Recommend electric folding scooter for end of commute (Mod Note Post #1)

beauf

ED E wrote: »

...

White on front between X and X off the ground.
Red on rear between X and X off the ground.
Directional indicators in amber with similar positional requirements.

Again it's just stuff you've made up.

While some of it might be reasonable some of it is not.

Can't really claim something doesn't meet the standard for lights when there is no standard for it .

prinzeugen

beauf wrote: »

It's not a legal requirement. So by proper you mean basically something you've made up.

I don't disagree that some lights need to be better regulated. But it's not correct to call it improper or incorrect if they meet the current requirements.

The Garda will pull you for incorrect or distracting lighting though. I witnessed a cyclist getting pulled on Camden St in early December that had one of those LED lights that give a camera flash every second. Aimed up not down so was blinding everyone near it.

Scooter type MPVs will need to meet minimum Irish standards for a MPV. They need a proper headlight. A LED light for a cycle wont cut it regardless of how bright it is.

ED E

beauf wrote: »

Again it's just stuff you've made up.

While some of it might be reasonable some of it is not.

Can't really claim something doesn't meet the standard for lights when there is no standard for it .

No, its not.

Directive 2009/67/EC of the European Parliament.

beauf

ED E wrote: »

beauf wrote: »

Again it's just stuff you've made up.

While some of it might be reasonable some of it is not.

Can't really claim something doesn't meet the standard for lights when there is no standard for it .

No, its not.

Directive 2009/67/EC of the European Parliament.

That's for motor bikes and cars etc....

If the scooters get legalised they will be similar to electric bicycles to which these specific rules do not apply.

beauf

prinzeugen wrote: »

beauf wrote: »

It's not a legal requirement. So by proper you mean basically something you've made up.

I don't disagree that some lights need to be better regulated. But it's not correct to call it improper or incorrect if they meet the current requirements.

The Garda will pull you for incorrect or distracting lighting though. I witnessed a cyclist getting pulled on Camden St in early December that had one of those LED lights that give a camera flash every second. Aimed up not down so was blinding everyone near it.

Scooter type MPVs will need to meet minimum Irish standards for a MPV. They need a proper headlight. A LED light for a cycle wont cut it regardless of how bright it is.

Again what's incorrect or improper lighting for a scooter or a bicycle. Can you give a legal definition?

beauf

Man this stupid multi quote on the touch version of boards...grrrr.

beauf

This might help...

Some of this is rules of the road, highway code not specifically legally defined...

https://www.bikeradar.com/features/bike-light-laws-in-the-uk-what-you-need-to-know/

prinzeugen

beauf wrote: »

That's for motor bikes and cars etc....

If the scooters get legalised they will be similar to electric bicycles to which these specific rules do not apply.

You are presuming that. And you linked to the rules of the road from the UK.

Not that the rules of the road are law anyway. The road traffic acts are.

The minimum standards in Ireland for a 2 wheeled MPV are, fixed low beam and high beam headlight, rear light, rear lit registration plate light, and brake light.

Mirrors and indicators must be in working order where fitted. The lights MUST be capable of staying illuminated when the engine is stopped.

beauf

I know and qualified what I said for exactly those reasons.

beauf

I'll do it again for the hard of reading...

beauf wrote: »

...
If the scooters get legalised they will be similar to electric bicycles to which these specific rules do not apply.

It was mentioned that a cyclist's was stopped for lights. Also about the correct cycling lights. I'm asking for about the fourth time where are the requirements for a bicycle.

beauf

Enough of the strawman (intentionally replying to a deliberately misrepresented proposition)... While we're at it.

griffdaddy

I don't have a link to hand but that quote from Charlie Flanagan yesterday was promising. He basically said they seem like a good idea and that he'd be talking to minister Ross about it this week or next. The other possibility is that the EU introduce a micromobility directive or regulation and Ireland is forced to cop the fck on. That would also be a good outcome.

zg3409

beauf wrote: »

I'll do it again for the hard of reading...

beauf wrote: »

...
If the scooters get legalised they will be similar to electric bicycles to which these specific rules do not apply.

It was mentioned that a cyclist's was stopped for lights. Also about the correct cycling lights. I'm asking for about the fourth time where are the requirements for a bicycle.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/travel_and_recreation/vehicle_standards/lighting_of_bicycles_in_ireland.html

I think the flashing type were also legalised a while back. You can pick up a set of lights in any pound shop.

beauf

That link also goes back to the actual legislation if anyone wants to look up the specifics.

beauf

griffdaddy wrote: »

I don't have a link to hand but that quote from Charlie Flanagan yesterday was promising. He basically said they seem like a good idea and that he'd be talking to minister Ross about it this week or next. The other possibility is that the EU introduce a micromobility directive or regulation and Ireland is forced to cop the fck on. That would also be a good outcome.

Can't come quick enough...

...Ghost...

punisher5112 wrote: »

Once insured, licence, correct lighting
meeting a required set of minimum standards etc which nobody will have on a bicycle or a battery scooter.

That's not only a broad brush, but a blatant misrepresentation. Moped riders and mopeds have have minimums standards and requirements, just like cars, buses, and bicycles. The standards are different for each and usually for rational, logical reasons. A bicycle is not required to have turn signals for example. They would be a good idea, but they are not required.

In the OP, I set out what I believe would be good ideas and I think a speed up to 50kph is reasonable enough. I think good lights should be part of the rules as well as having a minimum age.

Tax, insurance and licensing are not safety issues, which is what I was discussing. One could argue safety on how one is granted a license, but that would be pedantic.

