So Patrick street is bus only from Thursday 9th August

grogi

nostro wrote: »

I wasn't talking about toddlers in creches. That's deliberately changing the issue. I was talking about children of school going age. In most European countries they go to school on their own. In Ireland they are often driven by their parents.

What is the average distance a kid has to travel from home to the school in Ireland and different European countries?

Believe me, parents would love to let the kids wander around - but often it simply is not an option.

Now you could argue that it rains here sometimes.

Not sometimes... Ireland has not only the highest rainfall in Europe, but the highest number of rainy days in Europe as well.

I hear Copenhagen a lot here.. It gets 522 mm of rainfall vs 755 mm for Dublin (which is one of the dryest places in Ireland)... Only Dutch cities (Rotterdam, Amsterdam etc.) are worthy contenders, but not to Galway, Limerick or even Cork.

Lia_lia

The rain never bothered me when walking to the train station. Honestly. I can barely even remember it raining. Maybe it actually did rain lots but I was just so used to it? Or did it not rain in 2013? I'm not just saying this I genuinely can't remember the rain irritating me at all.


We cycled to school when we were kids. But I grew up in a town and lived outside the town which was a 15 minute cycle. Many of my school friends also cycled. This was in the 90's and early 2000's. Never see school kids cycling in Cork. Maybe it's just not a city thing? They get the bus instead? I don't know.

macraignil

My main problem with cycling in Cork is the hills. Many Cork suburbs are on hills not served by bicycle routes separated from normal traffic. Its not possible to keep a bicycle going at the same speed as normal traffic on a steep hill. It's simply dangerous and best avoided in my opinion. Cycling might be OK on some east west routes in the city centre but in Cork it is not going to be as much of an answer to public transport that it has been in other cities.

Criticising parents for giving their children a lift to school may be fair in some cases but for many it is the only viable option because of a variety of factors. The cost of owning a home in Ireland is such that many will not have purchased a home just because it was close to a school they could send their children to or in some cases not even because it was close to anything, with the price of well placed homes out of reach of many young families. Some areas also have schools that are known to be not very good and I wouldn't hold it against someone that they would want their children to go to a better school. There has also been the disparity between supply of non denominational schools and the demand. I could go on but to cut a long story short I just don't believe we can assume public transport will fit everyone's situation and we should be careful in any anti private transport measures we introduce as denying people freedom isn't going to lead to a better society even if some nanny state idealists would claim so.

beer enigma

GavRedKing wrote: »

First time being in town yesterday to see it in action, got parking on the south mall but after 3pm there was still a lot of cars parked on Patrick St, I'm assuming they werent given tickets but whats the procedure here if you went off shopping at 1am and came back to you car after 3pm and had to go down Patrick St?

Just seen that they are proposing to remove over 115 parking spaces along Morrissons Quay and Father Matthew Quay, can't see the logic there at all.

j8wk2feszrnpao

beer enigma wrote: »

Just seen that they are proposing to remove over 115 parking spaces along Morrissons Quay and Father Matthew Quay, can't see the logic there at all.

Wow. That'll hit the College of Com.
Decent parking disc revenue as well I'd imagine that'll be lost.

beer enigma

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Wow. That'll hit the College of Com.
Decent parking disc revenue as well I'd imagine that'll be lost.

School of Music too - parking is bad enough around there as it is when trying to drop the kids off.

cgcsb

FrStone wrote: »

Sure rapid growth means an increase in traffic, increasing urban sprawl leading to the countryside being destroyed and property prices increasing. There are plenty of good quality jobs in Cork as it stands. We need to be picky about what type of growth we need.
We don't have a north ring road to support the growth, or a motorway to Ringaskiddy (how long has that debacle gone on for) or the proper infrastructure to deal with Little Island.
The city council should be focussing where they have failed miserably for example Blackpool and not try and destroy whats remaining of the city centre.

Growth will be based in central areas particularly the Docklands, it'll be supported by improved public transport.

cgcsb

grogi wrote: »

I hear Copenhagen a lot here.. It gets 522 mm of rainfall vs 755 mm for Dublin (which is one of the dryest places in Ireland)... Only Dutch cities (Rotterdam, Amsterdam etc.) are worthy contenders, but not to Galway, Limerick or even Cork.

