Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2018 pt. 2

pjohnson

Mitch Connor wrote: »

whatever about the merits of the season, I would find it odd if people don't think Klopp has proven his ability to get the best out of attacking players, at least.

I reckon Lukaku, Rashford, Martial and Sanchez would be playing better football under him than we have seen under Mourinho - not to say those players are inherently better than Mane/Firmino/Salah - but the football Liverpool play in the final third is lightyears ahead of United, and I don't think the difference can be credited to a difference in quality of the players.

Lukaku wouldn't work into their style given he may drift wide but doesn't really drop back into a #10 role, Alexis and Martial do not have the ability to press with the intensity Klopp demands of his teams. Maybe Rashford would be an alternative to Mane.

Mitch Connor

Lord TSC wrote: »

So far as the league goes then....would I rather be in forth with a manager "getting the best out of players" or second with a manager who isn't operating at 100% efficency, and thus has more room to improve next season? The latter, personally.

I see no evidence of Mourinho being capable of getting the best out of his squad though - and personally I would back Liverpool before United for a league tilt next season on the back of that.

I think United will be a more expensive team next season, but I have no faith Mourinho will have us being a better team next season.

From the outside looking in I would have more faith in Klopp to run teams off the pitch than Mourinho to get more dour 1-0 wins.

Mitch Connor

pjohnson wrote: »

Lukaku wouldn't work into their style given he may drift wide but doesn't really drop back into a #10 role, Alexis and Martial do not have the ability to press with the intensity Klopp demands of his teams. Maybe Rashford would be an alternative to Mane.

Could Lukaku not do similar under Klopp to Lewandowski?

As for Sanchez not having the ability to press.... disagree strongly.

More of an arguement against Martial, but maybe that would be different at Liverpool in an attacking role rather than what amounts to left midfield.

Cantona's Collars

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Duncan has spoken. "PSG consider move for Pogba".

https://twitter.com/DuncanCastles/status/994143226868191233

1 billion dollars !

S.M.B.

Lord TSC wrote: »

So far as the league goes then....would I rather be in forth with a manager "getting the best out of players" or second with a manager who isn't operating at 100% efficency, and thus has more room to improve next season? The latter, personally.

The one big shining light for this season is that we've made big strides in terms of points accumulated while we still have so much room for improvement next season. Unfortunately, I think there is also the possibility that we could struggle to exceed this years points tally.

I'll be very interested to see what the odds are during the summer but there would be no way I'd be betting on United to finish ahead of Liverpool next year. Of course there's no way I'd be happy putting a bet on the opposite happening.

I am more than happy to give Jose the benefit of the doubt for now and see if further gains can be made next season.

jayo26

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I see no evidence of Mourinho being capable of getting the best out of his squad though - and personally I would back Liverpool before United for a league tilt next season on the back of that.

I think United will be a more expensive team next season, but I have no faith Mourinho will have us being a better team next season.

From the outside looking in I would have more faith in Klopp to run teams off the pitch than Mourinho to get more dour 1-0 wins.

The evidence is in the league position just because klopp has his team playing nicer football doesn't mean there is evidence that they are better equipped to challenge next year more so then this year.

If anything the evidence is that they still have a team that rubs out if steam at the end of the season when they still have to secure a top four spot.

The evidence with United is No matter what you think of the football we have still jumped up to second in the league and we have still beaten all the top six teams in the past few months where people were saying Jose can't win against top clubs.

We are the club with the manager that's a proven winner and continues to win so don't go on about no evidence you can't ignore all the positives.

deaddonkey15

jayo26 wrote: »

So it's ok to point out now that he gave up on the league early to concentrate successfully on Europe but back at end of season when the bullsh1t was been peddled that wasn't the story at all.

Of course it has been better to watch no one will argue that at all but the fact is there is only 2 or possible 3 clubs in Europe that play that good of football constantly.

Klopp has done a great job no doubt and maybe they will won the champs league and I'll be first to give him credit then but he has traded off the defensive duties of the team against top teams in order to score goals and they have got off very lucky.

