Landlord refusing to give extra key

jamesbondings

godtabh wrote: »

It matters because more people mean more wear and tear

Which is covered by a deposit.... None of the landlords business......

godtabh

jamesbondings wrote: »

Which is covered by a deposit.... None of the landlords business......

wear and tear for 2 people not 3 people

jamesbondings

godtabh wrote: »

wear and tear for 2 people not 3 people

Does it say 2 people only in his lease? A deposit will cover any wear and tear.... 2 3 or 20 people the tenant is responsible for that

beauf

beauf wrote: »

...It's probably just company policy from a "professional" letting company....

...your problem will be finding someone in it who treats you as a person not number on a spreadsheet...

Isnt this what lots of people here have been praising?, getting rid of the "amateur" landlords and making them all large professional organisations.

Well this sounds like one of the side effects.

sunnysoutheast

....... wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

It's not really asking for a "spare" set though is it? There are two sets of keys (and probably more importantly secure key fobs to the building/car park), one for each named tenant. What they are asking for is another set so they can move someone else in. To any decent management agency this would be a massive red flag that there is subletting going on.

When I rented apartments in the UK with key fobs etc. I got one non-copyable set only and there was a 24hr number to call if you were locked out.

K.Flyer

jamesbondings wrote: »

Which is covered by a deposit.... None of the landlords business......

Its very much his business, its his property. He has every right to dictate what happens with his property, or to delegate those decisions to the letting agency.

sunnysoutheast

Eric Cartman wrote: »

funnily enough that happens a lot. Landlords are getting waayyy stricter on this due to a lot of incidents where they rent a 1 bed apartment to a couple and return a few months later to find 8 Brazilians living there in bunk beds.

Im not picking on Brazilians, but those students really do not care where they live, they will pile in to any amount of space.

The curse of "Rent to let".

I rented a place in the West End in London and somebody had a 2-bed apartment sub-let to a group of Koreans. As there were no extra keys to the building allowed they'd try to tailgate in or block/break the outer access door. Absolute PIA but the agents got rid of them soon enough.

jamesbondings

K.Flyer wrote: »

Its very much his business, its his property. He has every right to dictate what happens with his property, or to delegate those decisions to the letting agency.

Pretty sure that outside of the letting agreement he has 0 say. Tenants have rights too which might seem crazy....

davo10

jamesbondings wrote: »

Pretty sure that outside of the letting agreement he has 0 say. Tenants have rights too which might seem crazy....

Can you provide a link which confirms the right of a tenant to move in another adult rent free when their lease prohibits it?

The LL can refuse to allow assignment of a lease, but hell the tenant can move as many non paying ones in as he/she wants?,

jamesbondings

davo10 wrote: »

Can you provide a link which confirms the right of a tenant to move in another adult rent free when their lease prohibits it?

The LL can refuse to allow assignment of a lease, but hell the tenant can move as many non paying ones in as he/she wants?,

I cannot. But that's because you are reading only what you want to read...... HIS LEASE DOES NOT PROHIBIT IT....... he can fill it to capacity which in this case is 4.....common sense out the window with you?

davo10

jamesbondings wrote: »

I cannot. But that's because you are reading only what you want to read...... HIS LEASE DOES NOT PROHIBIT IT....... he can fill it to capacity which in this case is 4.....common sense out the window with you?

I thought it said the lease holders plus their dependents? There are two lease holders, and I'm pretty sure an adult who is not a cohabitant is not a dependent.

jamesbondings

Read the thread again

CeilingFly

What you could try is to bring a copy of your lease + copy of utility bill and photo id to a locksmiths and ask them to make a copy based on that.

Preferably get a female to go in, claim she lost her set and is "getting grief from himself cos apartment owners will charge €100" - might work

McGrath5

Serious goal post movement going on from the tenant here.

The landlord would of vetted the 2 tenants who signed the lease originally and issued a lease based these 2 individuals only living in the apartment. To come along and start demanding extra sets of keys & fobs for strangers is way out of order.

jamesbondings

McGrath5 wrote: »

Serious goal post movement going on from the tenant here.

The landlord would of vetted the 2 tenants who signed the lease originally and issued a lease based these 2 individuals only living in the apartment. To come along and start demanding extra sets of keys & fobs for strangers is way out of order.

Can one not ask for an extra set? All the landlord needs to worry about is the rent being paid on time and the place being kept well. It is not up to him who the bill payer has over (so long as no subletting going on). Good God the amount of landlords in here.

