‘Luas on Wheels’ bus service for Galway

McGiver · 08-05-2018 1:27pm

Renee Slow Purse wrote: »

This bus sounds much like the new ones set to arrive for Translink this Sept.

http://www.translink.co.uk/also-on-our-site/Glider/

Look a bit space-age, Rapid-Transport system, but essentially just a hybrid low-emission/noise, 18 metre bendy bus. 105 capacity! USB & Wifi.

The only thing exceptional about it is that it's a hybrid. The rest is just a marketing BS, just a long bendy bus like any other at the moment.

McGiver · 08-05-2018 1:32pm

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Right now, the fastest way to board a bus in Galway is with a monthly or annual TaxSaver ticket: these are manual, the driver just has to glance at them.

I've got monthly TaxSaver Leap Card and it is being validated in a similar way as the normal Leap Card. Some drivers are taking too much time with these ones as well. Many of them first try Leap Card balance thinking it's a Leap Card, that shows zero, they then validate it as a monthly ticket.

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

Second fastest is cash. Yes, even when the driver has to give change.

Fastest is no cash. Validators/tickets outside. No need to validate Leap Card inside the bus. In the city I am fom, typical "Galway" bus stop would take just a few seconds, here it takes one minute or more.

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

There is already a substantial penalty for paying with cash rather than Leap (eg adult journey is 1.61 on Leap, or 2.30 with cash), but lots of people still pay with cash.

No, it's the other way round. Leap card is discounted. In the city I am from, validators/ticket machine ticket price is X, whereas if you want to buy a ticket from the driver with cash (which is being discouraged) you pay more i.e. X + Y.

Lord Glentoran · 08-05-2018 1:36pm

McGiver wrote: »

The only thing exceptional about it is that it's a hybrid. The rest is just a marketing BS, just a long bendy bus like any other at the moment.

Its still a bus, and it can't even reach its potential because the bike lobby snaffled the old Belfast and County Down Railway line to Comber.

08-05-2018 1:59pm

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

Its still a bus, and it can't even reach its potential because the bike lobby snaffled the old Belfast and County Down Railway line to Comber.

Nonsense

cgcsb · 08-05-2018 2:00pm

The problem with the Belfast system is that the same pinch points still exist and the overall effectiveness of the system is greatly reduced because SF (of all parties) voted to reduce the effectiveness of the BRT lanes by allowing taxis on them and reducing their operating hours. Who knew lefty SF were against public transport.

McGiver · 09-05-2018 12:32am

cgcsb wrote: »

The problem with the Belfast system is that the same pinch points still exist and the overall effectiveness of the system is greatly reduced because SF (of all parties) voted to reduce the effectiveness of the BRT lanes by allowing taxis on them and reducing their operating hours. Who knew lefty SF were against public transport.

It's not about left or right. SF aren't really left in a European sense, they are national socialists of a very specific, Irish caliber.

Switzerland's gov is definitely not left (I won't mention a permanent grand coalition here to keep it simple), yet they have the best public transport system and network in Europe and perhaps the world.

JupiterKid · 09-05-2018 9:59am

This proposal makes complete sense for a city of Galway’s size and morphology. But for it to work effectively, new higher residential density developments will need to be built at key nodes along the East-West route, more office space developed in the City Centre and a route through the Centre that will involve minimal interaction with existing traffic.

And Park & Ride facilities for commuters at the termini of this route.

McGiver · 10-05-2018 12:37am

JupiterKid wrote: »

This proposal makes complete sense for a city of Galway’s size and morphology. But for it to work effectively, new higher residential density developments will need to be built at key nodes along the East-West route, more office space developed in the City Centre and a route through the Centre that will involve minimal interaction with existing traffic.

And Park & Ride facilities for commuters at the termini of this route.

Spot on. It's not only about the current situation but about planning as well.

High density required, build more apartments and build higher. Two- to three-story buildings have too low density.

Funnily, Bonham Quay was described as "too high", "overlooking" and "overshadowing", but it has only 6 to 7 stories. As if it is a skyscraper or what

what_traffic · 10-05-2018 11:23am

Looks like more Bus Driver jobs coming to Galway City. Wonder what numbers will be like?
https://www.independent.ie/business/jobs/bus-ireann-to-recruit-200-staff-across-the-country-36892662.html

McGiver · 11-05-2018 12:21am

what_traffic wrote: »

Looks like more Bus Driver jobs coming to Galway City. Wonder what numbers will be like?
https://www.independent.ie/business/jobs/bus-ireann-to-recruit-200-staff-across-the-country-36892662.html

You mean like 10?

