DCM 2018 - Mentored Novice Thread

Supercell

coogy wrote: »

Heuston, we have a problem.

Turns out I will not have my new running shoes in time for the half marathon on Saturday. This means I'll be racing in 9 month-old running shoes.......:(


ARGH.

Last year I got new runners the day before the RnR half, so I went out for a short little run to break them in and hurt my achilles as I didnt realise the drop was less than my previous ones. Lost a months worth of training as a result. Lesson well learned.

Now I never ever run in anything new on a race week and never ever eat anything bar two slices of toast race mornining (with lashings of butter, cheese on one and jam on the other), I figure that was the gods puninishing me for not sticking with what already works.

The man in red and black

Second 16mile LSR done on Sunday. Tried out the High 5 Energy Gel Aqua for the first time. Had never tried a gel before. Took one at 5 and 11 miles. No stomach cramps. Almost had to jump into a farmers field for a toilet break but that was my own fault as my routine was interrupted by looking at a cow for my brother before going and forgot to go to the toilet after breakfast...not something you should forget before a 2.5hr run! Can't fault the gels on that score. Don't know if it was the gels or the route but I felt good on the way home, steady pace throughout. That may just have been the urgency of getting home to the bathroom though :P

18miles to do next weekend while on call so that will need to be gotten out of the way very early Sunday morning.

bucketybuck

I won't even do a LSR in new runners, never mind an actual race.

If I have a new pair I'll wear them around the house for 2/3 days, then do a couple of short runs. If they haven't hurt my feet at that point then I'll wear them for a LSR, and after that they become trusted.

I just think that if you go for a long run or race in new shoes then you are just asking for trouble, you'll end up with sore feet at best or an injury at worst. Break them in, let your feet get used to them!

bucketybuck

Rossi7 wrote: »

Could you not loop your LSR so it cuts out having to go through this routine, just make up whatever you need and stash them along your route. With regards to getting them into you on marathon day, thats what mates are for.Have them the scattered around the point that you want them at with whatever drink you made up with a gel elasticated to it. There's enough water stations around the course wthout having to carry gallons of water on your hip for 26 miles

Just being honest, but I need a marathon plan that is self sufficient, not one that relies on people maybe being where they are supposed to be. If I could guarantee a support team holding bottles for me that would be one thing, but I don't want to fall short because my mate got held up somewhere and left me with inadequate fueling.

I know I can carry enough Cliff Blok gels in my pockets and I know they work, I can take them and then use the water on the course. With Tailwind, maybe it is a great product, and I'd like it to work because I like the concept, but I'm still not confident that come the day the delivery methods will be 100% reliable.

coogy

bucketybuck wrote: »

I won't even do a LSR in new runners, never mind an actual race.

If I have a new pair I'll wear them around the house for 2/3 days, then do a couple of short runs. If they haven't hurt my feet at that point then I'll wear them for a LSR, and after that they become trusted.

I just think that if you go for a long run or race in new shoes then you are just asking for trouble, you'll end up with sore feet at best or an injury at worst. Break them in, let your feet get used to them!

Got it, thanks!!

coogy

Supercell wrote: »

Last year I got new runners the day before the RnR half, so I went out for a short little run to break them in and hurt my achilles as I didnt realise the drop was less than my previous ones. Lost a months worth of training as a result. Lesson well learned.

Now I never ever run in anything new on a race week and never ever eat anything bar two slices of toast race mornining (with lashings of butter, cheese on one and jam on the other), I figure that was the gods puninishing me for not sticking with what already works.

Yeah, makes sense! Thanks!

Kellygirl

juke wrote: »

Can I ask for some pacing advice?

After a slow FD 10 mile yesterday, I am (naturally) second guessing my pacing. I feel like I am going backwards. I was 15 seconds a kilometer slower than during the DCM half last year. If I wasn't running with Huzzah!, without a doubt I would have been even slower.

My easy & LSR pacing have been at the slower end of the scales. I'm wondering if I should plough on as I have been, or adapt times based on yesterday?

What I am really wondering is am I running too slow altogether? Or am I just having the usual mid-plan crisis

These are my last races:

Hi Juke,

I just went back a few weeks in your Strava to see what was going on. The paces you ran FD at pretty much match the pace work you have been doing during your marathon training. I don’t think you need to change your training paces. Last year when you were doing shorter distances you may have been training faster ( I didn’t check) but now you’ve had to slow down a bit to build up the endurance. The humidity on the day wouldn’t have helped. I sweated like no tomorrow the day before on my long run. You are also probably quite tired from training and no real taper before the race.

