Male carer for toddlers and its impact on kids

kerten

I have a 2.5 years old  daughter who didn't go through potty training yet and atteding to  full time childcare for last 18 months. Today I am told that one of her carers will be male. 
I am not comfortable with this because of the daily message being given to my daughter as it is ok to be touched by male person who is not her father or at least in families social circle at 2 years of age.
I am not concerned about the individual being a pervert or anything like that. My concern is reducing the barrier of accepting requests of strangers on the street for my kid.
When I raised this I am thrown at usual lines below;
- It is discrimination against man and it is a sin in these days so you should back off. 
- Why is it different than female carer changing nappies of a male toddler
- Studies shows having male carers are great for kids personality development
Considering most of the perverts on street attacking young kids(boy or girl) are male, none of the above address my concern about my own kid though. 
It is not possible to measure how vulnerable a kid become to a child abuser on the street due to message given in early ages. But any pro male carer article claims it is perfect for kids because  kids need male role models to learn from. As a father  I prefer lack of  male role model in creche hours over  more vulnerable kid against strangers on the street.
Don't take me as close minded individual resisting change. I am perfectly fine with male carer when kid is over 4years old where she doesn't need support in toilet, etc 
I would like to hear your view on this topic to understand what I can do next other than moving my kid to another creche if current one can't address my concern.

suilegorma

I completely understand your concern as it is relatively uncommon to have a male carer in these situations. But my perspective is that your child will hopefully get consistent care from this person, so in a way it's like a member of the family circle by default if that makes sense? Like I consider the carers in our creche as like aunties (and some uncle's!) to our children. But if you're not comfortable then you could speak to the creche to see if there's an alternative. Hth!

quad_red

You want the creche to remove the male carer from the premises because you think that spending time with a male carer will make your child more vulnerable to roaming child molesters on the street?

It is absolutely reasonable to ensure that the facility has screened staff and to ensure robust child protection measures are adhered to. For extremely young children there should be multiple staff on duty at all times etc. And you should meet the people who will be caring for your child.

However unilaterally demanding a childcare facility remove a carer because their gender bothers you (when you freely admit it has nothing to do with their performance, or capability) isn't reasonable. It's also illegal.

In regards to behaviour on the street - a child under four should never be alone on the street anyway. And there is still plenty of opportunity to discuss boundaries, self protection, what's appropriate etc. with a child before they're four even if they have a male carer.

pwurple

Yes, it is of course discrimination, but discrimination isn't necessarily a bad thing. We all discriminate every day.. what we choose to eat, choose to buy, choose to wear. Humans are discriminating.
I personally would not have a concern with this, as long as I had done the same due diligence with any other carer. Met them myself, had a reasonable relationship with them (spoke to them every drop-off etc), and checked training and background , or trusted the facility to do that. 

I don't think men should be excluded from careers.

I think children really do know the difference between strangers and non-strangers. If you have a genuine concern on that, Santa is a much more concerning concept.

iamwhoiam

It is really up to you to teach a child who is a trusted person and who is not ? What if she was sick and a male nurse or doctor had to examine her ? What if she needed physio from a male ? To be honest a child should not be shielded from males but thought that some males that mammy and daddy knows and mammy and daddy is ok with are in her life .

Dozyart

i think you should move your child to a different creche,not for your or your childs benefit but for the male carer who would have to put up with this type of crap!

punisher5112

Not all men are child molesting rapists.....

Wow op very narrow minded.

Hitman3000

As suggested by another poster, bring your child to a different creche. The male carer does not need to deal with your issues, the responsibilities he have is enough without dealing with discrimination.

spurious

Your child is far more at risk from close family members than a trained worker in a creche. The benefits of her seeing and experiencing a man interacting with children in what is (obviously still for some people) seen as a woman's job far outweigh any negatives.

I'm disappointed people still feel like this about people doing jobs which 'belong' to the other gender.

uberwolf

The other posters have tried to deal with your concern, and I'm on the same page - you are completely in the wrong on this.

But consider the other message you're giving your daughter. That our genders determine our roles in life.

kerten

quad_red wrote: »

You want the creche to remove the male carer from the premises because you think that spending time with a male carer will make your child more vulnerable to roaming child molesters on the street?

No. I am fine with a male carer as long as he doesn't involve toilet support/nappy change activities of my kid which means reassignment to classes with older kids than 2 years old.

This is not a male carer bashing thread. I am trying to share my concern as a father and get perspective of others in similar situation of mine.

quad_red

kerten wrote: »

No. I am fine with a male carer as long as he doesn't involve toilet support/nappy change activities of my kid which means reassignment to classes with older kids than 2 years old.

This is not a male carer bashing thread. I am trying to share my concern as a father and get perspective of others in similar situation of mine.

You're suggesting that you should have the right to veto what duties this person is trusted with purely based on their gender irrespective of their training, experience, vetting, personality, capabilities etc.

Your tone is respectful but with all due respect - what you're asking for isn't.

If the childcare facility has *any* reservations about this staff member then they should not be there. You should consider perhaps that based purely on their gender this person has likely had a much higher level of scrutiny and screening anyway.

But either way - you're placing a requirement on the creche that they cannot reasonably or legally adhere to.

kerten

pwurple wrote: »

Yes, it is of course discrimination, but discrimination isn't necessarily a bad thing. We all discriminate every day.. what we choose to eat, choose to buy, choose to wear. Humans are discriminating.
I personally would not have a concern with this, as long as I had done the same due diligence with any other carer. Met them myself, had a reasonable relationship with them (spoke to them every drop-off etc), and checked training and background , or trusted the facility to do that. 

