Shoes off.

the_pen_turner

the_pen_turner wrote: »

i would do my best to avoid going to someones house with this crazy rule. i would invite them over or meet somewhere else. only as a last resort would i go over to theirs.

if its in a profetional context then i am leaving them on for health and safety reaons unless very exceptional circumstances. my boots wouldnt be mucky

That's fair enough. I'd consider that to be completely irrational to be so difficult when visiting friends or family, but just like I can decide what's okay in my house, you can decide to visit or not or to leave, if you're as easily offended. When everyone else who visits under social circumstances does so without making a fuss, I'd be quite happy to show you to the door.

In a professional capacity, that's a little different. If you drag in stones in the tread on your work boots and damage flooring (for example), I'd have recourse to cover the expense. The likelihood is that this would truly not be a concern, because while people might consider my uptight, tradesmen know well enough that they can't be careless in someonen elses home. My experience is that such visitors are the very last ones to be concerned about.

Ruth Nutty Treachery

Ruth Nutty Treachery wrote: »

I have never ever encountered it. I would comply (without being happy about it of course) though, once told about the rule in a polite manner.

Of course it should always be polite, but if it's a firm 'request', it would be ill considered to refuse. If it's a service or tradesman, I'd be okay with it, after politely requesting that they check their boots/shoes if they're coming in and out and make sure they clean up after themselves.

When the floors are generally flawless and spotless, it's never a concern when it's someone arriving to do a job. They know the score when it comes to causing damage in someones home, accidental or not, no matter what their own rules are at home.

EDIT; Genuinely impressed by most trades visitors when it comes to this kind of thing. In my experience they'll bring their own hoover in or cardboard to put their toolbox sitting on and that kind of thing. When we've a clean home and a boot brush by the door which I know they'll use, I've seen it often in such cases, people doing those kinds of things have my respect in turn for the professional and courteous attitude they show.

To the shoe people here, if I arrived at your house and took my shoes off, would that be an issue? Clean socks and no smells.

ShyMets

Deleted User wrote: »

To the shoe people here, if I arrived at your house and took my shoes off, would that be an issue? Clean socks and no smells.

I certainly wouldn't have issue. Though I would politely point out that removing yours shoes was not required and you may find the floors a little cold

iamwhoiam

As a matter of interest are the " no shoes " people living up mucky lanes or in areas with sand or grit at the entrance ? Then hopping out of a car and walking three steps to the door is hardly going to ruin your house on the spot .? Yes I can see if it was snowing or huge puddles between the car and door etc , but arriving in the summer in a pair of sandals is unlikely to cause death or destruction .
Do the " no shoes " people relax in the summer ? Then during the snow when people called here they automatically kicked off shoes as they knew they dripped , but happily come in in sandals .I think most people really know the difference !!

iamwhoiam

iamwhoiam wrote: »

As a matter of interest are the " no shoes " people living up mucky lanes or in areas with sand or grit at the entrance ? Then hopping out of a car and walking three steps to the door is hardly going to ruin your house on the spot .? Yes I can see if it was snowing or huge puddles between the car and door etc , but arriving in the summer in a pair of sandals is unlikely to cause death or destruction .
Do the " no shoes " people relax in the summer ? Then during the snow when people called here they automatically kicked off shoes as they knew they dripped , but happily come in in sandals .I think most people really know the difference !!

The reason many people don't like being asked is they feel they're being insulted. The only way to not insult is to have the rule all the time for everyone, except for old people etc. Otherwise, you are actually judging someone's shoes at the door.

iamwhoiam

Deleted User wrote: »

The reason many people don't like being asked is they feel they're being insulted. The only way to not insult is to have the rule all the time for everyone, except for old people etc. Otherwise, you are actually judging someone's shoes at the door.

Personally I leave it up to peoples intelligence . Most people are aware if they have dirty , wet , manky shoes .
Kids might need guidance but my friends and family can make up their own mind .I have one brother who automatically kicks his off if he arrives from work , he is not as fussed if he arrives in sandals on a hot summer day and nor am I as we both know the difference

Quackster

I'd very much like the 'no shoes' folk to clarify the following two points:

Do they provide advance warning, where possible, to visiting guests who haven't been to their houses before so said visitors don't feel 'ambushed' at the front door?