Hope that helps. Ask away if not.

juke

Kellygirl wrote: »

Hi Juke,

I just went back a few weeks in your Strava to see what was going on. The paces you ran FD at pretty much match the pace work you have been doing during your marathon training. I don’t think you need to change your training paces. Last year when you were doing shorter distances you may have been training faster ( I didn’t check) but now you’ve had to slow down a bit to build up the endurance. The humidity on the day wouldn’t have helped. I sweated like no tomorrow the day before on my long run. You are also probably quite tired from training and no real taper before the race.

Hope that helps. Ask away if not.

Thanks Kellygirl. Last year my distances would have been less and I wouldn't have had as much weekly runs.

Makes sense - I'm over thinking, probably, again and not comparing like with like.

Kellygirl

juke wrote: »

Thanks Kellygirl. Last year my distances would have been less and I wouldn't have had as much weekly runs.

Makes sense - I'm over thinking, probably, again and not comparing like with like.

Oh I know what it’s like to over think! Just take it day by day and tick off all your training runs and you’ll be just fine. You are doing great.

Sheep1978

Supercell wrote: »

bar two slices of toast race mornining (with lashings of butter, cheese on one and jam on the other), .

cheese on one and jam on the other:eek:

kittyclaws

I wasn’t going to post but someone might learn from my stupidity
I raced FD10 even tho I had planned on doing it as my LSR. Racing has a bad effect on me, it takes me ages to recover, but I figured what’s 10 miles at this point when I was fine after doing 18 last weekend!
I felt fine after the race, and fine for most of yesterday. I went to the gym on my lunch hour for a weight session, then decided to go for my easy run straight from work as some of the girls were going out then. I only had a salad for lunch, so grabbed a bar from the vending machine and headed out.

After a mile I started to get dizzy. I thought I’d run it off so kept going - another half mile or so in I was shaking and sweating profusely. I had to stop and sit down. In the end I had to get a lift back to my car I was in such a state!
I rang my other half (who is a nutritionist) who said it sounded like my blood sugar was spiking and to get a banana, a chocolate protein milk and a breakfast bar into me to stabilise.
After a while I felt well enough to drive home. I feel ok today but gonna wait to do a test 4 mile run tomorrow to let the glycogen stores go back up.

I’m supposed to be doing my 20 mile run on Thursday, I’ll have to see how tomorrow’s run goes, I got a bit of a scare but looking back it’s my own fault for not refuelling properly after the race.

Dealerz2.0

kittyclaws wrote: »

I wasn’t going to post but someone might learn from my stupidity
I raced FD10 even tho I had planned on doing it as my LSR. Racing has a bad effect on me, it takes me ages to recover, but I figured what’s 10 miles at this point when I was fine after doing 18 last weekend!
I felt fine after the race, and fine for most of yesterday. I went to the gym on my lunch hour for a weight session, then decided to go for my easy run straight from work as some of the girls were going out then. I only had a salad for lunch, so grabbed a bar from the vending machine and headed out.

After a mile I started to get dizzy. I thought I’d run it off so kept going - another half mile or so in I was shaking and sweating profusely. I had to stop and sit down. In the end I had to get a lift back to my car I was in such a state!
I rang my other half (who is a nutritionist) who said it sounded like my blood sugar was spiking and to get a banana, a chocolate protein milk and a breakfast bar into me to stabilise.
After a while I felt well enough to drive home. I feel ok today but gonna wait to do a test 4 mile run tomorrow to let the glycogen stores go back up.

I’m supposed to be doing my 20 mile run on Thursday, I’ll have to see how tomorrow’s run goes, I got a bit of a scare but looking back it’s my own fault for not refuelling properly after the race.

Speaking only as a novice I know, but nothing is stupid when you are hitting the weekly miles we are, thanks for the heads up, and hopefully it was just a once off for you!

ariana`

kittyclaws wrote: »

I wasn’t going to post but someone might learn from my stupidity
I raced FD10 even tho I had planned on doing it as my LSR. Racing has a bad effect on me, it takes me ages to recover, but I figured what’s 10 miles at this point when I was fine after doing 18 last weekend!
I felt fine after the race, and fine for most of yesterday. I went to the gym on my lunch hour for a weight session, then decided to go for my easy run straight from work as some of the girls were going out then. I only had a salad for lunch, so grabbed a bar from the vending machine and headed out.

After a mile I started to get dizzy. I thought I’d run it off so kept going - another half mile or so in I was shaking and sweating profusely. I had to stop and sit down. In the end I had to get a lift back to my car I was in such a state!
I rang my other half (who is a nutritionist) who said it sounded like my blood sugar was spiking and to get a banana, a chocolate protein milk and a breakfast bar into me to stabilise.
After a while I felt well enough to drive home. I feel ok today but gonna wait to do a test 4 mile run tomorrow to let the glycogen stores go back up.

