2018 FA Cup Final - Chelsea vs Manchester Utd - 18/05 @ 17:15 - BBC, BT, TV3

IncognitoMan

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

I know exactly what I'm talking about.

Ok, lets see.

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Mourinho has the players in the team/squad with the attacking talent to let loose and win games if he'd let them.

He doesn't. He prefers to sit deep and defend first and then hope the opposition makes a mistake, nick a goal and then defend again.

They won the second most games of anyone in the league though? Like only a record breaking Man City team did better.

So what does that say about all the "freedom" given to the 18 other teams? Does it work better but somehow produce worse results?

Jose prefers to keep it tight in games against the better sides in the league but gives the players plenty of freedom against the weaker sides. If you play the same way against Man City and Stoke (at home) then City will take you apart.

I have no problem with this approach as you should approach different situations differently. I mean I'm not sure off the top of my head but I'd bet United's record against the top 6 is decent enough this year. Daft points dropped against weaker sides when the player were given "freedom" cost Utd more.

Edit: Oh yeah, and it was Chelsea who sat back today. Which is their right to do and it won them the game.

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

These are not bad players he has yet he'll moan about needing to spend another kings ransom on players this summer.

A team with Sanchez, Martial, Luakaku, Rashford, Herrera et al should be capable of much more.

Some of them are not bad players of course it is Man Utd so they should all be pretty ****ing good. But some aren't, some have no business being near a club like Man Utd like Jones, Fellaini, Young (at left back especially), Smalling, Darmain and probably one or two more but those guys are the main problems I feel.

It's just not a good enough squad yet, especially as City have hit their peak now.

We seen today that without Lukaku there was no focal point in attack and no one to replace him to the same effect. There needs to be more money invested weather you like it or not.

Chelsea could let our full backs have it all day because 1: they are Young and Valencia so a quality delivery is fairly unlikely and 2: they are crossing to Rashford, Snachez and Lingard.

Fair play to Chelsea they got their tactics spot on and were lucky that Lukaku wasn't fit enough to start so they could sit deep and nullify the attack with no presence in the box.

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Put it this way, Ferguson would be a lot closer to City, would have knocked out Sevilla and perhaps Bayern and would have beaten that Chelsea team today with the squad Mourinho has at his disposal.

Ah, ok sure. You know Fergie teams turned in some ****e performances during transition years as well. It wasn't all 1999 or 2008 football.

Fergie's United were well capable of losing European games where they should have won as well don't forget.

I don't think Jose got it right today but Fergie didn't get it right 100% either. Anyway the main reason United lost today was Jones, there's only so much a manager can do.

Back to the original post

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Mourinho really has no Plan B against decent sides. He parks the bus and hopes to sneak a goal and then deploy a flat back 10 for the rest of the game.

Only works if the opposition don't score first.

And he'll want another £300 million to spend in the summer to improve the squad.....

2-3 against Man City away.
2-1 against Spurs in the FA cup semi final
2-3 away to Palace (fair enough not the best team)
2-1 at home to Chelsea

Off the top of my head this season all games where the opposition scored first and if what you said was true those games wouldn't have been turned around. Yeah, I don't believe you know what you are talking about.

That squad DOES need another 4 maybe 5 players to get back to the very top. It's how far the standards had slipped at the club through appointing two ****e managers and allowing players who aren't good enough to continue at the club.

There's only so much you can do each summer and there's still a good 4/5/6 players at that club who have no business being there.

If United had had Jose from the very start when Fergie left I've no doubt there's a good few players who wouldn't be anywhere near the club. But he didn't and here we are.

This will be Jose's 3rd summer window, after this there can be no excuses. 3 windows is enough to build the team the way he wants it. Anyone who is sub standard and still at the club come August kick off will then be Jose's fault.

I think the world of football can be a little bit too knee jerky at times and people always want the instant result. I'm happy for Jose to get a 3rd season and to be hopefully backed again in the transfer market so he can build the team his way. If he fails I want him to fail on his terms. But it would have been near impossible to 100% sort out the shambles United were in under Moyes/LVG in 1 or 2 summers.

Tom Mann Centuria

Very poor final, as they often are, Chelsea the better team first half, United the second, and really should have at least taken it to extra time, Chelsea couldn't have complained if they had, but Chelsea did defend well, and the silverware is all that matters. Even if it's only an FA Cup.

Mourinho post match was just being his usual self. Lacked class at Chelsea, and hasn't changed.

Oh, and as an England fan, looking forward to seeing Jones and Cahill at the back. Mmmmmm, mouthwatering defence, we're going to win the World Cup.

IncognitoMan

Mr.H wrote: »

Lukaku didnt look too injured to come on late on.

As for players not being in form. If it was one or two players out of form that would be fair enough. But it seems like a lot of players are out of form and you gotta look at the manager for that.

If Jose was still at Chelsea playing like this, United fans would be laughing their asses off.

Yes, if Jose's Chelsea had finished 2nd and United finished 5th we sure would be laughing our asses off.

