The 8th Amendment Part 2 - Mod Warning in OP

kylith

January wrote: »

You tell me how I didn't use it properly, go on.

(He snuck into your house and replaced all your pills with mini mints)

BarleySweets

horseburger wrote: »

Fabulous.

Therefore we should all stop considering the pros and cons of repealing the amendment, and the uncertainty about what will be covered under subsequent legislation.

Now that Amy is supporting repeal, we don't need to consider the serious issue of the capability of public representatives - who many of us view with cynicism, in any other scenario, where many of us see public representatives as taking voting decisions in the Dáil and Seanad, with regard only for their political careers - to legislate on this issue.

You really do think you’re morally superior to so many other people don’t you? That’s disgusting pal, you need to rethink your outlook on life.

I’d much rather hear Amy Huberman’s thoughts on an issue than your friend Ian O’Doherty’s. At least she’s not shown herself to be a total hypocrite.

baylah17

kylith wrote: »

Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »

You are the one advocating repealing the 8th amendment, the onus is on you to to outline the basis for changing the status quo and to prove that a 6 week old zygote should not have a right to life.

It has no functioning brain.
It has no functioning nervous system.
It has no functioning organs.
It cannot survive outside of a womb.

Why should it have rights that take precedence over those of a grown woman?
Why should she have to carry it to term if she does not want to? Pregnancy and birth can be torturous.

Effectively it is a parasite
Usually welcome
Sometimes unwelcome
And sometimes likely to cause the death of the host
But the anti choice mob put the life of the parasite above all else

robarmstrong

horseburger wrote: »

Fabulous.
Therefore we should all stop considering the pros and cons of repealing the amendment, and the uncertainty about what will be covered under subsequent legislation.

That's funny, when did you even start considering the pros of repeal let alone stop considering?

tretorn

robarmstrong wrote: »

My partner has a heart-shaped uterus and a medically diagnosed weak womb, so regardless of any precautions we take, any pregnancy we have gone through (apart from this one which has been all good so far at 27 weeks with a baby girl in there) there was a very, very high chance she was going to miscarry, or the baby would have died further along.

Based on your soundbite, I shouldn't even consider having sex with her, due to the above information. See your logic? We have gone through too many miscarriages and have had an abortion across the water where she was not liable to have support or aftercare.

Despite my belief against abortion, imagine my anger, that my partner could not have this in her own country because technically what's wrong with her isn't a threat to her life and isn't deemed a threat enough (despite the numerous miscarriages) to a pregnancy.

We didn't qualify for the very strict measures put in place, if the 8th was repealed, we would qualify.

Have you ever thought about having a vasectomy.

I wouldnt think any medical person would be in favour of another abortion if your partner has a weak womb. Maybe should you think about taking responsibility for birth control.

Thats your responsibility first and foremost and it takes precedence over your desire for legal abortion.

v638sg7k1a92bx

zedhead wrote: »

So you will be voting to repeal the 8th then?

By repealing the 8th amendment will abortion in cases where the mothers life and health is at risk be legal in Ireland?

robarmstrong

tretorn wrote: »

Have you ever thought about having a vasectomy.

I wouldnt think any medical person would be in favour of another abortion if your partner has a weak womb. Maybe should you think about taking responsibility for birth control.

Thats your responsibility first and foremost and it takes precedence over your desire for legal abortion.

Are you actually f*cking serious with what you just said?

Kk333

kylith wrote: »

But people are saying that abortion shouldn't be available because people know there is a risk of pregnancy. People who engage in sport know that there are risks involved.

The analogy isn't even in the same ball park mate. Surely anyone who is anyway logical could see that.

tretorn

baylah17 wrote: »

Effectively it is a parasite
Usually welcome
Sometimes unwelcome
And sometimes likely to cause the death of the host
But the anti choice mob put the life of the parasite above all else

If you singleminded want to put people off listening to you then continue to compare a developing baby to the equivalent of a louse.

SureYWouldntYa

Anyone else finding their views contrasting with those of their families? I'm the only one in my immediate family who's going to repeal the 8th

Literally don't know what to say to granny when she says im in favour in killing babies, the couple times its been brought up the last few weeks i never know how to respond to that accusation

zedhead

Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »

By repealing the 8th amendment will abortion in cases where the mothers life and health is at risk be legal in Ireland?