Do they advise guests that they can bring clean footwear that they can change into and/or provide slippers so said guests don't actually have to walk around in their socks - something which can be quite off-putting/uncomfortable for folk who aren't used to it, particularly on potentially cold or slippery surfaces?

iamwhoiam

Quackster wrote: »

I'd very much like the 'no shoes' folk to clarify the following two points:

Do they provide advance warning, where possible, to visiting guests who haven't been to their houses before so said visitors don't feel 'ambushed' at the front door?

Do they advise guests that they can bring clean footwear that they can change into and/or provide slippers so said guests don't actually have to walk around in their socks - something which can be quite off-putting/uncomfortable for folk who aren't used to it, particularly on potentially cold or slippery surfaces?

I asked the same way back but got no answers .

odyssey06

Quackster wrote: »

I'd very much like the 'no shoes' folk to clarify the following two points:

Do they provide advance warning, where possible, to visiting guests who haven't been to their houses before so said visitors don't feel 'ambushed' at the front door?

Do they advise guests that they can bring clean footwear that they can change into and/or provide slippers so said guests don't actually have to walk around in their socks - something which can be quite off-putting/uncomfortable for folk who aren't used to it, particularly on potentially cold or slippery surfaces?

Plus somewhere they can change comfortably, bearing in mind older people for whom a shoe change is a different prospect to a teenager.

orourkeda1977

Shoes off from them equals fack off from me.

odyssey06

What would the "shoes off with no exceptions" brigade make of someone who rolls up in a wheelchair?

odyssey06

odyssey06 wrote: »

What would the "shoes off with no exceptions" brigade make of someone who rolls up in a wheelchair?

Tyres off, obviously.

v638sg7k1a92bx

Quackster wrote: »

I'd very much like the 'no shoes' folk to clarify the following two points:

Do they provide advance warning, where possible, to visiting guests who haven't been to their houses before so said visitors don't feel 'ambushed' at the front door?

Do they advise guests that they can bring clean footwear that they can change into and/or provide slippers so said guests don't actually have to walk around in their socks - something which can be quite off-putting/uncomfortable for folk who aren't used to it, particularly on potentially cold or slippery surfaces?

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I asked the same way back but got no answers .

I've been making this point from the beginning. The my house my rules brigade seem to miss the point that they are the host inviting guests into their home. If the overwhelming majority of people don't ask guests to remove their shoes, for their own sake and in terms of social engagement, do you not think you would adapt to the social norms and just wait until everybody left and hoover the floor if you were really that concerned about it or just don't invite people to your home?

I used to have a friend who was very house proud. When he first moved into his house and had guests over he would ask them to remove their shoes. However, he had the wherewithal to realise that if he wanted to keep inviting his friends over and have normal social interactions with these people that it just wasn't appropriate to ask guests to remove their shoes. Now he waits until everyone leaves he gives the house a once over and no one is any wiser.

Sheeps

The missus is Asian, so it's shoes off.

Sleeper12

Skylar Odd Stingray wrote:

I've been making this point from the beginning. The my house my rules brigade seem to miss the point that they are the host inviting guests into their home. If the overwhelming majority of people don't ask guests to remove their shoes, for their own sake and in terms of social engagement, do you not think you would adapt to the social norms and just wait until everybody left and hoover the floor if you were really that concerned about it or just don't invite people to your home?

It's a little like inviting your friends to a fancy dress party in your home but not telling them about the fancy dress part.

Quackster

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I asked the same way back but got no answers .

Yep, the silence is indeed rather deafening.

Sycamore Tree

Ruth Nutty Treachery wrote: »

The main reason is because they view it as uptight and unwelcoming.

And very very pretentious...

Sleeper12

Sycamore Tree wrote:

And very very pretentious...

Totally agree.
If the shoe fits if you'll pardon the pun

mud

I moved into a house share situation last year. Was living there a couple of months when the woman and I were chatting one day and she said “we take off our shoes in this house” me being unused to this style of communication didn’t realise that she was asking me to take my shoes off and somewhat dimly thought that she was just making a statement about her and the hubby.

