Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2018 pt. 2

yabadabado

Andrew Beef wrote: »

I don’t think I’ve ever cited Graeme Souness before, but I find him good as a pundit. He’s enormously experienced both as a player and as a coach and he speaks honestly and articulately. The fact that he played for them is irrelevant; Gary Neville provides top quality impartial analysis despite being a rabid Red Devil.

That is the key difference when discussing Souness. The man is a disgrace of a pundit when it comes to United.

PhlegmyMoses

Had written an amazingly satirical post. But I don't feel like I can beat: Pogba > zidane

Hyperbole? Non mon frere

Trigger

Lord TSC wrote: »

Lukaku with two so far against Saudi Arabia.

Two goals and an assist.. in saying that Romero and Rojo on the wrong side of a tonking from Spain

S.M.B.

Fair play to Young for somehow putting himself in contention for a seat on the plane to Russia.

bangkok

De gea with an assist.

Legend

Cookiemunster

astradave wrote: »

Two goals and an assist.. in saying that Romero and Rojo on the wrong side of a tonking from Spain

Romero only lasted 22 minutes. Got injured conceding the first goal apparently.

NoviGlitzko

Well folks. Heading over for the Swansea game. Mate had tickets sorted but it doesn't seem like we might have them come the match so i'm a bit worried. What would people recommend in here that'd be the best shot of getting tickets at a non-inflated price?

Comic Book Guy

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

Well folks. Heading over for the Swansea game. Mate had tickets sorted but it doesn't seem like we might have them come the match so i'm a bit worried. What would people recommend in here that'd be the best shot of getting tickets at a non-inflated price?

Try posting in the Man Utd season tickets thread, there is actually a single ticket for that game recently posted.
You should be able to tickets around the ground the day of the game, especially one against West Brom. There was plenty on offer for the City game before Christmas when I was over.

Whatsisname

NoviGlitzko wrote: »

Well folks. Heading over for the Swansea game. Mate had tickets sorted but it doesn't seem like we might have them come the match so i'm a bit worried. What would people recommend in here that'd be the best shot of getting tickets at a non-inflated price?

There’s a few United ticket accounts on twitter that are worth having a look at, just a word of warning, be very careful, I got scammed over for the Brighton match, along with a few hundred more I reckon.

beno619

bangkok wrote: »

Surprised actually pogba hasnt pushed more to be taking a few free kicks for us, he has very good technique

Ha what are you on about he's first choice on free kicks.

Last season he was unlucky and hit the post a few times this season they have been crap.

bangkok

beno619 wrote: »

Ha what are you on about he's first choice on free kicks.

Last season he was unlucky and hit the post a few times this season they have been crap.

He is def not first choice. Has walked away from loads of frees this season. Mata rashford sanchez have all taken frees while he has been on the field. Even lukaku took one when he was on the field

Trigger

bangkok wrote: »

He is def not first choice. Has walked away from loads of frees this season. Mata rashford sanchez have all taken frees while he has been on the field. Even lukaku took one when he was on the field

Two of those are left footers, in fairness there are plenty of few takers in the team so maybe they have designated areas amongst themselves..

Adamocovic

Saw some quotes from Giggsy this week, while on duty with Wales.

“I learned a lot about how lonely it was when I was United manager*,” he said. “When you shut the door of your office and everyone else has gone home, you’re on your own.

“It’s good to have people around and you want those people to be the ones you trust, but it can still be a lonely place. Ultimately you’re the boss and you have to make the decisions.”

*Interim manager for 4 weeks there Ryan :pac:

Liam O

Andrew Beef wrote: »

I think that the inference there is disgraceful.

He doesn’t track back, but he also takes up strange positions, and tries to dribble too much.

But to invoke race is offside.

Insulting a player's intelligence is shaky ground when you are talking about black players, you must be aware of that? Pogba has shown an awful lot of football intelligence from a very young age and to insult that element of his game is baffling imo.

He doesn't track back because he's lazy. The likes Berbatov, Zidane etc. were never called unintelligent because they did the same were they?

dave_o_brien

Liam O wrote: »

Insulting a player's intelligence is shaky ground when you are talking about black players, you must be aware of that? Pogba has shown an awful lot of football intelligence from a very young age and to insult that element of his game is baffling imo.

