it would be a combined effort by council, fai, irfu and athletics Ireland.

Currently the facilities at the RSC are far superior than any GAA ground in our county other than WIT Arena. So this is not a case of the GAA handing over their facilities.

This would be about unifying sport across Waterford, bringing a 21st century stadium to Waterford one that we can all be proud of.

Do you think the other organisations will be able to put as much money into this as the GAA? Then only for the GAA to be told, that they can't have a minor football final in there because its a minority sport?

Not happening!

914

Deiseen wrote: »

Do you think the other organisations will be able to put as much money into this as the GAA? Then only for the GAA to be told, that they can't have a minor football final in there because its a minority sport?

Not happening!

Not happening anyway as Walsh Park is the only deal in town, anything that we are discussing here is theoretical.

Instead of finding problems I prefer to find solutions, instead of closing doors, open them. With any development we will have problems and instead of just saying "no" and "not happening" why not say "how can we reslove this", "what issues might a rise and how can we slove them"

If the GAA were they main investor then it could be a case that they would have priority.

Minor football county final will never be in Walsh Park, never mind the RSC. Majority of football fixtures are in Faher as I previously stated. As the stronghold for football is in the West and it doesn't have the same following as hurling.

A few people lost the plot when a suggestion was made to have waterford v monaghan in Walsh Park in the football qualifier.

As for minor finals they often take place on week nights, the other main user of the RSC would be Waterfore Fc who's fixtures are mainly Fridays/Mondays. Soccer seasons rarely have changes unlike in GAA so it should be fairly straight forward to have a gaming/events committee set up to ensure all games could be played there.

Even just theoretical imagine the county board/GAA allowing Waterford FC to play in Walsh Park. (I'm not stating that either party would want this)

Every second week having somewhere between, depending on fixtures 1500-4000 people attending while the GAA getting a share of the gate receipts/rent for the ground, its a nice little earner. Like having a county final every second week.

We in Waterford need another stream of income in GAA as unfortunately we do not have a big enough club following and this has been stated over and over by Paddy Joe time and time again.

The RSC would mean less financial pressure, due to several parties involved, continued improvements to the RSC as it would have multiple ways of generating cash, money takin in by other sports, concerts etc

Deiseen

914 wrote: »

Deiseen wrote: »

Do you think the other organisations will be able to put as much money into this as the GAA? Then only for the GAA to be told, that they can't have a minor football final in there because its a minority sport?

Not happening!

Not happening anyway as Walsh Park is the only deal in town, anything that we are discussing here is theoretical.

Instead of finding problems I prefer to find solutions, instead of closing doors, open them. With any development we will have problems and instead of just saying "no" and "not happening" why not say "how can we reslove this", "what issues might a rise and how can we slove them"

If the GAA were they main investor then it could be a case that they would have priority.

Minor football county final will never be in Walsh Park, never mind the RSC. Majority of football fixtures are in Faher as I previously stated. As the stronghold for football is in the West and it doesn't have the same following as hurling.

A few people lost the plot when a suggestion was made to have waterford v monaghan in Walsh Park in the football qualifier.

As for minor finals they often take place on week nights, the other main user of the RSC would be Waterfore Fc who's fixtures are mainly Fridays/Mondays. Soccer seasons rarely have changes unlike in GAA so it should be fairly straight forward to have a gaming/events committee set up to ensure all games could be played there.

Even just theoretical imagine the county board/GAA allowing Waterford FC to play in Walsh Park. (I'm not stating that either party would want this)

Every second week having somewhere between, depending on fixtures 1500-4000 people attending while the GAA getting a share of the gate receipts/rent for the ground, its a nice little earner. Like having a county final every second week.

We in Waterford need another stream of income in GAA as unfortunately we do not have a big enough club following and this has been stated over and over by Paddy Joe time and time again.

The RSC would mean less financial pressure, due to several parties involved, continued improvements to the RSC as it would have multiple ways of generating cash, money takin in by other sports, concerts etc

And I've said, do you not think that the GAA will be looking to have as many games as possible in the new stadium? Just because a certain game isnt held in walsh park, doesnt mean they wouldn't want it in the new stadium.

In a perfect world, the GAA could make money from the blues. But seeing as thou they only get less than 2000 at each game, would they be able to pay the rent?

914

Deiseen wrote: »

And I've said, do you not think that the GAA will be looking to have as many games as possible in the new stadium? Just because a certain game isnt held in walsh park, doesnt mean they wouldn't want it in the new stadium.

In a perfect world, the GAA could make money from the blues. But seeing as thou they only get less than 2000 at each game, would they be able to pay the rent?

Honestly I don't think they would be looking to have as many games as possible in a new stadium as that would leave faher unused, supporters/players in the west frustrated with having to travel the hole time.

