Jastine Valdez found dead. No Ana discussion please. Mod warning post 1

OldMrBrennan83

This post has been deleted.

Alkers

BorneTobyWilde wrote:

Cops could have contained situation, seriously don't know how it got to the point where they shot multiple times to kill.

Could be a case of more than one Garda firing

Green Peter

Isn't the internet and boards great. It will be interesting to read back on this in a week's time. Some horrendous ****e from some idiot posters. Anyone who knows anything remotely accurate will not be on boards posting at this time.

thebull85

If it turns out this woman is dead, then the gardai done us all a massive favour by sending that scumbag to the morgue.

pah

In fairness, how often do the gardai shoot someone in this country. I don't know what happened but I do know that the lethal option would have been a last resort. It always is. Even then the purpose is to stop the threat, aim for centre mass and stop the threat, not shoot to kill.

BorneTobyWilde

Strider wrote: »

More complete speculation.

Nowhere to go in speculation? Who was he David Copperfield .


And I said multiple times we don't know facts, can't praise anyone at the minute. We can question it, that is what I'm doing, it's very very strange to see a man riddled with bullets , even with a knife.

Of course we don't even know if there was a knife yet .

pah

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Nowhere to go in speculation? Who was he David Copperfield .


And I said multiple times we don't know facts, can't praise anyone at the minute. We can question it, that is what I'm doing, it's very very strange to see a man riddled with bullets , even with a knife.

Of course we don't even know if there was a knife yet .

FML where to start. Are you a child?

tayto lover

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Nowhere to go in speculation? Who was he David Copperfield .


And I said multiple times we don't know facts, can't praise anyone at the minute. We can question it, that is what I'm doing, it's very very strange to see a man riddled with bullets , even with a knife.

Of course we don't even know if there was a knife yet .

You had your boot stuck into them before you know anything yourself.

Witcher

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Nowhere to go in speculation? Who was he David Copperfield .


And I said multiple times we don't know facts, can't praise anyone at the minute. We can question it, that is what I'm doing, it's very very strange to see a man riddled with bullets , even with a knife.

Of course we don't even know if there was a knife yet .

First the Gardai didn't control the situation correctly, now he was in a car when he was shot according to you.

You haven't a fcuking clue what happened, stop pretending you do.

The Talking Bread

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

It works both ways, how can everyone be praising the cops for killing a man who was in a car and had nowhere to go.
If I can't question it, then surely people should not be praising it without knowing the facts.

Big difference between praising the "cops" for their actions here than abstaining from jumping to conclusions whether they acted in error. Again, noone knows the facts, but I would assume the Gardai done exactly what they deemed to be vital in the situation. Turning the negative attention towards the poor Garda when you haven't a clue what happened in the car park when the real issue is the girl right now is just poor form

Suckit

His Wife/Partner must be going through the mill now.

Finding out all of this and that he is dead. She can't even question him/get angry at him/understand it.

Very sad for all.

BorneTobyWilde

pah wrote: »

FML where to start. Are you a child?

Someone who would ask that is acting like one in all fairness.

theballz

I rarely post on this forum but I needed to log in to say some of you need to seriously cop on.

One More Toy

Cop on lads

ANDREWMUFC

The Garda who shot this deranged pervert made the correct decision

theballz

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Big difference between praising the "cops" for their actions here than abstaining from jumping to conclusions whether they acted in error. Again, noone knows the facts, but I would assume the Gardai done exactly what they deemed to be vital in the situation. Turning the negative attention towards the poor Garda when you haven't a clue what happened in the car park when the real issue is the girl right now is just poor form

When is the last time anyone heard of a Garda in this country shooting anyone? They wouldn’t be used to such a thing at all.

Of course it is all speculation but you can guarantee something bad was going on at the time for them to retaliate in such a manner.

uck51js9zml2yt

pah wrote: »

In fairness, how often do the gardai shoot someone in this country. I don't know what happened but I do know that the lethal option would have been a last resort. It always is. Even then the purpose is to stop the threat, aim for centre mass and stop the threat, not shoot to kill.

