Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2018 pt. 2

Lord TSC

Lord TSC wrote: »

Risk of a triple post here.

TheDoc wrote:

Hold my beer

TheDoc

Deleted User wrote: »

haha, it's how I do, come along in the morning playing catchup from the evening and night before, then braindump

Sorry

Also saw Lord broke 30k posts, catching up to do

Lord TSC

TheDoc wrote: »

haha, it's how I do, come along in the morning playing catchup from the evening and night before, then braindump

Sorry

Also saw Lord broke 30k posts, catching up to do

Sign up for a game of Werewolf some time and your post count will fly up :pac:

Cantona's Collars

https://twitter.com/Sport_Witness/status/998831488702574592

Dariman to Juventus "soon" for €15 million.

Mitch Connor

Hopefully the start of a bunch of moves in and out of the club over the next month or so. Will be interesting to see how the World Cup and shorter window (in England) effects the transfer window.

Hopefully United are close on a number of deals.

TheDoc

Reading a piece there on my phone "Jose Mourinho is so exasperated at the availability of Eric Bailly for selection, he is open to selling the defender this summer"

Lul wut

Mitch Connor

TheDoc wrote: »

Reading a piece there on my phone "Jose Mourinho is so exasperated at the availability of Eric Bailly for selection, he is open to selling the defender this summer"

Lul wut

Have been hearing that since the West Brom game.

My hope would be that this summer simply isn't the time to be selling him and that he can get back into Mourinho's good books next season. He is the best CB we currently have, imo.

Lord TSC

TheDoc wrote: »

Reading a piece there on my phone "Jose Mourinho is so exasperated at the availability of Eric Bailly for selection, he is open to selling the defender this summer"

Lul wut

It seems to be that jose is frustrated not just with how often Bailly is injured, but his lack of motivation to get back asap from injury. As per The Mirror

But ahead of the West Brom match on April 14 - one week after the win over the Premier League champions - Bailly told Mourinho that he was unable to play due to illness.

Manchester United would go on to lose the game 1-0, as Darren Moore set about pulling off the unthinkable in keeping the Baggies in the league - a job that proved too far in the end, despite his best efforts.

Bailly then reportedly turned up to training in good condition the very next day, ready to get back to work.

And it is his apparent lackadaisical attitude to the West Brom game that has prompted Mourinho to freeze the defender out of the first team, report the Daily Mail.

jacool

TheDoc wrote: »

Pity Leon Goretzka is moving to Bayern, thought there'd be more of a rush for him from around Europe, looks quality anytime I saw him, granted was very rare. But gets talked about a lot

He is quality - watch him this summer.
It would be a miracle to sneak a player out under Bayern's nose. They bought him back in January just like they did the previous year with Sule and Rudy.

If they are selling Vidal, it could be just like Schweinsteiger, i.e. a cleverly timed move by Munich moving out a player at 30+.

bangkok

TheDoc wrote: »

Reading a piece there on my phone "Jose Mourinho is so exasperated at the availability of Eric Bailly for selection, he is open to selling the defender this summer"

Lul wut

He didnt want to play him as he wasnt going to the world cup.

Never heard such nonsense in my life

secman

Bayern Munich can hardly con us again.... Hargreaves and Basti.... if they are prepared to offload Vidal.... its for a reason....don't touch him. A lot of hard mileage on his clock... great player on his day... past it now for PL I'd say.

Cantona's Collars

https://twitter.com/MysticalAlexis/status/998485479585648640

Talisca on Instagram,half the United squad are suddenly following him.

Mitch Connor

bangkok wrote: »

He didnt want to play him as he wasnt going to the world cup.

Never heard such nonsense in my life

I don't know what you are refering to - the world cup excuse or him being frozen out? I'm hoping it is the world cup excuse.

Lord TSC

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

https://twitter.com/MysticalAlexis/status/998485479585648640

Talisca on Instagram,half the United squad are suddenly following him.

Haha, they aren't subtle. There's actually a good write up about him over on /r/RedDevils. I'll quote it here.

I wrote a comment on another thread about talisca but seeing so many people asking about him, decided to post it as a new thread.

I am not a Beşiktaş fan living in Turkey, a mere coincidence made me somehow attached to this club. So this post comes from a neutral you might say.

