Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2018 pt. 2

deaddonkey15

astradave wrote: »

I’d agree from a talent POV, but is he reliable enough to even be back up, this season wasn’t too bad but history shows him to be unreliable over the course of seasons

Yeah I agree. I'd have him as 4th choice if we were to sign Alderweireld. If he still get's injured and is out for a few months then he should be the first out the door next summer.

pjohnson

Jones is the modern Wes Brown.

Lord TSC

ESPN saying Jones and Smalling will start Sunday

Nunu

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

I'd be getting rid of Smalling and Rojo there. Worth keeping Jones as he's homegrown and somewhat decent.

Jones not a Utd youth player. Signed from Blackburn.

Jones should be a beast for Utd. Needs a full injury free season. Become a mainstay. So much potential.

I’m also a fan of Smallings. Scores a fair amount of goals too.

yabadabado

How many CBs is needed?
New CB
Bailly
Lindelof
Jones
TFM

Shouldn't that be enough, hard to keep anymore happy or give them much games.

Lucas Hood

Nunu wrote: »

Jones not a Utd youth player. Signed from Blackburn.

Jones should be a beast for Utd. Needs a full injury free season. Become a mainstay. So much potential.

I’m also a fan of Stallings. Scores a fair amount of goals too.

Jones counts as homegrown.

Nunu

Lucas Hood wrote: »

Jones counts as homegrown.

Does Smalling? Thought he meant was a Utd youth.

Lucas Hood

Nunu wrote: »

Does Smalling? Thought he meant was a Utd youth.

Smaling does indeed.

Jones is a good defender but limited on the ball and very injury prone.

Smalling isn't as good a defender but better on ball for me and not as injury prone.


I'd prefer to keep Smalling myself.

Lithium93_

Lord TSC wrote: »

ESPN saying Jones and Smalling will start Sunday

FA Cup Final is on Saturday.

Trigger

Nunu wrote: »

Jones not a Utd youth player. Signed from Blackburn.

Jones should be a beast for Utd. Needs a full injury free season. Become a mainstay. So much potential.

I’m also a fan of Smallings. Scores a fair amount of goals too.

Think he means homegrown over Rojo and decent over both

Beasty

Lithium93_ wrote: »

FA Cup Final is on Saturday.

It better be - I'll be heading back to City Airport if it's 5.15 on Sunday:eek:

deaddonkey15

astradave wrote: »

Think he means homegrown over Rojo and decent over both

Younger too.

bangkok

Lord TSC wrote: »

ESPN saying Jones and Smalling will start Sunday

Sure Bailly not going to world cup, have to give the lads a chance

I thought that Jose was fond of Rojo and gave him a fair share of starts while he was fit. On that alone, I'd imagine Rojo would be kept around.

Then when you factor in his willingness to maraud while bare-chested in defense of the manager, I think Rojo is staying put this Summer.

As for Smalling and Jones reportedly set to start in the final, this wouldn't surprise me. Bailly and Rojo have been a bit shaky since coming back from injury, and Lindelof ahead of Smalling/Jones would be a big call to make.

You never know, it could even be a farewell run for one of Smalling or Jones.

yabadabado

Didn't Rojo sign a contract extension recently?
I'd be surprised if he left.

hufpc8w3adnk65

astradave wrote: »

Woop transfer rumour season has officially begun!

Has Lord TSC started his list yet?

Trigger

Very good interview with Gary Neville here about Uniteds style of play, City, Harry Kane and how we will all go into hiding if Chelsea and Liverpool win the Cups :pac:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2018/05/15/gary-neville-interview-people-criticise-uniteds-style-football/

He categorises United’s season as one of “progression over success” but, interestingly, wonders if those critical of the style of play compared to the days of Sir Alex Ferguson are guilty of selective myopia.

“We’re in a situation now where under David Moyes, Louis van Gaal, Jose Mourinho, it’s been suggested the football is not very good,” he explains.

“And every game that goes by Sir Alex Ferguson’s football gets better and better because you forget the bad games, the 1-0s, the horrible defeats. I think we’ve become a bit idealistic about what the football was at times under Sir Alex. I was there for a large part of it, 21 years, and saw every game. And, yes, it was mesmerising at times, it was out of this world at times.

“But from 2003 to 2006, it wasn’t good. I played in that team, it wasn’t good. We weren’t playing at a high level. We were pretty average at that time. So you think about this three-year period or so now and what are you measuring against? Sir Alex’s 1999 treble winners or the 2003-2006 period when the football was pretty poor and Jose Mourinho was at Chelsea and destroying us?”

Neville says the debate about United’s brand of football has been amplified by what has happened down the road at City, who have entertained and enthralled en route to amassing an unprecedented 100 points.

