Cork developments

who_me

titan18 wrote: »

I always thought it was Peace Park as well. Even if you google Peace Park, it just refers you to Bishop Lucy Park

You're not wrong about Google - nearly all the first pages that come up get it wrong. I can't mock - I used to get it wrong too.

The Peace Park (or what's left of it) is at the junction of South Mall and Grand Parade, with the Great War memorial and the National Monument.

kub

Treehelpplease wrote: »

From Anglesea Street (or at least the gate was). You can still see some of the original buildings

Bang on, the gates and the arches and all the surronding stone work was all relocated from the site of Anglesea Street Garda station when it was being built.

opus

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Wasn’t Bishop Lucey Park previously occupied by a load of buildings which burned down in the 70s and then got turned into a Park? The gates and arch were originally from somewhere down in the docks?

Here's a pic I came across online recently, you can see the buildings that were there. Full pic of the city looking east is attached as well.

RINO87

opus wrote: »

Here's a pic I came across online recently, you can see the buildings that were there. Full pic of the city looking east is attached as well.

Wow, lots to see in that!! Have you a date on the pic, or could anyone care to take a stab at it? I'm not in cork long enough to take a shot!

Mefistofelino

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Wasn’t Bishop Lucey Park previously occupied by a load of buildings which burned down in the 70s and then got turned into a Park? The gates and arch were originally from somewhere down in the docks?

Yup. There was a furniture shop called Sean Jennings, IIRC, that burned down in 1970.

By the mid 70s, the entire site had been cleared back to South Main Street and it there was an archaeological dig there for a few years.

Justin Credible Darts

RINO87 wrote: »

Wow, lots to see in that!! Have you a date on the pic, or could anyone care to take a stab at it? I'm not in cork long enough to take a shot!

the old narrow streets that were where merchants quay is now is visible as is the one on the side of the old roches stores building, so would say 1975 ish,

Flickerfusion

titan18 wrote: »

I'm amazed people go there instead of just walking out to Fitzgeralds park. It's been filthy for at least 20 years by now.

Too far away if you’re in town.

It’s an awfully neglected little space unfortunately and we have literally no other green spaces in the city centre.

Now with all the cafes and so on closed, you really, really notice the lack of anywhere to relax in Cork.

For a city it’s size, it can be more or a concrete jungle than many serious metropolises which actually have lovely parks.

Then quaysides in Cork need to be completely redone as leisure spaces. It’s actually a major downside of this city that it has so little greenery.

Treehelpplease

That street next to Roches Stores is still there (although now cut in half by Merchant's Quay shopping centre), it is just blocked off on Patrick Street by a gate. It's called Merchant Street. I think the street 6 buildings down was called Fish Street

What is especially cool in that picture is the original Washington Street between Grand Parade and S Main Street, where the one story Mannix Culnane is now. I cant wait to see that corner filled in. Some Georgian modern building like the student apartments at the Brewery Quarter would be nice, or if they want to make it different, some Art Deco curves like The Capitol on Patrick Street would look great. Could tie in with the art deco of The Capitl on Grand Parade

whisky_galore

titan18 wrote: »

I always thought it was Peace Park as well. Even if you google Peace Park, it just refers you to Bishop Lucy Park

It's more like a Piss Park.

Mefistofelino

Justin Credible Darts wrote: »

the old narrow streets that were where merchants quay is now is visible as is the one on the side of the old roches stores building, so would say 1975 ish,

I'd imagine it's a good decade earlier. At the East end of the South Mall, on the river side you can see what appears the old Sutton House, which burned down in 1963. The replacement Gardner House was built in 1967. It's hard to tell if the Suton building is intact or just the shell.

The Cork Opera House in the photo is the "new" one, opened in 1963.

Flickerfusion

whisky_galore wrote: »

It's more like a Piss Park.

It’s also not like they have vast amounts of green space to maintain!

The Marina is also another mess. As much as we all go on about how nice the Atlantic Pond is, it really is sad looking in terms of maintenance and just TLC. The marina itself also needs to be repaved and probably lit with some attractive and appropriately soft lighting, although no doubt if the city council did light it it would be some garish modern art lamps.

Shalom Park - it’s a field basically - they make zero effort with it.

There’s a patch of land up at the top of Patrick’s Hill which could be a massively pleasant vista point and a major focus of the city centre, but sure they just mow or like an agricultural field.

They do a reasonable job on Fitzgerald’s Park, but the Bishop Lucy / Peace Park is just ignored the only green space in the city centre and let it rot.

Then we have the Tramore Valley Park (aka the landfill) which hasn’t even got pedestrian or cycle access!!!!??!?! You basically drive into it off a fast moving urban dual carriageway.

I’m sorry for making a comparison to Dublin, but if DCC left Merrion Square or Stephens Green in that condition or built a park with no pedestrian access on the M50 there would be protests!

People need to start holding city councillors to account on these issues - ask questions, pay attention and actually call for changes during the local elections.

We also need to snap out of this notion that everything in Cork is great and being utterly uncritical of the place. It has huge potential but it needs to be driven and that’s not happening.