11-05-2018 2:47am

McGiver wrote: »

Spot on. It's not only about the current situation but about planning as well.

High density required, build more apartments and build higher. Two- to three-story buildings have too low density.

Funnily, Bonham Quay was described as "too high", "overlooking" and "overshadowing", but it has only 6 to 7 stories. As if it is a skyscraper or what

Making apartments a better option for families and couples by increasing the size to a comparable one with those on the continent would go a long way. Nobody wants to live long term in a shoebox

Fitz* · 11-05-2018 10:03am

what_traffic wrote: »

Looks like more Bus Driver jobs coming to Galway City. Wonder what numbers will be like?
https://www.independent.ie/business/jobs/bus-ireann-to-recruit-200-staff-across-the-country-36892662.html

Will probably increase the 409 again and leave other bus routes struggling as usual.

what_traffic · 11-05-2018 11:17am

FitzShane wrote: »

Will probably increase the 409 again and leave other bus routes struggling as usual.

No idea. Need bus lanes and bus gates as well though. Will we see regular Metropolitan City services to Bearna/Clargealway/Moycullen like for Oranmore?

Mrs OBumble · 11-05-2018 11:34am

FitzShane wrote: »

Will probably increase the 409 again and leave other bus routes struggling as usual.

BE have already said at public meetings that the plan is for the 409 to go to evety 10 minutes (currently every 12) and the 404 to go to every 30 mins currently every 60).

Haven't seen any public announcements though.

Even with leave etc that won't use up 10 new drivers. (But I don't know if the figure of 10 for Galway is real or not.)

Fitz* · 11-05-2018 11:59am

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

BE have already said at public meetings that the plan is for the 409 to go to evety 10 minutes (currently every 12) and the 404 to go to every 30 mins currently every 60).

Haven't seen any public announcements though.

Even with leave etc that won't use up 10 new drivers. (But I don't know if the figure of 10 for Galway is real or not.)

Why increase the 409 even more? We already see many buses backed up there as it is. It already runs on a 12 min basis, so there are 5 buses per hour on that route. Add in the 3 x 403's which also serve Eyre Sq - Parkmore every hour and it is 8 overall.

That's double what any other bus route has in the city.

If they moved some of the 409's to an express service, or even lined the bus times up to the factory times it might make better use of the buses & drivers. Does the 409 really need 5 services per hour at 12.00 pm on a Wednesday? How many factories work them shifts? Why not increase the number of buses to align with factories hours and make the service more efficient. Increase during the shift beginning and finishing time, decrease when they are not needed.

I'm sure BE keep record of how many people use the route at certain times. Why not actually use this data?

ben.schlomo · 11-05-2018 12:07pm

FitzShane wrote: »

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

BE have already said at public meetings that the plan is for the 409 to go to evety 10 minutes (currently every 12) and the 404 to go to every 30 mins currently every 60).

Haven't seen any public announcements though.

Even with leave etc that won't use up 10 new drivers. (But I don't know if the figure of 10 for Galway is real or not.)

Why increase the 409 even more? We already see many buses backed up there as it is. It already runs on a 12 min basis, so there are 5 buses per hour on that route. Add in the 3 x 403's which also serve Eyre Sq - Parkmore every hour and it is 8 overall.

That's double what any other bus route has in the city.

If they moved some of the 409's to an express service, or even lined the bus times up to the factory times it might make better use of the buses & drivers. Does the 409 really need 5 services per hour at 12.00 pm on a Wednesday? How many factories work them shifts? Why not increase the number of buses to align with factories hours and make the service more efficient. Increase during the shift beginning and finishing time, decrease when they are not needed.

I'm sure BE keep record of how many people use the route at certain times. Why not actually use this data?

You do realise that it's not just a bus for factory workers ya? Gmit, all of Doughiska, Bons, Hotels, Wellpark retail and Merlin are all key stops along the route. It can be full to capacity in and out around 9/10 daily.

xckjoo · 11-05-2018 12:31pm

ben.schlomo wrote: »

You do realise that it's not just a bus for factory workers ya? Gmit, all of Doughiska, Bons, Hotels, Wellpark retail and Merlin are all key stops along the route. It can be full to capacity in and out around 9/10 daily.