It could of easily backfired in the last two rounds of champions league it could of backfired on them against city in the league they were hanging on at the end.

Against the top teams this year we have played as a team and got results it wasn't exciting football but it wasn't dire and it was successful our problem has been the white performances from the players against the bottom teams.

Could say the same about Mourinho. We've gotten lucky with our more pragmatic, defensive style in some of our performances against the top teams. It also can easily backfire - and it did against Sevilla.

Lord TSC

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I see no evidence of Mourinho being capable of getting the best out of his squad though - and personally I would back Liverpool before United for a league tilt next season on the back of that.

I think United will be a more expensive team next season, but I have no faith Mourinho will have us being a better team next season.

From the outside looking in I would have more faith in Klopp to run teams off the pitch than Mourinho to get more dour 1-0 wins.

Jayo largely answered in the same way I would have. So I won't repeat his sentiments.

I'd ask you though (and I mean you, not others). Would you like to see Jose sacked?

Despite the fact we achieved second, and had pur best league statistics by far this season, you seem to suggest you have no faith that we can build and improve this summer. So would you then feel you would like to see Jose run out the door, despite coming second in the league?

For what it's worth, I disagree about Your point on Klopp there. As mentioned earlier, there's a blueprint to beat his teams now, and I'd large say the same about him as you said about Jose. He will have a more expensive team but tbh I don't think he has it in him tomkick on another level and push ahead of either us or City next season. His weaknesses have been there for years and he hasn't addressed them, and I don't think he will change his tactical game plan next season either....

jayo26

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

Could say the same about Mourinho. We've gotten lucky with our more pragmatic, defensive style in some of our performances against the top teams. It also can easily backfire - and it did against Sevilla.

Seville wasn't backfiring or tactics it was attitude problems which the team seems to suffer a lot from.

I'm not throwing my support behind Jose's style far from it I'd love to be playing better football but I'm not going to droll over another clubs manager that hasn't exactly achieved anything yet or I'm not going to ignore any progress that's been made.

A lot of posters in here crapping on about pragmatic and defensive displays... United haven't played that way in a while now what we have done is failed to push on when taking foothold in games and failed to put in effort to win games I don't believe it's the managers tactics that caused it I believe a number of players downing tools because nothing to play for.

Andrew Beef

Transfer talk is probably very hard to read these days if you’re in your late 20s.

28/29 has become “he’s 30 next year!”

jayo26

Andrew Beef wrote: »

Transfer talk is probably very hard to read these days if you’re in your late 20s.

28/29 has become “he’s 30 next year!”

I think the biggest problem I have is that in Williams case is I don't think he is an exceptional enough talent to make exceptions for with his age.

Yes he could play for another five years but he ain't actually that good so if he starts to decline anyway at all he is an average player.

Van Perdue was one of the best signings we ever made because he was world class and he did exactly what he was signed to do.

Sanchez is approaching 30 too but he is a world class player he is way above willians level so he is worth the punt that he won't regress due to his age.

bangkok

if we sell Pogba this summer, this will be the list of Jose Signings since joining United..

Pogba....Sold
Mkhitarayan....Sold
Ibramihovic....released
Bailly..... not playing due to not being at world cup apparently
Lindelof....jury still out
Lukaku....hit
Matic.....hit
Sanchez....too early to tell but largely been poor so far

doesn't make good reading but hopefully Pogba is not sold and lindelof turns into a hit and the Bailly injury/illness/non world cup is sorted out

Adamocovic

Apologies if posted already but couldn't see it here.

Jones had these comments about Ferguson during the press conference the other day.

"(I am) just devastated, absolutely devastated," Jones said. "He is such a legend in my eyes. He is the one who brought me to the club and gave me that opportunity to play for one of the biggest clubs in the world. He's taken me under his wing like a father and it was shocking, it's sad, but I know his character.

I know he has that fight in him. Hopefully he'll recover well. He has got all his family and friends around him, the support from all the players and staff at Man United and football around the world," Jones added. "When something like that does happen it's nice that the football world comes together and shows support and we are all rooting for him. I'm sure he will be fine."