It will take away the barrier that stops it now and allow for our politicians to legislate for that. Without repealing the 8th, legislation cannot be implemented to allow for that.

The only way to achieve what you are in favour of is to start my repealing the 8th.

v638sg7k1a92bx

zedhead wrote: »

It will take away the barrier that stops it now and allow for our politicians to legislate for that. Without repealing the 8th, legislation cannot be implemented to allow for that.

The only way to achieve what you are in favour of is to start my repealing the 8th.

So the answer is no. Thanks

January

kylith wrote: »

(He snuck into your house and replaced all your pills with mini mints)

:pac:

It was the nuva ring, it actually worked really well for two years! I was devastated when it failed. I have implanon now, someone told me yesterday her third baby was conceived with implanon in her arm, scared the crap out of me.

Ken.

Mod- This is getting a bit heated. Everyone needs to step back please and calm down.

Thread locked for 15 minutes to allow a little cooling off.

Ken.

Mod-Reopened

BarleySweets

robarmstrong wrote: »

Are you actually f*cking serious with what you just said?

See my previous post, their attitude smacks of “I’m alright Jack, **** you and your troubles”

Kk333

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

Anyone else finding their views contrasting with those of their families? I'm the only one in my immediate family who's going to repeal the 8th

Literally don't know what to say to granny when she says im in favour in killing babies, the couple times its been brought up the last few weeks i never know how to respond to that accusation

Different times. Bite your lip with your granny and vote the way you want. You'll never win that battle.

eeepaulo

Has there been much online advertising?

I dont do facebook and use an ad blocker so i basically dont see adverts.

BarleySweets

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

Anyone else finding their views contrasting with those of their families? I'm the only one in my immediate family who's going to repeal the 8th

Literally don't know what to say to granny when she says im in favour in killing babies, the couple times its been brought up the last few weeks i never know how to respond to that accusation

Like the previous reply said, bite your lip, there’s no point in falling out with each other over an issue that’ll be resolved one way or the other in 5 weeks time.

In the meantime, if you really want to have a discussion about it with your family, maybe print out some of the In Her Shoes stories and ask their opinion on them in a non-confrontational way?

BarleySweets

eeepaulo wrote: »

Has there been much online advertising?

I dont do facebook and use an ad blocker so i basically dont see adverts.

Yes there has, ive seen ads from both sides.

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RobertKK

seamus wrote: »

I don't think you understand what the word "lie" means Robert.
There are no statements in that leaflets about what "will" happen, just what "may" happen.

And none of them were lies.

The morning after pill was banned in Ireland until 2003.
Women who are ill in pregnancy often do not get treated if it poses a risk to the unborn.
As mentioned above, the only treatment for pre-eclampsia is termination. Irish women with this condition have to engage in a balancing act where they're continually monitored and the pregnancy brought as far as the doctors believe is possible, before delivery. And that brings along with it a lot of potential lifelong complications and increased risk factors for other conditions; for both mother and child.

Whereas an early diagnosis with pre-eclampsia could allow for an early termination before it becomes any more complicated, this is just not an option in Ireland.

Scaremongering by the anti-amendment side then.
So the 8th amendment didn't ban something that was already banned before it existed?

robarmstrong

BarleySweets wrote: »

See my previous post, their attitude smacks of “I’m alright Jack, **** you and your troubles”

Honestly, I've heard all sorts of stuff from pro-lifers but that takes the biscuit.

Couldn't give a toss about the miscarriages we had to endure and the abortion that was denied to us here that we had to go travel for it, but instead blames me for it and basically suggests I get a vasectomy as a form of birth control.

If the 8th was repealed we would have never had to travel, and anyone that knows half a clue about gynecology would understand that a heart-shaped uterus means the fate of your baby all depends on where the baby implants, and if they implant in the wrong area then odds are that the baby will not grow properly and will pass away, the amniotic sac will rupture and in turn your waters will break very, very, very early, meaning the baby will die.

But sure that's my fault for not getting the snip like.

kylith

Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »

So the answer is no. Thanks

Actually, the answer is yes. The only way abortion can be legislated for for maternal health is to repeal the 8th

Kk333

....... wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

Haha best of look if he does that. Dont mess with grannies.