I don't think men should be excluded from careers.

I think children really do know the difference between strangers and non-strangers. If you have a genuine concern on that, Santa is a much more concerning concept.

I agree with you mostly and again my concern is not about carer himself is being a potential pervert or anything. To me such risk exist for any carer male or female and impossible to eliminate %100 regardless of how much screening/vetting done. So one has to rely on due diligence of other carers and parents themselves.

Regarding difference between strangers and non-strangers, I really don't know how it will shape up. This is my first kid so I can't really say such change introduced into her development is going to impact negatively or not.

For this case it is not just possible say it is ok or not because it is not possible to measure risk of being molested/abused until such thing happens.

draiochtanois

This post has been deleted.

Sleepy

How about if one of the carers is Jewish? Muslim? Black?

Your beliefs are sexist and you should have a long hard look at them.

silverharp

kerten wrote: »

Considering most of the perverts on street attacking young kids(boy or girl) are male, none of the above address my concern about my own kid though. 

I don't get this concern, do you plan to let your daughter walk the streets as a 2 or 3 year old?

kerten

iamwhoiam wrote: »

It is really up to you to teach a child who is a trusted person and who is not ? What if she was sick and a male nurse or doctor had to examine her ? What if she needed physio from a male ? To be honest a child should not be shielded from males but thought that some males that mammy and daddy knows and mammy and daddy is ok with are in her life .

Are you comparing a doctor/nurse checking your kid once every 2-3 months while you are next to him/her to a carer changing her nappies in separate changing room 2-3 times a day ?

I am not shielding my child from males, but I need to teach her boundaries, privacy, what is ok what is not as a parent.

I guess we can all agree that parenting is exact science and driven by parent's personality, experience and instincts. So I don't claim my way is the only right way and I am open to see other people's ways to educate myself.

That said, "You can't discriminate against X because it is too bad for society" is not something helps on this topic as it is not my ultimate goal to discriminate X,Y,Z for fun in these days.

It is a geniuine parenting concern I am having and I am open to any argument that would help me to address this concern.

kerten

punisher5112 wrote: »

Not all men are child molesting rapists.....

Wow op very narrow minded.

Where did I say that ?

Wheety

What stories are you reading about roving male molesters walking the streets looking for kids who trust them because they had their nappy changed by another male when they were younger? Also seems that these kids aren't with their parents at the time the molester happens upon them.

bigpink

Change crèche I’d say if it’s gonna cause a problem

super_furry

Change creche, although if I was the creche owner, I'd tell you that I didn't want you as a customer.

kerten

Dozyart wrote: »

i think you should move your child to a different creche,not for your or your childs benefit but for the male carer who would have to put up with this type of crap!

How do you confirm that my concern is not a valid one ? I mean I am obviously missing something you see.

And please something other than X has every right as much as Y to do Z.

vicwatson

Time to get rid of male nurses?

Nuns (The sisters of Nazereth) emotionally and sexually abused 100s of children as little as 50 years ago.

If you think your child is any less safe with a man you are sorely mistaken.

super_furry

kerten wrote: »

How do you confirm that my concern is not a valid one ? I mean I am obviously missing something you see.

And please something other than X has every right as much as Y to do Z.

You concern is born of nothing factual and seems to be hysterical nonsense to me, an outside observer. Particularly when you somehow believe that having a male carer change a nappy will lead to your child being sexually assaulted at some time in the future by someone else.

mloc123

It is okay for a woman to change a boys nappy... but not a man to change a girls nappy? Why?

Wheety

kerten wrote: »

How do you confirm that my concern is not a valid one ? I mean I am obviously missing something you see.

And please something other than X has every right as much as Y to do Z.

So you're asking for someone to come up with a rational explanation why your irrational fear is not valid? Plus they have to use specifics in their argument and can't just say the male has every right to be in this field?

Also, you say he's one of her carers? Maybe the creche already have a guideline on this?

kerten

silverharp wrote: »

I don't get this concern, do you plan to let your daughter walk the streets as a 2 or 3 year old?

No I don't. But risk here is not going to disappear when kids hits 4 years old.

When your kids starts going to school, after school care, summer camps, etc. they are still vulnerable to abuse/molesting. I understand Ireland is a safe country in general but my concern is the one of the main reasons that you don't let your kids out of your sight as much as you can No ?

TheBoyConor

Op you are talking out of your arse talking about a male carer confusing your child and putting them at risk of strangers on the street. - why would a child even be on the street without a parent?

And random strangers molesting children is actually very rare - the vast majority of child abuse occurs within the family home by family or extended family. That is well established knowledge. Yet you say only family males should be doing this kind of care for a child!!!! So you are saying that a child should only have this kind of care from those males that are statistically most likely to sexually abuse them.
That is what your argument amounts to. You totally are contracticting yourself.

Not to mention that what you are also suggesting is blantant discrimination and also would be totally illegal and the creche could be heavily fined if they honoured your request.

What do you think of women being engineers? Do you object to that?

bertsmom

Op just teach your own child what is and what isn't acceptable, her boundaries and privacy. That is your job!
Hopefully she may not grow up to be as sexist as you are if she has another male carer in her life. I pity the creche that has to deal with you and your ridiculous demands.

kerten

vicwatson wrote: »

Time to get rid of male nurses?

I tried to answer thay with a doctors/nurses vs daily carer above.