Here's the repost;

So here goes an analysis about him, from a neutral who has watched him play 3 times live at the vodafone park; A derby, a CL game, and a home game against a minor opponent. Not to mention the numerous times on TV.

First things first, he is talented as hell, he has flair, speed and top quality long shots and proper finishing including heading. Saw him score headers most #9 s could not.

Mentally up for anything, and a humble guy. No alcohol/party/nightlife problems, married and a father of two. Saw news about him visiting the ghettos of Istanbul, to help poor kids. Bought diapers and stuff.

The link: http://www.hurriyet.com.tr/sporarena/anderson-taliscadan-ornek-davranis-40593736

Final thing about his mental/moral issues; I checked on sunday who finished the Turkish League first, and the score of the Besiktas game came to my attention as it was 5-1. I guessed it would be a bore draw since they had 0 chance of winning the title. Guess what? Talisca with 2 goals, 2 assists. He was literally crying by the final whistle and the fans gave him a proper fairwell. Thats the type of person he is. Determined. (Their beloved star quaresma did not bother to play this very same game, posting pictures of him lounging by a pool on his insta)

Downsides;

Diving. Maybe it shouldn't be called diving but he goes down really easily. Tbf this year it is really less than last year.

Concentration. He gets lost on the pitch 2/3 times per game. It's like the game has stopped and he is resting. Saw this happen at least 5 or 6 times.

Stamina. Way better this season, but his first season he was like a rescued hostage after 50 mins, barely had the power to walk. But this season he was also stronger physically.

Positions he can play. He is a MC, an AMC, a striker(false9). Not quite effective on any wing since I believe he feels uncomfortable being limited. Some say he may be a Fellaini replacement, he is nowhere near fellaini defensive and aggression wise. Really gentle player. But he can intercept and he improved it a lot.

Traits. Free kicks. Pogba/mata whoever it is will have to step aside, this guy is a sniper, and bends it like becks Really good left foot, sharp/strong shooting.

What I have told about him are totally what I have witnessed. Wish I had remembered the games and could deliver the links. Many videos on YouTube about his 2 years at Beşiktaş would give you an idea.

The Turkish League might be tactically weak and corrupt as ****, but it really is tough and physical league, with %70 of their (besiktas) opponents playing heavily defensive football. That would give you a clue. Nothing like eredivise. If you place an eredivise team in the Turkish League, they will call 911 after 10 minutes.

My final opinion; for 30/40m euros he will prove he is a bargain. A determined Brazil international, who is really unpredictable.

There's a thread on twitter, a Besiktas fan has posted each and every goal he has scored for them. Here it is;

https://twitter.com/authorbesiktas/status/998222407101046785?s=19

TheDoc

TheDoc wrote: »

We signed Sanchez, which looks a pretty obvious explanation, for various reasons.

He's created a number of problems, and not fixed a solitary thing yet.

Could be part of it certainly. However, Martial got starts in the team since Sanchez came in and was pure shíte in many appearances. He was a starter with Sanchez in the losses to Spurs and Newcastle for instance.

Martial had 13 starts in the 24 league games he was available for before Sanchez came in - 54%

He had 5 starts in the 14 league games since Sanchez came in. But Martial had a thigh injury in early March which kept him out of the squad for 2 games, where as he had no injuries keeping him out before Sanchez came in. So out of the 12 league games he was available for, he started 41% of them.

Starting 54% of games before Sanchez came in, versus 41% after he came in. That's not a vast difference, not as if his starts were dramatically reduced. He still got plenty of sub appearances, just like earlier in the season when he would come on and be effective with his minutes.

Martial has registered just 1 assist and 0 goals since Sanchez came in. That's 1 assist in 640 minutes of football in all comps, after a start to the season with 11 goals and 9 assists.

Trigger

bangkok wrote: »

He didnt want to play him as he wasnt going to the world cup.

Never heard such nonsense in my life

In fairness if he threw him under the bus to the media, you would be the first one in here criticising him for not keeping it in-house.

bangkok

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I don't know what you are refering to - the world cup excuse or him being frozen out? I'm hoping it is the world cup excuse.

Yea the world cup excuse. Laughable

Mitch Connor

The little I have read on Talisca doesn't seem appealing. Seems like he plays the same position as Lingard, and solves no gap in the squad.