Most of them are serviced by multiple other bus routes too though (not sure about Doughiska). No point in increasing the number of buses if they're all going to be sitting in the same traffic looking at each other.

ben.schlomo · 11-05-2018 12:51pm

xckjoo wrote: »

ben.schlomo wrote: »

You do realise that it's not just a bus for factory workers ya? Gmit, all of Doughiska, Bons, Hotels, Wellpark retail and Merlin are all key stops along the route. It can be full to capacity in and out around 9/10 daily.

Most of them are serviced by multiple other bus routes too though (not sure about Doughiska). No point in increasing the number of buses if they're all going to be sitting in the same traffic looking at each other.

Doughiska isn't, Gmit and Merlin just by 402 and 404 which aren't good enough/efficient.

Mrs OBumble · 11-05-2018 1:18pm

FitzShane wrote: »

Why increase the 409 even more? We already see many buses backed up there as it is. It already runs on a 12 min basis, so there are 5 buses per hour on that route. Add in the 3 x 403's which also serve Eyre Sq - Parkmore every hour and it is 8 overall.

That's double what any other bus route has in the city.

If they moved some of the 409's to an express service, or even lined the bus times up to the factory times it might make better use of the buses & drivers. Does the 409 really need 5 services per hour at 12.00 pm on a Wednesday? How many factories work them shifts? Why not increase the number of buses to align with factories hours and make the service more efficient. Increase during the shift beginning and finishing time, decrease when they are not needed.

I'm sure BE keep record of how many people use the route at certain times. Why not actually use this data?

It's not BE's call.

The NTA approve routes and timetables, based on need, which they derive from the data.

I agree that other routes, esp the 405, are under-served. Hopefully they will be addressed too.

It is impressive the way that the 404 has developed though. I think they know some things about growing routes.

4068ac1elhodqr · 11-05-2018 1:30pm

Interesting stat for urban areas, one single 'Glider bus' (at full capacity),
can replace x87 cars, (assuming average occpancy of 1.2), that's 0.5km of congestion.

xckjoo · 11-05-2018 1:34pm

ben.schlomo wrote: »

Doughiska isn't, Gmit and Merlin just by 402 and 404 which aren't good enough/efficient.

GMIT must be the most serviced stop in Galway that isn't in Eyre Square! It has the 402, 404 and 409, with the 405 around the corner. I think they're all on 20-30 mins rotations too.

As always, it comes down to the buses sitting in the same traffic as everyone else. The only bus lane between GMIT and Eyre Square finishes at the Bons (which the 404 actually goes around

). Oh and there's that one on Forster Street too. All 100m of it :pac:

xckjoo · 11-05-2018 1:37pm

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

It is impressive the way that the 404 has developed though. I think they know some things about growing routes.

How has the 404 changed over the years? I take it a bit these days but wouldn't have prior to a few years ago.

what_traffic · 11-05-2018 2:23pm

xckjoo wrote: »

GMIT must be the most serviced stop in Galway that isn't in Eyre Square! It has the 402, 404 and 409, with the 405 around the corner. I think they're all on 20-30 mins rotations too.

True well serviced, but the facilities for the GMIT bus users is really really poor.
Really need a Bus Laybys, with shelters on both sides and proper pedestrian crossings.
Whoever in City Council planning Dept allowed NEW Garda Station to be built right on top of the road should be given a medal.

xckjoo · 11-05-2018 3:28pm

what_traffic wrote: »

True well serviced, but the facilities for the GMIT bus users is really really poor.
Really need a Bus Laybys, with shelters on both sides and proper pedestrian crossings.
Whoever in City Council planning Dept allowed NEW Garda Station to be built right on top of the road should be given a medal.

Well according to one local politician, the pedestrian crossing at Dawn Dairies is optimum for this bus stop as GMIT students could do with the exercise*.....

I believe Garda Stations are exempt from regular planning regulations, but I'm not sure if that lets them bypass everything. Someone more knowledgeable than myself might be able to fill us in.

* Looked up the tweet and it wasn't quite the wording on it so don't want to be fake news

ben.schlomo · 11-05-2018 3:43pm

xckjoo wrote: »

ben.schlomo wrote: »

Doughiska isn't, Gmit and Merlin just by 402 and 404 which aren't good enough/efficient.

