Looking to invest in Dublin, need some help from locals :)

Oren Plen

Hi there,

I am not Irish, but I've been interested in recent months in buying a property somewhere that could give me a good potential for price increase in the upcoming years.

When I examine different European markets, Dublin seem promising: Prices still haven't reached their 2008 peak, but are definitely rising, it is a very developed and modern city, which attracts many large businesses due to its tax policy, and everyone speaks english which is great (for me at least). 

In addition, current rental yields are very high compared to most of Europe and the rental demand, for properties in central locations in Dublin, seems quite high and I do not expect it to change dramatically, considering all the academic and business activity in the city.

My general plan is to buy a 1BR in a central place in Dublin (that would guarantee very high rental demand), with a budget of up to 200K Euros. Since I'm usually very cautious with these things I'd be happy to get your opinion on these issues, which still trouble me:

1. Would you aggree with my analysis of the potential for price growth in the Dublin?

2. Is this budget enough to buy a reasonable 1BR property that would allow me to achieve my goals? If not, what would be a suitable budget? 

3. My plan is to rent the property to students/young professionals. Are 1BR appartments attractive among this crowd? Do 1BR apps haev strong demand (when I search MyHome it seems they are)? will they aggree to live in a 30-40m^2 1BR apt? or do they invariably live with flat mates in 3-4 BR appartments, which will leave me without potential tenants?

4. I did some research and it seems that Dublin 7, and Dublin 2, are the most suitable in terms of high demand, decent areas and relatively lower prices. Am I correct?

5. How Should I approach finding a property? I do'nt live in Ireland, nor do I plan to visit it in the near future. 
Thus, I was thinking of finding a reputable estate agent that will find a decent property for me, as well as a management company. Obviously this will reduce returns, but they will probably still be much higher than I can get in my country. Of course I will do the maximum due dilligence, but naturally this can only be done up to a certain limit. How would you suggest finding a fair estate agent? 

6. Once I am offered a prporety, I plan to post it here to get the opinion of the "educated crowd" and see if I'm not being ripped off. I was also thinking of paying an appraiser/home inspector to test the house before I buy it to make sure it is indeed in the condition the realtor says it is. Does this make sense? is it possible? do you see any problem with this strategy? Would you do anything else?

7. What is the net rental return you estimate I can get from such a property? (After reducing vacancy periods, repairs, taxes, property management fees etc.).

8. How much is the typical fee for property management?

** If this is of some importance, I have european citizenship (Romanian passport) **

Thank you!!

whomitconcerns

erm...with that many questions....don't buy in ireland. have you been to Dublin before? Vorbesti engleză fluent?

2Mad2BeMad

I've a shed out me back, you can have it for 200k, rent it for 1500 quid a month.
Make your money back in no time

uck51js9zml2yt

2Mad2BeMad wrote: »

I've a shed out me back, you can have it for 200k, rent it for 1500 quid a month.
Make your money back in no time

200k won't buy him a shed!

alwald

Give me that 200K and I will buy a 1 bed no bother, PM for more info !

Oren Plen

whomitconcerns wrote: »

erm...with that many questions....don't buy in ireland. have you been to Dublin before? Vorbesti engleză fluent?

Da, Vorbesc excelent în engleză.
I would have asked the same questions, no matter where. I aggree buying at home is the best option. However, with current yields being close to zero, I think we need to take more risk.
Yeah, I've been to Ireland last month. Amazing place. Visited Dublin, which convinced me even further of how great a place this is for investing.

whomitconcerns

ok..so agents work very different in Ireland than in Romania, you pay them as the owner, then tenants dont pay agency fees to rent a place. You will need an agent if you are owning but not living there. Also the tenants have to deduct 20% from the rent to cover potential tax liabilities for a non resident landlord.

After that....€200k wont get you much and certainly not city centre, a one bed will be a pita to rent out unless big, tenants rights in Ireland are VERY strong.

If you insist on going forward utilise AirBnb or something similar with an agency to manage it for you. Youll thank me in the long run Forget about getting tenants. Good luck!

ted1

You need to look at the tax you’ll pay and also the costs associated with trying to evict a tenant who doesn’t pay. We have very strict eviction laws.
It’s much safer to invest in commercial property

LionelNashe

For 200k, there are two apartments listed on www.daft.ie listed in Dublin 2, and one of them is clearly in Dublin 1, so I'd say Dublin 2 is out of the question on that budget.

Dublin 1 is *just about* possible, and Dublin 7, parts of which are very central, but I wouldn't trust any predictions about capital gain.

Samuel T. Cogley

You'll get something in the rougher parts of D7/D8. They're not terrible areas just a bit lively. You'll also probably get something in D1 but that could be in a bad spot.

I put a thread up here about a UK 'documentary' series called Bad Tenants, Rogue Landlords. Watch an episode or two on YouTube and double the amount of time it takes to get stuff done. Are you able to support that sort of downtime?

Property management is approx. 10% of rent.

Ireland has no way of properly vetting tenants so pick an established EA (Estate Agent) and hope for the best.

the_syco

Oren Plen wrote: »

In addition, current rental yields are very high compared to most of Europe and the rental demand

What is the percentage or the rent do most of Europe tax?

Oren Plen wrote: »

2. Is this budget enough to buy a reasonable 1BR property that would allow me to achieve my goals? If not, what would be a suitable budget?

Have a separate budget for furnishing the house? Typically, houses are rented furnished in Ireland.

Oren Plen wrote: »

3. My plan is to rent the property to students/young professionals. Are 1BR appartments attractive among this crowd?

1BR will be for young professionals. Students won't be able to afford a 1BR apartment, unless there's actually several people living there.

