Eir rural FTTH thread II

m99T

Marlow wrote: »

Basically, when an exchange gets NGA enabled, either is a parent NGA exchange or it gets re-homed to a parent exchange.

If OpenEIR makes a balls of it, they "forget" to rehome said sub-exchange in time for it's "ready-for-order" date.

This can have 3 causes:
- they didn't finish the FTTH build before the date, it was supposed to actual target date
- they didn't connect the sub-exchange back to it's parent for the actual target date
- they "forgot" to update their internal database.

Or ...2 maybe all 3 of above.

The result of that scenario is, that wrong data is submitted to the wholesale partners or customers are left dangling. Fixing this can take from 1 week to 3 months .. if you're lucky. Took over 2 months in Castlegregory, Co. Kerry for example.

/M

Only in Ireland.

Andy From Sligo

Dominique Loud Waistband wrote: »

According to Openeir plans it's down for both FTTC and FTTH. Those closer to the cabinet will get FTTC and the outskirts will get FTTH.

Is there one of the cabinets on the right at

https://goo.gl/maps/4fNvCYEwRM22

been a while since I have been down there to look - but from memory I think there is a tall aluminium silver cabinet with vents in it (where it looks like there could be cooling fans) and then a smaller double size green cabinet next to it - must pop down tomorrow and take pics .

so thats odd then - the people who live near the cabinet will only be served by FTTC VDSL and not get speeds of up to 1000mbit/s ..... but the ones further away from cabinet will be able to avail of 1000mbit by FTTH .... bet the ones who live nearer to the cabinet will feel short changed - what will they get on VDSL just 100mbps then?

Marlow

m99T wrote: »

Only in Ireland.

No .. I believe OpenEIR are specialists at this. Other wholesale providers in Ireland operate a lot more professionally.

/M

Andy From Sligo

m99T wrote: »

Doubt it but funny if it was a matter of Collooney and Coolaney both being CNY and someone seeing this, thinking it was broken and removing it.

I mean, not funny for you though.

yeah , although i think from memory Collooney is CLY

m99T

Marlow wrote: »

No .. I believe OpenEIR are specialists at this. Other wholesale providers in Ireland operate a lot more professionally.

/M

It is a serious type of special. Gives us all something to complain about at least.

Marlow

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

so thats odd then - the people who live near the cabinet will only be served by FTTC VDSL and not get speeds of up to 1000mbit/s ..... but the ones further away from cabinet will be able to avail of 1000mbit by FTTH .... bet the ones who live nearer to the cabinet will feel short changed - what will they get on VDSL just 100mbps then?

Yes ... that's the way OpenEIR operate. Max 100 Mbit/s ... going up to 250 Mbit/s once supervectoring is introduced. 500m radius from the cabinet before FTTH is available.

/M

m99T

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

yeah , although i think from memory Collooney is CLY

yupp.

Andy From Sligo

when / if we finally get FTTH I will be going from a 11mbps down (realistically around 3-5mbps with contention when its busy) to at least 150mbps (or 90mbps when busy) at even the smallest package and I am currently paying 59PM for broadband only on a fixed wireless dish system ... I wont know myself! - it will be the feeling when i moved from 56k dial up to 3mbps fixed wireless .. or maybe even better feeling!

m99T

Would be nice to see something like B4RN in Ireland at some point.

Marlow

m99T wrote: »

Would be nice to see something like B4RN in Ireland at some point.

Not happening. There is a cultural problem in our rural (specifically farming) society, that is preventing that.

Nobody is going to give you a wayleave voluntarily in Ireland. Well. very very very very few people.

/M

m99T

Marlow wrote: »

Not happening. There is a cultural problem in our rural (specifically farming) society, that is preventing that.

Nobody is going to give you a wayleave voluntarily in Ireland. Well. very very very very few people.

/M

Didn't even think of that, but you are right. Sure they would all look for a percent of profits.

Marlow

m99T wrote: »

Didn't even think of that, but you are right. Sure they would all look for a percent of profits.

Percent ? If it only was a marginal percentage, we would have fiber at every single mast in the country.

We have fiber at less than 20% of the masts in the country.

/M

m99T

Marlow wrote: »

Percent ? If it only was a marginal percentage, we would have fiber at every single mast in the country.

We have fiber at less than 20% of the masts in the country.

/M

Can only hope the culture changes soon.

Moving back to rural England for university in September and i'm spoilt for choice with broadband providers. 100mb/s FTTC for £27 per month with phone and TV.

Such a difference.

tsue921i8wljb3

Andy From Sligo wrote: »

been a while since I have been down there to look - but from memory I think there is a tall aluminium silver cabinet with vents in it (where it looks like there could be cooling fans) and then a smaller double size green cabinet next to it - must pop down tomorrow and take pics .

so thats odd then - the people who live near the cabinet will only be served by FTTC VDSL and not get speeds of up to 1000mbit/s ..... but the ones further away from cabinet will be able to avail of 1000mbit by FTTH .... bet the ones who live nearer to the cabinet will feel short changed - what will they get on VDSL just 100mbps then?