Turns out that instead of asking me to remove my shoes she was passive aggressively telling me to do so and when I wasn’t complying the hubby had to step in and tell me to take the shoes off. I said I was happy to wear slippers in the house but wondered why the no shoes rule didn’t apply to their kids or visitors to the house? I never really got an answer to that question!

They also used to drag the strollers and bikes through the house so the no shoes rule was farcical. I also moved the **** out of there not long after when I realised that they didn’t want a housemate they just wanted a ghost-like atm :pac:

iamwhoiam

mud wrote: »

I moved into a house share situation last year. Was living there a couple of months when the woman and I were chatting one day and she said “we take off our shoes in this house” me being unused to this style of communication didn’t realise that she was asking me to take my shoes off and somewhat dimly thought that she was just making a statement about her and the hubby.

Turns out that instead of asking me to remove my shoes she was passive aggressively telling me to do so and when I wasn’t complying the hubby had to step in and tell me to take the shoes off. I said I was happy to wear slippers in the house but wondered why the no shoes rule didn’t apply to their kids or visitors to the house? I never really got an answer to that question!

They also used to drag the strollers and bikes through the house so the no shoes rule was farcical. I also moved the **** out of there not long after when I realised that they didn’t want a housemate they just wanted a ghost-like atm :pac:

Maybe your shoes matched your user name !!!

Sleeper12

mud wrote:

Turns out that instead of asking me to remove my shoes she was passive aggressively telling me to do so and when I wasn’t complying the hubby had to step in and tell me to take the shoes off. I said I was happy to wear slippers in the house but wondered why the no shoes rule didn’t apply to their kids or visitors to the house? I never really got an answer to that question!

I was asked to remove my shoes in a showers repair job. I explained that my shoes are there for health and safety and couldn't remove them. This wasn't an issue for him but I was raging when I got upstairs to be greeted by a huge hairy dog! Admittedly the dog wasn't wearing shoes but I still thought it a bit much to expect me to get dog hairs on my socks.

Their house, their rules but wow!

I love the way 'pretentious' is still being thrown around. You lads should try to understand these 'big words' before you use them. :rolleyes:

As or Quackster/Iamwhoiam's repeated questions, which have already been answered, I'll summarise:

From my perspective, I don't care if people think I should give advance notice or not. We have warm floors throughout and rugs by couches and armchairs for a little extra comfort underfoot when sitting around, there are a couple of chairs by the front door with a shoe horn available etc. There's nothing else I need do for any casual caller or guests. It's up to each of them to keep their feet clean and to wear socks that won't cause them embarassment. And in all honesty, genuinely, if they've a problem with that they can just go. A bit of chat here about it is one thing, but when it comes down to it in real life, it's not open for negotiation or discussion. Same goes for someone who wants to bring their pet dog inside. Not happening.

If you decide on 'no shoes' in your homes and want to send advance notice by SMS, provide slippers or crocs for guest use, have at it. I don't and won't.

As for the ridiculous question about what I'd do if someone arrived in a wheelchair.. Scraping the bottom of the barrel now, aren't you? :rolleyes: Of course that would be fine. A guide-dog would similarly not present a problem. But your shoes and your pets go no further than the front door.

iamwhoiam

JayZeus wrote: »

I love the way 'pretentious' is still being thrown around. You lads should try to understand these 'big words' before you use them. :rolleyes:

As or Quackster/Iamwhoiam's repeated questions, which have already been answered, I'll summarise:

From my perspective, I don't care if people think I should give advance notice or not. We have warm floors throughout and rugs by couches and armchairs for a little extra comfort underfoot when sitting around, there are a couple of chairs by the front door with a shoe horn available etc. There's nothing else I need do for any casual caller or guests. It's up to each of them to keep their feet clean and to wear socks that won't cause them embarassment. And in all honesty, genuinely, if they've a problem with that they can just go. A bit of chat here about it is one thing, but when it comes down to it in real life, it's not open for negotiation or discussion. Same goes for someone who wants to bring their pet dog inside. Not happening.

If you decide on 'no shoes' in your homes and want to send advance notice by SMS, provide slippers or crocs for guest use, have at it. I don't and won't.

As for the ridiculous question about what I'd do if someone arrived in a wheelchair.. Scraping the bottom of the barrel now, aren't you? :rolleyes: Of course that would be fine. A guide-dog would similarly not present a problem. But your shoes and your pets go no further than the front door.