I’m supposed to be doing my 20 mile run on Thursday, I’ll have to see how tomorrow’s run goes, I got a bit of a scare but looking back it’s my own fault for not refuelling properly after the race.

Nothing stupid about this at all. It's a good reminder for everyone to keep an eye on eating well and eating regularly to fuel the training and aid recovery.

I mentioned a few weeks ago about the weather getting cooler and i am definitely finding it so. I did an easy run last night and had to do a quick stop on the way home found myself really cold really quickly even with the fleece top that i leave permanently in the car. So keep warm folks.

incentsitive

I am so relieved to find that a lot of people found the LSR a drag this weekend.
I did it on Sunday evening, got to top of Roebuck Road at 10.3 miles (target 14 miles) and I was spent. I didn't have enough water for the run and its time to introduce energy gels.
I'll be doing my next one in cooler conditions.

Rossi7

Luckily enough I don't need reminding to carb load, I;m a pasta conniseur at this stage  I've got into the habbit of making some the night before or that day and just banging it into the microwave when I get home from a run washed down with some chocolate milk

coogy

I am eating like an absolute horse these days. I can't stop.

aloooof

coogy wrote: »

I am eating like an absolute horse these days. I can't stop.

It's great, isn't it! :pac:

Trying to map out a nice 20 mile run for the weekend that doesn't include laps of the park, here. It's proving surprisingly difficult! Covers some serious ground.

coogy

aloooof wrote: »

It's great, isn't it! :pac:

Trying to map out a nice 20 mile run for the weekend that doesn't include laps of the park, here. It's proving surprisingly difficult! Covers some serious ground.

Not a fan of laps then?

aloooof

I suppose when the laps are 6.5 miles each, it mightn't be so bad!

Supercell

How are you all hydrating on your lsr's?
I didn't bother for the last 18 miler but did carry three large gels with me on my running belt and it was cold and wet outside so no doubt that helped.
I don't think I could do the same distance again never mind 20 this weekend if conditions were warm like in Swords last weekend for the Frank Duffy 10 miler.

I'm thinking of either doing two loops (not a fan) and hydrating midway at home or just heading out early while its cool and try and hydrate well beforehand (and carry three gels again). I carried a bottle when on holidays earlier in the summer in Wales when it was mad hot and whilst it was definitely needed then I absolutely hated the sloshing around and felt it threw off my running form.
Another thought is to carry a few euro in my running belt and just buy a drink along the way in a shop but I don't like the idea of stopping mid run unless necessary - like crossing the road for example.
Any suggestions?

ariana`

Supercell wrote: »

How are you all hydrating on your lsr's?
I didn't bother for the last 18 miler but did carry three large gels with me on my running belt and it was cold and wet outside so no doubt that helped.
I don't think I could do the same distance again never mind 20 this weekend if conditions were warm like in Swords last weekend for the Frank Duffy 10 miler.

I'm thinking of either doing two loops (not a fan) and hydrating midway at home or just heading out early while its cool and try and hydrate well beforehand (and carry three gels again). I carried a bottle when on holidays earlier in the summer in Wales when it was mad hot and whilst it was definitely needed then I absolutely hated the sloshing around and felt it threw off my running form.
Another thought is to carry a few euro in my running belt and just buy a drink along the way in a shop but I don't like the idea of stopping mid run unless necessary - like crossing the road for example.
Any suggestions?

Could you leave a bottle at 2-3 different points along the route you'll be taking? Or plan your run to be passing your house or car a couple of times and leave water there.

Rossi7

Supercell wrote: »

How are you all hydrating on your lsr's?
I didn't bother for the last 18 miler but did carry three large gels with me on my running belt and it was cold and wet outside so no doubt that helped.
I don't think I could do the same distance again never mind 20 this weekend if conditions were warm like in Swords last weekend for the Frank Duffy 10 miler.

I'm thinking of either doing two loops (not a fan) and hydrating midway at home or just heading out early while its cool and try and hydrate well beforehand (and carry three gels again). I carried a bottle when on holidays earlier in the summer in Wales when it was mad hot and whilst it was definitely needed then I absolutely hated the sloshing around and felt it threw off my running form.
Another thought is to carry a few euro in my running belt and just buy a drink along the way in a shop but I don't like the idea of stopping mid run unless necessary - like crossing the road for example.
Any suggestions?

