Exit poll: The post referendum thread. No electioneering.

CruelCoin

Necrominus wrote: »

Did you read your own link and notice the flaw yet?

I posted two links.

It's sorted. Don't worry about it.

Feel free to dance around the point that was made though.

North and west are lower in the vote.

It's odd, and i feel its worth talking about.

Fr_Dougal

erica74 wrote: »

I wish all these “never again” people would shut up until we actually have the law changed. There will be plenty more women traveling to the UK. Nothing has changed, yet.

erica74

Noveight wrote: »

Much of the reaction seems to be a bit over the top and bordering on vicariousness, tbh.

Why do you think it's over the top? Do you know the people whose reactions you have witnessed? Do you know why they may be reacting so strongly?

Shurimgreat

Necrominus wrote: »

Yeah, populists gonna populist.

My hope is they are voted out at the next GE, truly show the Healy-Raes and their ilk that parish pump politics in Ireland is a thing of the past.

Country, not constituency first.

But I doubt it will bring about meaningful change tbh.

Agreed about populism. Its an Irish gombeen thing. People will always vote for the politician who changes their views overnight if they think there's more votes to be had rather than holding strong convictions either way.

You only have to look at the pathetic populism of FF, Sinn Fein and the Healy Raes over water charges to see it at its worst. They were for charges until they saw the votes were going to the other side. The Healy Raes were against charges and Irish Water but supplied machinery to them. You couldn't make it up.

enda1

Necrominus wrote: »

Of course I want diversity. I want my TDs to put their country first....

You know, the JOB they are elected to do?

Leave the surfacing of roads to the county councillors who are also elected officials.

TDs are actually supposed to represent their constituencies, not their country

It wasnt me123

Itssoeasy wrote: »

I understand that but only Ronan Mullen has said publicly that he will actively not support the bill and I'm assuming trying to water it down to the point of it being 8th amendment lite.

Nah, no-one is listening to him, not even the people on his own side.

He will be overwhelmed in the Seanad, the majority of TDs that were No voters, seem to say that as the majority was so large they won't stand in the way of the legislation. Ronan Mullen will just look like the ignoramous he is

erica74

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

I wish all these “never again” people would shut up until we actually have the law changed. There will be plenty more women traveling to the UK. Nothing has changed, yet.

To be fair, from what I've seen and read, "never again" is used in respect of what happened to Savita. I read it as a demand rather than a proclamation.

Noveight

erica74 wrote: »

Why do you think it's over the top?

Because their reaction seems to be making a bit of a carnival of the whole thing, like it's a personal achievement of theirs that the Yes vote has gone through. Furthermore, it is disrespectful of those who who voted No and I don't believe that is called for. Gloating over the result or claiming a moral high-ground isn't beneficial to anyone, nor is it a good reflection on a person themselves.

erica74 wrote: »

Do you know the people whose reactions you have witnessed?

Indeed I do, very well.

erica74 wrote: »

Do you know why they may be reacting so strongly?

No idea why they'd react as they have chosen to, precisely the reason why I believe it's unwarranted.

Dookie Monster

Amalgam wrote: »

Cruel and callous is a sceptic tank full of anonymous corpses. Devoid of dignity and identity. Their Mothers driven to the very end of their emotional and physical wits.

Two wrongs don't make a right

It wasnt me123

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

I wish all these “never again” people would shut up until we actually have the law changed. There will be plenty more women traveling to the UK. Nothing has changed, yet.

You think?

I would wager a bet (but the topic is so serious) that if a woman went to her doctor now, even before the legislation is enacted, their stance would be a lot different. Now they could give information and discuss options without fear of census. No doctor will be criticised for that even before the legislation is passed.

CruelCoin

Shurimgreat wrote: »

America has among the highest gun crime rates in the world. Do you want to keep up with them on that too because they are "modern".

If you had to choose between the states and syria, i know which you'd choose, so stop trying to move the goalposts.

spookwoman

This says it all about the No side

Necro

enda1 wrote:

TDs are actually supposed to represent their constituencies, not their country

Represent their constituencies on national issues. That doesn't happen in a lot of cases

sonofenoch

Euthanasia next.....if people say yes that (women) have the freedom of choice with their own bodies ie terminate a life in it ..............why is the freedom of choice to terminate your own life so taboo

MadYaker

Theres going to be a reckless session in Galway tonight. I canfeel it coming

Shurimgreat

Billy86 wrote: »

Poor comparison. America might have the highest gun crime rate in the world, but most developed western societies do not as they have much tighter restrictions and attitudes. Hence I would follow the developed western societies and not the outlier that is the USA. Wouldn't you?