GMIT must be the most serviced stop in Galway that isn't in Eyre Square! It has the 402, 404 and 409, with the 405 around the corner. I think they're all on 20-30 mins rotations too.

As always, it comes down to the buses sitting in the same traffic as everyone else. The only bus lane between GMIT and Eyre Square finishes at the Bons (which the 404 actually goes around ). Oh and there's that one on Forster Street too. All 100m of it :pac:

409 is the only one of them that gets you to the door in some form of straightforward, quick and regular way though. The 402 is a disaster with it's stop every ten feet throughout Renmore, you'd be quicker getting off at the Connacht and walking the rest of the way. 405 is decent but further away if weather is bad and sometimes services on it go missing.

Mrs OBumble · 11-05-2018 4:21pm

xckjoo wrote: »

How has the 404 changed over the years? I take it a bit these days but wouldn't have prior to a few years ago.

Through routing to Oranmore is great for students living out there.

Now seven days and running from 6am til 11pm roughly speaking. Times are a big improvement for Galway clinic staff and patients.

Full details here: http://news.galwaytransport.info/2016/05/410-cancelled-route-404-newcastle-clinic-oranmore-extension.html

McGiver · 12-05-2018 2:56am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Making apartments a better option for families and couples by increasing the size to a comparable one with those on the continent would go a long way. Nobody wants to live long term in a shoebox

Do you have any evidence for this? I'm from the continent and I don't think apartments here are particularly small. Are you expecting apartments the size of a house?

McGiver · 12-05-2018 3:08am

ben.schlomo wrote: »

409 is the only one of them that gets you to the door in some form of straightforward, quick and regular way though. The 402 is a disaster with it's stop every ten feet throughout Renmore, you'd be quicker getting off at the Connacht and walking the rest of the way. 405 is decent but further away if weather is bad and sometimes services on it go missing.

402 is alright, there 3 stops 250m apart and another 3 roughly 200m. Walking from Connacht definitely isn't faster. That part of Renmore route is used by seniors so it makes sense. The bus doesn't get delayed much in that part of Renmore there is no traffic there (i don't count faffing about with cash/leaps that's a different story). Delays occur on the Dublin Road and Bohermore.

405 is a useless service, buses not turning up at all etc.

ben.schlomo · 12-05-2018 10:50am

McGiver wrote: »

ben.schlomo wrote: »

409 is the only one of them that gets you to the door in some form of straightforward, quick and regular way though. The 402 is a disaster with it's stop every ten feet throughout Renmore, you'd be quicker getting off at the Connacht and walking the rest of the way. 405 is decent but further away if weather is bad and sometimes services on it go missing.

402 is alright, there 3 stops 250m apart and another 3 roughly 200m. Walking from Connacht definitely isn't faster. That part of Renmore route is used by seniors so it makes sense. The bus doesn't get delayed much in that part of Renmore there is no traffic there (i don't count faffing about with cash/leaps that's a different story). Delays occur on the Dublin Road and Bohermore.

405 is a useless service, buses not turning up at all etc.

Definitely isn't a useless service, every twenty minutes, majority do turn up, it's annoying when they don't but use the app and you should know in advance. Works for me when I need it.

Mrs OBumble · 12-05-2018 12:41pm

xckjoo wrote: »

GMIT must be the most serviced stop in Galway that isn't in Eyre Square! It has the 402, 404 and 409, with the 405 around the corner. I think they're all on 20-30 mins rotations too.

As always, it comes down to the buses sitting in the same traffic as everyone else. The only bus lane between GMIT and Eyre Square finishes at the Bons (which the 404 actually goes around ). Oh and there's that one on Forster Street too. All 100m of it :pac:

Despite that, and despite the rubbish facilities, the stop at GMIT is always busy, with lots of people getting on/off.

402 is on a 30 minute rotation in the daytime, 60 at night (yes, during evening classes).

404 is still on 60 minutes.

405 is on 20 mins, but does seem to be the one that BE sacrifice if they need to cut services. However it's still the best option if you're doing to the north end of the campus, or coming thru from Rahoon / Westside.

You may scoff that there are only two patches of bus lane, but the were well chosen: both make journeys quite a bit faster than before they were there. More would be better, but I wouldn't write off the bus service without them.

‘Luas on Wheels’ bus service for Galway

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