Glock 17

monojohn

Is there any way I can legally own a Glock here?

I heard that you can get them in the North which I will be moving to soon. Genghis true? Can you legally have one down here under any circumstances whatsoever?

Is it true that if you are a member of a gun club you can have one?

I owned a Sig 9mm here as I had it registered before 2008 but sold it in 2013.

I currently own a shottgun on licence.

I will be using the Glock for target shooting only.

Wadi14

No you wont be granted a licence for a center fire pistol in the Republic. But in saying that if you are moving into NI you can get one licenced in there.
You can then apply from NI to the Republic for a licence to travel to shoots in the Republic, its according to what Chief Super your dealing with, I know guys who have been refused a licence to bring their firearms into the Republic to shoot in comps at ranges.

Ohhh and something else to consider if your going to be target shooting don't buy a Glock lol

Hack12

Only option you have is to find the SIG you previously owned (must be the exact one) and you may be able to relicence that exact gun only.

As above Glock in NI should not be a issue and should speak to NITSA. As for bringing it into the Republic just forget about it.

Grizzly 45

Wadi14 wrote: »

Ohhh and something else to consider if your going to be target shooting don't buy a Glock lol

AHem...Cough...Glock Target model..cough.:)

gunny123

Wadi14 wrote: »

No you wont be granted a licence for a center fire pistol in the Republic. But in saying that if you are moving into NI you can get one licenced in there.
You can then apply from NI to the Republic for a licence to travel to shoots in the Republic, its according to what Chief Super your dealing with, I know guys who have been refused a licence to bring their firearms into the Republic to shoot in comps at ranges.

Ohhh and something else to consider if your going to be target shooting don't buy a Glock lol

Fired a glock 17 L and also a long slide .40 s&w (19 ?) They were as accurate as any other centrefire pistols i ever shot. Plenty good enough for club target shooting.

murph226

Hack12 wrote: »

Only option you have is to find the SIG you previously owned (must be the exact one) and you may be able to relicence that exact gun only.

Is this really possible?

2011

murph226 wrote: »

Is this really possible?

Yes. I know someone that did this. As it happens it was a Glock chambered in .40 S & W.

Cass

murph226 wrote: »

Is this really possible?

I done it.

The dealer still had my Sig even though he intended to sell it in the North. Was almost three years since i traded it into him. I re-applied ticking the box in section one (1) saying i had previously licensed the firearm and gave my old cert number (which had i not cancelled the license would actually have been valid/in date and i could have just picked the gun back up).

Three weeks later had the license in the post.

murph226

Interesting, might try and find my old Sig.

cw67irl

There was actually a release from i believe the Sports Coalition that there was no legal prevention from substituting a restricted short arm.


Might be worth a look.....

Cass

From their lips to God's ears, and i think it was the nasrpc saying this. Not as straight froward as they think and frankly not possible at all.

BattleCorp

Can I just clarify one point please.

Can a club member in Northern Ireland bring their centrefire pistol down here for competitions?

Sparks

BattleCorp wrote: »

Can I just clarify one point please.
Can a club member in Northern Ireland bring their centrefire pistol down here for competitions?

That's a stinker - the ban down here is on new licences for restricted short firearms; but we don't have a seperate visitors pass concept, we have a non-resident's firearms certificate and section 3D (the ban) looks like it applies there just as much as it does to new Irish licence applications (presumably to get round the loophole of keeping a new pistol up North and bringing it down here to shoot it).

Thing is, there's nothing about it mention on the non-residents application form, which is bloody confusing; and the way the act is worded almost bans non-resident applications on the grounds that the applicant is a non-resident anyway, so it's hardly well drafted

BattleCorp

Sparks wrote: »

That's a stinker - the ban down here is on new licences for restricted short firearms; but we don't have a seperate visitors pass concept, we have a non-resident's firearms certificate and section 3D (the ban) looks like it applies there just as much as it does to new Irish licence applications (presumably to get round the loophole of keeping a new pistol up North and bringing it down here to shoot it).

Thing is, there's nothing about it mention on the non-residents application form, which is bloody confusing; and the way the act is worded almost bans non-resident applications on the grounds that the applicant is a non-resident anyway, so it's hardly well drafted

Eh, I'm even more confused now.

Sparks

Well, in short I think you're toast unless the licence up north predates November 2008. That's going by the wording in the Act.

But the wording in the Act also makes Paintball utterly illegal in Ireland, down to the level where you could arrest the cleaner who cleans out the toilets at the paintball field; and it also lets you arrest everyone in the Gadget Shop over their toy crossbows, both of which would be for offences with maximum penalties of up to seven years in jail and twenty grand in fines -- and we don't see even freshly minted Gardai out of Tullamore doing that sort of thing. So we guess that there's a blind eye being turned because they are definitely aware of this, we've brought it up at the Oireachtas level in the past (and we also definitely know that both of these cases are due to accidental oversights during the drafting of the SI because we've brought it up with the DoJ in the past).