Mitch Connor

Some very nice goals in that thread - looks good in the air, pity that is a relatively useless trait at United.

Some very nice touches and finishes.

Lord TSC

Mitch Connor wrote: »

The little I have read on Talisca doesn't seem appealing. Seems like he plays the same position as Lingard, and solves no gap in the squad.

Could be the Fellaini replacement, a Plan B squad player. Could be seen as a "cheaper" RW option so we can focus our spend elsewhere, especially if we can invest in a RB option.

He's not a big, flashy name, but obviously Jose feels he's worth bringing in.

DM_7

What is the harm in Jose trying to bring Bailly on board with the mentality he wants his team to have? He is next on from Shaw, Martial, Pogba, Smalling to have questions raised.

Like them or not but guys like Lingard, Mata, Young and Valencia keep seeing off competition for places regardless of manager.

Talisman

Deleted User wrote: »

I'd be inclined to agree and know what you mean, but 11 goals and 7 assists between August and mid January suggests that he was in the right team at the right time at some stage.

Completely fell off a cliff since then though. Rashford too. Both of them had a very promising first half to the season. I dunno what the fúck happened since.

The obvious answer is that Alexis Sanchez landed and disrupted the balance of the team.

Sanchez on the left displaces Martial/Rashford. Sanchez in the centre takes from Pogba's game. Sanchez up front didn't work. Sanchez, Pogba and Mata don't work together. The common denominator in things breaking down in the final third has been the presence of Alexis Sanchez, before he arrived it looked like the players knew their roles.

Rashford was devastating on the left against Liverpool, in the next game he was shunted to the right to accommodate Sanchez. Sanchez should have been hooked in the Sevilla game but he remained on the pitch because the team needed goals.

Honestly I think Mourinho only signed him because he was convinced that Man City wanted him. Sanchez needing to get used to playing styles etc isn't really an excuse - Arsenal's game plan often appeared to be give the ball to Sanchez and let him do his thing. There has been no evidence of that spark in the player at Man Utd.

Adamocovic

astradave wrote: »

In fairness if he threw him under the bus to the media, you would be the first one in here criticising him for not keeping it in-house.

I don't think I would consider a laughable excuse that contradicts most of Mourinho's opinions in the past as keeping it in-house.

Fair enough he didn't throw him completely under the bus, but gave such a ridiculous excuse the media pounced on it. If you search Bailly online it's article after article now about their relationship and transfer speculation.

Yes Mourinho could have handled it worse, but he most certainly could have handled it better too. You would expect a manager of his experience to have done a better job with that one. He is well used to and aware of what the English media are like.

Mitch Connor

Lord TSC wrote: »

Could be the Fellaini replacement, a Plan B squad player. Could be seen as a "cheaper" RW option so we can focus our spend elsewhere, especially if we can invest in a RB option.

He's not a big, flashy name, but obviously Jose feels he's worth bringing in.

Doesn't seem he is much of a winger though. Seems very centrally orientated going on that twitter thread. Also, left footed.

Jose has raved about him in the past, wanted him at Chelsea years ago, so if we are signing him he is certainly a Mourinho signing.

Could be part of a replacement for Pogba.

I can still see us looking to sell Pogba, replace him with Savic for less money with more trust he could play a CM role, and then Talisca in front of Savic and Matic?

pjohnson

As much as Sanchez arriving I think to switch to 4-3-3 has also hindered Martial. He was at his best in the 4-2-3-1

Talisman

DM_7 wrote: »

What is the harm in Jose trying to bring Bailly on board with the mentality he wants his team to have? He is next on from Shaw, Martial, Pogba, Smalling to have questions raised.

Like them or not but guys like Lingard, Mata, Young and Valencia keep seeing off competition for places regardless of manager.

I would not be surprised to see Arsenal make an offer for Mata if Emery is appointed manager.

pjohnson

Drumpot wrote: »

Is it the case that we think the following will be the formation:

---

Lukaku
Sanchez -- Pogba --- RW
--Matic---- CM
LWB - CB - CB - LWB

That would mean a RW and CM are priorities cause our defence, while not perfect, has been fairly good this season. The next priority is a full back and central defender.