I can name several impovereished sh1tholes relative to Ireland instead where abortion is freely available. The poster made an irrelevant point. I think I'd rather live in San Marino than Venezuela. I'm sure you'd feel the same way

amcalester

sonofenoch wrote: »

Euthanasia next.....if people say yes that (women) have the freedom of choice with their own bodies ie terminate a life in it ..............why is the freedom of choice to terminate your own life so taboo

Nothing stopping a government legislating for that at the minute.

enda1

Necrominus wrote: »

Represent their constituencies on national issues. That doesn't happen in a lot of cases

I think we're veering away from the OP but I'd say that's precisely what most do do and what preople refer to as parish pump politics.

It's our government which is supposed to think in the common good and on a national basis.

Dookie Monster

blueser wrote: »

I'll ask again, seeing as you didn't answer me the first time around. Who are you to call for people to be excommunicated?

Should be treated like all murderers and their accomplices

Itssoeasy

Simon Harris doesn't even need to campaign in the next GE. He can sit at home going on the scenes at Dublin castle. I'd say Leo is secretly unhappy as Simon Harris is certainly a future FG leader now.

Noveight

sonofenoch wrote: »

Euthanasia next.....if people say yes that (women) have the freedom of choice with their own bodies ie terminate a life in it ..............why is the freedom of choice to terminate your own life so taboo

Interesting point there.

woejus

spookwoman wrote: »

This says it all about the No side

At least they offered the CHOICE of recycling your unwanted pregnancy in this picture...very progressive

MadYaker

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Simon Harris doesn't even need to campaign in the next GE. He can sit at home going on the scenes at Dublin castle. I'd say Leo is secretly unhappy as Simon Harris is certainly a future FG leader now.

Any Fianna Fail TDs who pushed for a no vote need to take a long hard look in the mirror. Almost every constituency has voted yes. Big win for Micheal Martin though.

DickSwiveller

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Simon Harris doesn't even need to campaign in the next GE. He can sit at home going on the scenes at Dublin castle. I'd say Leo is secretly unhappy as Simon Harris is certainly a future FG leader now.

Is abortion the only political issue? Do people not are about anything else?

Billy86

Shurimgreat wrote: »

I can name several impovereished sh1tholes relative to Ireland instead where abortion is freely available. The poster made an irrelevant point. I think I'd rather live in San Marino than Venezuela. I'm sure you'd feel the same way

They were actually responding to my post, here is the full and comprehensive list of all countries with abortion laws most comparable to ours:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_law
Angola, Central African Republic, Republic of the Congo, Democratic Republic of the Congo, Gabon, São Tomé and Príncipe, South Sudan, Egypt, Libya, Lesotho, Djibouti, Madagascar, Malawi, Mauritius, Somalia, Iraq, Andorra, San Marino, Lebanon, Syria, Yemen, Lesotho, Guatemala, Honduras, Paraguay, Suriname, Venezuela, Tonga, Tuvalu, Papua New Guinea, Solomon Islands, Micronesia, Marshall Islands, Kiribati, Palau.

You can try and argue that impoverished or backwards countries have more freedom of abortion, but you'll need to include the likes of the US, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Japan, Korea, essentially all of Europe, etc etc in there as well.

Shurimgreat

spookwoman wrote: »

This says it all about the No side

Immature post of the year.
I bet there are yes posters on signposts for gp surgeries and hospitals if you bothered to look.

Fr Tod Umptious

STB. wrote: »

The tallies clearly indicate in both their constituncies that neither of their constituents agree with eithers stance on this issue.

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

An for the millionth time I'm not saying the No would win those constituencies.

The point is that in those constituencies I would not be surprised if the win % for Yes was lower than the overall national %.

And as a result the TDs in question being far more in touch with their electorate than people think.

There you go

Healy Rae's
Kerry 58.3/41.7

McGrath
Tipp 59.1/40.9


Lower than the Average that is coming in right now at 67/32

Ulysses Gaze

Dookie Monster wrote: »

Should be treated like all murderers and their accomplices

spookwoman

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Jesus wept. I have passed dozens and dozens of yes posters all within a few hundred yards.