Landlords own the property in name ONLY when there is a tenant in situ. If I want to put a jacuzzi in the kitchen I can. So long as when I leave the house is back to its original state when I leave.....

_Brian

Perhaps you could offer to pay for the additional keys, after all it’s you who needs them.

Amalgam

jamesbondings wrote: »

I cannot. But that's because you are reading only what you want to read...... HIS LEASE DOES NOT PROHIBIT IT....... he can fill it to capacity which in this case is 4.....common sense out the window with you?

Pot.. Kettle.

As long as the people are named on the lease. You will never accept other posts on this thread. The lease has legal weight, you know that, but that doesn't line up well with you. The Landlord is *always* at fault..

KP81

Air bnb place I stayed at left the key inside a security box inside the post box in the lobby. They gave a code to acces box & door key. Not sure if you need fob to access lobby but similar solution could work for fob too.

jamesbondings

Amalgam wrote: »

Pot.. Kettle.

As long as the people are named on the lease. You will never accept other posts on this thread. The lease has legal weight, you know that, but that doesn't line up well with you. The Landlord is *always* at fault..

If his lease specifies it of course! But as his lease does NOT specify anything in particular and actually does say it can be filled to capacity ie 4 he can't? Why would his lease have 2 names specified and then the same document say he can have up to 4 people living there?

beauf

awec wrote: »

....Anyway, the OP doesn't want a spare set. They want their house guest to be given building access and a set of keys to their apartment for a number of months.

.... months and months....

hawkelady

jamesbondings wrote: »

McGrath5 wrote: »

Serious goal post movement going on from the tenant here.

The landlord would of vetted the 2 tenants who signed the lease originally and issued a lease based these 2 individuals only living in the apartment. To come along and start demanding extra sets of keys & fobs for strangers is way out of order.

Can one not ask for an extra set? All the landlord needs to worry about is the rent being paid on time and the place being kept well. It is not up to him who the bill payer has over (so long as no subletting going on). Good God the amount of landlords in here.

Landlords own the property in name ONLY when there is a tenant in situ. If I want to put a jacuzzi in the kitchen I can. So long as when I leave the house is back to its original state when I leave.....

You have no clue.. short answer is no you can't .. have you ever read a contract ?? If this is your attitude I hope and pray you never rent s place as I would feel sorry for your landlord.
But yeah, go ahead and put a jacuzzi in !! Your attitude is one of bizarre

Jaysci20

This is nothing to do with the landlord. I'd actually be pi$$ed off if I had a property and a tenant bothering over a completely nonsense issue like this.

LionelNashe

It's over 10 years since I rented; had three landlords at different times. I never heard of a landlord having to put all the occupants on the lease. The arrangements that I was familiar with would involve 1 person signing the lease and being on the hook legally for the tenancy, and if one tenant left then the tenants themselves would get a replacement tenant to move in. The landlord wouldn't necessarily know or care when this happened, as long as the place wasn't overcrowded. This idea that the landlord has to be satisfied with income of all the tenants sounds crazy to me and very unnecessary.

the_syco

jamesbondings wrote: »

It is not up to him who the bill payer has over (so long as no subletting going on).

Main reason a tenant would want another key would be subletting.

beauf

LionelNashe wrote: »

It's over 10 years since I rented; had three landlords at different times. I never heard of a landlord having to put all the occupants on the lease. The arrangements that I was familiar with would involve 1 person signing the lease and being on the hook legally for the tenancy, and if one tenant left then the tenants themselves would get a replacement tenant to move in. The landlord wouldn't necessarily know or care when this happened, as long as the place wasn't overcrowded. This idea that the landlord has to be satisfied with income of all the tenants sounds crazy to me and very unnecessary.

10yrs ago it didn't take years and potentially losses of tens of thousands to evict people.

You also now have a rent assistant schemes that require the landlord to lend the tenant or the govt a month's rent in arrears. More if they miss rent or do damage as it's unrecoverable.

The landlord is also funding a tenant protection agency that fines landlords thousands but has no means to recover debts owed to a landlord.

You also have the worst housing crisis in the history of the state. Especially in social and private rental market.

There were problems 10yrs ago too. It wasn't a golden era of housing for tenants or landlords then either.

yer man!

I had to get an extra key and fob from my property management company. Had to pay a deposit of €50 so that I would return the fob. We wanted an extra key so someone could check the apartment if we were on holidays, Landlord had no issue with this. It was a two bed apartment and we then had a total of three keys and fobs.

