How to find appropriate accommodation?

cinnamony

Hi All,

I'm giving my LL notice soon as I have to move out due to work. I'm a licensee and have been stuck in licensee arrangements due to not having previous LL references and also because tenants in other places are typically in the late 20's - early 30's and want people the same age (I'm in my early 20's).

Despite being so young I am already doing very well in my career and have recently landed an amazing job with a huge company. For my role I had to go through a variety of security checks that took over a month to complete.

When I move out I'd like to have a proper landlord, the reasons are:

-The possibility of being asked to leave at any time for no reason makes me extremely anxious.
-All owner occupiers I have lived with have been extremely disrespectful. Not cleaning up or washing dishes thus forcing me to clean for them in order to be able to do my things. Loud music/banging doors etc.. Very late at night (I have to wake up early every morning but they dont). Leaving electric ovens etc on all night. Not turning off lights etc etc... Of course I have no choice but to put up with this.
-Too much control over my life. For example, asking me to leave for the weekend without notice. Not allowing me to eat certain foods (eg fish due to smell). Not allowing guests, I'm not a party person but would like to just spend some time with my best friend watching Netflix etc every once in a while..

On top of this I suffer from severe OCD and the uncleaniness/disrespect really gets to me as it impacts my daily routine unexpectedly. I always clean up after I do something but I don't mind for example people forgetting to wash something or whatever. I am talking about letting the dirt pile up until I clean it.

I was wondering if a reference from my employer stating i gone through background checks and what they are would be sufficient for a landlord? What else can I do?

dennyk

It's really up to the landlord; they want a tenant who will pay their rent on time every month, won't cause trouble for the neighbors, and won't overhold and will leave the place spotless when it's time to leave, and with the current market landlords have plenty of applicants to choose from. If you can prove steady employment and show you have the funds to easily support yourself via bank statements or whatnot, that'll make you look better in a landlord's eyes. A letter from your employer saying you passed background checks, if you can even obtain such a thing (your employer may not be willing to provide that, as they aren't in the business of verifying such things themselves and there could potentially be data protection issues at play), might help, but maybe not much depending on what the background checks in question were; it certainly wouldn't hurt, though, so it's worth a shot.

More useful might be a reference from your current "landlord"; even if you're a licensee and it might not carry as much weight as a landlord from a registered tenancy, your host could at least verify your history of paying rent on time and not causing trouble.

davo10

Given you lack of track record/reference, and the sheer number of applicants for rental properties, you are going to have to make yourself as appealing as possible. Another applicant with similar funds and a reference will be more appealing to the LL. You may have to offer to pay more, or offer 3-6 months rent in advance.

cinnamony

davo10 wrote: »

You may have to offer to pay more, or offer 3-6 months rent in advance.

I'm young, but I wasn't born yesterday. Some Landlords are already robbing the people blind as it is. I will not pay more than a months deposit for a rental. Period.

DubCount

cinnamony wrote: »

I'm young, but I wasn't born yesterday. Some Landlords are already robbing the people blind as it is. I will not pay more than a months deposit for a rental. Period.

I dont think you will find many people who are happy with the current state of the rental market. There should be more properties available to rent, lower prices and better standards. However, we are where we are. Landlords will have a long line of potential tenants for any property being let in an urban area. You need to have something to beat the competition. A bigger deposit, better references, a bigger bank balance on your bank statement - something to make a LL want you in stead of the other 20 applicants the LL could pick.

You may want to make a stand that its against your principles to pay more than 1 months deposit. Its a stand you may be making from outside the property while someone else is moving in.

cinnamony

DubCount wrote: »

I dont think you will find many people who are happy with the current state of the rental market. There should be more properties available to rent, lower prices and better standards. However, we are where we are. Landlords will have a long line of potential tenants for any property being let in an urban area. You need to have something to beat the competition. A bigger deposit, better references, a bigger bank balance on your bank statement - something to make a LL want you in stead of the other 20 applicants the LL could pick.

You may want to make a stand that its against your principles to pay more than 1 months deposit. Its a stand you may be making from outside the property while someone else is moving in.

Don't get me wrong, I know how terrible the rental market is. But the more people who allow themselves to be treated like this the more it becomes acceptable.

A landlord reference is easy to falsify, I am simply choosing to be honest because I prefer to be that way.

I can provide a reference from my employer who are a well known company stating that I work for them and that as part of the recruitment process I had to go through background checks. As a matter of fact I had to sign a letter stating any refusal to go through these checks or if anything at all was picked up during then my offer would be dropped, it wasnt simple routine checks.

I can further provide bank statements showing I paid the rent on time and further I can provide my agreement with my current "landlord" that also states the amount of rent to be paid and when it is to be paid every month.