With your attitude towards posters and more importantly visitors I doubt I would be all that keen to visit with or without shoes . Its all about you isn't it

blackcard

Do you ask guests to wash their hands or wear gloves before shaking hands with them?

Skylar Odd Stingray

Skylar Odd Stingray wrote: »

I've been making this point from the beginning. The my house my rules brigade seem to miss the point that they are the host inviting guests into their home. If the overwhelming majority of people don't ask guests to remove their shoes, for their own sake and in terms of social engagement, do you not think you would adapt to the social norms and just wait until everybody left and hoover the floor if you were really that concerned about it or just don't invite people to your home?

I used to have a friend who was very house proud. When he first moved into his house and had guests over he would ask them to remove their shoes. However, he had the wherewithal to realise that if he wanted to keep inviting his friends over and have normal social interactions with these people that it just wasn't appropriate to ask guests to remove their shoes. Now he waits until everyone leaves he gives the house a once over and no one is any wiser.

Cool story.

In the real world, people just take their shoes off. I've never had a situation occur where someone would be so difficult as to not visit or decline an invitation because they didn't want to take their shoes off. You might say I didn't warn them, so they have no choice. Do you actually think that's intentional thought, or indeed, do you think I'd actually care either way?

Really, most people will just go with the flow when they visit someone elses home. You're very keen to make out that it's some unreasonable, uncomfortable, offensive or socially backwards thing to ask of visitors. In truth, most people won't be bothered, unless they're already looking for something to whinge about.

Either way, take them off or leave. Those are your choices and if you're the kind of person who'd leave, good riddance.

iamwhoiam

My grandchild came flying in my door today in mucky wellies from the park . She flew in past me all excited to tell her granda she saw a squirrel ! I saw mud dripping across my wooden floor and silently knew it would just take a brush and a wipe . But OMG it was worth it so not to curb her excitement . Imagine halting her excitement at the door in case my floor got a bit muddy ! No way , she is way way more precious than my floor

iamwhoiam

iamwhoiam wrote: »

With your attitude towards posters and more importantly visitors I doubt I would be all that keen to visit with or without shoes . Its all about you isn't it

My attitude towards posters? And visitors? Ha. Get a grip there.

It's not at all about me. It's about everyone. Everyone's expected to take off their shoes. Same rules for all. It's people who think they're entitled to exceptional treatment that I have trouble with.

In your home, you decide what's okay. Nobody has any right to insist they have the right to do whatever they want under your roof. They don't. Same applies here.

odyssey06

JayZeus wrote: »

Really, most people will just go with the flow when they visit someone elses home
Either way, take them off or leave. Those are your choices and if you're the kind of person who'd leave, good riddance.

Actually you are doing people a favour with this ultimatum. Anyone who decides to leave has probably done themselves a massive favour they wont regret.

iamwhoiam

JayZeus wrote: »

My attitude towards posters? And visitors? Ha. Get a grip there.

It's not at all about me. It's about everyone. Everyone's expected to take off their shoes. Same rules for all. It's people who think they're entitled to exceptional treatment that I have trouble with.

In your home, you decide what's okay. Nobody has any right to insist they have the right to do whatever they want under your roof. They don't. Same applies here.

I value my friends and family far more than my floor . Its that simple really

iamwhoiam

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I value my friends and family far more than my floor . Its that simple really

Yes, because a 'no shoes' rule devalues them in some way. Is that your argument?

I appreciate our family and friends treating our home with the same care we do and being respectful of our wishes while they're here. If they're not prepared to do that, I'd not be willing to have them here. It's a simple thing.

For all the grandstanding about turning around or not visiting people who ask this of you as a guest, I suspect most of you wouldn't embarrass yourselves by actually making a fuss over it.

Clean socks and clean jocks. You might visit a 'no shoes' home, or get hit by a bus. If you wash and put on fresh socks, you've no valid reason to object when visiting a home where they're likely to have a 'no shoes' rule in place.

odyssey06

odyssey06 wrote: »

Actually you are doing people a favour with this ultimatum. Anyone who decides to leave has probably done themselves a massive favour they wont regret.