You'll not be able to do the marathon without any hydration, the idea of the LSR is to get not just your body use to the distance but also your hydration strategies. Granted you'll get some sort of reprieve stopping off at a shop or home for water, is there really much to lose for those few mins that it will take. For the 18 LSR a few weeks back, I ran the first few K with a small kids bottle of water with an High 5 tab in it and left it down where I would loop back to it after 5-6 k. I stopped off at a garage then around the 18-19k bought another bottle and use their toilet, not quite as quick as a McClaren pit stop but worked for me.

cullenswood

Rossi7 wrote: »

You'll not be able to do the marathon without any hydration, the idea of the LSR is to get not just your body use to the distance but also your hydration strategies. Granted you'll get some sort of reprieve stopping off at a shop or home for water, is there really much to lose for those few mins that it will take. For the 18 LSR a few weeks back, I ran the first few K with a small kids bottle of water with an High 5 tab in it and left it down where I would loop back to it after 5-6 k. I stopped off at a garage then around the 18-19k bought another bottle and use their toilet, not quite as quick as a McClaren pit stop but worked for me.

Speaking of which, on the hotter days for my LSRs I'm using the High 5 tabs in my water. I find I have to make one or two pitstops along the way. I'm not drinking tons either, say 750mls over the course of the run. Was wondering was this an effect of the High 5 tabs, or just the water.
I previously wouldn't have needed any water on runs up to 24k and never had this issue, but after learning the hard way in the heat a while back I am more cautious now.
I know the weather shouldn't be as hot the last week in October (who knows with this years weather!) but I don't fancy having to have 2 or 3 loo breaks during the race.

happyfriday74

I got a pair of new asics keyano 25s over the weekend. Needed a new pair before october so why not sort it now.

Due to circumstances beyond my control i didn't get out fot my weekend long run so was stressing last night about lost time. Plan was long run sat/sun in my normal runners and then break in run monday night with the new ones. Wore the new runners around house and went for a 2k jog sunday evening in them.

Come monday I was pacing the halls over not getting my weekend long run in and went out in the new runners and ended up putting 15 miles through them and coming home at midnight.

A bit foolhardy but shoes fit like a glove and run went brilliantly

Kellygirl

cullenswood wrote: »

Speaking of which, on the hotter days for my LSRs I'm using the High 5 tabs in my water. I find I have to make one or two pitstops along the way. I'm not drinking tons either, say 750mls over the course of the run. Was wondering was this an effect of the High 5 tabs, or just the water.
I previously wouldn't have needed any water on runs up to 24k and never had this issue, but after learning the hard way in the heat a while back I am more cautious now.
I know the weather shouldn't be as hot the last week in October (who knows with this years weather!) but I don't fancy having to have 2 or 3 loo breaks during the race.

I haven’t noticed that as an effect of the High 5 tablets but prob no harm to use on them on the next few runs to see anyway.

happyfriday74

wow- my issue on the long runs is running out of water(750ml) and having to call into a pub or friends house to refill. Used to loop past the house but as soon as I got in the door Id have a child attacking each leg.

Will look at Hi 5 tabs

The man in red and black

I have only just started taking water with me on LSRs. Did it for the 14 and 16. Using a 11oz Flip Belt bottle. I think that is 330mls roughly. I have also started taking 2 High 5 Aqua Gels. I would generally drink 3-4 litres of water/milk daily so reckon I'm well hydrated starting. Is it a bad idea to be drinking so little water on such long runs?

OOnegative

The man in red and black wrote: »

I have only just started taking water with me on LSRs. Did it for the 14 and 16. Using a 11oz Flip Belt bottle. I think that is 330mls roughly. I have also started taking 2 High 5 Aqua Gels. I would generally drink 3-4 litres of water/milk daily so reckon I'm well hydrated starting. Is it a bad idea to be drinking so little water on such long runs?

No, as long as you feel comfortable. I would have been the same when running back in Ireland. Important thing is to re-hydrate properly after your run. Checking your pee is a good way to check, when it’s a straw like colour you are correctly hydrated.

The man in red and black

OOnegative wrote: »

No, as long as you feel comfortable. I would have been the same when running back in Ireland. Important thing is to re-hydrate properly after your run.

Thanks. No problems rehydrating. Generally neck 750mls of chocolate milk then drink 1 litre of water a bit slower and make sure to keep the water into me the rest of the day. Biggest problem lately is if I run in the evening having to get up to pee at night after all the rehydrating :P

OOnegative

The man in red and black wrote: »

Thanks. No problems rehydrating. Generally neck 750mls of chocolate milk then drink 1 litre of water a bit slower and make sure to keep the water into me the rest of the day. Biggest problem lately is if I run in the evening having to get up to pee at night after all the rehydrating :P

Feel your pain on the last bit!!