Also reports Fergie's health has improved.

bangkok

jayo26 wrote: »

Seville wasn't backfiring or tactics it was attitude problems which the team seems to suffer a lot from.

I'm not throwing my support behind Jose's style far from it I'd love to be playing better football but I'm not going to droll over another clubs manager that hasn't exactly achieved anything yet or I'm not going to ignore any progress that's been made.

A lot of posters in here crapping on about pragmatic and defensive displays... United haven't played that way in a while now what we have done is failed to push on when taking foothold in games and failed to put in effort to win games I don't believe it's the managers tactics that caused it I believe a number of players downing tools because nothing to play for.

Playing rashford on the right of midfield after a motm performance v Liverpool on the left?

Starting Fellaini over Pogba

very much a tactic/selection issue the same tactics that were used in the first leg as well

bangkok

Adamocovic wrote: »

Apologies if posted already but couldn't see it here.

Jones had these comments about Ferguson during the press conference the other day.



Also reports Fergie's health has improved.

he apparently asked how did Doncaster get on when he came out of coma

hufpc8w3adnk65

See the two lads at Saldord City got sacked yesterday and rumors that Scholsey is taking over! Who ever takes them over I’m sure will be close to the 5 lads from the class of 92. Chris Casper has be touted in the past


*edit Chris Casper

Trigger

MrMac84 wrote: »

See the two lads at Saldord City got sacked yesterday and rumors that Scholsey is taking over! Who ever takes them over I’m sure will be close to the 5 lads from the class of 92. Chris Eagles has be touted in the past

I seen that, thought it was mental, they have gained 3 promotions since there and are now just below the football league, found this part of a article I was reading interesting

They said the decision was made after talks with one of the club’s owners Gary Neville, and senior management where it emerged there were ‘irreconcilable differences’ around the managers’ personal terms, the length of their contract and the performance of the team.

Really don’t know how the performance of the team could be a negative, they have been great for where they are. Do they think they should be playing at PL/championship standard football for god sake.

Trigger

Press are trying there best to get news about Fergie.. Jose was great in his press conference, basically told them it’s a private matter for the family and he wouldn’t answering the questions..

https://twitter.com/cmwinterburn/status/994193206488248320?s=21

He also stated that Carrick will start the Watford game as Captain, was very complimentary of him

Cantona's Collars

https://www.footyheadlines.com/2017/11/leaked-manchester-united-18-19-third-kit-introduce-very-stylish-look.html?u=1&m=1

Third kit images leaked by accident on Adidas Australia site.

Trigger

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

https://www.footyheadlines.com/2017/11/leaked-manchester-united-18-19-third-kit-introduce-very-stylish-look.html?u=1&m=1

Third kit images leaked by accident on Adidas Australia site.

It’s due out today anyways isn’t it not

hufpc8w3adnk65

astradave wrote: »

I seen that, thought it was mental, they have gained 3 promotions since there and are now just below the football league, found this part of a article I was reading interesting



Really don’t know how the performance of the team could be a negative, they have been great for where they are. Do they think they should be playing at PL/championship standard football for god sake.

Ya it’s very strange. I mean they’ve passed every test thrown at them. Initial promotion, moving to full time, promotion again, it says mutual consent but they must have new jobs, or got well paid off cuz they packed up there full time jobs 12 months ago. I’d watching with a keen eye if Scholsy takes it as he’s been very harsh (overly imo) on certain people at United since he’s started on BT

jayo26

bangkok wrote: »

Playing rashford on the right of midfield after a motm performance v Liverpool on the left?

Starting Fellaini over Pogba

very much a tactic/selection issue the same tactics that were used in the first leg as well

Bulsh1t pogba came on in the 60th minute of that game when it was still scoreless and proceeded to stroll around midfield for the next half hour he didn't deserve to start because that's what he was doing in the previous games and continued to do consistently agreed that too until recently.

Rashford yes he was moved and he didn't play great but that's down to him surely a player that's as good as Rashford is ment to be can put in a decent shift against an average Seville side.