He doesn't track back because he's lazy. The likes Berbatov, Zidane etc. were never called unintelligent because they did the same were they?

Ah here...

Andrew Beef might be talking serious amounts of codswollop, but there was no implication of race in any of his posts.

And SO many people called Berbatov lazy.

Turtwig

Lazy is often a misnomer imo. Players gusting a butt are very often just out of position in the first place. Good example being ozil. He's a dedicated pro with very good aptitude. Yet, for reasons I've never understood is classed as lazy.

Cantona's Collars

https://twitter.com/ManUtdMEN/status/978974988345765888

"Jose Mourinho wants five signings to replace the six he intends to ship out at United this summer #mufc "

https://twitter.com/MirrorFootball/status/978957958938841088


"Jose has convinced Real Madrid star Bale to 'join Manchester United in summer'

Mitch Connor

at least Bale does actually play on the right, even if he is left footed.

Would have to think Martial/Rashford would be sold to bring him in.

Have to think it is total BS.

Liam O

dave_o_brien wrote: »

Ah here...

Andrew Beef might be talking serious amounts of codswollop, but there was no implication of race in any of his posts.

And SO many people called Berbatov lazy.

I don't know. It's just the amount of times I heard it about Lukaku during the summer when he is a very intelligent player too made me a bit sensitive to it. I just think that there are certain negative connotations to it. Especially considering how much footballing intelligence Pogba shows on the pitch. I don't believe that it was due to race that he made those comments. As I said it just seems to come up a lot more with black players without any real basis.

I don't know what people calling Berbatov lazy has to do with anything.

Someone needs segregate the different races and nationalities into lists and add in which adjectives are acceptable for each one in the fight for equality for all

wanderer100

Gonna miss this guy

https://twitter.com/MUFCScoop/status/979027745467494401

adox

Liam O wrote: »

I don't know. It's just the amount of times I heard it about Lukaku during the summer when he is a very intelligent player too made me a bit sensitive to it. I just think that there are certain negative connotations to it. Especially considering how much footballing intelligence Pogba shows on the pitch. I don't believe that it was due to race that he made those comments. As I said it just seems to come up a lot more with black players without any real basis.

I don't know what people calling Berbatov lazy has to do with anything.

It’s bollix really and awful to question on poster on it. Loads of white players are called unintelligent. Remember the lists of brainless wingers.

Was anyone apart from you actually thinking of Pogbas race when the poster called him unintelligent? I think I’ve called him that many times before and never even considered his race. It’s football I tellengence we are talking about. I think I even pointed out that it’s not a slight on a persons i tellengence and gave Rooney as an example. Not the brightest spark to put it mildly by all accounts but one of the most intellegent footballers I have ever seen.

I’m sure it wasnt your intention but your sort of argument does more harm than good when trying to stamp racism or prejudice out of the game.

Lord TSC

Mitch Connor wrote: »

at least Bale does actually play on the right, even if he is left footed.

Would have to think Martial/Rashford would be sold to bring him in.

Have to think it is total BS.

I know I've said it before, but I think if Jose can get the reported 75m for Martial, he'll happily take it, given he has Sanchez/Rashford for the left side already. We'd be in a stronger position tbh if we could swap Martial for a top level RW player....

Lord TSC

https://twitter.com/dries_mertens14/status/979041812861071360?s=19

pjohnson

Lord TSC wrote: »

https://twitter.com/dries_mertens14/status/979041812861071360?s=19

Unicrons Dad

For anyone that watched the england v italy game the other night who looked better between Verratti and Jorginho? Aren't they similar types of midfield players ? United have been linked with those 2 but much more linked with Lazios savic . Savic looks a fine player but not the deep lying passer we need. Id only go for him if Pogba was going. So out of Verratti Jorginho or Kroos who would be the dream signing?

Unicrons Dad

Lord TSC wrote: »

I know I've said it before, but I think if Jose can get the reported 75m for Martial, he'll happily take it, given he has Sanchez/Rashford for the left side already. We'd be in a stronger position tbh if we could swap Martial for a top level RW player....