And anyone who'd refuse and leave has done us a favour too. I wouldn't want to waste my time hosting them.

v638sg7k1a92bx

JayZeus wrote: »

Cool story.

In the real world, people just take their shoes off. I've never had a situation occur where someone would be so difficult as to not visit or decline an invitation because they didn't want to take their shoes off. You might say I didn't warn them, so they have no choice. Do you actually think that's intentional thought, or indeed, do you think I'd actually care either way?

Really, most people will just go with the flow when they visit someone elses home. You're very keen to make out that it's some unreasonable, uncomfortable, offensive or socially backwards thing to ask of visitors. In truth, most people won't be bothered, unless they're already looking for something to whinge about.

Either way, take them off or leave. Those are your choices and if you're the kind of person who'd leave, good riddance.

Actually, in the real world people leave their shoes on. It's only in a small minority of home that guests are expected to take their shoes off. Everyone is out of step except for Jim comes to mind.

You also suggest that you don't care but if you really didn't care then why would you invite someone to your home in the first place?

blackcard

blackcard wrote: »

Do you ask guests to wash their hands or wear gloves before shaking hands with them?

Of course not.

It's about being respectful and mannerly.

I expect them not to pick their nose, put their feet up on the coffee table, scratch their arse, fondle their balls, drink milk from the carton and so on. You don't do these things in someone else's home, no matter what you may do in your own home.

Where your hosts don't wear their shoes indoors, you should make a genuine offer to remove yours or be prepared to do so if asked. Consider it to be good manners when in someone else's home.

Skylar Odd Stingray

Skylar Odd Stingray wrote: »

Actually, in the real world people leave their shoes on. It's only in a small minority of home that guests are expected to take their shoes off. Everyone is out of step except for Jim comes to mind.

You also suggest that you don't care but if you really didn't care then why would you invite someone to your home in the first place?

In the real world, it's both. The 'small minority' is still something like tens of thousands of homes, even in little old Ireland with its kitchens and wellies.

As for the second part, all are welcome, until they make themselves unwelcome by thinking they've a right to do something that isn't okay in our home. One of that 'small minority' which still represents a significant number of homes. So while you don't have to do it that way in your home, be prepared to make yourself unwelcome in others if you refuse to take off your shoes.

It's not all that long ago people would have kicked up a fuss about being asked not to smoke in someone elses home also. All the same noises. This is very much the same thing. Not about health, but more about the homeowners right to decide what you can or can't do in their house.

In my house, you don't get to wear your shoes and I don't care if that bothers or offends you.

Pretzeluck

JayZeus wrote: »

In the real world, it's both. The 'small minority' is still something like tens of thousands of homes, even in little old Ireland with its kitchens and wellies.

As for the second part, all are welcome, until they make themselves unwelcome by thinking they've a right to do something that isn't okay in our home. One of that 'small minority' which still represents a significant number of homes. So while you don't have to do it that way in your home, be prepared to make yourself unwelcome in others if you refuse to take off your shoes.

It's not all that long ago people would have kicked up a fuss about being asked not to smoke in someone elses home also. All the same noises. This is very much the same thing. Not about health, but more about the homeowners right to decide what you can or can't do in their house.

In my house, you don't get to wear your shoes and I don't care if that bothers or offends you.

I would literally turn around and give you the middle finger on my way back if you ordered me to take my shoes off.

Sleeper12

JayZeus wrote:

My attitude towards posters? And visitors? Ha. Get a grip there.

It's basic manners to inform first time guests, before they get to your house, that they are required to remove their shoes. Your posts state over & over again that you have little or no respect for your guests by failing to inform them before hand.

I totally get "my house, my rules". I have my own lovely home myself. I totally respect the fact that you won't have shoes in the house, even for guests. What I don't get is your bad manners and total disrespect towards an invited guest. When you invite them over the phone or in person for the first time why is it so hard for you to tell them that they will be expected to remove their shoes? It gives them a chance to wear their best socks or in some cases to put on socks. It gives them a chance to bring their own indoor slippers. Your guests might not want to walk on your floors in their good socks. What is wrong with doing the polite thing and letting your guests know in advance? Why insist on being so rude to people that you invite into your home?

I think this is the attitude that posters are commenting on. It can still be "my house, my rules" without being so rude and disrespectful to guests and posters

v638sg7k1a92bx

JayZeus wrote: »

Of course not.