Dont rewrite history the outstanding theme of that game we stie player that started thought all they had to do was turn up and they would win and I'd be pretty sure many would agree with me on that.

J. Marston

Big fan of Carrick. Great player for United and won everything.

Last member of the 2008 CL winning team to leave.

bangkok

jayo26 wrote: »

Bulsh1t pogba came on in the 60th minute of that game when it was still scoreless and proceeded to stroll around midfield for the next half hour he didn't deserve to start because that's what he was doing in the previous games and continued to do consistently agreed that too until recently.

Rashford yes he was moved and he didn't play great but that's down to him surely a player that's as good as Rashford is ment to be can put in a decent shift against an average Seville side.

Dont rewrite history the outstanding theme of that game we stie player that started thought all they had to do was turn up and they would win and I'd be pretty sure many would agree with me on that.

They def didnt think they just needed to turn up..we were lucky we came away with a 0-0 from the first leg. Should have been a big wake up call but it wasnt. Its up to the manager to motivate and get tactics spot on and he failed over both legs

Adamocovic

MrMac84 wrote: »

See the two lads at Saldord City got sacked yesterday and rumors that Scholsey is taking over! Who ever takes them over I’m sure will be close to the 5 lads from the class of 92. Chris Eagles has be touted in the past

astradave wrote: »

I seen that, thought it was mental, they have gained 3 promotions since there and are now just below the football league, found this part of a article I was reading interesting

Really don’t know how the performance of the team could be a negative, they have been great for where they are. Do they think they should be playing at PL/championship standard football for god sake.

I don't believe they were sacked, every report seems to be leading with parting ways while a majority are claiming Johnson and Morley left. If anything it's sounding more like Salford weren't meeting their demands so they have walked out.

Quote from Anthony Johnson:

Although we are naturally disappointed we felt the time was right. To go out on a high, after securing another promotion, makes us ready for the next challenge.

Although that won't be with SCFC, we are already excited about where that challenge will be. We have had a great time at SCFC with a great set of players who have delivered what we asked and as a manager that is all you want.

With their success and the recognition this has gotten them I can see them getting a Football League Job easily, something they are well aware of.

The mention of performance comes from the club statement who said they had a difference of "personal terms relating to contract length and performance related matters". That to me sounds more to do with their contracts and any rewards or incentives based on performances.

Gary Neville had this to say.

"The last four seasons with the managers have been the most successful in the club's history and a huge part of that is down to Anthony and Bernard, so this announcement is regrettable.

However after a meeting this morning between myself, senior management and the managers it was clear there were differences between us that could not be resolved and it was therefore decided to part ways, and whilst this is disappointing, it is the right decision for all concerned."

All just speculation from me but I don't buy the narrative that Salford or the former players pushed them out the door. Johnson and Morley have been actively discussing their future work and saying they enjoyed their time at Salford but time to take on a new challenge.

It's pretty much confirmed that they want a long-term contract and sounds like incentives based on how successful they have been in terms of their performance, but Salford did not want to commit to this. Then with them being aware they can get a job in a higher division decided to part rather than succumb to Salford City's demands.

jayo26

bangkok wrote: »

They def didnt think they just needed to turn up..we were lucky we came away with a 0-0 from the first leg. Should have been a big wake up call but it wasnt. Its up to the manager to motivate and get tactics spot on and he failed over both legs

That's your opinion my opinion is I seen players strolling around the pitch not putting in an effort.

Cantona's Collars

Lithium93_ wrote: »

City will always, ALWAYS pale in comparison to United, even when the club is going through a rough patch, or patches as the last few years will show.

Since Toure's been at City they've won:

EPL: 11/12, 13/14, 17/18
FA Cup: 10/11
League Cup: 13/14, 15/16, 17/18
Community Shield: 12/13

United have won:

EPL: 10/11, 12,13
FA Cup: 15/16
League Cup: 16/17
Europa League: 16/17
Community Shield: 10/11, 11/12, 13/14, 16/17

Adamocovic

If players look like they aren't trying or arsed on the pitch the blame falls to both the player and the manager.