I think completely removing the need for a right back is quite drastic but it just might work.

bangkok

Talisman wrote: »

I would not be surprised to see Arsenal make an offer for Mata if Emery is appointed manager.

Arsenal already have ozil and mkhitarayan. Signing mata would be pointless

Zeek12

Lord TSC wrote: »

Risk of a triple post here.

News in Germany is Bayern are trying to offload Vidal. They've set his price at 50m, but word is they'd take 35m.

Probably still too much for a 31 year old with knee issues, but for 25m or so, he'd be an interesting squad option.

This "reeks" of Schweinsteiger all over again - and for a lot more money!
A 31 yr old midfielder with knee issues?

Sorry, wouldn't go near him.
A very good midfielder 3 years ago maybe.....but that ship has sailed.

adox

Mata is another one I wouldnt mind seeing the back of.

NoviGlitzko

Truly believe it's not the personal. United are at ****ing nothing until the tactics change. We could have five Messi's up front and I've no doubt they'd all struggle in our system.

adox

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

Truly believe it's not the personal. United are at ****ing nothing until the tactics change. We could have five Messi's up front and I've no doubt they'd all struggle in our system.

I disagree. I think the players have to carry as much as the blame as the manager at least. They have proved to be a gutless bunch over the last few seasons. the new arrivals bar one or two seem to have fitted into that culture quite nicely.

Thats not absolving Jose in anyway but there are very few players in that squad I have any trust in.

bangkok

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

Truly believe it's not the personal. United are at ****ing nothing until the tactics change. We could have five Messi's up front and I've no doubt they'd all struggle in our system.

Would be a very messy team

jayo26

Any one know what tactics Jose was using on the cup final that made the players misplace passes?

Blame his training yes, but do not blame tactics because a professional player cant pass a ball from a to b.

I watched a league of Ireland game the other night for the first time in years and I was pleasantly surprised so much to the point that I will actually try get in a couple of live games over the summer but one thing that stood out for me is they actually could pass the bloody ball to each other why can't a bloody so called world class player or at least international standard player do it in a cup final at times when we need it most.

pjohnson

jayo26 wrote: »

Any one know what tactics Jose was using on the cup final that made the players misplace passes?

Blame his training yes, but do not blame tactics because a professional player cant pass a ball from a to b.

I watched a league of Ireland game the other night for the first time in years and I was pleasantly surprised so much to the point that I will actually try get in a couple of live games over the summer but one thing that stood out for me is they actually could pass the bloody ball to each other why can't a bloody so called world class player or at least international standard player do it in a cup final at times when we need it most.

I said before some of the recent decisions made by some players wouldn't be tolerated at Galway United.

bangkok

jayo26 wrote: »

Any one know what tactics Jose was using on the cup final that made the players misplace passes?

Blame his training yes, but do not blame tactics because a professional player cant pass a ball from a to b.

I watched a league of Ireland game the other night for the first time in years and I was pleasantly surprised so much to the point that I will actually try get in a couple of live games over the summer but one thing that stood out for me is they actually could pass the bloody ball to each other why can't a bloody so called world class player or at least international standard player do it in a cup final at times when we need it most.

Too be honest i think majority of the players arent playing with freedom and too many of them are nervous playing such are the tactical demands by the manager

Mitch Connor

there is no belief or confidence in our players, and they have struggled under pressure being heaped on top of that.

That is partly going to be an issue they need to sort for themselves, the pressure at United won't ease. But creating an environment of confidence and belief is on Jose as manager.

ElChe32

jayo26 wrote: »

Any one know what tactics Jose was using on the cup final that made the players misplace passes?

Blame his training yes, but do not blame tactics because a professional player cant pass a ball from a to b.

I watched a league of Ireland game the other night for the first time in years and I was pleasantly surprised so much to the point that I will actually try get in a couple of live games over the summer but one thing that stood out for me is they actually could pass the bloody ball to each other why can't a bloody so called world class player or at least international standard player do it in a cup final at times when we need it most.

