Succession [HBO] *Spoilers*

ILikeBoats

Wow, I would've said Roman was youngest and that's why Logan manipulated* him most.

*not sure is manipulated is the right word

Nigel Fairservice

I always thought Roman was the youngest as well. Not sure it was ever said but from the way the others treated him.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120473036#Comment_120473036

There's still an element of that, especially given that he's younger than Kendall and Kendall always seemed to be the one being primed to succeed Logan. Roman in many ways had to fight harder to build up into higher roles within the organisation, but that also made him more susceptible to being manipulated or swayed by Logan in order to please him.

Shiv in many ways had to do the same but veered more towards trying to impress Logan from the outside and trying too hard to show initiative so he'd eventually bring her in.

But even regardless of age, Roman is clearly the least mature of them all so probably took on the role of the youngest Roy by default anyway.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120466663#Comment_120466663

If Greg tries Tom is going to lock Greg up in his basement and rename him Reek.

I'm an emotional wreck. Shiv's shaking hand and disbelief as she was talking to Logan, Roman desperate for a hug from Gerrie, Kendall in action mode trying to make it all ok, and Connor..well erm..yes.

The writers and director know a thing or two about grief I think.

Galwayguy35

I'd like to have seen more of James Cromwell in the show.

lmahoney79

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120483557#Comment_120483557

We may see him a bit more now for the funeral etc. He's a great actor.

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120483557#Comment_120483557

No way , his character brought far too much of Cromwells own preachy leftist politics, he was the one weak link and thankfully became a rarer feature as the seasons progressed

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120485956#Comment_120485956

That's part of why his character worked so well imo. He's very much a polar opposite to most of the rest of the family. Not interested in money or success, worried about the effect of the company globally. Yet he's still stayed on the board, still profits financially etc. I think his character was definitely used sparingly as it's not like any of the rest of the characters would ever listen to him or be affected by him (case in point: Greg wanting to sue Greenpeace to get his inheritence), but he provides a good contrast and reminder that Logan Roy came from nothing and has kept his whole family close and financially secure as much as possible, but that he's also tainted his children with that success as none of them, like Logan, can see outside of the company. Even Greg could have done what his grandfather wanted and gotten his $250m inheritence, but he's corrupted by the success of the rest of the Roys (and Tom) and wants to work his way higher to get more money.

cmac2009

Another brilliant epsiode this week. The quality of the writing and acting is phenomenal. In a league of their own at the moment imo.

tesla_newbie

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120486721#Comment_120486721

He was a typical wealthy liberal hypocrite

lmahoney79

The last 10 seconds of this week's episode was the best bit. Kendalls smile at Hugo at the end was brilliant!

martyos121

Karl has quickly become my favourite character in this, he’s had some great little moments lately.

It’s quite clear that the comic relief role has shifted to him from Greg too, with the latter looking slimier by the week.

I feel like the show will end with Greg in a completely undeserved position of strength (financially, at least). Him latching onto the rich widow has only highlighted how much Tom has influenced him.

shrewdness

My favorite part

"You're in miscellaneous matters, in pencil, with a question mark..."

"Nevertheless!"

While near impossible to match last week, thought this was another strong episode. The writing really shines through when it's just all the characters in the one space for a whole episode, and it's still great. Marcia fairly slithered back in there quick, fairly ruthless too.

That end was quality, Kendall quickly asserting that he's really the top dog. Gonna be some conflict soon with Roman. I think Kendall is right too - that move is the kind of ruthless stuff Logan would have pulled. It reminded me of the end of season 2 when Logan said Kendall wasn't cut out for the top job because he wasn't a killer - but later looked on almost with pride when Kendall came out in opposition to Logan in the press conference.

Larbre34

I enjoyed Kerry's humiliation a bit too much.

Have to hand it to Marcia all the same, she's well able for all-comers, with a well timed blade between the ribs.

Selling the town house over Logan's still cooling corpse was peak Marcia.

MfMan

In which Marcia became an uber-bitch.

The DayDream

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120488506#Comment_120488506

Marcia hated Greg in S1 and I don't think she's warmed to him much since.

And now Greg has become very unlikable to me, too. Though that's perhaps due to the allegations of having relations with underage girls that have come out recently about Nick Braun.

The White Wolf

I did wonder would "can Ken prove to be the killer his father demanded" be the final arc after Logan died. Kendall is just such a pitiful, sorry excuse for a human being; at the first whiff of his father's approval his greed for it all comes to the forefront again. Not that Siobhan or Roman are any better, as the second it even vaguely seemed like Logan picked a successor, they also fell back into their default self defences.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490055#Comment_120490055

Greg has always been a sh*tty character, but he's usually been bullied by someone like Tom or Kendall, and he's funny, so he's always been a bit more sympathetic than others. I mean he was preparing to sue Greenpeace to protect his inheritence, but because the idea of suing Greenpeace was funny as well as Greg trying to rationalise it to people, it wasn't that bad.