Copenhagen getting 30% less rain than Dublin hardly justifies it though. Besides Copenhagen rain is freezing sleet, that'd really give you a chill. How did previous generations of Irish people survive, in spite of the fact that it rains.

cgcsb

beer enigma wrote: »

Just seen that they are proposing to remove over 115 parking spaces along Morrissons Quay and Father Matthew Quay, can't see the logic there at all.

Good move, brave it has to be said. The less places to park = less car commutes. Needless to say the quayside should be a public amenity not a car park. Waterford ruined what should be a stunning public space with a big massive car park.

AugustusMinimus

cgcsb wrote: »

Copenhagen getting 30% less rain than Dublin hardly justifies it though. Besides Copenhagen rain is freezing sleet, that'd really give you a chill. How did previous generations of Irish people survive, in spite of the fact that it rains.

They on average died 10 years younger. I don’t think this is the solution.

namloc1980

beer enigma wrote: »

Just seen that they are proposing to remove over 115 parking spaces along Morrissons Quay and Father Matthew Quay, can't see the logic there at all.

The quaysides in Cork should be a public amenity especially the south facing ones. Using riverside frontage as a carpark is an awful waste of a valuable open public space. Why does everything in Cork have to be about cars and more cars? Wouldn't something like this be a far better amenity than a car park?

j8wk2feszrnpao

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

They on average died 10 years younger. I don’t think this is the solution.

Exactly, why do we always need to refer back to the past?
People cycled back then because they didn't have the means and the finances for alternatives. The "good auld times" weren't so good.

namloc1980

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Exactly, why do we always need to refer back to the past?
People cycled back then because they didn't have the means and the finances for alternatives. The "good auld times" weren't so good.

Having the means and finances to sit in traffic in your car isn't so good either.

j8wk2feszrnpao

namloc1980 wrote: »

Having the means and finances to sit in traffic in your car isn't so good either.

I'm not saying it is, but going by the "generation" argument, then this generation is choosing that method and so should they be prioritized? Not necessarily. But the public aren't crying out for more amenities. Why does everything in Cork have to be about amenities and more amenities?

namloc1980

munstermagic11 wrote: »

I'm not saying it is, but going by the "generation" argument, then this generation is choosing that method and so should they be prioritized? Not necessarily. But the public aren't crying out for more amenities. Why does everything in Cork have to be about amenities and more amenities?

But it isn't and not sure why you are making that point. Cork has a remarkably low level of public open space in the city centre. Tiny Bishop Lucey Park and that's about it. There isn't a single playground in the city centre for kids. On the other hand we have vast amounts of public space given over to the private car and then when proposals come into to address the imbalance the naysayers flood in wondering where they can park their private vehicle.

beer enigma

namloc1980 wrote: »

The quaysides in Cork should be a public amenity especially the south facing ones. Using riverside frontage as a carpark is an awful waste of a valuable open public space. Why does everything in Cork have to be about cars and more cars? Wouldn't something like this be a far better amenity than a car park?

Don't get me wrong, I think it look great just the lack of parking for College of Com and School of Music is a concern at the moment, let alone with the reduction of spaces. People come in from far and wide for both venues and a bus is not always an option. It's bad enough on Union Quay with people double parking as it is without giving them more excuses.

As I say, I'm absolutely all for making the Quays a feature, but they need to make improvements to transport routes to service this area - those 115 cars will have to go somewhere.

AugustusMinimus

namloc1980 wrote: »

But it isn't and not sure why you are making that point. Cork has a remarkably low level of public open space in the city centre. Tiny Bishop Lucey Park and that's about it. There isn't a single playground in the city centre for kids. On the other hand we have vast amounts of public space given over to the private car and then when proposals come into to address the imbalance the naysayers flood in wondering where they can park their private vehicle.

What cities have play grounds located in the City Centre / Central Business District.

cgcsb

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

What cities have play grounds located in the City Centre / Central Business District.

Dublin

namloc1980

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

What cities have play grounds located in the City Centre / Central Business District.

Dublin, London, Nice, Munich, Bristol. Just a few places I've been in the last while all have parks and/or playgrounds in the city centres.

FrStone

namloc1980 wrote: »

The quaysides in Cork should be a public amenity especially the south facing ones. Using riverside frontage as a carpark is an awful waste of a valuable open public space. Why does everything in Cork have to be about cars and more cars? Wouldn't something like this be a far better amenity than a car park?