Ave Sodalis

Kk333 wrote:

Haha best of look if he does that. Dont mess with grannies.

Maybe, but it might be worth a try. I changed my granny's mind by telling her the reality. I told her that if I got pregnant, that I likely can't afford to travel for it. There is also a chance that any abortion pills ordered online will be stopped at customs. However, one way or another, I will do whatever physically necessary to not be pregnant. She can choose to force that on me, or she can vote to make it a lot safer and easier. I didn't get angry about it, I didn't get emotional. I just laid out my options and explaim how she has a hand to play in those options.


It's easy to say No when you're thinking of some random girl and some random pregnancy. It's a lot harder to say No when you realise that this decision affects people you care about.

v638sg7k1a92bx

....... wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

There are very few guarantees in life with the exception of death and taxes. What you're effectively saying is that I want access to abortion in the event that my contraceptive pill fails i.e. abortion should be a form a birth control because I don't want to take responsibility for my decisions in life.

If you don't want to have children, there is no reason why you can't have sex and avoid pregnancy unless you are extremely unlucky or reckless, this is a fact which every medical professional will tell you. If you are in an adult relationship and want to enjoy sex then go ahead and tear the mattress to shreds, but if you become pregnant even though you took precautions then that is your tough luck! You knew the risks but wanted the rewards. We don't get everything we want in life all of the time and these arguments of the imaginary victims and the marginal cases to try and prove and point which you have no interest in defending hold no water. It's called personal responsibility or is that the part of the conversation where you stick fingers in your ears while you clock up 5000 posts in a year and complain how you never got the same opportunities as everybody else in life.

v638sg7k1a92bx

Ave Sodalis wrote: »

Maybe, but it might be worth a try. I changed my granny's mind by telling her the reality. I told her that if I got pregnant, that I likely can't afford to travel for it. There is also a chance that any abortion pills ordered online will be stopped at customs. However, one way or another, I will do whatever physically necessary to not be pregnant. She can choose to force that on me, or she can vote to make it a lot safer and easier. I didn't get angry about it, I didn't get emotional. I just laid out my options and explaim how she has a hand to play in those options.

It's easy to say No when you're thinking of some random girl and some random pregnancy. It's a lot harder to say No when you realise that this decision affects people you care about.

This economic argument really doesn't hold up. Ireland is not some economic backwater or third world country. Pro Choice advocates trying to make out that Women are travelling across the Irish sea with two and sixpence is nonsense.

SusieBlue

Rogelio Tinkling Cue wrote: »

There are very few guarantees in life with the exception of death and taxes. What you're effectively saying is that I want access to abortion in the event that my contraceptive pill fails i.e. abortion should be a form a birth control because I don't want to take responsibility for my decisions in life.

If you don't want to have children, there is no reason why you can't have sex and avoid pregnancy unless you are extremely unlucky or reckless, this is a fact which every medical professional will tell you. If you are in an adult relationship and want to enjoy sex then go ahead and tear the mattress to shreds, but if you become pregnant even though you took precautions then that is your tough luck! You knew the risks but wanted the rewards. We don't get everything we want in life all of the time and these arguments of the imaginary victims and the marginal cases to try and prove and point which you have no interest in defending hold no water. It's called personal responsibility or is that the part of the conversation where you stick fingers in your ears while you clock up 5000 posts in a year and complain how you never got the same opportunities as everybody else in life.

For some people having an abortion IS taking personal responsibility. Just because it isn’t a choice you would make doesn’t make it a wrong one.

It is in the best interests of neither women nor babies to have parenthood forced on them, to teach them some sort of life lesson.

You are weaponizing children into punishments to be bestowed on their ‘careless’ mothers.
Which leads me to believe you are pro-birth, not pro-life.

Because if you cared about the life that child would be born into at all, you’d trust the mother when she says she CANNOT do it.
She will be the one bringing up this child, she knows what life she can give this child.
Forcing motherhood on a woman who doesn’t want it and bringing an unwanted child into a life of neglect/ poverty/ disability, the list goes on, is in no ones best interests.
Least of all the baby.