Gumbo

yer man! wrote: »

I had to get an extra key and fob from my property management company. Had to pay a deposit of €50 so that I would return the fob. We wanted an extra key so someone could check the apartment if we were on holidays, Landlord had no issue with this. It was a two bed apartment and we then had a total of three keys and fobs.

Was the landlord a person you could call and tak to or a large IRES property management company like the OP?

hawkelady

yer man! wrote: »

I had to get an extra key and fob from my property management company. Had to pay a deposit of €50 so that I would return the fob. We wanted an extra key so someone could check the apartment if we were on holidays, Landlord had no issue with this. It was a two bed apartment and we then had a total of three keys and fobs.

Why couldn't you just leave one of your keys with you friend ? Did you really need two sets of keys whilst away on holidays?
Going off on tangent I know , but I'm genuinely interested to know why you needed to spend money on a third key

McGrath5

jamesbondings wrote: »

Can one not ask for an extra set? All the landlord needs to worry about is the rent being paid on time and the place being kept well. It is not up to him who the bill payer has over (so long as no subletting going on). Good God the amount of landlords in here.

Having friends and family over is entirely different than demanding extra sets of keys & fobs for somebody who is not named on the lease.

j8wk2feszrnpao

godtabh wrote: »

wear and tear for 2 people not 3 people

If one person moved out (leaving just 1 in the premises) would the landlord then drop the price due to less wear and tear?

McGrath5 wrote: »

Having friends and family over is entirely different than demanding extra sets of keys & fobs for somebody who is not named on the lease.

So the answer is to add their name to the lease, provide the keys and fob (whatever that costs), and issue resolved?

Subcomandante Marcos

OP, your letting agency sound like completely unreasonable arseholes.

endacl wrote: »

Keyfobs and security keys are quite expensive to duplicate. Perhaps your landlord is just tight?

No, they're not. They cost bigger all. You can get any RFID fob copied in seconds. There's a place beside the Olympia who do for about a tenner a pop for the general public.

godtabh

munstermagic11 wrote: »

If one person moved out (leaving just 1 in the premises) would the landlord then drop the price due to less wear and tear?

No because you signed a lease for 2 people. Not one person or 3 people. If you change the status quo the landlord doesnt have to agree to it.

The OP has a lease with 2 named persons on it. He wants to change that. Not the landlords concern and doesnt have to agree to it.

McGrath5

munstermagic11 wrote: »

So the answer is to add their name to the lease, provide the keys and fob (whatever that costs), and issue resolved?

Why would the landlord agree to this? They let the apartment with 2 tenants on the lease, presumably that was their prerogative at the time.
It is totally unreasonable for the tenants to demand an extra name added to the lease after it has been signed, and everything that is entailed with it ie wear and tear etc.

godtabh

munstermagic11 wrote: »

So the answer is to add their name to the lease, provide the keys and fob (whatever that costs), and issue resolved?

The landlord doesnt have to agree to this and its clear they wont. Again though **** to the OP.

j8wk2feszrnpao

McGrath5 wrote: »

Why would the landlord agree to this? They let the apartment with 2 tenants on the lease, presumably that was their prerogative at the time.
It is totally unreasonable for the tenants to demand an extra name added to the lease after it has been signed, and everything that is entailed with it ie wear and tear etc.

Why is it unreasonable to have an extra person added to the lease?
It's their prerogative not to agree, but what' the big deal with adding that person to the lease?

awec

Read the OP again folks, the landlord had no problem adding them to the lease but the new tenant was unable to prove they had a source of income and so could not be added to the lease in the end.

_Brian

Jaysci20 wrote: »

This is nothing to do with the landlord. I'd actually be pi$$ed off if I had a property and a tenant bothering over a completely nonsense issue like this.

My tenant rang one day to know would it be ok to give away the spare curtains for the house, her brother moved into a flat and was looking for some. Got a bit miffed when I said no.

awec

jamesbondings wrote: »

If his lease specifies it of course! But as his lease does NOT specify anything in particular and actually does say it can be filled to capacity ie 4 he can't? Why would his lease have 2 names specified and then the same document say he can have up to 4 people living there?

His lease does not say that at all.

j8wk2feszrnpao

awec wrote: »

Read the OP again folks, the landlord had no problem adding them to the lease but the new tenant was unable to prove they had a source of income and so could not be added to the lease in the end.

I saw that earlier, but genuine question, could the landlord not waive that?
i.e. in this case it's a family member, a student with upcoming exams, ..... maybe landlord can call over once a month to ensure it's all ok etc.....
A comprise agreement between them.
Again, no onus on the landlord, but given the lease is 'Should not exceed the sleeping capacity of the apartment' and they are adding one; seems not to be that big a deal.