Sure what advantage is an extra few trees and a wider footpath? It's pointless.

The only advantage of it that I can see, is that the prostitutes that hand around morrisons Island, will now be able to hide behind a few trees. Which will make it more difficult for workers walking home to avoid them.

whisky_galore

namloc1980 wrote: »

The quaysides in Cork should be a public amenity especially the south facing ones. Using riverside frontage as a carpark is an awful waste of a valuable open public space. Why does everything in Cork have to be about cars and more cars? Wouldn't something like this be a far better amenity than a car park?

They will have plenty space for lots of begging pitches.

namloc1980

whisky_galore wrote: »

They will have plenty space for lots of begging pitches.

What's your point? Let's not develop anything because "they" might beg.

j8wk2feszrnpao

namloc1980 wrote: »

But it isn't and not sure why you are making that point. Cork has a remarkably low level of public open space in the city centre.

It doesn't have a remarkable low number of open spaces. Where is the outcry from the public on this matter? It's doesn't exist. That's the point.


"we have vast amounts of public space given over to the private public car"

namloc1980 wrote: »

and then when proposals come into to address the imbalance the naysayers flood in wondering where they can park their private vehicle.

Yes. The people that work in the city, that live in the city, that shop/visit in the city. The public.

namloc1980

munstermagic11 wrote: »

It doesn't have a remarkable low number of open spaces. Where is the outcry from the public on this matter? It's doesn't exist. That's the point.


"we have vast amounts of public space given over to the private public car"

Yes. The people that work in the city, that live in the city, that shop/visit in the city. The public.

Yes Cork does have a remarkably low amount of open space in the city centre. Unprecedented to be honest even in an Irish context. Dublin has numerous parks in the city. Galway has Eyre Square. Limerick the People's Park and riverside walk.

Also no such thing as a public car. You can't rock up and sit in any car you want and drive off.

There's outcry from people who live in the city. People are crying out for more public space in the city. Have you not seen the campaigns for Marina Park or Tramore Valley Park? I don't understand why anybody would object to making a city more liveable and not just a car centered traffic nightmare. I can already imagine the objections if/when a BRT/LRT line in Cork gets the go ahead.

the beer revolu

nostro wrote: »

I wasn't talking about toddlers in creches. That's deliberately changing the issue. I was talking about children of school going age. In most European countries they go to school on their own. In Ireland they are often driven by their parents.
Now you could argue that it rains here sometimes. And the little dears could get pneumonia and die. Or that the distances to school are larger in Ireland (they are not) or that Irish children would not be smart enough or fit enough to go to school on their own. Or that Ireland is a much more dangerous country than others(it is not) so children have to be chaperoned everywhere.
Ironic to see programs like Operation Transformation harping on about childhood fitness when the solution is obvious.
Let children be independent and go to school on their own. Stop mollycoddling them and driving them.

Or their bags are too heavy to carry.

SleetAndSnow

the beer revolu wrote: »

Or their bags are too heavy to carry.

this^ As a 5th year student, in my school, we have no Lockers to hold our books so have to carry the entire plethora of a4 hardback copies, folders, 7/8 300-400 page books. Its bad enough having to walk around school with it all day (and yes its damaging my back, we have complained to the school about there being no lockers for 5th and 6th years but they don't really care). There is no way we would be able to walk or cycle to school up and down the hills etc.

no.8

FrStone wrote:

Sure what advantage is an extra few trees and a wider footpath? It's pointless.

Have you travelled to any other mid to large cities outside of Cork? If so. . And assuming you're eyes were open you'd know the answer. Sorry but its pretty obvious

cgcsb

FrStone wrote: »

Sure what advantage is an extra few trees and a wider footpath? It's pointless.

The only advantage of it that I can see, is that the prostitutes that hand around morrisons Island, will now be able to hide behind a few trees. Which will make it more difficult for workers walking home to avoid them.

wow you're dry

no.8

whisky_galore wrote:

They will have plenty space for lots of begging pitches.

Lets not build roads in case somebody knocks someone down in other words. Backwards thinking

cgcsb

no.8 wrote: »

Have you travelled to any other mid to large cities outside of Cork? If so. . And assuming you're eyes were open you'd know the answer. Sorry but its pretty obvious

I'm pretty sure it's a joke(of some description). Nobody is going to go to a public consultation and say well what about the prostitutes hiding behind tress.