Let's not forget the fiasco that was abbeylara.

JimPa

ANDREWMUFC wrote: »

The Garda who shot this deranged pervert made the correct decision

You're assuming it's sexually motivated? It's a likely scenario but there's been enough jumping in this thread already.

G_R

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Someone who would ask that is acting like one in all fairness.

You're the one who has basically decided that the guards have escalated the situation by needlessly shooting him, yet you weren't there.

There will be an investigation by GSOC which I presume will be made public. That will contain the facts. When that is released, feel free to read it and make commentary then.

Until then, you know the same amount of information I do on the subject, which is basically f**k all, so how about we don't jump to conclusions just yet.

ED E

Simona1986 wrote: »

Could be a case of more than one Garda firing

Or an ARU/RSU with an MP7, 16 rounds in a 1s burst.

tayto lover

I can sympathise with the Garda who felt he had to shoot this man. He didn't go to work this morning knowing what was ahead of him.
I also sympathise with the partner/wife of the dead man and her children. She didn't know what was ahead of her today either.
I can sympathise with the parents, family and friends of the missing girl too.They still don't know what's ahead of them.

pah

Cannon Ripe Penalty wrote: »

Let's not forget the fiasco that was abbeylara.

My op was "how often is someone shot by gardai"

Abbeylara was 18 years ago

Raging_Ninja

Cannon Ripe Penalty wrote: »

Let's not forget the fiasco that was abbeylara.

Lessons were learned from that though. Significantly more money was spent on equipment. Procedures changed to place the ERU in charge of the scene instead of the local superintendent.

Never mind that the shooting itself was ruled to have been legitimate by any reasonable standard. There's only so much one can do when faced with an armed mentally ill individual.

At the end of the day, you don't learn very much from success.

Strazdas

Should be pointed out the Armed Response Unit are regularly attending incidents all over Dublin (with the gang feuds etc) and have intercepted attempted hits on people on several occasions. They don't have any sort of a reputation for being trigger happy or opening fire first and asking questions later.

flazio

I presume the Guards will be all over the last registered address for that car by now?

Seth Brundle

ANDREWMUFC wrote: »

The Garda who shot this deranged pervert made the correct decision

One would assume they made a necessary decision but not quite the correct one given that we understand they don't know where she is and now they can't ask him!

thebull85

pah wrote: »

My op was "how often is someone shot by gardai"

Abbeylara was 18 years ago

This was more recent

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/irish-news/man-shot-by-offduty-garda-who-thought-he-was-raider-36063815.html

The Talking Bread

JimPa wrote: »

You're assuming it's sexually motivated? It's a likely scenario but there's been enough jumping in this thread already.

He never said sexually motivated to be fair? He said pervert. Not necessarily the same. Kidnapping a young girl for whatever reason is clearly perverted

Happy4all

How quickly can they get his movements the last 24 he's from phone records?

The Talking Bread

flazio wrote: »

I presume the Guards will be all over the last registered address for that car by now?

It is his wife's car. They established that this morning

BorneTobyWilde

Not sure people here can read plain English. Then seem to see the words they want to see.
No one knows what happened, all we can do is question and find out. But to be polishing the medals for the cops is a bit much at this stage. She is still missing, and they killed the one guy who knows where she is. Hardly a success now is it.

Mam of 4

Jastines family must be living in a nightmare , not knowing if she is lying injured or worse somewhere , unimaginable what they must be going through .
His family , and his partner and children , a nightmare of a different making , none of any of the families lives will ever be the same because of the actions of one man . Horrifying tbh

whiskeyman

Suckit wrote: »

His Wife/Partner must be going through the mill now.

Finding out all of this and that he is dead. She can't even question him/get angry at him/understand it.

Very sad for all.

Not to mention every hack will be on their doorstep in the morning... or most likely already.

Tippex

flazio wrote: »

I presume the Guards will be all over the last registered address for that car by now?