I would love to see a bit of real urbanism take off here. It’s actually happened in many of the small West Cork towns and there’s no reason the city couldn’t do similar on a much grander scale.

Frostybrew

RINO87 wrote: »

Wow, lots to see in that!! Have you a date on the pic, or could anyone care to take a stab at it? I'm not in cork long enough to take a shot!

I would guess 1963 or 1964. You can see the Opera House under construction in the larger photo. It reopened in 1965.

Also good to see the area where Paul St. car park is now.

Mefistofelino

What struck me about the photo is that even though it is over half a century ago, car parking is starting to fill up the streets -Patrick's Quay, Lavitt's Quay, Fr Matthew Quay and up the middle of Patrick Street.
Since then, we've nearly doubled the population but the national private car stock has increased six-fold.

Flickerfusion

And Ireland is only 38th in terms of cars per capita !

AwaitYourReply

Frostybrew wrote: »

I would guess 1963 or 1964. You can see the Opera House under construction in the larger photo. It reopened in 1965.

Also good to see the area where Paul St. car park is now.

Yeah, much of Browne Street was eventually built over to make way for Paul Street Quinnsworth TESCO Shopping Centre & adjoining Paul St. Multi-Storey Car Park. St. Peter & Pauls' Scout Unit CBSI which serves the Middle Parish was originally based at a premises on Browne Street and then would have transferred to CCYMS Hall on Castle Street by the early 1970's although, Paul Street Shopping Centre/Multi-Story Car Park would not open until around 1985!

On Cornmarket Street (aka Coal Quay) Guy & Company printers would have moved into the former Musgrave's Cash & Carry which is now where TK Maxx, Lidl etc; Guy's previously had a shop on Patrick Street which later became a Bank of Ireland branch close to St. Peter & Paul's Church.

Justin Credible Darts

I remember the cake shop down one of the 2 streets now gone where merchants quay was.
and remember the wire fence that was in bits down the other street nearer to the river, that surrounded later a make shift car park

fonecrusher1

Flickerfusion wrote: »

It’s also not like they have vast amounts of green space to maintain!

The Marina is also another mess. As much as we all go on about how nice the Atlantic Pond is, it really is sad looking in terms of maintenance and just TLC. The marina itself also needs to be repaved and probably lit with some attractive and appropriately soft lighting, although no doubt if the city council did light it it would be some garish modern art lamps.

Shalom Park - it’s a field basically - they make zero effort with it.

There’s a patch of land up at the top of Patrick’s Hill which could be a massively pleasant vista point and a major focus of the city centre, but sure they just mow or like an agricultural field.

They do a reasonable job on Fitzgerald’s Park, but the Bishop Lucy / Peace Park is just ignored the only green space in the city centre and let it rot.

Then we have the Tramore Valley Park (aka the landfill) which hasn’t even got pedestrian or cycle access!!!!??!?! You basically drive into it off a fast moving urban dual carriageway.

I’m sorry for making a comparison to Dublin, but if DCC left Merrion Square or Stephens Green in that condition or built a park with no pedestrian access on the M50 there would be protests!

People need to start holding city councillors to account on these issues - ask questions, pay attention and actually call for changes during the local elections.

We also need to snap out of this notion that everything in Cork is great and being utterly uncritical of the place. It has huge potential but it needs to be driven and that’s not happening.

I would love to see a bit of real urbanism take off here. It’s actually happened in many of the small West Cork towns and there’s no reason the city couldn’t do similar on a much grander scale.

I know its not really in the city at all but the way the Ballincollig Regional Park has been left with a broken weir is another example of how Dublin-centric this country is. Its been like that since 2015 I think. Its an eye sore and poses a risk to visitors.

Of course if it was anywhere near Dublin it would have been sorted a few years ago.

opus

RINO87 wrote: »

Wow, lots to see in that!! Have you a date on the pic, or could anyone care to take a stab at it? I'm not in cork long enough to take a shot!

Pic came from the Old Photos of Cork City & County FB group, well worth keeping an eye on. Don't ever post anything on FB but I keep an eye on that group as some gems pop up there.

The date was around 1960 according to the description. Can't comment personally as a) didn't live in Cork then & b) wasn't born

CHealy

Treehelpplease wrote: »

That street next to Roches Stores is still there (although now cut in half by Merchant's Quay shopping centre), it is just blocked off on Patrick Street by a gate. It's called Merchant Street. I think the street 6 buildings down was called Fish Street

This is great stuff, Iv walked Patrick Street thousands of times and never noticed those gates.

Such a pity that Dunnes Stores building is what replaced these streets.

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.899465,-8.4708488,3a,75y,92.53h,95.56t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1si9KFetfIpQiSu63ZkozJVA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

Captainsatnav

For anyone wishing to support the (albeit crushingly unambitious and pathetic) measures the sorry excuse for a city council are seeking to implement - have at them here before 12pm today: https://consult.corkcity.ie/en/browse

TheChizler

Captainsatnav wrote: »

For anyone wishing to support the (albeit crushingly unambitious and pathetic) measures the sorry excuse for a city council are seeking to implement - have at them here before 12pm today: https://consult.corkcity.ie/en/browse

I threw a submission in there. Broadly supportive I think the one-way system proposed is madness, nobody will follow it. They tried it in the market and it went out the window after a day or two. What happens if they agree and want to change to two-way, hypothetically? Do they restart the consultation?