The same could be said when we put €5 million into walsh park, would the GAA or county board not want all games or as many as possible to take place there? Western fixtures, football fixtures can't see it either way.

As for Waterford FC they currently pay rent in the RSC, and with the new owner present, I'm sure rent wouldn't be an issue.

914

Just to add I am a 110% GAA man, my time spent in the RSC is for atheltics so this is not a case of me wanting the GAA to open up so other sports can jump on a benefit.

I feel waterford has an opportunity to creating a new vision of ireland where all sports participate together, doing away with this, my sport is better than your sport bull. Sport no matter what code is hugely beneficial to kids and if we had a one fits all ground in Waterford we could be inspiring the youth of our county to participate more while making Waterford a sporting stronghold, this would also have huge benefits to the local economy.

Deiseen

914 wrote: »

Just to add I am a 110% GAA man, my time spent in the RSC is for atheltics so this is not a case of me wanting the GAA to open up so other sports can jump on a benefit.

I feel waterford has an opportunity to creating a new vision of ireland where all sports participate together, doing away with this, my sport is better than your sport bull. Sport no matter what code is hugely beneficial to kids and if we had a one fits all ground in Waterford we could be inspiring the youth of our county to participate more while making Waterford a sporting stronghold, this would also have huge benefits to the local economy.

I agree with you there. What are the dimensions of an athletics track? Would it fit within a GAA field?

914

No, atheltic track would not fit around a GAA pitch that is why it would need to be moved to one of the football pitches behind the main pitch with a small stand for spectators.

Had a fella giving me stick one night, how self centered the GAA are by not incorporating a running track when they redeveloped Croke Park.

Got great satisfaction telling him it wouldn't fit around a GAA pitch and asking why it wasn't done in the Aviva 😀

Deiseen

914 wrote: »

No, atheltic track would not fit around a GAA pitch that is why it would need to be moved to one of the football pitches behind the main pitch with a small stand for spectators.

Had a fella giving me stick one night, how self centered the GAA are by not incorporating a running track when they redeveloped Croke Park.

Got great satisfaction telling him it wouldn't fit around a GAA pitch and asking why it wasn't done in the Aviva 😀

What i mean is, through some ingenuity, could you have a running track, gaa field and soccer pitch? I have seen a pitch that does this in the US. it's got different layers and retracts away depending on sport/eveng being held.

Starting to get into the big money for this kind of system thou!

914

It would be possible with a retractable pitch, I'd say your talking serious money. Infairness my RSC is probably serious money either way.

Hence why its only pie in the sky talk. Would like to see it discussed at council level and see if it is achievable even if it was a 50 year plan or something.

At the moment walsh park is the only gig in town and we need it to get the green light and get back playing at home.

Jamie2k9

At the moment walsh park is the only gig in town and we need it to get the green light and get back playing at home.

Would rather it didn't, force GAA into a big decision.

914

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Would rather it didn't, force GAA into a big decision.

The fear would be if it doesn't get the green light the plans would just be readjusted and we would end up with something smaller.

Residents didn't a roof over the stand opposite the current stand so it was left off. No terrace at the town end. So residents sun/views won't be effected.

No floodlights as that was previously rejected. So in a sense it was planned smartly to try and keep residents happy.

Johnboy1951

914 wrote: »

The fear would be if it doesn't get the green light the plans would just be readjusted and we would end up with something smaller.

Residents didn't a roof over the stand opposite the current stand so it was left off. No terrace at the town end. So residents sun/views won't be effected.

No floodlights as that was previously rejected. So in a sense it was planned smartly to try and keep residents happy.

It is really not a suitable location for the required re-fit to bring it up to an acceptable standard for attendees as well as athletes.

Those residents are absolutely correct of course ...... if I tried to build something unsuitable in my garden it would be prevented also.

Re-development of Walsh park, to a proper modern standard, is not going to happen ...... because of the location in a residential neighbourhood.
Not unless the GAA can buy out all residents who would be affected by the development.

If the GAA could (somehow) get together with other sporting bodies and in doing so support a regional sports stadium, where they could play high profile games with large attendances,
while at the same time do a refurb of Walsh park, keeping the ground capacity as low as necessary to accommodate all the needs of the association, particularly for proper training facilities etc., outside of the games to be held in the shared venue,
then that to me would be ideal.

The shared facility would have many uses and associations making use of it and the GAA's use would not happen very often in the overall calendar of GAA events.

So a smaller Walsh park with great facilities, to cater for high profile club games in all categories, with the availability of the shared stadium for high profile county games with large attendances, would seem to be ideal.

But, as said earlier it won't happen due to a lot of factors.

