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The 8th Amendment Part 2 - Mod Warning in OP

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    #7322
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    horseburger wrote: »
    Why focus on his views on other issues, rather than discussing why he holds certain views about the various groups that are campaigning, on this issue of the repeal of the Eighth Amendment?

    He is a newspaper columnist. It is hardly surprising, that depending on the issue being discussed, that he might explore a contrarian viewpoint on a particular issue, and examine the arguments for and against that contrarian viewpoint.

    I disagreed with comments he made about bus services, during the Bus Éireann strike last year.

    That doesn't mean that I disregard all the perspectives he takes, on other issues, about which he writes, in his role as a columnist in the Irish Independent.

    Why focus on his views on anything?
    Who cares what he thinks?
    What does it have to do with repealing the 8th amendment?


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    #7323
    Triceratops Ballet
    Registered Users Posts: 4,894 ✭✭✭Triceratops Ballet


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    As adults we understand that there are risks involved with being in sexual relationships and the consequences of those risks, regardless of the precautions we take.

    by that "logic" when smokers present at hospitals with lung cancer they should be told to jog on


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    #7324
    .......
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,057 ✭✭✭.......


    This post has been deleted.


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    #7325
    v638sg7k1a92bx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭v638sg7k1a92bx


    BarleySweets wrote: »
    Bull****. So you want to tie people down to raising kids together just because they decided to have sex together? Who are you to force that notion onto anybody? What kind of society would that result in?

    I'm not forcing a notion onto anyone. They are the ones choosing to have sex.


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    #7326
    BarleySweets
    Registered Users Posts: 198 ✭✭BarleySweets


    horseburger wrote: »
    Why focus on his views on other issues, rather than discussing why he holds certain views about the various groups that are campaigning, on this issue of the repeal of the Eighth Amendment?

    He is a newspaper columnist. It is hardly surprising, that depending on the issue being discussed, that he might explore a contrarian viewpoint on a particular issue, and examine the arguments for and against that contrarian viewpoint.

    I disagreed with comments he made about bus services, during the Bus Éireann strike last year.

    That doesn't mean that I disregard all the perspectives he takes, on other issues, about which he writes, in his role as a columnist in the Irish Independent.

    Because your original quotes that Ian O’Doherty made were his accusations that some Repealers were “acting as if they are morally superior”. My quotes showed that Ian O’Doherty himself sees himself as morally superior to Muslims and gays who want to get married.


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    #7327
    robarmstrong
    Registered Users Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭robarmstrong


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    As adults we understand that there are risks involved with being in sexual relationships and the consequences of those risks, regardless of the precautions we take.

    My partner has a heart-shaped uterus and a medically diagnosed weak womb, so regardless of any precautions we take, any pregnancy we have gone through (apart from this one which has been all good so far at 27 weeks with a baby girl in there) there was a very, very high chance she was going to miscarry, or the baby would have died further along.

    Based on your soundbite, I shouldn't even consider having sex with her, due to the above information. See your logic? We have gone through too many miscarriages and have had an abortion across the water where she was not liable to have support or aftercare.

    Despite my belief against abortion, imagine my anger, that my partner could not have this in her own country because technically what's wrong with her isn't a threat to her life and isn't deemed a threat enough (despite the numerous miscarriages) to a pregnancy.

    We didn't qualify for the very strict measures put in place, if the 8th was repealed, we would qualify.


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    #7328
    zedhead
    Registered Users Posts: 602 ✭✭✭zedhead


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    I'm not forcing a notion onto anyone. They are the ones choosing to have sex.

    SO people who don't want children should remain celibate?


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    #7329
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    As adults we understand that there are risks involved with being in sexual relationships and the consequences of those risks, regardless of the precautions we take.

    Should we refuse treatment to alcoholics? Smokers?
    How about extreme sportpeople?
    People that get knocked down crossing the road?
    They know the risks.............


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    #7330
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    As adults we understand that there are risks involved with being in sexual relationships and the consequences of those risks, regardless of the precautions we take.

    Ah, so we’re back into weaponizing children into punishments to be inflicted on their ‘careless’ parents.
    We don’t trust these women to make an informed choice, but we forced the burden and responsibility of parenthood on them no problem.
    Can’t be trusted with a choice, can be trusted with a child, is it?


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    #7331
    horseburger
    Registered Users Posts: 2,137 ✭✭✭horseburger


    amdublin wrote: »
    Amy Huberman has today tweeted her support for repealing the 8th amendment

    Fabulous.

    Therefore we should all stop considering the pros and cons of repealing the amendment, and the uncertainty about what will be covered under subsequent legislation.

    Now that Amy is supporting repeal, we don't need to consider the serious issue of the capability of public representatives - who many of us view with cynicism, in any other scenario, where many of us see public representatives as taking voting decisions in the Dáil and Seanad, with regard only for their political careers - to legislate on this issue.


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    #7332
    Kk333
    Registered Users Posts: 83 ✭✭Kk333


    Triceratops Ballet wrote: »
    by that "logic" when smokers present at hospitals with lung cancer they should be told to jog on

    Your seriously comparing lung cancer to pregnancy? Your own logic isnt great bud.