Where your hosts don't wear their shoes indoors, you should make a genuine offer to remove yours or be prepared to do so if asked. Consider it to be good manners when in someone else's home.

But they don't know that there is a no shoes rule in your home because you haven't told them and you haven't given them an opportunity to refuse other than when they set foot in your doorway and you ask them to engage in this maldaptive behaviour or gtf out of your house. Who exactly is being rude here?

Lads, you can think it's rude or disrespectful and that's all well and fine. Nobody who comes here has objected but if anyone does, I'll hear them out, let them know it's the same rules for anyone and let them decide what they want to do. If they want to make a big deal out of it, they'll be told they can leave with no hard feelings.

Unlike here, in real life, people don't argue about this sort of thing. There's no confrontation with anyone asked to take their shoes off and honestly, if someone doesn't want to come back because they have to take their shoes off as a social visitor, I won't be going out of my way to turn that around.

TIckers, you don't like what you read and you don't have to. You can consider it rude, you can keep trying to argue and go around in circles. It's easier just to decide I'm whatever 4 letter word you decide to be most appropriate and then take a deep breath and let it go. I'm not 'warning' people that it's no shoes here. They can either take off their shoes like normal people really do, right here in the real world, or they can act like a pratt and be a drama queen over some perceived rudeness on my part. I really just don't care about the offence it may cause to someone who gets offended by this kind of thing. Rude? I really just don't care.

Quackster

JayZeus wrote: »

If you decide on 'no shoes' in your homes and want to send advance notice by SMS, provide slippers or crocs for guest use, have at it. I don't and won't.

This, I must say, I would consider a wholly unreasonable attitude. Having lived in a country where removing outdoor shoes indoors is the norm, I've no issue with it, in and of itself, and I understand the logic behind it (at least in certain climates). However it's universally understood there that guests bring appropriate indoor footwear to change into whenever practicable. And when that's not possible, there'll always be a few pairs of spare slippers or similar available in every house.

You haven't spelled it out but I'm reading that you wouldn't allow guests bring their own slippers? That I find most bizarre. Not everyone is comfortable walking around only in socks, especially on uncarpeted floors, and it's plain disrespectful expecting them to.

I've only ever come across this scenario once in this country (and I wasn't warned in advance or provided with appropriate footwear to change into) and while I was absolutely polite and respectful during the visit and never commented on the matter, I really am in no rush to revisit.

james678

If someone asks me to take my shoes off I would have no problem with it.
I wouldn't go into someones house and automatically take them off though. I think some people would look at you like you have two heads if you did it.

Sleeper12

JayZeus wrote:

Lads, you can think it's rude or disrespectful and that's all well and fine. Nobody who comes here has objected but if anyone does, I'll hear them out, let them know it's the same rules for anyone and let them decide what they want to do. If they want to make a big deal out of it, they'll be told they can leave with no hard feelings.

Why would you put a guest in this position when a simple "oh by the way there'll be no shoes worn in the house for the party tomorrow" would avoid it?

I have to say I genuinely believe that you are winding up posters on this thread. I have never come across someone who would be deliberately disrespectful & rude to guests in their home especially when you are expecting them to respect you, your rules and your house. I don't believe what you are saying is the truth & I base that on never coming across anyone that would deliberately be disrespectful & rude to their guests so needlessly when a simple heads up is all that's needed.

Quackster

Quackster wrote: »

This, I must say, I would consider a wholly unreasonable attitude. Having lived in a country where removing outdoor shoes indoors is the norm, I've no issue with it, in and of itself, and I understand the logic behind it (at least in certain climates). However it's universally understood there that guests bring appropriate indoor footwear to change into whenever practicable. And when that's not possible, there'll always be a few pairs of spare slippers or similar available in every house.

You haven't spelled it out but I'm reading that you wouldn't allow guests bring their own slippers? That I find most bizarre. Not everyone is comfortable walking around only in socks, especially on uncarpeted floors, and it's plain disrespectful expecting them to.

I've only ever come across this scenario once in this country (and I wasn't warned in advance or provided with appropriate footwear to change into) and while I was absolutely polite and respectful during the visit and never commented on the matter, I really am in no rush to revisit.