Again, I don't suggest anyone travels at 50kph in a cycle lane, but Lumen specifically mentioned 16 year olds, scooters and cycle lanes, which is why I mentioned that 16 year olds already have access to faster machines and are often in the cycle lane.

rubadub

from the cycling forum

silverharp wrote: »

Garda stops Electric Unicycle Scooter in Dublin, funny bit, the guy tells the garda that he is filming him, and the garda says you cant GDPR , what a muppet

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xIsNi1HUTg

Johnboy1951

rubadub wrote: »

from the cycling forum

A very reasonable Garda in one respect, but a failure to apply the law in another.

The law should be applied in all circumstances or completely ignored/changed.

If the Garda had taken details and let him off with a warning, and his details recorded in case of future breaches, I would understand.

SteM

Whatever about scooters, those unicycle things on city centre roads are an accident waiting to happen imo.

quarryman

Fair play to the contributors on this thread that do not own a scooter yet have managed to ruin the discussion.

On the actual topic of scooters:
I picked up a Kugoo S1 last week. I thought it was going to be an exact copy of my Zoom Stryder but it’s definitely inferior. It’s still ok but the Zoom is much better in terms of build quality.

rubadub

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/e-scooter-business-says-sales-down-over-50-due-to-confusion-over-legality-1.3875124

E-scooter business says sales down ‘over 50%’ due to confusion over legality
Department of Transport says e-scooters not allowed on public roads, fines may be issued

...When asked about the legality of e-scooters that require a degree of physical propulsion before a motor can start, a spokesman for the Department of Transport compared e-scooters to a certain category of e-bicycles.

The spokesman said some e-bikes “require continuous effort on the part of the cyclist [and] are considered to be pedal cycles” because “the engine is not the means of propulsion, but an aid to the user”.

Other e-bicycles “that can be exclusively propelled by the motor are classified in EU law as low-performance mopeds” and are subject to Road Traffic legislation, with the user obliged to have tax, insurance and an appropriate driving licence where the vehicle is to be used in a public place.

He said e-scooters, similar to pedal-assisted cycles, “do not require continuous effort on the part of the user, and are therefore considered to be mechanically propelled vehicles”.

The "continuous effort" is key, as many unscrupulous sellers have been been making laughably disingenuous claims that the gardai & RSA have made it absolutely 100% clear that they are legal if they need a push start.

I am surprised sales have not dropped more, at least some customers are not being duped/conned by any dodgy sellers telling them there is no potential issue at all.

ted1

50% down on what ? How long is the shop open ?

How many more places are selling scooters. Aren’t three selling the most popular ones ?

Her sakes could be down due to competition

antodeco

quarryman wrote: »

Fair play to the contributors on this thread that do not own a scooter yet have managed to ruin the discussion.

On the actual topic of scooters:
I picked up a Kugoo S1 last week. I thought it was going to be an exact copy of my Zoom Stryder but it’s definitely inferior. It’s still ok but the Zoom is much better in terms of build quality.

What was the price difference between both? I have the S1, and replaced rear wheel with a pnuematic tyre, loosened the rear suspension and greased the front suspension. I find it's more than suitable for my needs, as it was cheaper than all the other eScooters out there!

quarryman

antodeco wrote: »

What was the price difference between both? I have the S1, and replaced rear wheel with a pnuematic tyre, loosened the rear suspension and greased the front suspension. I find it's more than suitable for my needs, as it was cheaper than all the other eScooters out there!

S1 was €300
Zoom was €700

Can you tell me where you bought the pneumatic tyre and also how you loosened and greased the suspension?

antodeco

quarryman wrote: »

S1 was €300
Zoom was €700

Can you tell me where you bought the pneumatic tyre and also how you loosened and greased the suspension?

I think for less than half the price, its certainly worth the value!

The front suspension I just used a lubricant (it's under the "squashable" rubber spring above the charging point.
The rear suspension, you'll see a nut just behind where the battery pack is. I gave that a turn or 2 until I could see the rear suspension flex when I stood on it.

Pnuematic tyre from AliExpress. I ordered an 8" M6 wheel.

The link is: https://s.click.aliexpress.com/e/Ya09fyG

I filled this tyre up with slim and TyreWeld a few times. I also put a small bit of glue around the valve, as I wasn't 100% certain the air wouldn't escape.

Completed a few hundred Kms already and it's like a different scooter. Alot more confident on it in the wet than before.

Anything else, just ask.

beauf

quarryman wrote: »

Fair play to the contributors on this thread that do not own a scooter yet have managed to ruin the discussion. ...

If you don't want a robust discussion don't use an open forum....

Why do you have to have a scooter to comment. Everyone is sharing public spaces with scooters and some people might be considering getting one in the future.

Scooters have a lot of similar issues as cycling. It's likely those issues will be brought up.

beauf

antodeco wrote: »

I think for less than half the price, its certainly worth the value!
...

What's the difference in weight.

antodeco

beauf wrote: »

What's the difference in weight.

Zoom is 10.8Kg and the S1 is 11kg

beauf

quarryman wrote: »

...
I picked up a Kugoo S1 last week. I thought it was going to be an exact copy of my Zoom Stryder but it’s definitely inferior. It’s still ok but the Zoom is much better in terms of build quality.

Why did you pick up a second scooter? Not much difference in weight...

Capt'n Midnight

From Austin , Texas.
https://www.cdapress.com/article/20190502/AP/305029958

. The investigators identified 271 individuals with potential e-scooter-related injury incidents during the study period last fall; of those, 190 confirmed an e-scooter riding-related injury. Most accidents occurred on streets. Most riders were men. Among the injured, 48% suffered a fracture, laceration or abrasion to the head; 70% injured upper limbs; and 55% injured lower limbs. Of the 190 riders, 35% suffered some type of fracture.

...
The CDC’s Laurel Harduar Morano said, “We know we’re missing cases of injuries. These are the injuries severe enough to require emergency medical care.”