But now you can see him trying to worm his way back into the "family" because he needs someone to latch on to and even if Gerri, Frank etc took over, they'd just sell the company to Mathison and peace out. Greg now wants to hitch his wagon to the kids because he wants to be involved in what they move onto.

Another great episode though. I do think Kendall's name was underlined rather than crossed out, but it's a moot point regardless. Kendall has taken it to mean he's the successor and now he's doing what he needs to make it a reality.

EltonJohn69

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490441#Comment_120490441

One of the writers was on the HBO podcast and she said she definitely feels it was crossed out

elefant

I couldn't help but wonder: why would you bother going back to underline something in pencil? It's not like there was a list of names for one to be highlighted as particularly important.

That he went back to strike-through a name as he was making addenda (like 'Greg?') seems much more likely, right? And there was hardly something Kendall did in the past few seasons that feels like a reason to have earned an underline from Logan!

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490496#Comment_120490496

Really? That's interesting. I suppose it's good to know there is no definitive answer. I was mostly going by how the line starts under Kendall's name, and so if that's where he started the line that was probably his intention. But it's definitely as ambiguous as possible which is the right move.

whatever76

I think Logan was messing with Kendell's head again and purposely left it open to interpretation and deliberately put a slant on the line and added Greg in pencil.

Also ++spoiler++

Anyone think Siobhan lost the baby? I think something happened when they in discussion on who going forward for Interim  - she kinda stopped suddently and then backed down very quickly and was bit flustered ... hence the fall ! Just a hunch 

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490557#Comment_120490557

I don't think so. They only introduced the fact she's pregnant in this episode (though I saw someone online point out she refused a glass of champagne at the wedding last week), and there's still more story to be had there in her relationship with Tom. I think her fall etc was more just about her loss of power. She was finally on an even-keel with Kendall and Roman, and now she knows she has no claim to be their equals in sheparding the company through the deal with Mathison. She's been pushed to the side again, she's pregnant and doesn't have Tom with her, and she wasn't getting the sympathy she felt she deserved with Logan's death.

MfMan

Is Shiv pregnant by Tom, or IVF? (Latter presumably?) Why was she so angry in the wake of the meeting where the 2 brothers were ratified - I thought she had accepted it as a done-deal? Did Kerry mumble to Roman that they were going to be married as they were picking up her belongings?

Though I can't remember it now, I loved the exchange between Marcia and Willa when the latter arrived to sympathise. Something like Marcia saying "You've come up (in the world now)", with Willa replying "You also".

Willa and her mother (who's an absolute dimwit) completely misread the room as they're audibly heard discussing apartment renovations by the mourners.

So much good stuff in this episode, arguably better than last weeks.

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490780#Comment_120490780

Almost definitely pregnant by Tom, I think. She's 20 weeks, so chances are it happened a few weeks before the end of Season 3 when they were still together. I don't think too much time passed in between the seasons, especially as the deal with Mathison was still being finalised.

As for why she was angry after Kendall & Roman were named interim COOs of the company, it was because she was on even ground with them when they were going to build their own thing together, but now they're going to be the ones to bring in the Mathison deal and she's been pushed to the side. It's not so much about the deal itself, but her not being in the same position to help bring the deal in. That's always been her biggest gripe. Kendall and Roman were always part of Waystar whereas Shiv tried to work her way up the ladder from the outside. But she's never been able to have the success within Waystar because she never won Logan's approval/respect. Now she's not even involved in the final sale of the company. She's pushed to the side again, and now I guess if she goes ahead with the pregnancy, she'll be a single mother and will probably struggle to be as big a part of whatever she, Kendall and Roman were going to do.

The White Wolf

There's a number of ways you can come at the letter, (there's a cognitive one as well that has been mentioned, off his medication?), but ultimately I do read the letter as a gauntlet to all of them to **** each other over.

The Greg angle I can't explain, as I said it could be a cognitive slip or maybe a nudge to use him as a pawn to whoever has the bright idea to use him first. Why else put a kid in there that you can barely feign to be in the same company as?

Penn

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490840#Comment_120490840

I wonder if the Greg thing might just be an indication of when the changes were made to the will. Tying in with a time Greg did something which impressed or helped Logan enough that he'd decide to leave him a few things in his will. Would possibly indicate what his relationship with Kendall was like at the time.

MfMan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120490829#Comment_120490829

Not exactly sure if she's 20 weeks; her doctor says the 20-week scan will be the next milestone, but I don't think it specifically highlighted how far off it was.

cobham

Probably at 16 wks ... amniocentesis scan was mentioned as having been done.