That silver cabinet is the exchange. There does not seem to be a traditional exchange building that you would see in other areas.

FTTC is up to 100Mb at the minute depending on distance from the cabinet. I suppose it is a sort of reverse discrimination. Those living in clusters in the village will get the inferior technology.

tsue921i8wljb3

m99T wrote: »

Can only hope the culture changes soon.

Moving back to rural England for university in September and i'm spoilt for choice with broadband providers. 100mb/s FTTC for £27 per month with phone and TV.

Such a difference.

If the UK is so advanced why does B4RN exist at all?

Marlow

m99T wrote: »

Moving back to rural England for university in September and i'm spoilt for choice with broadband providers. 100mb/s FTTC for £27 per month with phone and TV.

That right there has nothing to do with culture. It has to do with politics and proper regulation.

Regulated wholesale pricing for a VDSL copper line in Ireland exceeds 20 EUR/month + VAT. It was below that in 2016, but Comreg allowed OpenEIR to increase the pricing by 4 EUR/month. FTTH line rental is even higher than that. That's before you poor internet connectivity into the line.

SIRO operates at the regulated pricing prior to the 2016 price increase. Voluntarily.

Comreg has no teeth, nor any interest in actual regulation and the departments of comms (and fish, evironment or whatever else they poor in there at any given time) has not clue nor does want to have a clue.

We will only see a change, when the government ACTUALLY takes action. That's not going to take any time soon.

In the meanwhile, the best consumers can do is to vote with their feet ... and support local providers, that spend their money in the local enonomy. Eirs money is going to France now. Vodafones money is going globally. etc.

/M

m99T

Dominique Loud Waistband wrote: »

If the UK is so advanced why does B4RN exist at all?

Well put. Still, at least it exists. FTTH seems to still be pretty bad there.

tsue921i8wljb3

m99T wrote: »

Well put. Still, at least it exists. FTTH seems to still be pretty bad there.

Woeful. They are even behind us in the rankings. The UK is not a market we should be trying to emulate.

ED E

To be fair OpenReach have FARRRR more high density profitable subs than low density cost leeches than OpenEir do. That makes offering a lower wholesale price a chunk more practical.

m99T

Dominique Loud Waistband wrote: »

Woeful. They are even behind us in the rankings. The UK is not a market we should be trying to emulate.

I read something about them not even making the rankings. Less than 1% market penetration.

Also:

Dominique Loud Waistband wrote: »

I suppose it is a sort of reverse discrimination.

Marlow

Dominique Loud Waistband wrote: »

If the UK is so advanced why does B4RN exist at all?

The UK is well regulated, when it comes to pricing.

The UK is lacking with coverage for 2 different reasons:
- while OpenEIR is forced to allow duct-sharing/pole-sharing at a regulated price and when not available has to provide dark fiber, BT didn't have to do that until recently. Every provider had to dig their own ducts/cables/errect poles
- on the other hand local licenses were awarded are marginal cost (10 GBP opposed to 6k EUR figures in Ireland for mast .. annually .... as an example)

Rural areas have been left completely uncovered. Even when it comes to mobile.

You think mobile coverage in Ireland is bad ? It is superior to most european countries. In Scotland you can travel MILES without any signal whatsoever.

There are "group broadband schemes" in Scotland and Wales .... yes.. similar to our first attempt of GBS ... that are thriving extremely well .. especially connecting the scottish islands and the westcoast of scotland.

It's because they have been supported well by Ofcom, the department and WISPA ... a group that brings wireless ISPs together and encourages a minimum standard of broadband.

You take all of the above and you won't find it here .... for a lot of reasons. Culture and Government being the foremost culprit. Ireland-Offline being the best approach taken to solve this, but not very successful to date, because ignored.

/M

tsue921i8wljb3

Very good m99T! Are you studying art in the UK? :pac:

Marlow

Dominique Loud Waistband wrote: »

Very good m99T! Are you studying art in the UK? :pac:

I thought Galway was the place to study Art ? Must have been doing something wrong there.

/M

m99T

Dominique Loud Waistband wrote: »

Very good m99T! Are you studying art in the UK? :pac:

:pac: Comp Sci with Networking Security and Forensics. Having a stock pic of 'Careful Now' on the desktop for 3 years has been one of the best decisions i've ever made.

shigllgetcha

had a guy out today checking my duct. he used to work for kn. Its not blocked and he located my phone line in the garden and it goes right under the front steps and said its right under the wooden floor in the hall but i really dont want to lift the floor.

my duct is over 60m, if i add an access box, what size would i need, would square wavin risers do (6 inch square)? he located the duct exactly so shouldnt be a problem to install

If i run a separate duct from the access point to a bedroom wall, could i use 20mm hydrodare pipe rather than 32mm? easier to work with.