I took them today. Out to waterford airport there is maybe 2 posters on the road then you get this.
The others passage east and no everywhere

Itssoeasy

MadYaker wrote: »

Any Fianna Fail TDs who pushed for a no vote need to take a long hard look in the mirror. Almost every constituency has voted yes. Big win for Micheal Martin though.

It's can be seen as a big win now for him. But if it had gone the other way he'd be in a spot of bother politically.

Well I've seen some of them stating that they will in no way impede the bills progress. I mean even mattie mcgrath seemed to not be as argumentative as he normally is. He brought up the committee again which I didn't think was relevant.

The one thing I didn't like as a whole over the campaign was during the debates with an audience was the clapping from both sides. I couldn't understand why it was clapping.

Billy86

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

There you go

Healy Rae's
Kerry 58.3/41.7

McGrath
Tipp 59.1/40.9


Lower than the Average that is coming in right now at 67/32

Lower than average true, but I would consider 16-18% margins to be a pretty clear mandate. They were out of touch on that front, but hopefully they amend their stance accordingly (and while I don't like the Healy-Rae's, I have a lot of faith that they will... they're pragmatists first and foremost).

retro:electro

DickSwiveller wrote: »

Is abortion the only political issue? Do people not are about anything else?

Are you sad? Do you feel left out that you didn’t get a referendum?

Shurimgreat

spookwoman wrote: »

I took them today. Out to waterford airport there is maybe 2 posters on the road then you get this.
The others passage east and no everywhere

Ok go back out and take some pictures of yes posters including those on signposts for hospitals, clinics, gp surgeries and probably churches and any other location. Report back with your findings.

Billy86

Itssoeasy wrote: »

The one thing I didn't like as a whole over the campaign was during the debates with an audience was the clapping from both sides. I couldn't understand why it was clapping.

Same here, and frankly if this is to become the new norm in political debates (as has been the case in a few countries in the last few years) it's time to have them behind closed doors (though still televised of course). A debate on serious issues like this should never, ever be reduced to a game of 'who can shout the loudest' and that should not be tolerated.

spookwoman

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Ok go back out and take some pictures of yes posters including those on signposts for hospitals, clinics, gp surgeries and probably chur ches and any other location. Report back with your findings.

There is no signs for clinics, gp surgeries and churches near me. You are not allowed to put posters on signs for hospitals as they are classed as road signs.
Try again and by the way the pIctures represent irony. Look it up, I R O N Y

Itssoeasy

DickSwiveller wrote: »

Is abortion the only political issue? Do people not are about anything else?

Of course it isn't and how you took that I meant that. It was clearly meant To refer to 8th amendment issue.

Yes they do but it seems because he was the minister for health who pushed for a referendum and drafted the heads of bills he will be seen favourable by the voters in Wicklow who voted yes.

Fr_Dougal

It wasnt me123 wrote: »

You think?

I would wager a bet (but the topic is so serious) that if a woman went to her doctor now, even before the legislation is enacted, their stance would be a lot different. Now they could give information and discuss options without fear of census. No doctor will be criticised for that even before the legislation is passed.

You think more women won’t have to travel to the UK for an abortion before the actual law changes? 🤔

ArmaniJeanss

Noveight wrote: »

Because their reaction seems to be making a bit of a carnival of the whole thing, like it's a personal achievement of theirs that the Yes vote has gone through. Furthermore, it is disrespectful of those who who voted No and I don't believe that is called for. Gloating over the result or claiming a moral high-ground isn't beneficial to anyone, nor is it a good reflection on a person themselves.



Indeed I do, very well.



No idea why they'd react as they have chosen to, precisely the reason why I believe it's unwarranted.

My big sister tells me stories of the 1983 8th campaign, but to be honest even she admits they are a bit boring, it was a no-contest, a rout.

More relevant to her is the slightly forgotten 87-88 campaigns around the Well Woman & Open Line clinics which gave non-directive counselling (i.e., they didn't tell you that having your baby was the only option) and got subjected to pickets, graffiti, dail questions, police involvement (generally neutral in fairness), high court injunctions, the Hamilton judgement.

Her and her friends are celebrating like goodo today - I think it's understandable.