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    #7333
    v638sg7k1a92bx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭v638sg7k1a92bx


    kylith wrote: »
    So someone in a relationship who either does not want children or does not want more children should not have sex with their partner until after menopause? Which can be anything up to age 50.

    ETA: I take it you would also criminalise men who abandon their children?

    I suggest they use birth control as it is intended.


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    #7334
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,862 ✭✭✭✭January


    Bingo, mask has slipped. Another one who is shaming women for having sex for pleasure.


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    #7335
    zedhead
    Registered Users Posts: 602 ✭✭✭zedhead


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    I suggest they use birth control as it is intended.

    And if it fails? Tough sh*t on them?


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    #7336
    amcalester
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭amcalester


    robarmstrong wrote: »
    Don't bother, when pushed on certain points the poster has declined to comment on questions asked. Not worth your time.

    I’ve been following the thread, so I’m well aware of the posters m.o.

    I just posted that in the hope that it might stop 2 pages of posts about IO’D.


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    #7337
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    I suggest they use birth control as it is intended.

    That’s very helpful advice to someone who is already in the midst of a crisis pregnancy. The damage has been done at that stage, not that your advice is of any use.


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    #7338
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,862 ✭✭✭✭January


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    I suggest they use birth control as it is intended.

    That's what I did, it failed.


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    #7339
    v638sg7k1a92bx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭v638sg7k1a92bx


    zedhead wrote: »
    But you said before if you dont want to get pregnant you wont?

    Now you're saying it can happen but if it does tough sh*t, deal with the health implications, life restrictions, financial limitations that you may not be able for.

    Do we deny medical treatment to those who engage in high risk sports? They knew the risks so they should just deal themselves with the consequences right.

    As I've said, ad nausea, I'm in favour of abortion where there is a serious risk to the life or health of the mother.


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    #7340
    v638sg7k1a92bx
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,913 ✭✭✭v638sg7k1a92bx


    January wrote: »
    That's what I did, it failed.

    No you didn't


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    #7341
    zedhead
    Registered Users Posts: 602 ✭✭✭zedhead


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    As I've said, ad nausea, I'm in favour of abortion where there is a serious risk to the life or health of the mother.

    So you will be voting to repeal the 8th then?


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    #7342
    kylith
    Registered Users Posts: 17,736 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    I'm not forcing a notion onto anyone. They are the ones choosing to have sex.

    So again: people who do not want to have children should choose not to have sex, ever? Even if they're married or in a LTR?


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    #7343
    BarleySweets
    Registered Users Posts: 198 ✭✭BarleySweets


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    I'm not forcing a notion onto anyone. They are the ones choosing to have sex.

    Pathetic!

    So your problem is with recreational sex? Is that shameful to you? Does the thought that other people have sex but have no wish to procreate make you feel uneasy?


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    #7344
    robarmstrong
    Registered Users Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭robarmstrong


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    As I've said, ad nausea, I'm in favour of abortion where there is a serious risk to the life or health of the mother.

    So repeal the 8th then. We were denied an abortion because the medical experts who examined my partner deemed that a heart-shaped uterus and weak womb was not a serious enough grounds to qualify.


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    #7345
    Kk333
    Registered Users Posts: 83 ✭✭Kk333


    bubblypop wrote: »
    Should we refuse treatment to alcoholics? Smokers?
    How about extreme sportpeople?
    People that get knocked down crossing the road?
    They know the risks.............[/

    You cant seriously be comparing pregnancy to that? "People who get knocked down crossing the road"? I think the yes campaign does more to hurt itself sometimes.


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    #7346
    kylith
    Registered Users Posts: 17,736 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    I suggest they use birth control as it is intended.
    Even used totally perfectly it has a failure rate.


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    #7347
    robarmstrong
    Registered Users Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭robarmstrong


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    No you didn't

    Are you for real? January (although I don't know her personally) has been nothing short of an absolute pillar for the 8th campaign in what she has done, are you seriously questioning whether or not she misused the birth control pill?


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    #7348
    Ave Sodalis
    Registered Users Posts: 7,553 ✭✭✭Ave Sodalis


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote:
    No you didn't


    And you know this how?


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    #7349
    kylith
    Registered Users Posts: 17,736 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    Kk333 wrote: »
    bubblypop wrote: »
    Should we refuse treatment to alcoholics? Smokers?
    How about extreme sportpeople?
    People that get knocked down crossing the road?
    They know the risks.............

    You cant seriously be comparing pregnancy to that? "People who get knocked down crossing the road"? I think the yes campaign does more to hurt itself sometimes.

    But people are saying that abortion shouldn't be available because people know there is a risk of pregnancy. People who engage in sport know that there are risks involved.


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    #7350
    January
    Closed Accounts Posts: 23,862 ✭✭✭✭January


    Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »
    No you didn't

    You tell me how I didn't use it properly, go on.


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    #7351
    robarmstrong
    Registered Users Posts: 1,598 ✭✭✭robarmstrong


    Kk333 wrote: »
    You cant seriously be comparing pregnancy to that? "People who get knocked down crossing the road"? I think the yes campaign does more to hurt itself sometimes.

    I think posting up lies, misleading posters, twisting statistics is more damaging to the pro-life campaign than what bubblypop said is to the pro-choice campaign.


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