The players have responsibilities to give it their all, it's what they are paid to do. BY half-arsing anything it shows real unprofessionalism.
The manager is there too manage them, help motivate them, and prepare them. The player is ultimately on the pitch also because the manager has made that decision.

I'm all for people having opinions but on this topic if anyone assigns the blame for lacklustre performances solely at the players or the manager they are completely wrong. Or 50% if you prefer.

Liam McPoyle

Martial has generally struck me as somewhat of a sullen character, even when things are going well on field he rarely seems to be enjoying himself. If Jose does not feel he has what it takes to make it at United then so be it. I'd hate to see him leave but if he does, once its not to a domestic rival then I can accept it. It could well be a case that he will go on and be a worldie in a different team / set up but for every KDB there are countless Kezman's, Kalou's or Del Horno's.

Using those players as sticks to beat JM with is lazy and would be expected from certain groups of rival fans but anyone with an ounce of objectivity knows its not a simple case of Jose getting rid of world class players.

I feel this will be the summer that makes or breaks Jose at United. Hopefully for us its the former. Martial could prove to be a key piece one way or another.

pjohnson

MrMac84 wrote: »

See the two lads at Saldord City got sacked yesterday and rumors that Scholsey is taking over! Who ever takes them over I’m sure will be close to the 5 lads from the class of 92. Chris Eagles has be touted in the past

Chris Eagles is now a managerial candidate? Fcuk off. He must just about be 30?

Trigger

pjohnson wrote: »

Chris Eagles is now a managerial candidate? Fcuk off. He must just about be 30?

Definitely around that, 30/32, he was up in Scotland this season I thought..

bangkok

pjohnson wrote: »

Chris Eagles is now a managerial candidate? Fcuk off. He must just about be 30?

32.

Andre Villas boas was manager of porto at same age

Lord TSC

Its only now registering with me that the PL ends this week....

Cantona's Collars

Madrid have turned their attention to the latest shiny thing. €200 million for Salah.
Maybe they'll forget about annoying United about De Gea.

https://twitter.com/footballitalia/status/994183202783879168

Whatsisname

pjohnson wrote: »

Chris Eagles is now a managerial candidate? Fcuk off. He must just about be 30?

Wonder if he still uses a tub of brylcreem a day

Mitch Connor

I think Martial will go on to be a fantastic player somewhere, and the sale of him will be a stick United are beaten with.

However, I also think Martial has 0 chance of becoming the best player he can be under Mourinho.

He won't get consistent starts in the middle.
He will be asked to be too defensive (for his liking) on the left and United in general do not attack with the speed, freedom or movement that I think are needed to get the best out of him.
I also think Mourinho just doesn't like/trust him enough (I can't understand why Martial wasn't centre with Rashford wide at the weekend).

United are not going to sack Mourinho in the summer so I have to look at things with that in mind. As it stands, we have Martial, Rashford and Sanchez, whose best chance of playing is from the left. We have no one that is actually suited to playing on the right.

On the assumption Mourinho is staying, and Martial won't have a much better time next season, selling Martial to fund the purchase of a right sided attacker that will give some balance to the frontline is arguably the correct thing to do.

Lord TSC

Jose says Lukaku wont play the last two league games but hopefully will be fit for the finals.

I wonder if he'll give the fringe players, who disappointed last game, more chances.

Or if we'll get glimpses of some players like Gomes and Chong....

Mitch Connor

Lord TSC wrote: »

Jose says Lukaku wont play the last two league games but hopefully will be fit for the finals.

I wonder if he'll give the fringe players, who disappointed last game, more chances.

Or if we'll get glimpses of some players like Gomes and Chong....

I would guess at a full strength team tomorrow night, and if we get the point(s?) needed to secure second place we will see a couple of the young lads at the weekend.

Lithium93_

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Since Toure's been at City they've won:

EPL: 11/12, 13/14, 17/18
FA Cup: 10/11
League Cup: 13/14, 15/16, 17/18
Community Shield: 12/13

United have won:

EPL: 10/11, 12,13
FA Cup: 15/16
League Cup: 16/17
Europa League: 16/17
Community Shield: 10/11, 11/12, 13/14, 16/17

So in the 8 years Toure's been at City, they've won 8 Domestic Honours to United's 9, hardly putting United in City's shadow..

He really should've thought before speaking.

Trigger

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Madrid have turned their attention to the latest shiny thing. €200 million for Salah.
Maybe they'll forget about annoying United about De Gea.

https://twitter.com/footballitalia/status/994183202783879168

Ah it’s just trying to unsettle him before the final..

jayo26

Adamocovic wrote: »

If players look like they aren't trying or arsed on the pitch the blame falls to both the player and the manager.

The players have responsibilities to give it their all, it's what they are paid to do. BY half-arsing anything it shows real unprofessionalism.
The manager is there too manage them, help motivate them, and prepare them. The player is ultimately on the pitch also because the manager has made that decision.

I'm all for people having opinions but on this topic if anyone assigns the blame for lacklustre performances solely at the players or the manager they are completely wrong. Or 50% if you prefer.

I 100 percent agree with you have said it before. I was not trying to observe Jose of the blame for recent results I was arguing that it wasn't pragmatic or defensive football that was been served up it was unmotivated players and possibly alot saving themselves for big games and world cup.

jayo26

astradave wrote: »

Ah it’s just trying to unsettle him before the final..

But you never know

Lord TSC

jayo26 wrote: »

But you never know

Imagine, Salah to Real and then Bale to us :pac:

Actually, the yearly Ronaldo rumours must be coming soon too.

jayo26

Lord TSC wrote: »

Imagine, Salah to Real and then Bale to us :pac:

Actually, the yearly Ronaldo rumours must be coming soon too.

Saying that would we really want klopp with 200 million to spend?

He probably buy Memphis depay and he score 40 goals.

Trigger

jayo26 wrote: »

Saying that would we really want klopp with 200 million to spend?

He probably buy Memphis depay and he score 40 goals.

My worry would be the net spend graphs :pac:

jayo26

astradave wrote: »

My worry would be the net spend graphs :pac:

Oh yes disaster

hufpc8w3adnk65

pjohnson wrote: »

Chris Eagles is now a managerial candidate? Fcuk off. He must just about be 30?

Chris Casper my bad.

deaddonkey15

jayo26 wrote: »

Seville wasn't backfiring or tactics it was attitude problems which the team seems to suffer a lot from.

United beat Huddersfield in the FA Cup before the first Sevilla game. In between the two legs they beat Chelsea and Liverpool and came back from 2 down to beat Palace. After the 2nd Sevilla game they beat Brighton in the FA Cup. I find it hard to believe that a number of players chose to collectively have a poor attitude and put in half arsed performances for the two Champions League games, but turned up to win every other game in that period. It was clearly a more safety first, defensive approach to both games that ultimately backfired. Regardless, it's the manager's job to motivate his players and make sure they are in the right frame of mind going into a game.

jayo26 wrote: »

I'm not throwing my support behind Jose's style far from it I'd love to be playing better football but I'm not going to droll over another clubs manager that hasn't exactly achieved anything yet or I'm not going to ignore any progress that's been made.

Getting to a Champions League final is an achievement. Especially with that squad. They're 1 injury away from playing Solanke or Ings in the final.

Drumpot

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I think Martial will go on to be a fantastic player somewhere, and the sale of him will be a stick United are beaten with.

However, I also think Martial has 0 chance of becoming the best player he can be under Mourinho.

He won't get consistent starts in the middle.
He will be asked to be too defensive (for his liking) on the left and United in general do not attack with the speed, freedom or movement that I think are needed to get the best out of him.
I also think Mourinho just doesn't like/trust him enough (I can't understand why Martial wasn't centre with Rashford wide at the weekend).