Offering to pay more than a month's deposit and more rent in an already inflated market? Won't do. If the other viewers wish to do so its their choice I don't care.

cinnamony

cinnamony wrote:

I'm young, but I wasn't born yesterday. Some Landlords are already robbing the people blind as it is. I will not pay more than a months deposit for a rental. Period.

cinnamony wrote:

Offering to pay more than a month's deposit and more rent in an already inflated market? Won't do. If the other viewers wish to do so its their choice I don't care.

You won't get a place with that attitude. I know if I was a landlord and someone came with the air of arrogance and entitlement that you are giving off (perhaps unintentional but it's definitely there), I would immediately pass on you as a tenant.

irelandrover

Why is a one month deposit the line in the sand? It can take several months for a landlord to get out a non-paying tenant. It makes sense that they protect themselves against that.

cinnamony

[Deleted User] wrote: »

You won't get a place with that attitude. I know if I was a landlord and someone came with the air of arrogance and entitlement that you are giving off (perhaps unintentional but it's definitely there), I would immediately pass on you as a tenant.

If I went to view a place and the landlord asked me to pay thousands as a deposit for a piece of paper that I could have faked, I would not want them as a landlord. If standing up for myself against this kind of attitude is "entitlement and arrogance" then good. Thank you for the compliment and have a nice day.

irelandrover wrote: »

Why is a one month deposit the line in the sand? It can take several months for a landlord to get out a non-paying tenant. It makes sense that they protect themselves against that.

During Christmas my former landlord asked me to move out so he could sell the house. I moved out by the agreed date and he told me he'd put the deposit in my account within the end of the week. I left trusting that he would and he didn't and claimed I never gave him notice. I've been in a court case with him ever since even though I provided the court with solid proof and he didn't have a single shred of evidence for his claims. Should I start telling landlords I won't pay them a deposit? It works both ways. With the current cost of renting even a months deposit is much more than many people's wages.

Browney7

OP, ask the company if they can place an advert on the internal staff message board for you - if it's a big company they probably have a electronic message board/buy and sell equivalent. Someone might have a one bedroom apartment they may be looking to let out or else know someone.

I assume you are being once bitten twice shy regarding the licensee arrangement but you shouldn't discount this option totally - you are more aware of the potential stroke a licensee landlord could try pull and you would in future refuse to leave a room until you've any money that is owed to you in cash.

messy tessy

irelandrover wrote: »

Why is a one month deposit the line in the sand? It can take several months for a landlord to get out a non-paying tenant. It makes sense that they protect themselves against that.

I have been in rented accommodation for 7 years, can provide references for each year, along with work references. If a landlord asked me for a couple of months as a deposit upfront it would make me question why they needed the additional money, and why they felt a work reference wasn't enough. This is not the norm and would actually make me reluctant to take a place like that.

I don't get why the OP is being accused of being entitled or arrogant, for expecting a reference and deposit to be enough.

DubCount

OP. You seem to believe your work reference should be sufficient for any landlord, and that no landlord should be entitled to seek anything more compelling from a potential tenant. Perhaps you are right. Personally I don't believe its as perfect as you believe. For a start, you appear to be a new employee at this company, and are unlikely to have completed your probationary period. That is a negative, not a positive.

Its hard to describe the choice presented to a landlord. Typically a landlord is confronted with lots of interested tenants, many with excellent track records, many working for good companies. More than likely, there will be multiple interested parties that would very likely make ideal tenants. Anything you can do to appeal to a Landlord may help you win the race, and should not be ruled out.

Sorry to hear you had problems recovering your last deposit. Not all landlords are the same, and many will be more trustworthy. Good luck with your search.

cinnamony

Browney7 wrote: »

OP, ask the company if they can place an advert on the internal staff message board for you - if it's a big company they probably have a electronic message board/buy and sell equivalent. Someone might have a one bedroom apartment they may be looking to let out or else know someone.

I assume you are being once bitten twice shy regarding the licensee arrangement but you shouldn't discount this option totally - you are more aware of the potential stroke a licensee landlord could try pull and you would in future refuse to leave a room until you've any money that is owed to you in cash.

Thanks! I'll speak to Management/HR about this. To be fair I haven't completely written it off because sharing has its potential downfalls too (like the other tenants breaking their lease), the thing I don't like about it is paying market rent but having no protection. It feels like Ireland just can't do anything correctly, the laws either side too much with one side or the other. No balance whatsoever.

Paying a deposit is a given, but I can't justify paying more than a month to someone who may not give it back.