“What City have done – the way they’ve done it and the points difference – that’s the pressure on the football [at United], that there’s this almost complete, pure football being played at City and United play differently,” he explains. “If, at the end of next season, Pep wins another league, that will be a big problem [for United], but if Jose was to win the league next year you could actually argue Jose has done the better job. So next season will be critical in establishing the job each manager has done in Manchester.”

jayo26

Was reading that last night Dave it was linked in a few places and it's crazy because I think he sums up what alot of us have been counter arguing about progress this season and it can't come from anyone better then someone that actually played in one of Ferguson's dullest teams but also one of his biggest rebuilding jobs.

brinty

Think the times are reporting we'll be announcing the signing of Alex Sandro after the FA Cup final on Saturday. £50m is the price being touted

Liam McPoyle

What would Neville know? He's never heard of the United way clearly. He needs to talk to Souness about it because the Scousers are experts in it.

brinty

Business Cat wrote: »

What would Neville know? He's never heard of the United way clearly. He needs to talk to Souness about it because the Scousers are experts in it.

Meoowwwwwww
Shots fired...... :P

Liam McPoyle

brinty wrote: »

Meoowwwwwww
Shots fired...... :P

Not at all mon amie, tis the truth. Now if I'd suggested an alternative table and a net spend chart, then we'd really be cooking.

:pac:

S.M.B.

If Jose is under such pressure to win a title next year you can understand why he'd be looking at the likes of Willian to come in and do a job rather than waiting for the likes of Martial and Rashford to kick it up a few gears.

Mitch Connor

From 2003-2006 there was PLENTY of criticism of how United were playing under Fergie.

EDIT - there was plenty of criticism of the football after that too - saying we were too defensive and reactionary to the opposition rather than looking to impose ourselves.

hufpc8w3adnk65

Mitch Connor wrote: »

From 2003-2006 there was PLENTY of criticism of how United were playing under Fergie.

I think the point Mitch is that this is forgotten about now. People thinking of 26 years of champagne football. I remind some armchair supporters in my local of the days of 4-5-1 with Three lung Park, Fletch, O Shea in cm, Rooney wide left, Tevez wide right and Ronaldo cf. we didn’t allways play 4-4-2 and attack teams for 90 mins straight

Kerrydude1981

MD1990

brinty wrote: »

Think the times are reporting we'll be announcing the signing of Alex Sandro after the FA Cup final on Saturday. £50m is the price being touted

Been very poor for Juventus this season.

Very good signing if he regains form though.

jayo26

I don't think Jose is under pressure to win the title I think he is just under pressure to challenge for it but all other managers have to be aswell it will be no different at Liverpool or Chelsea either.

Most fans would of been delighted this year if we had even 10 extra points but most other years 80 odd points would get you to within 10 of the champions it's such a fine line to be honest.

Nalz

Will I Am Not wrote: »

Blast from the past

He had an great goalscoring record after he left for 2 seasons, then never heard of again.

jayo26

Nalz wrote: »

He had an great goalscoring record after he left for 2 seasons, then never heard of again.

He has been blighted by injury he was a quality player for us in the younger teams I was so sorry to see him go.

Drumpot

S.M.B. wrote: »

If Jose is under such pressure to win a title next year you can understand why he'd be looking at the likes of Willian to come in and do a job rather than waiting for the likes of Martial and Rashford to kick it up a few gears.

And there in lies the point that people often miss. If you want champions league and league success you can’t expect a manager to juggle it with blooding youngsters.

People might quote Sir Alex but he was at the club three decades and literally built and rebuilt squads tailored exactly for his needs. That includes a squad mentality that still doesn’t look to exist with the one Jose inherited.

SAF final signing was Robin Van Persie. No coincidence that it was getting harder to keep up with city’s massive spend.

But there is also precedence when Rooney and Ronaldo were bought. Asides from the fact they showed more signs (IMO) of quality then the young lads we have now, they were given time to mature. 2003-06 weren’t exactly among United’s best but again people seem to selectively forget that.

Drumpot

jayo26 wrote: »

I don't think Jose is under pressure to win the title I think he is just under pressure to challenge for it but all other managers have to be aswell it will be no different at Liverpool or Chelsea either.

Most fans would of been delighted this year if we had even 10 extra points but most other years 80 odd points would get you to within 10 of the champions it's such a fine line to be honest.

I agree about Jose, but not the others. Poch and Klopp are under zero pressure and if they finished no better next season would not be worrried about their positions. That’s one of the reason why they can afford to take more risks with football and brooding youngsters or unproven players.