Neither will a redevelopment of Walsh Park (as a major venue) ever be satisfactory because of compromises necessary due to its location.

dzilla

Christy Browne wrote: »

People in this thread are laughably ignorant

Yup

Deiseen

The one positive of this is that it will give Waterford GAA a revenue stream that it just did not have before. 2 sold out hurling games and a decent crowd at 1/2 football games could bring in some substantial money each year.

Maybe in 5 years we can talk about the bigger picture.

deiseach

The County Boards responds to Martin Cullen - http://www.waterfordgaa.ie/taggedNews/10041731/2119/waterford_g_a_a_statement

Jamie2k9

Our focus is now on developing a first class stadium at Walsh Park which everyone in Waterford can be proud of.

They are deluded.

Deiseen

Jamie2k9 wrote: »

Our focus is now on developing a first class stadium at Walsh Park which everyone in Waterford can be proud of.

They are deluded.

Ah now, it only took 13 years to get this first class stadium to the planning application stage.

You wouldn't mind if it was Croke Park 2.0 that they were going for but 13 years for THIS. Its a disgrace!!

TheQuietFella

Deiseen wrote: »

Ah now, it only took 13 years to get this first class stadium to the planning application stage.

You wouldn't mind if it was Croke Park 2.0 that they were going for but 13 years for THIS. Its a disgrace!!

Croke Park will be torn down and rebuilt before we have anything worthy of being called a stadium.

deiseach

For everyone dreaming of staging neutral games in a new stadium in Waterford, you'd better discard any potential game not involving Cork, because today showed that if they can get a game into Frank's eilifint bán, they will.

fricatus

deiseach wrote: »

For everyone dreaming of staging neutral games in a new stadium in Waterford, you'd better discard any potential game not involving Cork, because today showed that if they can get a game into Frank's eilifint bán, they will.

Stade de Frank, as I’ve heard it called

Deiseen

This one is for you TheQuietFella, who thinks that everything gets approved and built in Dublin with no fuss. Think you even used this exact development as an example!

https://www.rte.ie/amp/980326/

914

Deiseen wrote: »

This one is for you TheQuietFella, who thinks that everything gets approved and built in Dublin with no fuss. Think you even used this exact development as an example!

He did indeed use that example. Well spotted.

TheQuietFella

https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2018/0722/980326-st-pats-appeal-cool-heads-after-stadium-setback/

My point was that at least they went for it! They saw a bigger picture and tried
to improve upon what they already had! You can't fault them for that?

What has been done here for the last 50 years?
This county is an embarrassment on how it excels in failure!

JohnC.

Thanks Fella. We can all dream of a stadium on every corner and streets paved with gold.

914

TheQuietFella wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2018/0722/980326-st-pats-appeal-cool-heads-after-stadium-setback/

My point was that at least they went for it! They saw a bigger picture and tried
to improve upon what they already had! You can't fault them for that?

What has been done here for the last 50 years?
This county is an embarrassment on how it excels in failure!

The current plan will have the county board repaying 1 million. If they were to go for another location/bigger stadium their repayment would be much greater.

I don't think it is a risk that they could take given we only had 2k attend last years county final.

You say at least st pats went for it. Was there plan not for a
12k stadium. Walsh park will be 15k.

TheQuietFella

914 wrote: »

The current plan will have the county board repaying 1 million. If they were to go for another location/bigger stadium their repayment would be much greater.

I don't think it is a risk that they could take given we only had 2k attend last years county final.

You say at least st pats went for it. Was there plan not for a
12k stadium. Walsh park will be 15k.

You are probably correct considering that there were 16k at the Cork County Final last year but this isn't about just County Finals! What were they waiting for in all the years that it's sitting there? Maybe having two county boards just doesn't help! Are there many other counties with two county boards?

spideyman92

914 wrote: »

The current plan will have the county board repaying 1 million. If they were to go for another location/bigger stadium their repayment would be much greater.

I don't think it is a risk that they could take given we only had 2k attend last years county final.

You say at least st pats went for it. Was there plan not for a
12k stadium. Walsh park will be 15k.

Regardless of capacity, St. Pats had ambition and were at least going with plans that would benefit the area and not just a stadium that will stand on its own gated off from the community for much of the year.

Deiseen

spideyman92 wrote: »

914 wrote: »

The current plan will have the county board repaying 1 million. If they were to go for another location/bigger stadium their repayment would be much greater.

I don't think it is a risk that they could take given we only had 2k attend last years county final.

You say at least st pats went for it. Was there plan not for a
12k stadium. Walsh park will be 15k.

Regardless of capacity, St. Pats had ambition and were at least going with plans that would benefit the area and not just a stadium that will stand on its own gated off from the community for much of the year.

An ambition that appears, to not fit in with what is actually possible.
Whatever about the county board (and I am a huge critic), they have gone with a design that is achievable. Now it looks like St. Pats will have to go back to the drawing board and start from zero.
Ambition is one thing, but if it's not achievable, then what is the point?