I'm a season ticket St.Pat's fan and I'm enjoying the style of football we play with a number of talented young fellas (Darragh Markey is having a crackin' season for us) . I'd encourage any of you to get down to your local LOI club and show some support - unless your local team in Shamrock Rovers of course.

pjohnson

ElChe32 wrote: »

I'm a season ticket St.Pat's fan and I'm enjoying the style of football we play with a number of talented young fellas (Darragh Markey is having a crackin' season for us) . I'd encourage any of you to get down to your local LOI club and show some support - unless your local team in Shamrock Rovers of course.

Be harsh to reccomend Bray aswell tbh.

jayo26

ElChe32 wrote: »

I'm a season ticket St.Pat's fan and I'm enjoying the style of football we play with a number of talented young fellas (Darragh Markey is having a crackin' season for us) . I'd encourage any of you to get down to your local LOI club and show some support - unless your local team in Shamrock Rovers of course.

My local is wexford youths or wexford fc whatever they are called now but I refuse to follow them due to the founding father who I despise as a human been.

But I have been very impressed with how Waterford have changed the fortunes around from the last time I noticed them in second tier.

pjohnson

jayo26 wrote: »

My local is wexford youths or wexford fc whatever they are called now but I refuse to follow them due to the founding father who I despise as a human been.

But I have been very impressed with how Waterford have changed the fortunes around from the last time I noticed them in second tier.

Waterford are very good alright.

hufpc8w3adnk65

jayo26 wrote: »

My local is wexford youths or wexford fc whatever they are called now but I refuse to follow them due to the founding father who I despise as a human been.

But I have been very impressed with how Waterford have changed the fortunes around from the last time I noticed them in second tier.

Your dead to me!

adox

adox wrote: »

I disagree. I think the players have to carry as much as the blame as the manager at least. They have proved to be a gutless bunch over the last few seasons. the new arrivals bar one or two seem to have fitted into that culture quite nicely.

Thats not absolving Jose in anyway but there are very few players in that squad I have any trust in.

So, does it not boil down to the management? If not only the Fergie/Moyes/LVG signings are showing fúck-all enthusiasm, but most of Jose's own signings, it can't be attributed to those same old gutless players we've had for years. It's a problem if the newer players are already becoming unsettled or showing emotional lethargy.

I don't want to steer us to another day of Jose in/out talk and this is not my point at all, but after 2 seasons a manager is more to blame than the players for any team/football problems which there are. That doesn't mean there is enough to be blamed for that someone needs to go, just that Jose is ultimately the one who needs to get all these players working together and fighting for something.

The manager in any football team has that responsibility. I fúcking hate that 'The buck stops with...' saying, but it's true of a manager who has had 2 seasons and 4 transfer windows to make the team his own and the players walk through walls for him.

We lack leadership of course, but what happened to a manager instilling it in his players? I didn't think it was something that could only be bought in the transfer market.

jayo26

Mitch Connor wrote: »

there is no belief or confidence in our players, and they have struggled under pressure being heaped on top of that.

That is partly going to be an issue they need to sort for themselves, the pressure at United won't ease. But creating an environment of confidence and belief is on Jose as manager.

bangkok wrote: »

Too be honest i think majority of the players arent playing with freedom and too many of them are nervous playing such are the tactical demands by the manager

Really so how can pogba go from been our player of the month in April to putting in putrid performances in his final game of the league and cup final? Is it suddenly he rediscovered his confidence again for a few weeks or the manager took the shakels off them for a month?

The excuses been rolled out to defend some of the players is shocking.

Pogba was out best player up until Christmas time people were saying he would be even better in a 433 and jose wasnt using him right. We switch to a 433 and he goes absoloutely to sh1t for the oast few months of the season as do most other members of the team.

I genuinely believe some of them were saving themselves for the world cup because they felt they had nothing to play for at club level at least I hope it is because if they don't and they turn up next season with the same attitude we are ****ed.

Jose has not suddenly turned into a van gaal manager with no freedom yes he was defensive minded but his teams with Madrid and Chelsea always scored goals always created chances even United last year we created somewhere near the most chances in the league we just couldn't score.

Jose needs to buck up his ideas or he will be gone yes he does but it is not as simple as laying the blame on the manager for everything because if the club goes down that route we will never get back to a consistent direction we will end up like Chelsea and players revolting against the manager ever 2 years.

jayo26

MrMac84 wrote: »

Your dead to me!

Haha for which part exactly lol.