I agree. Hed love Willian

Andrew Beef

Liam O wrote: »

Andrew Beef wrote: »

I think that the inference there is disgraceful.

He doesn’t track back, but he also takes up strange positions, and tries to dribble too much.

But to invoke race is offside.

Insulting a player's intelligence is shaky ground when you are talking about black players, you must be aware of that? Pogba has shown an awful lot of football intelligence from a very young age and to insult that element of his game is baffling imo.

He doesn't track back because he's lazy. The likes Berbatov, Zidane etc. were never called unintelligent because they did the same were they?

Your post is disgusting to be honest.

I have never read the like of it.

The inference is vile and I find it deeply offensive.

Andrew Beef

When I see Paul Pogba, I just see a footballer, albeit one who I think is overrated and flawed. Race doesn’t come into it. I am shocked and appalled that you are posting otherwise. It is the worst thing I’ve seen on these pages.

jayo26

Andrew Beef wrote: »

When I see Paul Pogba, I just see a footballer, albeit one who I think is overrated and flawed. Race doesn’t come into it. I am shocked and appalled that you are posting otherwise. It is the worst thing I’ve seen on these pages.

I don't see what your disgusted over? But then again I didn't read your original post

Don't think he was calling anyone a racist but there is a precedent there in my opinion that black players get labelled as not intelligent enough if they have a problem like tracking back instead of just been called lazy.

I don't believe you were been racist but again it's not such a shocking thing for someone to discuss race as an issue when judging opinions on players I think your just so shocked and disgusted because it's your opinion he is debating it over.

Trigger

Some new staff..

https://twitter.com/samuelluckhurst/status/979269251558182912?s=21

StringerBell

Pogba is not lacking in intelligence, he does not have good defensive awareness at all though which I guess gets labelled intelligence at times incorrectly. His positioning is poor and players run off him easily, this all stems from his inability to improve his awareness. His instinct focuses on other aspects of the game, he is a creative attack minded player, he is not nor probably ever will be a complete midfielder. Not because he doesn't have the tools or the intelligence but because it appears he is unable to curb his natural instincts. Berba was constantly called lazy much like ozil due to the way they glide around the pitch not looking like they are busting a gut.

I don't think it's a race thing when people refer to players as lazy or question their intelligence and often I think it says more about the person being offended then it does the one making the comment...

The truth is there is no player at the top level who is lazy as you simply wouldn't make it to that level if you were. There are guys who look like they are busting a gut more sure, but nobody actually lazy. Game intelligence is a different animal and though most players have a good level of intelligence for the game some are just a cut above and see things before anybody else, your Messi's, xavis, scholes' etc defensive awareness is another aspect of the game that creative players struggle with as they are hard wired to think about what to do with the ball imo

Some players instincts are to sniff out danger before it develops, the Italian defenders have a rich tradition of it. The likes of makelele made a career of it, busquets is almost a perfect blend of the two and was for a long time probably the most complete midfield player I've seen in a long time.

I started writing this post too long ago and got interrupted a couple of times so forgive the rambling nature of it.

StringerBell

The man who finally found the secret to thanking something twice

jayo26

StringerBell wrote: »

The man who finally found the secret to thanking something twice

There was someone else here a while ago that somehow managed to thank a post 10 times!!!!! While I do agree I'm talented I'm not quiet at that level yet.


Also you need to get yourself a good addblocker

Cantona's Collars

Giggs has asked Bale just to drive one car with a modified seat to help solve his injury problems.
I remember Giggs having to do the same to solve his persistent hamstring injuries. It was found that the way the seating position was in his sports cars was causing problems.

Liam O

StringerBell wrote: »

Pogba is not lacking in intelligence, he does not have good defensive awareness at all though which I guess gets labelled intelligence at times incorrectly. His positioning is poor and players run off him easily, this all stems from his inability to improve his awareness. His instinct focuses on other aspects of the game, he is a creative attack minded player, he is not nor probably ever will be a complete midfielder. Not because he doesn't have the tools or the intelligence but because it appears he is unable to curb his natural instincts. Berba was constantly called lazy much like ozil due to the way they glide around the pitch not looking like they are busting a gut.