I haven't spelled it out, and if they're slippers or whatever, I'd have no problem with it. A change of footwear to indoor shoes is fine by me.

As for the rest of it, what you find wholly unreasonable I find perfectly reasonable. I may be the only person you'll ever encounter who believes it so, but as has been said time and time again, my house, my rules. Nobody's forced to visit, to stay or to return. Come and go as you please. Just not wearing your shoes indoors.

Isn't it a bit off the fascination people seem to have with trying to tell me what's reasonable, fair, respecful, disrespectful, rude or otherwise when it basically comes down to the fact that in my home we don't wear our outdoor footwear indoors and I insist on the same from people who come to visit.

A socially polite veneer can and indeed is applied when we're all smiles and greeting each other, but underneath it all, the simple fact is that this is a rule that isn't going be bent just because of someone being uncomfortable with being asked to take their shoes off, for whatever arbitrary and wholly inadequate excuses they might wish to offer.

If you're on crutches, in a wheelchair, have a splint with a rubber sole or whatever then that's all fine by me. But big Eamonn with the two day old socks being worried about the fact his big toe might poke out any moment now could benefit from a bit of social embarrassment. I'm not bending the rules for that eejit, or for the difficult or argumentative visitor who thinks they get to call the shots.

Like I said, it's all fine until it comes down to the line. No shoes, unless I decide to make an exception and it should be pretty clear that I'll only do that under very valid circumstances, not just because of someones discomfort or some BS about how it's not part of Irish culture.

Sleeper12

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Why would you put a guest in this position when a simple "oh by the way there'll be no shoes worn in the house for the party tomorrow" would avoid it?

I have to say I genuinely believe that you are winding up posters on this thread. I have never come across someone who would be deliberately disrespectful & rude to guests in their home especially when you are expecting them to respect you, your rules and your house. I don't believe what you are saying is the truth & I base that on never coming across anyone that would deliberately be disrespectful & rude to their guests so needlessly when a simple heads up is all that's needed.

You might find it hard to believe but I assure you I genuinely don't consider this sort of thing to be important to notify people about in advance of their arrival. I consider it petty to object to removing your shoes when you visit someone socially and I expect that any adult who I would ever want in my home in any case will only be the kind of person who will wash and wear clean socks anyway. And if you do that, I don't see what your basis would be except that you're looking for some reason to feel 'put out'. In which case, I'm not particularly like to care much about that reaction either.

Just because you haven't come across anyone with a clear cut approach to this kind of thing doesn't mean it's not true. You and others can consider me to be whatever you want, but I honestly believe it's the objectors who have the bigger hang up than I have when it comes to this kind of thing.

Suffice to say, in day to day life, this actually isn't the problem all the hypothetical arguments being made against my black and white 'no shoes' rule make it out to be. People offer, are asked or will be told to take their shoes off and we get on with their visit. If they're so offended they leave or won't come back, well then, there are bigger problems and talk about having to take shoes off is just nonsense either way.

Sleeper12

JayZeus wrote:

Isn't it a bit off the fascination people seem to have with trying to tell me what's reasonable, fair, respecful, disrespectful, rude or otherwise when it basically comes down to the fact that in my home we don't wear our outdoor footwear indoors and I insist on the same from people who come to visit.

I'm sure you won't find it rude or unreasonable where tradesmen coming into your home refuse to remove their protective footwear

Sleeper12

Sleeper12 wrote: »

I'm sure you won't find it rude or unreasonable where tradesmen coming into your home refuse to remove their protective footwear

Absolutely.

JayZeus wrote: »

In a professional capacity, that's a little different. If you drag in stones in the tread on your work boots and damage flooring (for example), I'd have recourse to cover the expense. The likelihood is that this would truly not be a concern, because while people might consider me uptight, tradesmen know well enough that they can't be careless in someone elses home. My experience is that such visitors are the very last ones to be concerned about.

JayZeus wrote: »

If it's a service or tradesman, I'd be okay with it, after politely requesting that they check their boots/shoes if they're coming in and out and make sure they clean up after themselves.

When the floors are generally flawless and spotless, it's never a concern when it's someone arriving to do a job. They know the score when it comes to causing damage in someones home, accidental or not, no matter what their own rules are at home.