HONKEY TONK

Just looking at the expiry of contracts, its going to cost alot of money to replace these players and we will get **** all by selling them.

Here is a list of United players' contract expiry dates:

Summer 2018

Marouane Fellaini

Summer 2019

Ander Herrera

Luke Shaw

Juan Mata

Antonio Valencia*

Phil Jones*

Chris Smalling*

Matteo Darmian*

Anthony Martial*

David de Gea*

James Wilson*

Andreas Pereira*

Sam Johnstone

Daley Blind

Ashley Young

Summer 2020

Marcus Rashford*

Eric Bailly*

Timothy Fosu-Mensah*

Cameron Borthwick-Jackson*

Nemanja Matic*

Summer 2021

Jesse Lingard*

Paul Pogba*

Victor Lindelof*

Joel Pereira*

Sergio Romero*

Scott McTominay*

Marcos Rojo*


Summer 2022

Romelu Lukaku*


Alexis Sanchez*

*Option of an additional year.

Talisman

bangkok wrote: »

Arsenal already have ozil and mkhitarayan. Signing mata would be pointless

Emery loves Mata from their time together at Valencia - given the choice he would take him over almost anyone. He wanted PSG to sign Mata in 2017 when they had Ben Arfa, Di Maria, Draxler, Moura, Pastore, and others in the squad.

Liam O

adox wrote: »

I disagree. I think the players have to carry as much as the blame as the manager at least. They have proved to be a gutless bunch over the last few seasons. the new arrivals bar one or two seem to have fitted into that culture quite nicely.

Thats not absolving Jose in anyway but there are very few players in that squad I have any trust in.

There is just no intensity which it looked like Jose was trying to alleviate with making players fight for their position in the squad. Even when 1-0 down late on it's pass around the middle for far too long and eventually go wide when the defense have had time to set.

It's a mentality thing imo. It used to be big news when United didn't win and being in the shirt meant that the buck stopped at you. This is because if it wasn't Keane, Giggs, Scholes, Rio, Vidic etc. on the field who would tear you a new one, you then had to trudge back to a dressing room where there was Fergie who was going to make you feel like you let him down.

Now there's a bit of a careless culture there, the shirt doesn't mean that teams are afraid and the players don't see drawing or losing as letting down everyone around them as United are no longer on the perch trying to swat away challenges every year.

The team haven't evolved post Fergie into a modern superclub on the pitch. A recruitment policy that spans through different managers is needed. United had the profile to pick up the best players in the world but went for big names over stability and team building. Each manager trying to use a get out of jail by throwing money around approach won't work long term. They come in and tear up the previous regime and that is what needs to stop.

bangkok

jayo26 wrote: »

Really so how can pogba go from been our player of the month in April to putting in putrid performances in his final game of the league and cup final? Is it suddenly he rediscovered his confidence again for a few weeks or the manager took the shakels off them for a month?

The excuses been rolled out to defend some of the players is shocking.

Pogba was out best player up until Christmas time people were saying he would be even better in a 433 and jose wasnt using him right. We switch to a 433 and he goes absoloutely to sh1t for the oast few months of the season as do most other members of the team.

I genuinely believe some of them were saving themselves for the world cup because they felt they had nothing to play for at club level at least I hope it is because if they don't and they turn up next season with the same attitude we are ****ed.

Jose has not suddenly turned into a van gaal manager with no freedom yes he was defensive minded but his teams with Madrid and Chelsea always scored goals always created chances even United last year we created somewhere near the most chances in the league we just couldn't score.

Jose needs to buck up his ideas or he will be gone yes he does but it is not as simple as laying the blame on the manager for everything because if the club goes down that route we will never get back to a consistent direction we will end up like Chelsea and players revolting against the manager ever 2 years.

Jose has critisised every single player he hs signed apart from matic. Players not going to gain confidence from that

14murphy

ElChe32 wrote: »

I'm a season ticket St.Pat's fan and I'm enjoying the style of football we play with a number of talented young fellas (Darragh Markey is having a crackin' season for us) . I'd encourage any of you to get down to your local LOI club and show some support - unless your local team in Shamrock Rovers of course.

As a Bohs fan I can't back the statement up enough. Get down to your local club and show some support and enjoy some ball, but **** Shamrock Rovers.