Seamai

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Wasn’t Bishop Lucey Park previously occupied by a load of buildings which burned down in the 70s and then got turned into a Park? The gates and arch were originally from somewhere down in the docks?

There was a shop called Jennings there till the early 70's and that gate used to be on Anglesea Street, roughly where the fire station is now.

titan18

Flickerfusion wrote: »

Too far away if you’re in town.

It’s an awfully neglected little space unfortunately and we have literally no other green spaces in the city centre.

Now with all the cafes and so on closed, you really, really notice the lack of anywhere to relax in Cork.

For a city it’s size, it can be more or a concrete jungle than many serious metropolises which actually have lovely parks.

Then quaysides in Cork need to be completely redone as leisure spaces. It’s actually a major downside of this city that it has so little greenery.

There's a few places that could be done with easily I think too. Out in front of the Opera House for one. Put grass down there and you've a nice small little area that people can sit out. Get rid of the small little road there too. Just have it grass up to the footpath by Luigi Malones. I'm sure there's others too, but Council will likely never get rid of parking for it.

You'd have to blame a lot of the shop owners there too. There's some very short term thinking between them and the Council. I live 10 minutes walk from the city but unless I'm going in to get something, I'd rarely go in there. I'd rather go to the Lough or walk towards UCC and on to Fitzgeralds park. There's no reason to go in to the City for a lot of people to relax. You go in there as you're looking to go shopping or to a restaurant/bar. If there was more recreational areas in there, you'd have people going in and then they might visit your store/cafe/restaurant etc.

namloc1980

titan18 wrote: »

There's a few places that could be done with easily I think too. Out in front of the Opera House for one. Put grass down there and you've a nice small little area that people can sit out. Get rid of the small little road there too. Just have it grass up to the footpath by Luigi Malones. I'm sure there's others too, but Council will likely never get rid of parking for it.

You'd have to blame a lot of the shop owners there too. There's some very short term thinking between them and the Council. I live 10 minutes walk from the city but unless I'm going in to get something, I'd rarely go in there. I'd rather go to the Lough or walk towards UCC and on to Fitzgeralds park. There's no reason to go in to the City for a lot of people to relax. You go in there as you're looking to go shopping or to a restaurant/bar. If there was more recreational areas in there, you'd have people going in and then they might visit your store/cafe/restaurant etc.

But that's no good for Mary and Jimmy who want to drive in and park outside the door of whatever shop they want to buy in and then drive away home. That's the demographic that many of the traders in the city want and they fight tooth and nail for it. Meanwhile the world over it is proven that implementing measures that attract people into cities is invariably much better for business.

opus

Had to head to work for a few hours this morning so took the opportunity to check on the Square Deal demolition work. Those buildings coming down certainly have that old look about them.

kub

Some positivity in todays Echo, Cork is hailed the 5th overall best city in Europe for economic potential, will this spur on future investment I wonder ?


https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/Cork-city-hailed-fifth-overall-best-city-in-Europe-for-economic-potential-61dc2288-bafa-4c75-a047-46771a8bfcf0-ds

neddynasty

fonecrusher1 wrote: »

I know its not really in the city at all but the way the Ballincollig Regional Park has been left with a broken weir is another example of how Dublin-centric this country is. Its been like that since 2015 I think. Its an eye sore and poses a risk to visitors.

Of course if it was anywhere near Dublin it would have been sorted a few years ago.

I think that's a bit unfair. The weir might be broken but visitors have no business being on the weir. All the weir does is push water into the old canals in the park. Also, there has been a lot of money put into the park in the last 5 years. The park has been extended into the gunpowder site, KMs of extra walking tracks, benches, playground, basketball courts, parking, allotments etc. That work was done by Cork County Council though.

fonecrusher1

neddynasty wrote: »

I think that's a bit unfair. The weir might be broken but visitors have no business being on the weir. All the weir does is push water into the old canals in the park. Also, there has been a lot of money put into the park in the last 5 years. The park has been extended into the gunpowder site, KMs of extra walking tracks, benches, playground, basketball courts, parking, allotments etc. That work was done by Cork County Council though.

As someone who regularly visits the park I can tell you water ways within the park used to really make it special so the broken weir has had a big impact on the park. And the fact is I often see people near the weir so IMO its a potential risk to them regardless as to whether they have any business near it.

I take your point about the excellent new walking lanes and tracks, agreed. But I stand by my own also. If the weir was in Dublin it would have been sorted within a year.

igCorcaigh

On Bishop Lucey Park:

http://www.redfm.ie/news/cork/gardai-arrest-man-following-city-centre-stabbing/

namloc1980

Bishop Lucey Park is an awful hole. Last time I was there, there were junkies shooting up at the back of the park. Wouldn't go near the place after that.