I would imagine they were all over it before the car reg was released to the public.

ED E

Happy4all wrote: »

How quickly can they get his movements the last 24 he's from phone records?

If the court will issue the order you're talking an hour or two.

Qrt

Happy4all wrote: »

How quickly can they get his movements the last 24 he's from phone records?

I'd assume it depends on the operator and if there were any google maps/find my friends type tracking.

pah

thebull85 wrote: »

This was more recent

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/irish-news/man-shot-by-offduty-garda-who-thought-he-was-raider-36063815.html

"It is understood that a struggle then ensued, which resulted in the officer's handgun being discharged."

Not the most clearcut example is it

VonZan

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Not sure people here can read plain English. Then seem to see the words they want to see.
No one knows what happened, all we can do is question and find out. But to be polishing the medals for the cops is a bit much at this stage. She is still missing, and they killed the one guy who knows where she is. Hardly a success now is it.

You seem to be focusing all the blame here on the Gardai and not the man that abducted this girl. What a strange narrative to try and drive at this stage. I would take a long look at yourself before having a go at anyone else.

Gatling

G_R wrote: »

No, if they shoot, they aim for the largest part of the body which is the stomach. Less chance of missing.

Center mass is what and where they target

JimPa

The Talking Bread wrote: »

He never said sexually motivated to be fair? He said pervert. Not necessarily the same. Kidnapping a young girl for whatever reason is clearly perverted

True, and I knew that would come up. But it would be a poor word to use in such a circumstance if there was no sexual motivation.

Happy4all

Happy4all wrote: »

How quickly can they get his movements the last 24 he's from phone records?

Think my question was missed by the poster here who also has a 171 quashqai.

Does the gps within the car log data for a few days?

Omackeral

pah wrote: »

My op was "how often is someone shot by gardai"

Abbeylara was 18 years ago

A few months ago but it's definitely rare, I agree.

Man shot by off-duty Garda in August last year

G_R

Happy4all wrote: »

How quickly can they get his movements the last 24 he's from phone records?

Potentially a couple of seconds. If location services are on on his phone, they just need yo open Google maps and go to the timeline and it'll all be there.

Sam Quentin

ED E wrote: »

If the court will issue the order you're talking an hour or two.

Your kidding right?
Surely a judge would sign that 'off' in seconds...

Raging_Ninja

G_R wrote: »

Potentially a couple of seconds. If location services are on on his phone, they just need yo open Google maps and go to the timeline and it'll all be there.

if the phone is unlocked...

wellwhynot

It reminds me a bit of the O’Dwyer case. He was to his family a normal family man as was Larry Murphy. Both of the above went home and acted as normal after murdering their vicims.

Mark Hennessy didn’t though. He had been missing since yesterday. He never returned home as planned. Does that give us some hope that Jastine is out there somewhere?

BorneTobyWilde

Mam of 4 wrote: »

Jastines family must be living in a nightmare , not knowing if she is lying injured or worse somewhere , unimaginable what they must be going through .
His family , and his partner and children , a nightmare of a different making , none of any of the families lives will ever be the same because of the actions of one man . Horrifying tbh

I think we can all agree they are asking WHY WHY WHY did they kill him, he knows where she is.
There would be something seriously wrong if they were not questioning why the needed to kill him.

Qrt

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Think my question was missed by the poster here who also has a 171 quashqai.

Does the gps within the car log data for a few days?

I would imagine it depends on the model of the car. There may be an insurance related "black box" or similar installed. Gardaí likely know what they do and don't have already.

Roger Hassenforder

Omackeral wrote: »

A few months ago but it's definitely rare, I agree.

Man shot by off-duty Garda in August last year

Pah just put that one to bed

Happy4all

G_R wrote: »

Potentially a couple of seconds. If location services are on on his phone, they just need yo open Google maps and go to the timeline and it'll all be there.

Hoping she is found alive and soon. Distressing stuff for her family.