Lantus

A good landlord won't entertain this nonsense, sorry op. If it were me I would replace both keys with two new keys.

The sister needs to adapt her lifestyle to suit you. I didn't have a difficulty with spending every day in college in class or study area or library from 8am to 6pm every day.

If it's for a very short time period she can like it or lump it.

runawaybishop

munstermagic11 wrote: »

I saw that earlier, but genuine question, could the landlord not waive that?
i.e. in this case it's a family member, a student with upcoming exams, ..... maybe landlord can call over once a month to ensure it's all ok etc.....
A comprise agreement between them.
Again, no onus on the landlord, but given the lease is 'Should not exceed the sleeping capacity of the apartment' and they are adding one; seems not to be that big a deal.

Waive the requirement to show you can pay the rent, not much chance of that. The OP just needs to accept they wont get another key and deal with it, its not the end of the world.

yer man!

hawkelady wrote: »

Why couldn't you just leave one of your keys with you friend ? Did you really need two sets of keys whilst away on holidays?
Going off on tangent I know , but I'm genuinely interested to know why you needed to spend money on a third key

Other housemate was away over Christmas, so was I, apartment empty for 2-3 weeks. Would both be arriving back late at night so needed keys to get back into the property.

yer man!

kceire wrote: »

Was the landlord a person you could call and tak to or a large IRES property management company like the OP?

Large property company that owned half the street in the middle of the city. Building is designated a manager who you email personally.

j8wk2feszrnpao

runawaybishop wrote: »

Waive the requirement to show you can pay the rent, not much chance of that. The OP just needs to accept they wont get another key and deal with it, its not the end of the world.

It's hardly the end of the World on the landlords side either.
Ask for rent up front if that's an issue.
OP may just work out the key situation and there'll be 3 people there anyway.

RHJ

This post has been deleted.

runawaybishop

munstermagic11 wrote: »

It's hardly the end of the World on the landlords side either.
Ask for rent up front if that's an issue.
OP may just work out the key situation and there'll be 3 people there anyway.

I don't see why any LL would want to put someone on the lease who cannot pay rent or damages, how would they pursue someone that has no money?

OP needs to just sort out the 2 keys amongst the 3 of them like an adult.

j8wk2feszrnpao

runawaybishop wrote: »

I don't see why any LL would want to put someone on the lease who cannot pay rent or damages, how would they pursue someone that has no money?

Payment in advance? A binding agreement that the other are responsible for any damage (which they probably are anyway)? I don't know, just co-operation between the two parties.

runawaybishop wrote: »

OP needs to just sort out the 2 keys amongst the 3 of them like an adult.

They explained the difficulties. But if they do work it out, then they'll have the extra person there anyway.

runawaybishop

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Payment in advance? A binding agreement that the other are responsible for any damage (which they probably are anyway)? I don't know, just co-operation between the two parties.

Sounds like a lot of hassle for the LL to arrange a new lease so someone that isn't paying rent can get a key. Then they have someone on the lease that they cannot persue if anything happens as they have no money. Whats in it for the LL here?

munstermagic11 wrote: »

They explained the difficulties. But if they do work it out, then they'll have the extra person there anyway.

What difficulties? The guest can only access the house during set times. Not really that hard to work around tbh.

j8wk2feszrnpao

runawaybishop wrote: »

Sounds like a lot of hassle for the LL to arrange a new lease so someone that isn't paying rent can get a key. Then they have someone on the lease that they cannot persue if anything happens as they have no money. Whats in it for the LL here?

They could just give the key without the other hassle and take the advance payment? It's up to them. Courtesy, a favour, co-operations with tenants.... I'm not saying the landlord has to, it's up to them. If the person is going to be staying there (should they work out using the 2 keys), then better that landlord meets them, knows them, and has some knowledge if it happens anyway.

runawaybishop wrote: »

What difficulties?

The ones described by the OP.

Doop

This thread is hilarious, a bit of flexibility goes a long way.. the rent is getting paid...
OP short of saying you lost a set of keys as mentioned earlier get a lock box and try find somewhere discreet to install it


https://www.ie.screwfix.com/master-lock-8-key-combination-key-safe.html?utm_source=Google&utm_medium=CPC&utm_campaign=Shopping&gclid=Cj0KCQjw_ODWBRCTARIsAE2_EvV7YfW_UFmtRVud50QX_zJiBGX5LR1QHg9bAHILD_mg87ZaRuG5MQEaAnGzEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds