Advice Needed - Issues with new Landlord.

LyleLanley

Hello boards.ie. I'm just looking for some advice about how to deal with my current housing situation and was hoping someone here might have had an experience similar to mine. My brain hurts from trying to get everything sorted in my head on me tod, so any advice would be greatly appreciated. My apologies, its a bit long and kinda convoluted.

My Old Situation: Resident in an apartment for 5 years and 8 months. There's another one above me, owned by the same fella. My rent is low for these times, as it has been since I moved in. My old landlord was a sound man, we got on really well and therefore he enjoyed having me as a tenant and never increased my rent. He sadly passed away back in January.

My New Situation: Old landlord's Brother has been left the property, while his uncle is Executor of the Will. I pay the Executor the rent for the property while probate is ongoing. Executor went on holidays for the Easter break, and Brother arrived to start making some demands.

Here's what I was told:
He called to my apartment, told me the rent would be increasing by 40% with immediate effect and I'd have time to think about it. Three days later he called back, and I told him that I wasn't willing to pay that high for a one bed apartment, and that because the property being in a Rent Pressure Zone, I'm protected by the legislation from that kind of increase. I told him I'd be happy to pay the maximum increase possible under the guidelines once he is legally owner and has provided me the rent review in writing and given me the 90 days notice. He got a bit mad and left.

Yesterday, he arrived with a Notice of Termination for me. The Notice itself is fine, the correct amount of notice is being provided, family member needs the apartment and it was accompanied by a statutory declaration from a lawyer and all that. The problem is that it's all signed by the Brother, and the Executor had no idea about any of this when I spoke to him today. I asked the Brother to provide a Deed of Title to prove ownership of the property, but he hasn't. And the probate of the will is still ongoing. Does this have any legal grounds at all? He will own the property, but he doesn't currently, I think, because the Will is still being dealt with.

Secondly, it turns out that my upstairs neighbours just agreed to the price increase from the jump. So now, instead of paying the Executor, they're directly paying the Brother. Again, no Deed of Title to show ownership of the property... So the Brother has ignored the RPZ limit, the 90 day notice period and the need to provide a rent review in writing. Is he allowed to do any of this? I don't think my neighbours are aware of any of these legislations, either... They're from Cambodia, and from what I've spoken to them about what's going on with the property, they're a bit stumped by all this, so they just agreed to pay because they thought they'd be booted otherwise.

My main query is, do you think I'm better off going to Threshold and the RTB with all this or should I talk to the Brother, tell him he's potentially broken some legislation that the RTB might not approve of and see if I can bargain him down to not evicting me and giving me the rent increase in line with the RPZ guidelines?

I really don't wanna have to move but I'm looking for new spots anyway in the likely scenario this all won't work out for me. I guess even if I go to the RTB and win a dispute it will only delay my eviction...

Anyway, any thoughts/opinions/experiences would be very gladly received. Thanks for reading such a long winded explanation...

DubCount

Sorry to hear about your situation.

I would contact Threshold. I think there are good grounds for going to the RTB. I think the 2 grounds you referred to (He is not the Landlord until probate has completed, and he is using the family member excuse to execute an eviction because you refused an illegal rent increase) would both be valid grounds for going to the RTB. Try to get any evidence you can. See if the tenant in the other apartment would testify at the RTB, or even sign a letter stating how and when his increase was implemented. Threshold will be best place to advise you on how to enforce your rights.

Good luck...

LyleLanley

DubCount wrote: »

Sorry to hear about your situation.

I would contact Threshold. I think there are good grounds for going to the RTB. I think the 2 grounds you referred to (He is not the Landlord until probate has completed, and he is using the family member excuse to execute an eviction because you refused an illegal rent increase) would both be valid grounds for going to the RTB. Try to get any evidence you can. See if the tenant in the other apartment would testify at the RTB, or even sign a letter stating how and when his increase was implemented. Threshold will be best place to advise you on how to enforce your rights.

Good luck...

Thanks. The neighbours did text me about what happened with the Brother with the rent figures and stuff on it, so I have that if I need proof of "This is what he tried to do to me", I guess.

Everything was verbal so that's really the only proof I have of the attempted rent raise. Seeing as they're being massively ripped off, illegally, I'd hope they'd open an RTB dispute as well at the same time as me, but we'll have to see. They may not want to rock the boat and risk getting chucked out along with me. The whole thing is just awkward to deal with because giving him trouble and lodging a complaint is just gonna guarantee eviction anyway down the line.

jimmycrackcorm

LyleLanley wrote:

Yesterday, he arrived with a Notice of Termination for me. The Notice itself is fine, the correct amount of notice is being provided, family member needs the apartment and it was accompanied by a statutory declaration from a lawyer and all that. The problem is that it's all signed by the Brother, and the Executor had no idea about any of this when I spoke to him today. I asked the Brother to provide a Deed of Title to prove ownership of the property, but he hasn't. And the probate of the will is still ongoing. Does this have any legal grounds at all? He will own the property, but he doesn't currently, I think, because the Will is still being dealt with.

You're on a winner with this. You can't be thrown out and the notice is invalid because he isn't the owner and can't prove it.

Keep all the documentation as it'll build towards an RTB case where he's trying to illegally use the family moving in excuse to put you out. Especially in light of the rent increase demand. If you have that in writing now when he is in breach of the RPZ and not in possession, then happy days.

davo10

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

You're on a winner with this. You can't be thrown out and the notice is invalid because he isn't the owner and can't prove it.

Keep all the documentation as it'll build towards an RTB case where he's trying to illegally use the family moving in excuse to put you out. Especially in light of the rent increase demand. If you have that in writing now when he is in breach of the RPZ and not in possession, then happy days.

Sounds like the brother is learning quickly, from verbal demand, to written demand, now he knows he has to wait a few more weeks to give a valid notice of eviction. Op, looking at the bigger picture, if you have been paying way below market rate, would you have been better to consider the increase? Yes, it was against legislation but according to a Threshold representative interviewed on The Last Word, a lot of tenants are doing this in order to remain in their rentals. So, as things stand, the new owner wants you out, he is learning fast so he will serve you with a valid notice soon, you will be evicted and you will be looking for a new place to rent, so best to start looking.

Graces7

davo10 wrote: »

Sounds like the brother is learning quickly, from verbal demand, to written demand, now he knows he has to wait a few more weeks to give a valid notice of eviction. Op, looking at the bigger picture, if you have been paying way below market rate, would you have been better to consider the increase? Yes, it was against legislation but according to a Threshold representative interviewed on The Last Word, a lot of tenants are doing this in order to remain in their rentals. So, as things stand, the new owner wants you out, he is learning fast so he will serve you with a valid notice soon, you will be evicted and you will be looking for a new place to rent, so best to start looking.

The brother does not yet own the property as ti is in probate. Need to ask threshold/rtb about that.

Could be literally years before this changes. The land my dwelling is on is owned by a third party; six years and counting and no nearer resolution.

He is jumping the gun Has surely no legal powers to act as he is doing and as the OP said, without the executor's knowledge or approval.

Thus he cannot evict, or serve notice?

theteal

I can’t help OP but I’m just taken aback at the greed of some people. He just inherited these properties, no original investment, not an ounce previous work went into the place, they just fell into his lap. Now the first thing he does is make other people’s lives difficult just because he can and all for a few extra shillings. Sorry for your trouble. I think ultimately you’ll have to move but I’d like to think I’d make this very inconvenient for him until that day comes.

The_Conductor

Ok there are a few things here.

1. Until such time as the estate has been probated- any rent due- is due to the executor of the estate- and no-one else.

2. Any changes in the tenancy- are at the sole authority of the executor of the estate- until such time as the various properties have been vested in their new owners.

3. You (and your neighbour) are in an RPZ. It doesn't mean the rent increase is limited to 4%- the exact increase will be determined by when the last rent review was conducted.

4. If you agree to an illegal rent increase- you could subsequently lodge a case with the RTB- pointing out the illegality- and a landlord (and he isn't your landlord yet) cannot detract from your rights under the Act.

5. The executor needs to be made aware that the other tenant is paying rent to the brother- and not the executor- defacto- until such time as the estate has been probated- it is vested in executor- and it is not in the giving of the supposed heir to demand money from you or the other tenant.

6. The average estate- involving residential property- takes 6-7 months to formally be assessed. It does not take years- but it also doesn't happen overnight. The exact length of time- could be a little as a few weeks- if its straight forward and the executor has a decent solicitor do the paperwork. Yes- you do hear of some probates dragging on for years- they are the exception, rather than the rule.

7. Your contact is with the executor of the estate- and you should ensure that everything is done through him.

8. You need to get everything in writing- everything- because it sounds like you're going to need it. Verbal = hearsay. Written (even text messages) = papertrail.

9. The other tenant upstairs has a case they themselves can lodge with the RTB- either as joint parties with you- or separately- you can't force them to do a joint case.

10. If you want to know what the rent increase you can be allowed is- use the RPZ calculator here:

https://onestopshop.rtb.ie/calculator/rpz

Just for arguments sake- your rent hasn't been increased since 1st Nov 2011- and the supposed date for the new rent level is the first of July of this year, and it was 1,000 at the outset- your allowable increase now would be:



R x (1 + 0.04 x t/m)


€1000 x ( 1 + 0.04 * 80/24) = €1133.33

That is 13.33333% increase. Not 4% and not 30%.

The calculator on the RTB website- is a simple and easy to use tool- and both tenants and landlords- should stick to it- and quit coming up bizarre rent levels.

Note- the initial review after the imposition of the legislation had a 24 month window- its 4% per 12 month period thereafter.

Graces7

The_Conductor wrote: »

Ok there are a few things here.

1. Until such time as the estate has been probated- any rent due- is due to the executor of the estate- and no-one else.

2. Any changes in the tenancy- are at the sole authority of the executor of the
estate- until such time as the various properties have been vested in their new owners.
4. If you agree to an illegal rent increase- you could subsequently lodge a case with the RTB- pointing out the illegality- and a landlord (and he isn't your landlord yet) cannot detract from your rights under the Act.

6. The average estate- involving residential property- takes 6-7 months to formally be assessed. It does not take years- but it also doesn't happen overnight. The exact length of time- could be a little as a few weeks- if its straight forward and the executor has a decent solicitor do the paperwork. Yes- you do hear of some probates dragging on for years- they are the exception, rather than the rule.

Respectfully challenging this from experience

davo10

With the rent that far below current market rate, its highly unlikely that the op will get another notice of rent increase. With the 4% increase restriction, the rent will never reach market rate if it is currently 30% below. The new owner, when he gets his act together, will issue a correct notice of termination siting that property is needed for a family member.

LyleLanley

davo10 wrote: »

Sounds like the brother is learning quickly, from verbal demand, to written demand, now he knows he has to wait a few more weeks to give a valid notice of eviction. Op, looking at the bigger picture, if you have been paying way below market rate, would you have been better to consider the increase? Yes, it was against legislation but according to a Threshold representative interviewed on The Last Word, a lot of tenants are doing this in order to remain in their rentals. So, as things stand, the new owner wants you out, he is learning fast so he will serve you with a valid notice soon, you will be evicted and you will be looking for a new place to rent, so best to start looking.

He's not really learning, he's ploughing ahead with everything on a verbal basis... The only paper trail is the Notice of Termination and the text I received from my neighbours clarifying their new arrangement. I just can't afford to jump from €850 to €1200, so going along with what he wants would kinda wreck myself financially.

davo10 wrote: »

With the rent that far below current market rate, its highly unlikely that the op will get another notice of rent increase. With the 4% increase restriction, the rent will never reach market rate if it is currently 30% below. The new owner, when he gets his act together, will issue a correct notice of termination siting that property is needed for a family member.

Its actually 40% increase he's looking for, apologies. Typo in the first post. If he stuck to the guidelines, my rent would go up to €935. Which I don't think is that far out of line with what a one bed apartment costs around the place (outside of Dublin). I'm not trying to be greedy, and I agreed to pay that €935 once all the proceedings are done correctly, I just can't go above €1000 p/m in my current situation.

If the neighbours and I were to go to the Brother and say look, so far you've:
1. Issued Termination Notice without being owner
2. Failed to provide Deed of Title for that Notice
3. Gone around the Executor to increase and collect rent
4. Failed to produce Deed of Title to prove he's allowed change the rent, but has taken money already from my neighbours
5. Increased rent above the RPZ level in a RPZ
6. Ignored the 90 day notice rule
7. Failed to deliver rent review in writing

And point out to him that we will go to the RTB with this, would anyone think it likely that he'd maybe change his mind? I dunno what kind of result will even come from us appealing to the RTB. I imagine it'll just stall proceedings, and once finished he'll evict anyway. I'm not trying to blackmail him or be like "Look what we can get you on!", I'm just trying to find any angle where this scenario has a decent ending.

davo10

He is learning. He has gone from a verbal demand for a rental increase far in excess of what is allowed, to a letter of termination with a signed declaration for a valid reason. You are right, it isn't valid until he owns the property, but that will come. Incidentally, I doubt he would be required to show you the Deed, but if he is claiming to be the owner, he has to be legally the owner.

A "decent ending" in the owners eyes will no doubt be market rate. He cannot achieve that with you there so it's likely he will look at other ways to achieve it.

LyleLanley

davo10 wrote: »

He is learning. He has gone from a verbal demand for a rental increase far in excess of what is allowed, to a letter of termination with a signed declaration for a valid reason. You are right, it isn't valid until he owns the property, but that will come. Incidentally, I doubt he would be required to show you the Deed, but if he is claiming to be the owner, he has to be legally the owner.

A "decent ending" in the owners eyes will no doubt be market rate. He cannot achieve that with you there so it's likely he will look at other ways to achieve it.

Yeah, I guess you're right. In that regard at least it suits me because I have some paper proof. The family member in question is himself, so I don't even know if he gives a massive crap about the money... or maybe he'll just kip there for 6 months so I can't come back and then rent it out at the high price. Also €935 for a single bed apartment in Galway kind of is market rate? €1200 just seems mad to me.

ted1

theteal wrote: »

I can’t help OP but I’m just taken aback at the greed of some people. He just inherited these properties, no original investment, not an ounce previous work went into the place, they just fell into his lap. Now the first thing he does is make other people’s lives difficult just because he can and all for a few extra shillings. Sorry for your trouble. I think ultimately you’ll have to move but I’d like to think I’d make this very inconvenient for him until that day comes.

Have you ever heard in inheritance tax?
It’s also not social housing. The man is entitled ti try to achieve market rent (although RPZ limits his ability)

Fian

The_Conductor wrote: »

8. You need to get everything in writing- everything- because it sounds like you're going to need it. Verbal = hearsay. Written (even text messages) = papertrail.

I agree with everything in this post except this part.F first of all it is not actually hearsay - because it is not being introduced to prove the truth of the statement it is being introduced to prove that a demand for an illegal rent increase was made. Aside from that your word should be enough anyway, it is not necessary for you to have confirmation in writing and verbal should be enough. Of course it is useful if you do get confirmationin writing, but don't despair if you don't. I agree with previous posters, they are going to find it difficult to impose this rent increase on you.

One thing to consider is when your part IV tenancy expires. They may be able to refuse a renewal of the Part IV tenancy.

When did your tenancy commence?

theteal

ted1 wrote: »

Have you ever heard in inheritance tax?
It’s also not social housing. The man is entitled ti try to achieve market rent (although RPZ limits his ability)

Oh, will he have to pay some tax out on this lucrative gift? I’m sure some of the free rent he’ll receive can help there. Are you actually serious????

I would say the deceased landlord was entitled to achieve market rent but it appears that he was a decent sort and didn’t want to see his tenants struggling with housing costs just because he could make a few extra quid. It appears his brother is not of the same ilk.

Anyway, sorry for this to detract from your thread OP

ted1

theteal wrote: »

ted1 wrote: »

Have you ever heard in inheritance tax?
It’s also not social housing. The man is entitled ti try to achieve market rent (although RPZ limits his ability)

Oh, will he have to pay some tax out on this lucrative gift? I’m sure some of the free rent he’ll receive can help there. Are you actually serious????

I would say the deceased landlord was entitled to achieve market rent but it appears that he was a decent sort and didn’t want to see his tenants struggling with housing costs just because he could make a few extra quid. It appears his brother is not of the same ilk.

Anyway, sorry for this to detract from your thread OP

Yes he’ll have to pay cash, cash he may not have. And may need to draw down a personal loan at possibly 8% to pay back over a short 5-10 year period.

So as I said before it’s not social housing. He is entitled to charge market rent.

The brother was in a different situation and it’s not comparable.