Any united fan expecting a league or champions league win needs to stop drinking the hype coolaid. No matter what manager united has there is literally Not one reason we should demand to over throw city. They have been for over a decade and will continue to spend vastly more then united. If united go for the same player as city they can outspend us. That’s just a fact and no amount of “United is massive” waffle will change that. Players chase the money and trophies of which city can promise both with confidence. The mess that has been united is not the prosper it once was so we can’t expect success.

That’s why this “united way” horseh*t needs to stop. Maybe we can’t win the flash buckling way people think we always played cause we have to try and win an alternative way to compensate for our under spending in comparison to city?!

Mitch Connor

Drumpot wrote: »

I agree about Jose, but not the others. Poch and Klopp are under zero pressure and if they finished no better next season would not be worrried about their positions. That’s one of the reason why they can afford to take more risks with football and brooding youngsters or unproven players.

Any united fan expecting a league or champions league win needs to stop drinking the hype coolaid. No matter what manager united has there is literally Not one reason we should demand to over throw city. They have been for over a decade and will continue to spend vastly more then united. If united go for the same player as city they can outspend us. That’s just a fact and no amount of “United is massive” waffle will change that. Players chase the money and trophies of which city can promise both with confidence. The mess that has been united is not the prosper it once was so we can’t expect success.

That’s why this “united way” horseh*t needs to stop. Maybe we can’t win the United way cause we have to try and win an alternative way to compensate for our under spending in comparison to city?!

We play City in the league twice a season.

Why can't we aim to play better football than the rest if not City? Why do we need to be defensively dour in the 36 other games. Why does City's spending mean we play rubbish and lose to Brighton, Newcastle, West Brom, Huddersfield etc.

Cantona's Collars

MrMac84 wrote: »

I think the point Mitch is that this is forgotten about now. People thinking of 26 years of champagne football. I remind some armchair supporters in my local of the days of 4-5-1 with Three lung Park, Fletch, O Shea in cm, Rooney wide left, Tevez wide right and Ronaldo cf. we didn’t allways play 4-4-2 and attack teams for 90 mins straight

One huge difference is that when we did play defensively under Ferguson we broke with pace and intent. We just don't see that any more bar a few times at the start of the season. Now it's just so methodical and the opposition get time to funnel back whereas before we would see situations where attackers would outnumber defenders in an instant.
Look back at the video I posted a few days ago and compare it with what we see now.

yabadabado

MD1990 wrote: »

Been very poor for Juventus this season.

Very good signing if he regains form though.

He didnt hit the heights of previous seasons but he hasnt been very poor.His season would still be classed a lot more productive than any of United's current full backs.

I was reading an article recently that his head was turned last summer and he has wanted out since.Could question his professional but its not surprising.

Liam McPoyle

I still dont know what happened after the first game against LFC. We were flying up to that point but after that it appeared that a "go for it" attitude was replaced with a "dont lose" one.

Drumpot

Mitch Connor wrote: »

We play City in the league twice a season.

Why can't we aim to play better football than the rest if not City? Why do we need to be defensively dour in the 36 other games. Why does City's spending mean we play rubbish and lose to Brighton, Newcastle, West Brom, Huddersfield etc.

Actually Mitch that’s a different point completely. The season united won the league in 2007 they lost many games to the lower quality teams like you mentioned so that happens.

And I’m not saying we can’t win playing better football I am saying we shouldn’t expect it without factoring in the fact that united is not the top dog in spending.

You regularly miss the point on this. I don’t know how many times people have to spell it out to you. People aren’t defending the style of football cause it’s acceptable in the long run , fans are accepting it because there has been clear progress, the team is getting stronger and they accept that sometimes you have to take the good with the bad. It takes time to rebuild the club and some people focus on the over all picture when rating the managers performance.

You focus on one or two elements , rinse repeat and ignore anything to the contrary. You think people are attacking you because they disagree with your narrow minded assesment of how the club is progressing. Most fans agree that the football needs to improve but while the team is improving and looking on the up, we are willing to give Jose time to work on the style.

pjohnson

Anything less than 100% win record next year is unacceptable. The second we drop points Jose should be fired.

Trigger

pjohnson wrote: »

Anything less than 100% win record next year is unacceptable. The second we drop points Jose should be fired.

I do think it’s more the manner of defeats rather than the actual defeats itself. I touched on this yesterday but the one thing sorely lacking in those games was someone with leadership qualities to take the games by the scruff of the neck and drive the team on. We are lacking a player like Robbo, Keane, Vidic. A player(S) that won’t accept that sort of stuff.

Oh and 2 fullbacks, we definitely need two fullbacks

Mitch Connor

Drumpot wrote: »

Actually Mitch that’s a different point completely. The season united won the league in 2007 they lost many games to the lower quality teams like you mentioned so that happens.