DubCount wrote: »

OP. You seem to believe your work reference should be sufficient for any landlord, and that no landlord should be entitled to seek anything more compelling from a potential tenant. Perhaps you are right. Personally I don't believe its as perfect as you believe

Not at all. I have said in the thread before that I can provide bank statements as well, I also have to put my trust in the Landlord its not just the other way around yet I don't have the right to ask them for anything to prove they are truthworthy. Its an agreement where both parties are at risk, unfortunately it is what it is.

DubCount

messy tessy wrote: »

I don't get why the OP is being accused of being entitled or arrogant, for expecting a reference and deposit to be enough.

Perhaps that is more to do with how things are said, than what things are said. Period.

cinnamony

DubCount wrote: »

Perhaps that is more to do with how things are said, than what things are said. Period.

Its because you don't like the fact not everyone is up to being robbed and you know it. A deposit is fine, asking for someone's entire savings or wages for properties that are often under standard isn't. Cop on you are starting to sound like a snow flake.

McCrack

OP you're coming across pretty poor here

If you reflect that in your real life encounters you will lose out

DubCount

cinnamony wrote: »

Its because you don't like the fact not everyone is up to being robbed and you know it. A deposit is fine, asking for someone's entire savings or wages for properties that are often under standard isn't. Cop on you are starting to sound like a snow flake.

Mike3549

OP nobody is robbing you, deposit plus 1st and last months rent is quite a popular thing at the moment in RPZ. Dont mix licency with tennancy. When you rented a room, you were a licensee, you had no rights. If you rent the whole place - you are a tennant, you are protected, a landlord cannot keep your deposit for no reason.
In a current rental situation i would recommend you to stick with sharing.

Graham

cinnamony wrote: »

I'm young, but I wasn't born yesterday. Some Landlords are already robbing the people blind as it is. I will not pay more than a months deposit for a rental. Period.

OP, unfortunately in many parts of the country the market is not your side.

You can of course stick to your guns and refuse to budge but if you're competing with potential tenants who do have previous landlords references and who are prepared to offer larger deposits, who do you think a landlord will offer the property to?

That's not particularly my opinion on what is/isn't fair, however it is the reality in many parts of the country.

cinnamony

Mike3549 wrote: »

OP nobody is robbing you, deposit plus 1st and last months rent is quite a popular thing at the moment in RPZ. Dont mix licency with tennancy. When you rented a room, you were a licensee, you had no rights. If you rent the whole place - you are a tennant, you are protected, a landlord cannot keep your deposit for no reason.
In a current rental situation i would recommend you to stick with sharing.

Forgive me - been having terrible trouble sleeping due to the owner-occupiers I live with being so noisy at night so having some trouble expressing myself coherently.

I have no problem paying deposit and a month's rent upfront - this is standard. What I do have a problem with is paying 3-6 months deposit without any security. Because even if they can't take my deposit away for no reason its still a very stressful situation to go through, my court case has been ongoing for months now. Also this is really excessive imo considering the current cost of renting and definitely not standard. I guess rather than robbing I should have described it as greed..

Also I am not looking to rent by myself but share with tenants rather than owner-occupiers. My issue with owner-occupiers is that they can inpose any rules they want and have no respect for you whatsoever and you have to put up with it because you are essentially a guest. If I was sharing with the other tenants I would have the option of speaking to them and - for example - ask them to lower the amount of noise they make after say 10pm. I have really long commutes in the morning, as well as long working hours as I'm in fintech..

Del2005

cinnamony wrote: »

I have no problem paying deposit and a month's rent upfront - this is standard. What I do have a problem with is paying 3-6 months deposit without any security. Because even if they can't take my deposit away for no reason its still a very stressful situation to go through, my court case has been ongoing for months now. Also this is really excessive imo considering the current cost of renting and definitely not standard. I guess rather than robbing I should have described it as greed..

It's not greed it's a person or company with a substantial asset they are agreeing to lease to a stranger with little protection if the tenant does not pay the rent or wrecks the place, so they make the deposit big to make sure that they have slight protection. Blame lies with the government not the landlord.

cinnamony

Del2005 wrote: »

It's not greed it's a person or company with a substantial asset they are agreeing to lease to a stranger with little protection if the tenant does not pay the rent or wrecks the place, so they make the deposit big to make sure that they have slight protection. Blame lies with the government not the landlord.

The government are definitely to blame but in some situtions (licensee) you get no protection and there are definitely some landlords that are just greedy and use the housing crisis to feed that (i.e. Slumlords)

DubCount

cinnamony wrote: »

Also I am not looking to rent by myself but share with tenants rather than owner-occupiers. My issue with owner-occupiers is that they can inpose any rules they want and have no respect for you whatsoever and you have to put up with it because you are essentially a guest. If I was sharing with the other tenants I would have the option of speaking to them and - for example - ask them to lower the amount of noise they make after say 10pm. I have really long commutes in the morning, as well as long working hours as I'm in fintech..

