The 8th Amendment Part 2 - Mod Warning in OP

1hnr79jr65

As a guy my own view is the following,

Would i be upset or hurt if my fiancee wanted an abortion without colsulting me? - Depending on circumstance, of course i would.
Would i be upset or hurt if my fiancee needed an abortion? - Again depending on circumstance, yes I could be.
Do i think abortion should be allowed for all circumstances? - No, i believe in cases of rape/incest, mental or physical health risks and other similar cases it should be freely granted. However there are other instances i would not agree with it.
Do i have a right to tell another human what to do to their body if they are of sound mind and of legal age to self determine best course of action? - No, no more than anyone would have the right to tell me i must have a circumscision, or i must not masturbate and so on.
Am i voting for unlimited abortions? - I will be voting for choice.

For the abortion referendum I will be voting "YES" in favor of giving that choice to those whose lives will be ultimately be affected. Regardless of my personal views, regardless of posters or documentation from either side. I am voting to give what should be already free to women, the ability to make a choice based on their own circumstances and how they feel best to tackle those circumstances.

One thing i am annoyed about is the anti abortion side flaunting huge posters around with pictures of abortions, those are someones personal moments, they would have grieved for in some way. The anti abortion lobby are using vicious, cruel and shock methods to enforce their agenda hoping it will upset folks enough to vote No. Any group that uses such tactics reaks of desperation, yes abortion is not a pleasant thing for anyone to go through but weaponising photos of someones private moments will not endear those to rally to their cause.

One would have to wonder as those images being used are of real abortions, as images they technically count as "Data" and as such did the anti abortion groups have permission to share said "Data" without breaching data protection laws?

Zubeneschamali

Simi wrote: »

So your advice is to circumvent the law by illegally obtaining abortion pills and using them?

Wow!

This is the same mindset as the 13th amendment - a fetus is a baby but no-one should be punished for going to England and murdering one.

Makes not a lick of sense to keep the 8th on the books while advocating wholesale lawbreaking via internet pills or dodging via Ryanair, but "Holy Catholic Ireland, not while you're under my roof, something something".

erica74

Just making sure everyone can find the link

https://togetherforyes.causevox.com/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=post&utm_campaign=cf1

Hopefully once more posters are put up, people will be even more inclined to talk about this and research the facts behind the referendum.

€302,349 raised, target now €400,000.

JDD

pleas advice wrote: »

where have I ever said that? heres an answer I gave in the previous thread

So you’re in favor of legalizing the termination pill? That’s great, why didn’t you say that before? Will you be voting yes?

Or are you saying you’re going to vote no, but you’re okay with a sort of wink wink nudge nudge situation where we’ll say the importation of termination pills is illegal but the DPP won’t enforce the law? And you okay with someone taking strong medication with plenty of contraindications without a doctor being available to advise them?

baylah17

pleas advice wrote: »

up to 12 weeks, yes. Assuming the proposed legislation passes, repealing the 8th will result in abortion on demand.

And whats wrong with that, other than youre mistrust of women to know whats best for themselves?

ELM327

Sour Lemonz wrote: »

As a guy my own view is the following,

Would i be upset or hurt if my fiancee wanted an abortion without colsulting me? - Depending on circumstance, of course i would.
Would i be upset or hurt if my fiancee needed an abortion? - Again depending on circumstance, yes I could be.
Do i think abortion should be allowed for all circumstances? - No, i believe in cases of rape/incest, mental or physical health risks and other similar cases it should be freely granted. However there are other instances i would not agree with it.
Do i have a right to tell another human what to do to their body if they are of sound mind and of legal age to self determine best course of action? - No, no more than anyone would have the right to tell me i must have a circumscision, or i must not masturbate and so on.
Am i voting for unlimited abortions? - I will be voting for choice.

For the abortion referendum I will be voting "YES" in favor of giving that choice to those whose lives will be ultimately be affected. Regardless of my personal views, regardless of posters or documentation from either side. I am voting to give what should be already free to women, the ability to make a choice based on their own circumstances and how they feel best to tackle those circumstances.

One thing i am annoyed about is the anti abortion side flaunting huge posters around with pictures of abortions, those are someones personal moments, they would have grieved for in some way. The anti abortion lobby are using vicious, cruel and shock methods to enforce their agenda hoping it will upset folks enough to vote No. Any group that uses such tactics reaks of desperation, yes abortion is not a pleasant thing for anyone to go through but weaponising photos of someones private moments will not endear those to rally to their cause.

One would have to wonder as those images being used are of real abortions, as images they technically count as "Data" and as such did the anti abortion groups have permission to share said "Data" without breaching data protection laws?

+1
Also speaking as a man, you have a similar outlook to myself.

NuMarvel

pleas advice wrote: »

up to 12 weeks, yes. Assuming the proposed legislation passes, repealing the 8th will result in abortion on demand.

Incorrect. We already have "abortion on demand" up to 12 weeks in Ireland, because women can, and do, import the abortion pill from overseas without having to give any medical reason or indication.

None of those women to date have faced any criminal sanctions, be it for illegal importation or for an illegal abortion. What's more, even No side politicians have said these women shouldn't be prosecuted or criminalised, so it's unlikely they'll ever face criminal sanctions.

Assuming the legislation passed, repealing the 8th will not result in "abortion on demand" up to 12 weeks; it will regulate it, making it safer for women, and it will decriminalise it, which even your fellow No supporters have called for.

Zubeneschamali

Trasna1 wrote: »

I'm surprised repeal couldn't come up with a positive image/picture.

I am not surprised that they didn't try. As with the Citizens Assembly and Oireachteas Committee, when the conversation sticks to the facts, repeal wins.