I don't think it's a race thing when people refer to players as lazy or question their intelligence and often I think it says more about the person being offended then it does the one making the comment...

The truth is there is no player at the top level who is lazy as you simply wouldn't make it to that level if you were. There are guys who look like they are busting a gut more sure, but nobody actually lazy. Game intelligence is a different animal and though most players have a good level of intelligence for the game some are just a cut above and see things before anybody else, your Messi's, xavis, scholes' etc defensive awareness is another aspect of the game that creative players struggle with as they are hard wired to think about what to do with the ball imo

Some players instincts are to sniff out danger before it develops, the Italian defenders have a rich tradition of it. The likes of makelele made a career of it, busquets is almost a perfect blend of the two and was for a long time probably the most complete midfield player I've seen in a long time.

I started writing this post too long ago and got interrupted a couple of times so forgive the rambling nature of it.

I guess lazy is a bad way of framing it alright. Attitude may be a better word. These players have been the most talented players on their team for their whole lives and don't believe they have to work as hard as their peers in the defensive side of the game as that is not their remit I think that is fair enough? Pogba is a world record transfer fee breaking player, if he was chasing the ball back he would have goals and assist numbers comparable to Dembele or the likes and would be called a failure in that sense. I believe that at times this season he has put his own interests above the team and have been greatly disappointed by that, as presumably has his manager.

My problem is you would certainly never hear/have heard the likes of similar link up players like Scholes, Iniesta or Xavi labelled as unintelligent because they don't track back as much. Pogba may see a purely defensive player like Matic behind him and think that is enough. I don't agree with it and his manager doesn't agree with it but I don't think it's anything to do with intelligence, it's just how he has always played. There have always been players around him to cover for this attitude. It was just strange to me to hear that it was down to a lack of intelligence, footballing or otherwise as like I said, similar players to him with similar attitudes to tracking back get lauded for their intelligence.

Mitch Connor

Hmmm, Director of Football Operations - a new role. Would is that just a logistical role or will it play any part in transfers and contracts etc

Adamocovic

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Giggs has asked Bale just to drive one car with a modified seat to help solve his injury problems.
I remember Giggs having to do the same to solve his persistent hamstring injuries. It was found that the way the seating position was in his sports cars was causing problems.

Also apparently banned caps (baseball hats) as he wants them to dress sharply.

Somewhere Tony Pulis is choking on his cornflakes!

StringerBell

jayo26 wrote: »

There was someone else here a while ago that somehow managed to thank a post 10 times!!!!! While I do agree I'm talented I'm not quiet at that level yet.


Also you need to get yourself a good addblocker

I'm on the phone, can you get adblock for the phone? Suppose you can, never occurred to me

StringerBell

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Hmmm, Director of Football Operations - a new role. Would is that just a logistical role or will it play any part in transfers and contracts etc

Woodward is doing pretty well with the transfer side of things and has increased his and united reputation globally as an honourable club to do business with. Unless he wants it step away from that side himself for personal reasons of be shocked if someone was taking over for him

jayo26

StringerBell wrote: »

I'm on the phone, can you get adblock for the phone? Suppose you can, never occurred to me

Yeah you sure can I use an app called adaway but it's only for rooted android phones I'm not sure what's the best for anyone else but works well with me and chrome mobile.

pjohnson

I got "Adblock" it popped up on my Samsung Internet browser. I just had to enable it with a push.

20 Times 20 Times

Raging got two tickets for the FA cup semi final and cant go . Luckily enough I have someone to take them off my hand.

dave_o_brien

StringerBell wrote: »

I don't think it's a race thing when people refer to players as lazy or question their intelligence and often I think it says more about the person being offended then it does the one making the comment...

What happened here can be summarised as follows:

Person A: I think player-x is unintelligent as a player.
Person B: That's racist, because he is black.
Person A: ....?!

This is a strawman fallacy; it introduces a point unmade by Person A and attacks that. When used effectively (particularly in fiery and emotional debates), it is a remarkable debating tool. In this instance it is transparent.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman

As an aside, one would do worse than familiarising themselves with common logical fallacies; there is an upcoming referendum that will rely heavily on both sides on them. A concerned voter should be equipping themselves with the ability to spot them when they do crop up. It is apparent that one side in particular are indulging in enormous logical fallacies.

