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The 8th Amendment Part 2 - Mod Warning in OP

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    #6752
    robarmstrong
    Registered Users Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭robarmstrong


    RobertKK wrote: »
    Some women even wish they had an abortion story to tell...

    http://time.com/4608364/lena-dunham-wish-abortion-comments/

    Like that pro-life nurse who was found out to be telling porky pies?

    Deflect mode is in full force today. Either that or you're just in complete denial.


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    #6753
    horseburger
    Registered Users Posts: 2,137 ✭✭✭horseburger


    gmisk wrote: »
    Ah great here come the links!
    Hurrah my day is complete!

    Perhaps before you complete your day, you might consider what was discussed in the echanges between Peter Fitzpatrick and Patricia Lohr, and how what Ivana Bacik claimed, is contradicted by what was stated by Patricia Lohr two months earlier, on the issue of abortions being approved on grounds that were not originally sought.


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    #6754
    robarmstrong
    Registered Users Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭robarmstrong


    horseburger wrote: »
    Perhaps before you complete your day, you might consider what was discussed in the echanges between Peter Fitzpatrick and Patricia Lohr, and how what Ivana Bacik claimed, is contradicted by what was stated by Patricia Lohr two months earlier, on the issue of abortions being approved on grounds that were not originally sought.

    As someone who's "on the fence" -

    What are your comments about the shortcomings of the pro-life campaign?


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    #6755
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,467 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    garbo speaks wrote: »
    Some women wear the "I've had an abortion" like a badge of honor. What a frightening time we live in where the liberal media has brainwashed society into thinking this is normal.

    how about responding to a post when you quote it instead of soapboxing?


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    #6756
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    RobertKK wrote: »
    Some women even wish they had an abortion story to tell...

    http://time.com/4608364/lena-dunham-wish-abortion-comments/

    What would you do if your daughter suffered a type of epilepsy similar to the condition described in the post I quoted, would you expect her to lay down her life on the odds that she may survive the pregnancy, or would you advise her to get the boat?


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    #6757
    Zubeneschamali
    Registered Users Posts: 16,686 ✭✭✭✭Zubeneschamali


    horseburger wrote: »
    Well done on criticizing RTE and the Oireachtas for discussing this issue.

    We are not criticising them - we are criticising you for spamming the thread with them over and over.


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    #6758
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 22,009 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    horseburger wrote: »
    Perhaps before you complete your day, you might consider what was discussed in the echanges between Peter Fitzpatrick and Patricia Lohr, and how what Ivana Bacik claimed, is contradicted by what was stated by Patricia Lohr two months earlier, on the issue of abortions being approved on grounds that were not originally sought.
    horseburger wrote: »
    "Rubbish links to youtube", of videos of programmes, and Oireachtas coverage, where the issue was being discussed.

    Well done on criticizing RTE and the Oireachtas for discussing this issue.

    Nobody cares what those people think (or you for that matter).
    People who are here on the repeal side are here because they are capable of independent rational thought.

    I'm surprised the Oireachtas domains are accessible to a US based IP address.


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    #6759
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 22,009 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    robarmstrong wrote: »
    Ask him about his opinion/issues with the pro-life campaign and watch him blissfully ignore what you've asked of him.
    Oh that's been done a few times, when he runs out of ways to deflect he'll log off for a couple of days and the next poster of similar viewpoint comes online!


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    #6760
    pq0n1ct4ve8zf5
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,070 ✭✭✭✭pq0n1ct4ve8zf5


    horseburger wrote: »
    Perhaps before you complete your day, you might consider what was discussed in the echanges between Peter Fitzpatrick and Patricia Lohr, and how what Ivana Bacik claimed, is contradicted by what was stated by Patricia Lohr two months earlier, on the issue of abortions being approved on grounds that were not originally sought.

    What's your opinion on the conduct of the pro-life campaign?


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    #6761
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,467 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    RobertKK wrote: »
    Some women even wish they had an abortion story to tell...

    http://time.com/4608364/lena-dunham-wish-abortion-comments/

    good job on completely missing the point of what she said.


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    #6762
    BarleySweets
    Registered Users Posts: 198 ✭✭BarleySweets


    garbo speaks wrote: »
    Some women wear the "I've had an abortion" like a badge of honor. What a frightening time we live in where the liberal media has brainwashed society into thinking this is normal.

    Nobody is saying it’s normal. Nobody is encouraging it either. And nobody is going to force an abortion on anybody.

    Likewise, nobody should be shamed for having 1 or however many abortions. It’s not a shameful act. It’s her choice.


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    #6763
    RobertKK
    Registered Users Posts: 33,749 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    What would you do if your daughter suffered a type of epilepsy similar to the condition described in the post I quoted, would you expect her to lay down her life on the odds that she may survive the pregnancy, or would you advise her to get the boat?