Zubeneschamali

NuMarvel wrote: »

What's more, even No side politicians have said these women shouldn't be prosecuted or criminalised, so it's unlikely they'll ever face criminal sanctions.

That is not how the law works. It is not up to politicians to decide who should obey laws, it is just up to them to decide what the law should be.

Law enforcement, from the guards up to the Director of Public Prosecutions, have a very strong Constitutional duty to punish women caught procuring abortions in Ireland. If we don't repeal the 8th, we will eventually see a case before the Courts, someone facing a 14 year jail sentence.

And it will be no use the pro-life crew saying "...but we didn't mean you to enforce that law".

baldshin

Has anyone else questioned the cost of the posters? €10 a poster when you're buying such a large quantity seems way over the top.

nozzferrahhtoo

baldshin wrote: »

Has anyone else questioned the cost of the posters? €10 a poster when you're buying such a large quantity seems way over the top.

Yea that struck me too. When more than doubling your order quantity you would expect a per unit drop in cost by the supplier.

But the new higher target happened very quickly due to the sheer speed of donations yesterday. So perhaps the organizers simply have not gone back to their supplier yet to ask for a re-quote. So they are still working with the base quote they were offered.

The level of money they have now gives them a lot of buying power to shop around. I hope they have a business head on their shoulders and they shop around, play quotes off each others, and maybe even consider going beyond just posters to printed media in news papers, radio, buses, bill boards, who knows.

kylith

pleas advice wrote: »

Me, personally. No. Nor for importing abortion pills, or taking them.

So you’re ok with women taking abortion pills, as would be the case if abortion to 12 weeks was legalised, but not with being able to do so without risking prosecution or being able to get proper medical advice and aftercare?

ohnonotgmail

kylith wrote: »

So you’re ok with women taking abortion pills, as would be the case if abortion to 12 weeks was legalised, but not with being able to do so without risking prosecution or being able to get proper medical advice and aftercare?

the mental gymnastics required to adopt that position are pretty impressive. if it was an olympic event it would definitely win gold.

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Annasopra

baldshin wrote: »

Has anyone else questioned the cost of the posters? €10 a poster when you're buying such a large quantity seems way over the top.

You are also paying for distribution and delivery, plastic cable ties and for them to be hung up by companies with drivers, machinery etc so not that over the top

borderlinemeath

€50 donated. Past €320k now. Keep it going

Simi

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

the mental gymnastics required to adopt that position are pretty impressive. if it was an olympic event it would definitely win gold.

It's possibly the most sadistic position I've seen someone adopt so far.

Someone who knows the eight is ineffective at preventing abortion, who accepts that women are going to have unsafe abortions using pills and who actually seems fine with that, so long as it's unsafe, illegal and in secret with no support.

I mean JDO's example was a case where medical supervision is an absolute necessity, but he would rather risk her life to protect an amendment he knows doesn't work.

pq0n1ct4ve8zf5

I've been trying to tune out of this the last week or so for personal reasons but donated to the campaign and looked at the comments...could someone give me the quick version of what the hell John McGuirk said yesterday?? He's responsible for a few grand of donations by the look of things.

Trasna1

baldshin wrote: »

Has anyone else questioned the cost of the posters? €10 a poster when you're buying such a large quantity seems way over the top.

It's also a waste of money, ineffective and they are eyesores. Sean Gallagher managed to come second in a presidential election without posters and probably would have won but for the fake tweet. Other media is more powerful.

I hope all campaigns take down the cable ties when it's all over however.

Triceratops Ballet

Misael Echoing Horse wrote: »

I've been trying to tune out of this the last week or so for personal reasons but donated to the campaign and looked at the comments...could someone give me the quick version of what the hell John McGuirk said yesterday?? He's responsible for a few grand of donations by the look of things.

Screenshots of his moronic tweets attached!

gmisk

I see people are now trolling him after posting donations....lol

Do you think the Iona institute and the like screen every donation to make sure it has come from in ireland?!?! ah come on...sour grapes

gmisk

I dont see any mention of David Quinns recent tweet...which i found hilarious!
All Hail our men overlords!!!!!!!!!

The built world around you; men did that. Your house, car, street, plumbing, electric wiring etc. Men. Let's say sonething nice about men today.

Fred Swanson

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Triceratops Ballet

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

I think we're all questioning it, but rather than answer they're just interested in throwing mud on us repealers

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ohnonotgmail

Triceratops Ballet wrote: »

Screenshots of his moronic tweets attached!

Why is he claiming that the donations are anonymous? some people ticked a box to not have their names displayed publicly but togetherforyes know who they are.

garbo speaks

borderlinemeath wrote: »

€50 donated. Past €320k now. Keep it going

There's a sucker born every minute.

NuMarvel

Misael Echoing Horse wrote: »

I've been trying to tune out of this the last week or so for personal reasons but donated to the campaign and looked at the comments...could someone give me the quick version of what the hell John McGuirk said yesterday?? He's responsible for a few grand of donations by the look of things.

Nothing especially out of the ordinary. He's just being his usual eloquent, considered, and reserved self. :D

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

There's a line in today's paper where they say they raised €100,000 at the their March for Life last month. Considering they also claim there was up to 100,000 people at the march, that means an average donation of €1 per person. Talk about skinflints!

BabysCoffee

Hitting 330,000 euros now.

Over 8,800 people have donated. Incredible

https://togetherforyes.causevox.com/?utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=post&utm_campaign=cf1

Triceratops Ballet

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

Why is he claiming that the donations are anonymous? some people ticked a box to not have their names displayed publicly but togetherforyes know who they are.

he's not the strongest on the aul joined up thinking, he's spouting some sh1te again today