WoolyJumper

To be honest yesterday if you told me urban areas (outside Dublin) were coming back with percentages in the high 50s id have been relieved. The fact that areas that I expected to be a no or a very weak yes are coming back with these figures is a huge (pleasant) surprise. So yeah there is still an urban/rural divide when you consider areas in Dublin are coming with 70% + and other urban areas averaging at 65%. But the results show that the more rural areas are not as traditional or conservative as we thought. They are still coming back with a majority yes and a pretty decisive yes in many areas. Not many would have predicted that yesterday. The urban rural divide is not as big as it used to be.

Shurimgreat

Billy86 wrote: »

Lower than average true, but I would consider 16-18% margins to be a pretty clear mandate. They were out of touch on that front, but hopefully they amend their stance accordingly (and while I don't like the Healy-Rae's, I have a lot of faith that they will... they're pragmatists first and foremost).

Thats one way of describing them. The other is as vote chasing populists who will tell the Yes voter in Caherciveen they now support the Yes side and the No voter in Kilorglin they were No all along.

_Dara_

Mickeroo wrote: »

I'll be nothing but sensitive to any no voters I personally know or spoke to. I have nothing but respect for their opinions regardless of how much I disagree.

As for the troglodites at the Iona institute or Mcguirk, Tóibín,Sherlock, Rick Moranis and Co well they don't deserve any. Their whole campaign was based on a lack of sensitivity, scare mongering and lies.

The thought of what they must feel like today is frankly delightful. Maybe that makes me immature but **** it, I'll leave the maturity to better people than me. I'm proud as all hell to be Irish today.

Plus fucking one.

It wasnt me123

Fr_Dougal wrote: »

You think more women won’t have to travel to the UK for an abortion before the actual law changes? ��

No I don't but at least they won't have to slink off. They can go to their gps and probably get information and options.

Last week they caught a plane with no back up medical treatment. No if they feel they have to catch a plane, their gp will be able to provide back up medical treatment with no problems.

Thats what I meant. Now they can discuss options with their gps and get treatment and information from them.

woejus

Shurimgreat wrote: »

Immature post of the year.
I bet there are yes posters on signposts for gp surgeries and hospitals if you bothered to look.

So salty... your tone of bitter disappointment is such a joy to read.

Justin Credible Darts

loving the seething., sulking and bitterness of the no brigade to accept what 70% of the country voted for.

spookwoman

woejus wrote: »

So salty... your tone of bitter disappointment is such a joy to read.

same lot were calling the Yes side bitter

Deusexmachina

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Simon Harris doesn't even need to campaign in the next GE. He can sit at home going on the scenes at Dublin castle. I'd say Leo is secretly unhappy as Simon Harris is certainly a future FG leader now.

Jesus, thats my sleep ruined for the next few nights....the horror!!

Noveight

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

My big sister tells me stories of the 1983 8th campaign, but to be honest even she admits they are a bit boring, it was a no-contest, a rout.

More relevant to her is the slightly forgotten 87-88 campaigns around the Well Woman & Open Line clinics which gave non-directive counselling (i.e., they didn't tell you that having your baby was the only option) and got subjected to pickets, graffiti, dail questions, police involvement (generally neutral in fairness), high court injunctions, the Hamilton judgement.

Her and her friends are celebrating like goodo today - I think it's understandable.

It seems like your sister has a pretty far-reaching history with the struggle though. If she has a lot of time and effort invested in it a hooly today is definitely well earned and beyond understandable. Fair play to all involved, actually.

The person I'm on about would have a far lesser genuine connection to the choices at the heart of the referendum and so I'm not sure their celebrations are as warranted as those of your sister or her friends. I think they may be happier that the No side lost than they are with the Yes side having won, which isn't a great attitude

Itssoeasy

Deusexmachina wrote: »

Jesus, thats my sleep ruined for the next few nights....the horror!!

Well I said FG leader not Taoiseach. Apologies for ruining your sleep.

RacoonQueen

There were never any 'winners' in this. What a woman or a couple must go through to come to the decision to seek an abortion is unimaginable. May this landslide result help the women who still have to travel each week until it all comes together, have easier journeys than those who went before them, knowing they are some of the last.

Deusexmachina

RacoonQueen wrote: »

There were never any 'winners' in this. What a woman or a couple must go through to come to the decision to seek an abortion is unimaginable. May this landslide result help the women who still have to travel each week until it all comes together, have easier journeys than those who went before them, knowing they are some of the last.

Well said. I suspect some of the gloaters on here didnt actually bother their arse to vote. But a bandwagon is always a magnet for some.