    The 8th amendment would allow her to get treatment and if the unborn died or was needed to be removed to save her life, it would be done.

    It like the lies by Yes about cancer and no chemotherapy, when pregnant women do get chemotherapy.


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    #6764
    RobertKK
    Registered Users Posts: 33,749 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    BarleySweets wrote: »
    That’s a lie. You’re not being asked to vote on the life of the unborn in this referendum. Nobody is going to force abortions on anyone nor are they going to deny the right to life if a woman chooses to continue with her pregnancy.

    You’re being asked to remove a constitutional restriction on abortion. There’s been two tragic stories written in the other thread on the 8th detailing how this restriction on abortion condemns women who are physically unable to endure a pregnancy, through illness or the effects of medication that they need to take. These women, should they accidentally become pregnant, are literally unable to seek medical attention here unless they get to the point where they are hours from death. How can you support that? Can you not imagine how much worry they and their families feel?

    So what is the 8th amendment about?
    We vote yes to remove it, we vote no to keep it.

    Of course we are being asked to vote on the life on the unborn and whether he/she should continue to have constitutional protection, and if not unrestricted abortion will be introduced up to 12 weeks, and up to viability in the case of life limiting conditions and mental health grounds - mental health which will be similar to the UK version except there is no time limit given apart from viability of the unborn.


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    #6765
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 22,009 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    RobertKK wrote: »
    The 8th amendment would allow her to get treatment and if the unborn died or was needed to be removed to save her life, it would be done.

    It like the lies by Yes about cancer and no chemotherapy, when pregnant women do get chemotherapy.
    Delusion.
    This is a post of complete and utter delusion.

    Lies about chemotherapy? Speak to any of the leading oncologists or head of maternity departments, they will confirm this as bunkum.


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    #6766
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 22,009 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    RobertKK wrote: »
    So what is the 8th amendment about?
    We vote yes to remove it, we vote no to keep it.

    Of course we are being asked to vote on the life on the unborn and whether he/she should continue to have constitutional protection, and if not unrestricted abortion will be introduced up to 12 weeks, and up to viability in the case of life limiting conditions and mental health grounds - mental health which will be similar to the UK version except there is no time limit given apart from viability of the unborn.
    We are not voting on abortion.
    We are voting on women's health.

    The government will then have the power to legislate for abortion, but it will not be in the constitution and can be changed at a later date. All that has been presented so far is a recommendation from the citizen's assembly.


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    #6767
    RobertKK
    Registered Users Posts: 33,749 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    ohnonotgmail wrote: »
    good job on completely missing the point of what she said.

    Strange that abortion advocates took issue with her too.


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    #6768
    RobertKK
    Registered Users Posts: 33,749 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    ELM327 wrote: »
    We are not voting on abortion.
    We are voting on women's health.

    The government will then have the power to legislate for abortion, but it will not be in the constitution and can be changed at a later date. All that has been presented so far is a recommendation from the citizen's assembly.

    Oh please, keep telling yourself that. It will help the no side immensely if the Yes totally misses the elephant in the room which is the lives of the mother and the unborn.


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    #6769
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users Posts: 40,467 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    RobertKK wrote: »
    Strange that abortion advocates took issue with her too.

    plenty of people take issue with Lena Dunham. doesnt change the fact that you completely misconstrued what she said.


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    #6770
    gmisk
    Registered Users Posts: 33,110 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    ELM327 wrote: »
    Delusion.
    This is a post of complete and utter delusion.

    Lies about chemotherapy? Speak to any of the leading oncologists or head of maternity departments, they will confirm this as bunkum.

    https://twitter.com/john_mcguirk/status/983066151931523073?s=19
    On a very related note...john Mc Guirk with another absolute clanger.. In the face of facts from a professor who actually knows what she is talking about (Louise Kenny)


  • Options
    #6771
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 22,009 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    RobertKK wrote: »
    Oh please, keep telling yourself that. It will help the no side immensely if the Yes totally misses the elephant in the room which is the lives of the mother and the unborn.
    Point to one part of my post that is not true?
    ELM327 wrote: »
    We are not voting on abortion.
    We are voting on women's health.

    The government will then have the power to legislate for abortion, but it will not be in the constitution and can be changed at a later date. All that has been presented so far is a recommendation from the citizen's assembly.


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    #6772
    garbo speaks
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 300 ✭✭garbo speaks


    RobertKK wrote: »
    Some women even wish they had an abortion story to tell...

    http://time.com/4608364/lena-dunham-wish-abortion-comments/

    Soon, having an abortion will be a must have like the latest handbag or fashion accessory. Shame on these people.