Francie Barrett

A horrific spectacle, I had to turn off after 10 minutes.

theoneeyedman

Poor game from the bits I saw, United kicked the ball against the blue bus but hadn't the class.up.top to break through. Awful miss from Pogba.
Love all the commentary about Jose being so clever with Herrara manmarking Hazard, when the critical play of the game was from Hazard with his 'shadow' nowhere in sight. Tactical genius.

Nerdlingr

I actually didnt think it was a bad final... second half anyway. I've seen worse...2007 springs to mind!!!
First half the amount of misplaced passes from both teams was shocking. Always amazes me when professional footballers over hit free kicks, cant take corner kicks and are unable to do anything with their 'weaker' feet.
At least united had to go for it second half... and jose got mourinho'd by conte, so that was a nice touch.
United with all their attacking talent couldnt get through the big blue bus.
Happy for conte to get a trophy on probably his last game for chelsea. seems like a likeable enough chap.

one more question : how is phil jones in the england squad? lad is a disaster. (not that im complaining)

Mr.H

IncognitoMan wrote: »

Yes, if Jose's Chelsea had finished 2nd and United finished 5th we sure would be laughing our asses off.

well dont worry everyone else is laughing for you

Mr.H

Nerdlingr wrote: »

I actually didnt think it was a bad final... second half anyway. I've seen worse...2007 springs to mind!!!
First half the amount of misplaced passes from both teams was shocking. Always amazes me when professional footballers over hit free kicks, cant take corner kicks and are unable to do anything with their 'weaker' feet.
At least united had to go for it second half... and jose got mourinho'd by conte, so that was a nice touch.
United with all their attacking talent couldnt get through the big blue bus.
Happy for conte to get a trophy on probably his last game for chelsea. seems like a likeable enough chap.

one more question : how is phil jones in the england squad? lad is a disaster. (not that im complaining)

Cray talk. One of the worst finals in years. Jose left his spare bus in London and it was used. United where great until the final third. Useless is probably a better term. United fans can pretend all; they want but Manchester united are nothing but rubbish on the field. I love football but wish I could pretend I was joking when saying I almost fell asleep watching the final.

Pathetic

The Talking Bread

Francie Barrett wrote: »

A horrific spectacle, I had to turn off after 10 minutes.

no you didn't. And no you didn't.

ERG89

Watched the highlights of the final & it didn't look too bad but as soon as Ruud Gullit was asked about the game he said it was awful :pac:
Chelsea didn't seem to play that great which was surprising considering the result I thought they raised their game like the night they beat Spurs to give Leicester the title but I was surprised considering the clear issues with Conte that United couldn't beat them yesterday

Liam McPoyle

ERG89 wrote: »

Watched the highlights of the final & it didn't look too bad but as soon as Ruud Gullit was asked about the game he said it was awful :pac:
Chelsea didn't seem to play that great which was surprising considering the result I thought they raised their game like the night they beat Spurs to give Leicester the title but I was surprised considering the clear issues with Conte that United couldn't beat them yesterday

Chelsea weren't that great, in fact they were quite pedestrian, they had what, one or two shots on goal other than the penalty? United first half barring the last minute or so were as bad as I've seen them this season, misplaced passes all over the shop. Second half we were better but still couldn't find a way to break down their packed defense. Barring one gilt edged chance (Pogbas header) we didn't put any pressure on the Chelsea 6 yard box. Chelsea were the better of two poor teams.

I've removed some of my posts
Apologies all, didn't take the loss well, mixing it with booze doesn't help

Muahahaha

Pogba was infuriating out there yesterday. He often looked like he was going to turn it on but then he never did. As times he would play a forward pass and then just saunter to catch up with play, it was like he didnt actually want the ball at times. And then that free header at the end, really poor stuff. Id imagine Utd supporters pull their hair out with him at times, he can be really frustrating to watch.

Muahahaha

Muahahaha wrote: »

Pogba was infuriating out there yesterday. He often looked like he was going to turn it on but then he never did. As times he would play a forward pass and then just saunter to catch up with play, it was like he didnt actually want the ball at times. And then that free header at the end, really poor stuff. Id imagine Utd supporters pull their hair out with him at times, he can be really frustrating to watch.

3 times he visibly lost the rag because the ball didn't get played to him. This I totally disagree with.

Muahahaha

M!Ck^ wrote: »

3 times he visibly lost the rag because the ball didn't get played to him. This I totally disagree with.

What Im getting at Mick is he played the ball forward a lot but then literally walked forward/slowly jogged in midfield instead of sprinting to catch up with the play and making himself another option or threat. When he wants Pogba is excellent at coming into the box late and mopping up chances, he did this superbly in vs Man City in the 3-2 game only a few weeks back. Yesterday he was the complete opposite, it was like he didnt really want to be there at times. As I said he is some talent but can also be infuriating at times.

NIMAN

Another shocking advertisement for the EPL.

Dire stuff.

Tom Mann Centuria

NIMAN wrote: »

Another shocking advertisement for the EPL.

Dire stuff.

Did you only watch it now?