Its important to look at the legal relationship you have with your new "landlord". If one person in the house is the tenant and you are renting off that person, you are a licensee. In this instance your status is no different than when you are renting from an owner-occupier. The person you are renting from can set the ground rules, and you don't have rights and security of tenure etc.. If you are one of several people renting directly from the person who owns the property (when the owner does not live in the property) then you are a tenant, and the tenancy provides rights to security of tenure and peaceful enjoyment of the property etc.

cinnamony

DubCount wrote: »

Its important to look at the legal relationship you have with your new "landlord". If one person in the house is the tenant and you are renting off that person, you are a licensee. In this instance your status is no different than when you are renting from an owner-occupier. The person you are renting from can set the ground rules, and you don't have rights and security of tenure etc.. If you are one of several people renting directly from the person who owns the property (when the owner does not live in the property) then you are a tenant, and the tenancy provides rights to security of tenure and peaceful enjoyment of the property etc.

I have seen a lot of these arrangements alright, generally they are paid in cash too so I imagine this is usually against their lease with the landlord? Btw I only realized that I replied to your post by mistake (with the snowflake comment) that was to some comment that seems to have been deleted now. Sorry didn't realize I had quoted the wrong person!

DubCount

cinnamony wrote: »

I have seen a lot of these arrangements alright, generally they are paid in cash too so I imagine this is usually against their lease with the landlord? Btw I only realized that I replied to your post by mistake (with the snowflake comment) that was to some comment that seems to have been deleted now. Sorry didn't realize I had quoted the wrong person!

No problem - it gave me a good laugh. I hope my replies did not cause offence.

I have been a small time landlord for 14 years. Picking a tenant is a difficult task. During the recession, I was happy to find anyone that was half way reasonable. Now, Its like picking out a golden ticket winner.

Laws for tenants are significant and mean available property is restricted. Meanwhile, Licensees have almost zero rights and are open to any amount of abuse.

The reality of the market is nuts, but we are all stuck with it.

Graces7

OP;have you thought re renting via an agency?

TheBoyConor

OP another thing going against you is your age. Many landlords will see young, early 20s guy and think drinking sessions, house parties, drunkenness and random people coming over and thus view you as a higher risk and might prefer someone in their later 20s or 30s.
Of course you'll say to them "oh I'm not into partying and big sessions" but sure everyone will say that, wont they because they want the house.

Is it right? No, of course not. But at the end of the day that is the real world we are living in. And I bet if you were a landlord yourself you would see things a bit differently also.

cinnamony

DubCount wrote: »

No problem - it gave me a good laugh. I hope my replies did not cause offence.

I have been a small time landlord for 14 years. Picking a tenant is a difficult task. During the recession, I was happy to find anyone that was half way reasonable. Now, Its like picking out a golden ticket winner.

Laws for tenants are significant and mean available property is restricted. Meanwhile, Licensees have almost zero rights and are open to any amount of abuse.

The reality of the market is nuts, but we are all stuck with it.

Nah not at all!

I know there is no balance whatsoever, its like the people who are in charge of regulating the sector are purposefully just trying to make it worse. It baffles me how did they not see this happening, the private sector should have never been pushed to deal with all levels of housing. The mind boggles!

Graces7 wrote: »

OP;have you thought re renting via an agency?

I haven't I must say, I actually don't know much about renting through agencies!

Lux23

Money talks cinnamony, and I reckon the easiest way around your situation is to pay some extra cash up front. For instance, you could offer the first and last month's rent up front and then a deposit as well. You won't end up paying any more in the long-run. You could also consider bribing a letting agent.

Samuel T. Cogley

Davo suggested advanced rent he said nothing about a deposit. It amazes me the amount of people that confuse the two. As for one month's rent being standard security, not in desirable rental areas it's not.

As for owner-occupiers you'll find just as many bad house shares with an owner occupier than without. We're owner occupiers and have had nothing but happy housemates apart from two issues - we're a bit messy and we make that clear from the get go, the room was a bit cold so we got a heater. We've provided LL references for ex housemates as well as ended up fostering a cat but that's a different story!

mikemac2

You’ve had a string of weirdo owner occupiers. They sound like the untidy messers when usually a benefit of an owner occupied house is its quieter and cleaner and no scumbag housemates

I’ve been in a few owner occupied places and each worked out fine. I wouldn’t entirely give up hope on this area but I get why you want to be a tenant and not a licensee

As you’re only looking for for a room to rent and not a place of your own I think the one month rent and one month deposit will be fine. With summer approaching maybe students leaving will free up places for you. Take your time