And I’m not saying we can’t win playing better football I am saying we shouldn’t expect it without factoring in the fact that united is not the top dog in spending.

You regularly miss the point on this. I don’t know how many times people have to spell it out to you. People aren’t defending the style of football cause it’s acceptable in the long run , fans are accepting it because there has been clear progress, the team is getting stronger and they accept that sometimes you have to take the good with the bad. It takes time to rebuild the club and some people focus on the over all picture when rating the managers performance.

You focus on one or two elements , rinse repeat and ignore anything to the contrary. You think people are attacking you because they disagree with your narrow minded assesment of how the club is progressing. Most fans agree that the football needs to improve but while the team is improving and looking on the up, we are willing to give Jose time to work on the style.

I don't beleive it is a different thing.

You are saying we can't expect entertaining football because City spend more than us. We have played poor football and not beaten them, maybe we should try being a really good footballing team and see if that beats more teams.

I argue the United football is rubbish for the most part, and for the money spent on the players and on the manager, we should very much be able to expect more.

Jose has been given a fortune (both paid and spent on players) and he isn't getting the best out of any of our attacking players apart from Lingard. For every other player, it is very easy to argue we should be getting more out of them. Why is this still the case at the end of his second season?

As for the clear progression - our points are up, which is great - but I honestly don't think our attacking is any better now than it was same stage last season. I see no improvement in the attacking patterns, movement, speed or interplay, and no indication that Jose is doing anything to solve it cause its basically the exact same.

Lord TSC

I think there'll be on Jose to do one of two things.

1. Win the league

2. Second but with a more caviler style of football.

There's a sense of unrest about HOW Jose come second this year, and while you can debate if thats fair or not forever, the reality is the ill-will that existed towards JOse since the day he started will continue to snowball if next season doesn't see more growth. And realistically, in the league, there's only two ways to consider the team moving forward. 1st place finish, or second with more flair.

He's set that bar himself this year. He's risen expectations which is great, but he will have to clear that bar next season.

Spending another 200m, and grinding out results enroute to another second won't be good enough again. I'm happy with the growth we've seen this season but there'll need to be more by this time next year.

Cantona's Collars

https://twitter.com/Sport_Witness/status/996646558488776704

PSG sniffing around Savic now.

Trigger

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

https://twitter.com/Sport_Witness/status/996646558488776704

PSG sniffing around Savic now.

You zerked it

Cantona's Collars

astradave wrote: »

You zerked it

It gets contagious at transfer window time.

Did anyone mention that Tuttosport claim Jose wants to sign Bonucci?

Trigger

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

It gets contagious at transfer window time.

Did anyone mention that Tuttosport claim Jose wants to sign Bonucci?

Don’t think so, seen it earlier though elsewhere.. would prefer Alderweirald, but wouldn’t say no to Bonucci if we couldn’t get him.

Will I Am Not

Nalz wrote: »

He had an great goalscoring record after he left for 2 seasons, then never heard of again.

Yeah, I had high hopes for him

I was talking with a lad in work yesterday about players that fell by the wayside. He was going on about N’gog, Teixeira, Insua etc at Liverpool.
There’s been loads at United.
Thinking about the likes of Manucho, Possebon and Henríquez brought back memories

Ravel Morrison is actually a teammate of Henríquez in Mexico.

brinty

So far i'm counting our potential transfers as follows

Alderweirald
Savic
Alex Sandro
Fred
Bonucci


Am i missing anyone....

brinty

Will I Am Not wrote: »

Yeah, I had high hopes for him

I was talking with a lad in work yesterday about players that fell by the wayside. He was going on about N’gog, Teixeira, Insua etc at Liverpool.
There’s been loads at United.
Thinking about the likes of Manucho, Possebon and Henríquez brought back memories

Ravel Morrison is actually a teammate of Henríquez in Mexico.

David Bellion, Gabriel Obertan and Erc Djemba x 2 spring to mind too

jayo26

That possebon tackle ruined him aswell never forget that.

LuckyLloyd

Lord TSC wrote: »

I think there'll be on Jose to do one of two things.

1. Win the league

2. Second but with a more caviler style of football.

There's a sense of unrest about HOW Jose come second this year, and while you can debate if thats fair or not forever, the reality is the ill-will that existed towards JOse since the day he started will continue to snowball if next season doesn't see more growth. And realistically, in the league, there's only two ways to consider the team moving forward. 1st place finish, or second with more flair.

He's set that bar himself this year. He's risen expectations which is great, but he will have to clear that bar next season.

Spending another 200m, and grinding out results enroute to another second won't be good enough again. I'm happy with the growth we've seen this season but there'll need to be more by this time next year.

I'd say he'd get away with a slight regression in the league if he made the CL semi or finals in parallel.