United are not going to sack Mourinho in the summer so I have to look at things with that in mind. As it stands, we have Martial, Rashford and Sanchez, whose best chance of playing is from the left. We have no one that is actually suited to playing on the right.

On the assumption Mourinho is staying, and Martial won't have a much better time next season, selling Martial to fund the purchase of a right sided attacker that will give some balance to the frontline is arguably the correct thing to do.

When you have a team of 9 or 10 consistently top performing players who are comfortable playing with each other , the system and the pressure expectations on them, I think your sentiments are fine with regard with giving younger players more starts.

Long before Jose took over, United looked a disjointed mess at times with supposedly top quality players disappearing quite frequent in games where we needed them most. People talk as if United was some finely tuned machine before Jose came in and wrecked everything. We weren't talking about finishing second in the league or mounting a proper title challenge any season.

The short summary of why Martial cannot and will not be a front starter for United anytime over the next two seasons is because he is not good enough if you want to be winning the league or champions league. He knows it, you know it and everybody knows the best he could hope for is a couple of meaningless league or cup starts in that position. He would get away with it at a smaller club with less pressure, but not at United and the club cant afford to take a risk when he hasn't shown consistency or forced his way into that position.

At United you just cant be learning and maturing and EXPECT to start your preferred position. It was a long time before Rooney was played at his preferred position at the club and for me Rooney was a vastly better player then Martial has shown at the club at the same age.

Unfortunately for players like Martial, Salah, De Bryune and Lukaku they just aren't/weren't good enough in their early 20s to be a consistent starter in a top club (challenging for league or champions league) of a top European league. That's just a fact that people love to ignore when trotting out that Jose supposedly couldn't get the most out of them.

It will be a shame if Martial leaves but if he doesn't have the patience to wait for his chance (which I don't blame him or others in this scenario) then maybe its best for all concerned that we let him go with some sort of buy back option.

Drumpot

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

United beat Huddersfield in the FA Cup before the first Sevilla game. In between the two legs they beat Chelsea and Liverpool and came back from 2 down to beat Palace. After the 2nd Sevilla game they beat Brighton in the FA Cup. I find it hard to believe that a number of players chose to collectively have a poor attitude and put in half arsed performances for the two Champions League games, but turned up to win every other game in that period. It was clearly a more safety first, defensive approach to both games that ultimately backfired. Regardless, it's the manager's job to motivate his players and make sure they are in the right frame of mind going into a game.



Getting to a Champions League final is an achievement. Especially with that squad. They're 1 injury away from playing Solanke or Ings in the final.

You see that logic can be applied both ways but the question is really who do you trust ? Why would any United fan trust the players ? What have the players done over the last 5 seasons to deserve such a defence? Jose has won more English league titles in the last 5 years then any United player during that term so why shouldn't we trust he knows more about setting teams up to win then players who haven't proven anything in the 5 years ?

To be frank I trust that Jose is rooting out chancers and player simply not up to the challenge of winning leagues or champions leagues. Its unsettling players who have coasted along and been given a very easy ride by fans like yourself who default to blaming coaches if things aren't working out. Jose's standards are simply higher then yours when it comes to what he expects from a player.

In terms of Liverpool getting to a champions league final I am not sure why that is relevant in this discussion. They beat Man City on the way to that final and we all know they aren't better then city, its just the nature of cup competitions. Very similar to giant killings in FA cup and surprise finalists that do happen , even in Europe. Of course avoiding the biggest Euro powerhouses Barca, Madrid, PSG and Juventus and getting a few dodgy decisions go you way helps but this is the nature of cup football.

If somehow Liverpool fall out of 4th spot and lose the Euro Cup final do you think their fans will be comforted by their highlights of this season during Euro League group games ? Of course not. I mean they have managed to make the league top 4 a serious chore when they were challenging for 2nd. I don't understand how some united fans will only look at the most negative aspects of the teams performance and ignore other things. Like the way spurs and Liverpool teams have totally switched off in the league the last few weeks and yet Jose got crap for United doing the same. Oh but Klopp and Poch are still spoken of highly by those who can only see one side of the Jose coin . .