Regardless, Andrew Beef's opinion that Pogba isn't intelligent is an opinion, but one most would disagree with. He is a remarkable attacking talent gifted with extraordinary vision and technique. To criticise him for his defensive positioning is to criticise DDG for his low goalscoring rate or Messi for the fact that he's never saved a penalty in all his Barcelona career. Don't judge a fish by his ability to ride a bicycle.

Trigger

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Hmmm, Director of Football Operations - a new role. Would is that just a logistical role or will it play any part in transfers and contracts etc

Doubt it, more so someone for all the higher staff on the football side of things from the Academy, plus club Secretary, Accounts etc to report to, who would then in turn report to Woodward, less work for Woodward and he could concentrate on First team/transfers and the like

Just waiting for someone to misunderstand and think we are being in a DOF over Jose

Liam O

dave_o_brien wrote: »

What happened here can be summarised as follows:

Person A: I think player-x is unintelligent as a player.
Person B: That's racist, because he is black.
Person A: ....?!

This is a strawman fallacy; it introduces a point unmade by Person A and attacks that. When used effectively (particularly in fiery and emotional debates), it is a remarkable debating tool. In this instance it is transparent.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/strawman

As an aside, one would do worse than familiarising themselves with common logical fallacies; there is an upcoming referendum that will rely heavily on both sides on them. A concerned voter should be equipping themselves with the ability to spot them when they do crop up. It is apparent that one side in particular are indulging in enormous logical fallacies.

Regardless, Andrew Beef's opinion that Pogba isn't intelligent is an opinion, but one most would disagree with. He is a remarkable attacking talent gifted with extraordinary vision and technique. To criticise him for his defensive positioning is to criticise DDG for his low goalscoring rate or Messi for the fact that he's never saved a penalty in all his Barcelona career. Don't judge a fish by his ability to ride a bicycle.

I initially brought it up as an observation that it seems to be talked about more with black players for whatever reason.

I've subsequently named similar players to Pogba who have never and would never be called unintelligent. I just find it baffling that a poster can continually call a player unintelligent and useless based purely on the fact that he doesn't track back when that is usually a trait of the most intelligent players in the game.

Maybe I was wrong to bring it up in the first place but after a Summer of reading about Lukaku being a flat track bully and a lump with no football intelligence when he is one of the more intelligent players around (even if I still have reservations on his overall ability) I'm a bit sensitive to baseless accusations on this subject possibly and if Andrew has taken it as an insult towards him that's not how it was meant.

paulbok

astradave wrote: »

Doubt it, more so someone for all the higher staff on the football side of things from the Academy, plus club Secretary, Accounts etc to report to, who would then in turn report to Woodward, less work for Woodward and he could concentrate on First team/transfers and the like

Just waiting for someone to misunderstand and think we are being in a DOF over Jose

Or tomorrow's back page headlines, "United take on director of football to force Jose out".

On a vaguely similar note, the annual United prepare mega offer for Ronaldo stories are in full swing. They are not even hiding the fact anymore he is looking for a new contract with pay parity with Messi & Neymar.

dave_o_brien

Liam O wrote: »

Maybe I was wrong to bring it up in the first place but after a Summer of reading about Lukaku being a flat track bully and a lump with no football intelligence when he is one of the more intelligent players around (even if I still have reservations on his overall ability) I'm a bit sensitive to baseless accusations on this subject possibly and if Andrew has taken it as an insult towards him that's not how it was meant.

I think this is fair, for what it's worth. I can't see anywhere how it might have been attributed to Andrew Beef, but I think your response here is totally understandable.

Andrew Beef is still holding a fairly bizarre opinion!

Andrew Beef

Liam O, I accept your apology.

Unicrons Dad

Unicrons Dad wrote: »

For anyone that watched the england v italy game the other night who looked better between Verratti and Jorginho? Aren't they similar types of midfield players ? United have been linked with those 2 but much more linked with Lazios savic . Savic looks a fine player but not the deep lying passer we need. Id only go for him if Pogba was going. So out of Verratti Jorginho or Kroos who would be the dream signing?

Would still appreciate some feedback on this