Thing is, we rely so much on "letting AGS decide" here that it's barely a law anymore. So maybe they'll grant you a nonresident's cert to shoot a match and then not arrest you for possession of an unlicenced short firearm when you bring the pistol down for the match. But whether or not they'd do that I have no way of knowing. You could ask at the FCP and get an answer from the FPU, but the thing is, how many cases have we seen here where superintendents appear to be committing contempt of the supreme court's ruling in Dunne despite the commitment of the FPU to prevent that kind of thing through training and the like? I really, really, really don't think "erra it'll be grand" from a Garda is safe to rely on when the Act doesn't tally with the Garda (mainly because there's more than one Garda and they don't all have the same opinions on things but they do all have the same powers of arrest). And it'd be especially unsafe if you don't have it in writing and recorded to hold up as proof you did due diligence in the court.

Hack12

Battlecorp. They need to have it licenced in the Republic aswel as NI.

In relation to sub, my understanding is you can substitute a CF pistol now but the issue is when you go to renew the licence as you are granted the licence based on the original firearm which you no longer have so your licence may be revoked. I'm not sure if it is 100% the case or people are afraid to take the chance understandably.

Sparks

Hack12 wrote: »

Battlecorp. They need to have it licenced in the Republic aswel as NI.

Yup, that's what the non-residents cert is for.

In relation to sub, my understanding is you can substitute a CF pistol now

Well... you can apply for it. You might need to fight to have the substitution done though.

but the issue is when you go to renew the licence as you are granted the licence based on the original firearm which you no longer have so your licence may be revoked.

It's more that when you go to renew the licence, you are not actually renewing a licence. We don't do that anymore. Since 2006, anytime you fill out an FCA1 - even if it's the prepopulated one you get in the post from the Gardai - it's a new application for a new firearms certificate under the law. So if you substitute your pistol on the certificate you hold today, when that certificate expires, you have to apply for a new one and then section 3D kicks in and the licencing person is automatically barred from granting a certificate by law.

There was a theory that you could take your current pistol, substitute in a new one on that certificate, use the new one until the certificate was almost up, then substitute the old pistol back onto the certificate and put the new pistol in storage; get a new certificate on the old pistol and then repeat the whole dance. But I think you'd have no chance in hell of that working in the real world, even if only because of how long court backlogs are these days. You'd need your chief super to be willing to go along with it for a start; and frankly I don't think the Department would be terribly happy if such a workaround was being used instead of us amending the restricted list (which is the best approach to fixing this mess properly at the moment).

Cass

Sparks wrote: »

It's more that when you go to renew the licence, you are not actually renewing a licence. We don't do that anymore. Since 2006, anytime you fill out an FCA1 - even if it's the prepopulated one you get in the post from the Gardai - it's a new application for a new firearms certificate under the law.

This is why my head hurts with firearm laws because from the Garda website and on the actual form:

Please note that only the PRE POPULATED FCR form will be acceptable to An Garda Síochána when renewing a firearm certificate and each application for renewal must be accurately completed prior to returning the FCR to the Garda Station. Finally, the Firearms Renewal Form (FCR) is only used for renewals of firearm certificates. Any new application or substitution for a firearm certificate shall continue to be made on the FCA1 application form.

Sparks

It'll hurt your head more when you check the Act and notice that you totally can renew a certificate; we just haven't been. Or maybe I'm wrong and the pre-populated FCA1s have been treated as renewals and we only did the new application thing for the first turn or two through the new three-year-licence mill; but I was almost certain we were still getting the new-application treatment because our character witnesses still get called and the other steps from new applications are being done for what should be renewals.

Cass

Sparks wrote: »

.............. and the pre-populated FCA1s have been treated as renewals and we only did the new application thing for the first turn or two through the new three-year-licence mill; ................

Small distinctions can have big meanings so when i say that the pre-populated FCA1s are called FCR (Firearm Certificate Renewals) i mean they not the same document (yet the exact same) and right there on the form it says renewals.

I had been calling them re-applications because like you i thought that is what it was each year, but it seems either i was wrong or they "fell" back into the renewals without anyone taking much notice.

Grizzly 45

I only ever had my character witnesses called once.That was in 2008.One was a serving local TD/minister at the time,the other a friend of mine...I still use them both with no problem:) Been told the Super had to go and ring up the minister to ask about me,which is just usually the FAO's job..:D

As for the cert ,I think it has gone back to renewal,for a quiet life of all concerned..I mean at this stage I don't have any room anymore for the dates of the firearms cert refusals, with all the court cases on various different applications.:p

Gravelly

I've never had my character witnesses contacted, despite having gone from no firearm to 4 in a short space of time. I've never had my safe checked either. A friend of mine, who is one of my character witnesses, and who deals with the same FO, has had his safe checked and his witnesses contacted!

BattleCorp

The Community Officer (apologies, can't remember his correct title) had to do a report on my security for the Chief Superintendent when I first applied for a restricted firearm. He checked safes, windows, doors, alarms, etc. Did his best to pull the safes off the wall. Very thorough.

Never had my references checked though. The wife would have probably told me if they did.

extremetaz

BattleCorp wrote: »

The Community Officer

Crime prevention officer.

We just had the same inspection on the new gaff a few weeks back.