EDIT; Genuinely impressed by most trades visitors when it comes to this kind of thing. In my experience they'll bring their own hoover in or cardboard to put their toolbox sitting on and that kind of thing. When we've a clean home and a boot brush by the door which I know they'll use, I've seen it often in such cases, people doing those kinds of things have my respect in turn for the professional and courteous attitude they show.

Sleeper12

JayZeus wrote:

You might find it hard to believe but I assure you I genuinely don't consider this sort of thing to be important to notify people about in advance of their arrival. I consider it petty to object to removing your shoes when you visit someone socially and I expect that any adult who I would ever want in my home in any case will only be the kind of person who will wash and wear clean socks anyway. And if you do that, I don't see what your basis would be except that you're looking for some reason to feel 'put out'. In which case, I'm not particularly like to care much about that reaction either.

"I genuinely don't consider this sort of thing to be important". This is the disrespectful part. I'm autistic but even I can put myself in the shoes (pun intended) of my guests. What isn't important to you might be for your guest. There's a word called empathy, & many autistic people struggle with it. It's not that they are deliberately self centered & selfish. It's that they genuinely find it difficult to see things from another person's point of view. I'm wondering if maybe you are autistic too?

Sleeper12

Sleeper12 wrote: »

"I genuinely don't consider this sort of thing to be important". This is the disrespectful part. I'm autistic but even I can put myself in the shoes (pun intended) of my guests. What isn't important to you might be for your guest. There's a word called empathy, & many autistic people struggle with it. It's not that they are deliberately self centered & selfish. It's that they genuinely find it difficult to see things from another person's point of view. I'm wondering if maybe you are autistic too?

I'm not, but I wouldn't find anything objectionable about the question so thanks for asking it.

Feel free to label me self-centred and selfish. There was a time when I would invest the time and energy required to accommodate other peoples preferences to the best of my abilities, no matter how petty or inconsequential I considered them to be. The fact is that this often requires compromising on my own comfort and I just couldn't be bothered with it any more. My home is easier to maintain when people (us included) don't wear outdoor footwear, indoors. I'm happy with that, so that's how it's going to be.

When it comes to actual important matters, I'm happy be open to what someone else needs and do what I can to accommodate that wherever I can, at the expense of my own comfort, time and expense or whatever.

But when it comes to minor matters such as taking off your shoes when you come in to my home, I just decide what's the best rule to apply for social callers and that's the end of that. Shoes off at the door. Clear, simple, no need to give it a second thought or entertain a discussion about it. The only times an exception is made is when I make it, because of a practical constraint or reasonable requirement, such as safety boots, wheelchairs (hypothetical) etc. In such cases, well, there's not much of a choice to make either way.

Right now, nobody with physical disabilities or injuries that would create a problem for them visit us, and we're not having any work done, so the only people who'll be coming past the door are family or friends coming for a social visit. They can all take off their shoes, and in reality they do and they don't complain. I don't know if it bothers them or not, but they know (as you might have realised by now) that raising any objections is a waste of everyones time. It's not negotiable and until something changes and someone needs an exception to be made for a valid reason (hurt feelings or perceived social discomfort don't meet that standard for me), everyone will be required to do the same.

It's quite possible I'm just a selfish bastard who doesn't care enough to think about what other people think is acceptable. It's quite likely in this case. It also really doesn't matter because I'm okay with things being how they are and there's no reason to change it.

Sleeper12

JayZeus wrote:

I'm not, but I wouldn't find anything objectionable about the question so thanks for asking it.

There's nothing objectionable about the question. I'm autistic. It's who I am & I proudly wear it as a badge of honor.

Sleeper12

Sleeper12 wrote: »

There's nothing objectionable about the question. I'm autistic. It's who I am & I proudly wear it as a badge of honor.

I agree. I've seen some people reject a question such as the one you posed as nonsense or a ridiculous suggestion. I see it as a perfectly reasonable possibility when one encounters someone who may exhibit some atypical behaviour in social interaction.

In my case, I'm just a grump with very little interest in toeing the line when other people expect certain things from me. Just like you, I'm perfectly comfortable accepting that this is who I am and neither of us need apologise to anyone for the difficulty they have understanding or accepting that.