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    #6773
    BarleySweets
    Registered Users Posts: 198 ✭✭BarleySweets


    RobertKK wrote: »
    So what is the 8th amendment about?
    We vote yes to remove it, we vote no to keep it.

    Of course we are being asked to vote on the life on the unborn and whether he/she should continue to have constitutional protection, and if not unrestricted abortion will be introduced up to 12 weeks, and up to viability in the case of life limiting conditions and mental health grounds - mental health which will be similar to the UK version except there is no time limit given apart from viability of the unborn.

    I told you what the 8th is about. It’s literally just removing the constitutional block. What happens after is up to the government. You have quoted nothing more than rumors about what legislation the government will enact if the 8th is removed. Rumors.

    Regardless of any of that, the real question: how do you think I should feel about a woman who has one or multiple abortions?


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    #6774
    RobertKK
    Registered Users Posts: 33,749 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    ELM327 wrote: »
    Delusion.
    This is a post of complete and utter delusion.

    Lies about chemotherapy? Speak to any of the leading oncologists or head of maternity departments, they will confirm this as bunkum.

    You are the suffering from what you claim I am.
    Audrey McElligott, who is originally from New Jersey but has been living for the past eight years in Blackrock, Co Louth, told how she was diagnosed with stage-four Hodgkin's Lymphoma while six months' pregnant.

    She had three cycles of chemotherapy and delivered a healthy baby boy, Joseph Francis, now five.
    "I am appalled to see abortion campaigners falsely claiming that women can't get cancer treatment in this country under the Eighth Amendment," said the mother of two.

    Also speaking at the event, Prof Eamon McGuinness, a former chairman of the Institute of Obstetrics and Gynaecology at the Royal College of Physicians of Ireland, said no Irish doctor would ever fail to intervene to save the life of a pregnant woman - even if that risked the life of her unborn child.
    Prof McGuinness said those who claimed the Eighth Amendment prevented Irish women from getting treatment "are either gravely mistaken, or substituting their personal views for medical facts".

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/abortion-referendum/eighth-did-not-stop-doctors-acting-to-save-me-36795994.html


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    #6775
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 22,009 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    RobertKK wrote: »
    You are the suffering from what you claim I am.



    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/abortion-referendum/eighth-did-not-stop-doctors-acting-to-save-me-36795994.html
    He can say what he wants but that's only one doctor.
    It does not reflect the reality.

    Are you John McGuirk?


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    #6776
    gmisk
    Registered Users Posts: 33,110 ✭✭✭✭gmisk


    garbo speaks wrote: »
    Soon, having an abortion will be a must have like the latest handbag or fashion accessory. Shame on these people.
    Ah come on!
    This is a wind up surely?!?


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    #6777
    BarleySweets
    Registered Users Posts: 198 ✭✭BarleySweets


    garbo speaks wrote: »
    Soon, having an abortion will be a must have like the latest handbag or fashion accessory. Shame on these people.

    And if it is, what harm?

    How is any woman’s actions any of your business? Do you want a say in where they work or what they have for lunch too?


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    #6778
    RobertKK
    Registered Users Posts: 33,749 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    BarleySweets wrote: »
    I told you what the 8th is about. It’s literally just removing the constitutional block. What happens after is up to the government. You have quoted nothing more than rumors about what legislation the government will enact if the 8th is removed. Rumors.

    Regardless of any of that, the real question: how do you think I should feel about a woman who has one or multiple abortions?

    The government published the policy paper on what would be introduced. It is not rumour.


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    #6779
    Delirium
    Moderators Posts: 51,805 ✭✭✭✭Delirium


    RobertKK wrote: »
    You are the suffering from what you claim I am.

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/abortion-referendum/eighth-did-not-stop-doctors-acting-to-save-me-36795994.html

    The woman was six months pregnant, chemotherapy is a problem for pregnancies in the first three months when the organs are still developing.

    If you can read this, you're too close!



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    #6780
    RobertKK
    Registered Users Posts: 33,749 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    ELM327 wrote: »
    He can say what he wants but that's only one doctor.
    It does not reflect the reality.

    Are you John McGuirk?

    I'm sorry the post didn't back up what you say. He actually said people like you are using personal views for medical facts.


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    #6781
    ELM327
    Registered Users Posts: 22,009 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    RobertKK wrote: »
    The government published the policy paper on what would be introduced. It is not rumour.
    No, they published a suggestion.
    The government may not even last long enough anyway.

    The referendum is not a causation to introduce abortion, merely to give our politicians the ability to legislate as the electorate sees fit.

    Repealing the 8th does not make abortion legal. It would be worthwhile for you and your ilk to do some research on what you are voting for.


This discussion has been closed.
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