If i drill a hole in the wall through to the bedroom, could i bury the duct in the footpath without turning the duct up the wall, do you think the kn guy would run the fibre up the wall for a foot to the hole from where the wall meets the footpath without the duct turned up?

Theres a small chance that if i put an access box in and he rod'ed to the house the duct in the hall might just terminate in the right place but i think its pretty unlikely. The current run was longer than his rods and he said itll be longer than any rod kn bring so we couldnt tell where the duct ended

ArrBee

shigllgetcha wrote: »

had a guy out today checking my duct. he used to work for kn. Its not blocked and he located my phone line in the garden and it goes right under the front steps and said its right under the wooden floor in the hall but i really dont want to lift the floor.

my duct is over 60m, if i add an access box, what size would i need, would square wavin risers do (6 inch square)? he located the duct exactly so shouldnt be a problem to install

If i run a separate duct from the access point to a bedroom wall, could i use 20mm hydrodare pipe rather than 32mm? easier to work with.

If i drill a hole in the wall through to the bedroom, could i bury the duct in the footpath without turning the duct up the wall, do you think the kn guy would run the fibre up the wall for a foot to the hole from where the wall meets the footpath without the duct turned up?

Theres a small chance that if i put an access box in and he rod'ed to the house the duct in the hall might just terminate in the right place but i think its pretty unlikely. The current run was longer than his rods and he said itll be longer than any rod kn bring so we couldnt tell where the duct ended

Just throwing this out there....
Is it possible for them to feed fibre from the house back to the road via the duct?
Like, disconnect the phone line and use it as a pull string to bring the fibre backwards?

Assuming that you dont want the phone line to stay, and that the phone socket is a suitable location for your fibre connection of course.

Andy From Sligo

m99T wrote: »

Only in Ireland.

I've just been thinking about this - if it is to be believed the gossip in the village that "the cabinet is a mess inside , and nobody wants to touch it!" i'm thinking why? - these are trained eir (or KN networks or whoever) engineers ... why would they be frightened / not trained enough to roll their sleeves up and just sort it out inside for a day or 2 - just dig in there and get it sorted!

We dont live in a third world country and surely a massive infrastructure such as eir should not be bothered about sorting out wiring in a cabinet nor make a huge mistake about main and node exchanges on a list sent to providers .. meaning it has to be corrected on this list even before a chosen provider can get in touch with eir (or KN whoever it is who ultimately installs the fibre into the home cable and equipment) - meaning they have had to mark it as down / not live any more. You would think this crowd would check, double check, triple check that the information was correct before sending it out. not make mistakes and hold everything up!

shigllgetcha

ArrBee wrote: »

Just throwing this out there....
Is it possible for them to feed fibre from the house back to the road via the duct?
Like, disconnect the phone line and use it as a pull string to bring the fibre backwards?

Assuming that you dont want the phone line to stay, and that the phone socket is a suitable location for your fibre connection of course.

I dont think kn would do that and the phone line is cemented into the floor

KCross

What diameter is the cable that they run in through your house duct?

I was at a house recently that had a fibre cable on the outside wall and it was very thin. Looked like it could be easily broken. Are all the FTTH installs the same?

I was expecting it to be a cable of similar size and strength to the copper cable just to protect it from being broken. Is that not the case?

Andy From Sligo

ArrBee wrote: »

Just throwing this out there....
Is it possible for them to feed fibre from the house back to the road via the duct?
Like, disconnect the phone line and use it as a pull string to bring the fibre backwards?

Assuming that you dont want the phone line to stay, and that the phone socket is a suitable location for your fibre connection of course.

I have had 2 different answers on this one from 2 different people.

We have a 'never used/activated' copper PTSN telephone line in our duct underneath the front garden and even runs to an external eircom connection box underneath the ESB meter on the outside wall and then runs onto all copper telephone wiring into the house (our house was built 2008) but its phone landline has never ever been activated.

so one person told me (cant remember who now my brain is fried with so much information about FTTH and everything) " oh no, what they will do is take your unused PTSN copper cable out of the duct and replace it with the Fibre (fiber) cable which is a little bit bigger than the PTSN cable if not same size" - and if you want to use a normal telephone (and take a VOIP package) we supply you with a router with VOIP terminal where you plug in your normal telephone and make calls by VOIP over fibre.

Then another person who said the duct has to be perfectly clear for the fibre cable to pass through (or there will be an extra charge for unblocking it!) when i sad can it go in place of the PTSN cable said "Oh no, thats against the law - they cannot remove the PTSN cable and leave you with no landline - the fibre cable will have to run alongside the PTSN , thats why the duct as to be clear of all blockages!"