Wesser

There is no agent in Ireland to help you buy a house. Agents act for the vendor only .
I think it's very unlikely that you find anything for 200k in Dublin.

Samuel T. Cogley

Wesser wrote: »

There is no agent in Ireland to help you buy a house. Agents act for the vendor only .
I think it's very unlikely that you find anything for 200k in Dublin.

Plenty of 1BR apartments in D8 for under 200K many making significant returns through Airbnb.

the_syco

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

Plenty of 1BR apartments in D8 for under 200K many making significant returns through Airbnb.

AirBnB would probably be the best idea for investment. Something like this house may suit the OP, but 30k more looks better, and has more room. Would perhaps avoid buying an apartment with a view to do AirBnB's, if management companies are going against them.

_brendand_

Wesser wrote: »

There is no agent in Ireland to help you buy a house. Agents act for the vendor only .
I think it's very unlikely that you find anything for 200k in Dublin.

Not true - http://<SNIP>/

CalRobert

You're asking for a lot of research for free. Why should we provide it?

Oren Plen

CalRobert wrote: »

You're asking for a lot of research for free. Why should we provide it?

Karma.

GingerLily

Oren Plen wrote: »

CalRobert wrote: »

You're asking for a lot of research for free. Why should we provide it?

Karma.

Taking affordable homes away from people living in Dublin - I'm more worried about homes for people here - not Karma

_brendand_

GingerLily wrote: »

Taking affordable homes away from people living in Dublin - I'm more worried about homes for people here - not Karma

To be quite frank, the only people doing a disservice to the people of Dublin here are those folks suggesting he AirBnB the property instead of renting it out.

beauf

This is what investors mean by "professional" landlords.

Samuel T. Cogley

_brendand_ wrote: »

To be quite frank, the only people doing a disservice to the people of Dublin here are those folks suggesting he AirBnB the property instead of renting it out.

There is a massive lack of hotel rooms which is damaging tourism and business generally; hence why Airbnb is so lucrative. The money lost to the economy is actual money lost where in, at least some cases, permanent residents have other options such as sharing, staying at home or commuting.

Furthermore if the government don't want properties let out through Airbnb they need to stop screwing private landlords.

Samuel T. Cogley

GingerLily wrote: »

Taking affordable homes away from people living in Dublin - I'm more worried about homes for people here - not Karma

How many people are buying 1BR properties to live in long term? I doubt it's very many. These units are almost exclusively for renters and without Landlords there's no where to rent.

Sleeper12

Oren Plen wrote:

In addition, current rental yields are very high compared to most of Europe and the rental demand, for properties in central locations in Dublin, seems quite high and I do not expect it to change dramatically, considering all the academic and business activity in the city.

Rents are at their highest level ever. Don't rely on them staying this high. Rents could drop by a third or more within 5 years as the shortage of homes tapers off.

I'm not saying don't buy. Just pointing out that rent this high isn't the norm

beauf

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

There is a massive lack of hotel rooms which is damaging tourism and business generally; hence why Airbnb is so lucrative. The money lost to the economy is actual money lost where in, at least some cases, permanent residents have other options such as sharing, staying at home or commuting.

Furthermore if the government don't want properties let out through Airbnb they need to stop screwing private landlords.

Hotel industry went through the same boom bust boom everything else did.

https://www.independent.ie/business/irish/zombie-hotels-arise-in-ireland-as-recession-empties-rooms-26676456.html
http://www.thejournal.ie/hotel-profits-ireland-2266734-Aug2015/
http://www.dublineconomy.ie/2018/02/01/dublin-hotel/

Kinda need to over supply otherwise the bust will repeat.

GingerLily

Samuel T. Cogley wrote: »

GingerLily wrote: »

Taking affordable homes away from people living in Dublin - I'm more worried about homes for people here - not Karma

How many people are buying 1BR properties to live in long term? I doubt it's very many. These units are almost exclusively for renters and without Landlords there's no where to rent.

My friend has recently.

I'm not going to bother persuading someone not to invest. I do think it's obvious though that Dublin doesn't need small time long distances landlords investing in property here.

Samuel T. Cogley

GingerLily wrote: »

My friend has recently.

I'm not going to bother persuading someone not to invest. I do think it's obvious though that Dublin doesn't need small time long distances landlords investing in property here.

OP is likely to be a more effective LL based in Romania than someone based in Cavan. Probably more likely to pay tax too!

Also glad to hear 1 beds are starting to sell to owner occupiers, there's hope for me shifting mine yet! :pac:

You've missed the boat to a huge degree IMO.

dar100

Nice little earner on this

http://www.daft.ie/dublin/houses-for-sale/north-circular-road/emmet-street-north-circular-road-dublin-1727011/

Samuel T. Cogley

https://www.daft.ie/dublin/apartments-for-sale/dublin-8/apartment-at-no-6-ushers-quay-dublin-8-dublin-8-dublin-1737924/

Probably about the best value you'll get on a 1BR CC apartment.

Oren Plen

Thanks, looks great, seems that with a bit of patience/luck it's possible to find such a property.
Do you have any buyer's agent you can recommend as trustworthy to help me find such a property? (hope it's OK to ask here, I also wrote you a PM).

Oren Plen

Augeo wrote: »

You've missed the boat to a huge degree IMO.

Why? 
Judging by the yields, Dublin's financial status, the low supply of new houses, current prices compared to previous peak levels and the short time that has passed since the trough, if I had to bet, there is still much room for price increase. I know it's just a bet but so is leaving money in the bank