Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2018 pt3

Lord TSC

Don't get the "I'd rather no one than Boateng" posts

There's players I'd rather more, but I'd also rather the money be spent than not, and while I don't know much about the specific player, having a player used to playing for a top level team, at a top level, is better than nothing right now.

It looks, for instance, as if we can get Boateng now and Toby next summer. Boateng would be a short term solution, but a short term solution seems better than none at all.

Again, its a "cutting your nose off to spite your face" mentality.....

Minderbinder

Rossi IRL wrote: »

There is no denying that Woodward is great at getting in the sponsors. I think we could do with somebody to run the on field stuff like signings and managers etc to work alongside Woodward.

It must be so hard to find sponsors for United. The market is what it is. He hasn’t done anything revolutionary.

Whatsisname

After our last 2 signings from Bayern, I'd always be wary of signing anyone they're willing to let go.

Drumpot

pjohnson wrote: »

Jaysus Rashford has joined some company.

Ibrahimovic
Rooney
Van Nistelrooy
Sheringham

the previous incumbents of it!

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Think Beckham too.

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

Mark Hughes
Denis Law

Clayton Blackmore

IamtheWalrus

Mitch Connor wrote: »

And that's the type of signing the club are ultimately interested in.

Ouch!

Lord TSC

Not the greatest of sources, but it certainly feels as if the Italian press have started the "PogBack" narrative, and this will play into it....

https://twitter.com/CmdotCom_En/status/1026493643622895616?s=09

J. Marston

Would we even profit if we sold him? Suppose the World Cup win boosts his value because his United performances sure as fúck haven't.

Drumpot

Lord TSC wrote: »

Not the greatest of sources, but it certainly feels as if the Italian press have started the "PogBack" narrative, and this will play into it....

https://twitter.com/CmdotCom_En/status/1026493643622895616?s=09

I don’t know anything about Savic but if he’s good, Jose wants him, doesn’t want Pogba and united can get a decent fee for Pogba I’m all for it....

bangkok

Drumpot wrote: »

I don’t know anything about Savic but if he’s good, Jose wants him, doesn’t want Pogba and united can get a decent fee for Pogba I’m all for it....

he was useless in the world cup anyway

Lord TSC

Drumpot wrote: »

I don’t know anything about Savic but if he’s good, Jose wants him, doesn’t want Pogba and united can get a decent fee for Pogba I’m all for it....

The issu is "decent few".

The reports are saying €110m. In the current market, with such little time left, I'd want at least €160m.

I'd also not be massively confident we'd get the required business done either.

Turtwig

Demichelis joined city as a short term option. Turned out to be quite good for them in the end. Boateng is better than most other options available. If the club can get him they should.

dor83

If Juve actually want Pogba back Utd should just tell them a straight swap of him and Darmian for Pjanic and Sandro, I think Pjanic is an excellent player and would be an improvement on Pogba(more consistent) and while he is more valuable Sandro for Darmian would make up the difference.

bangkok

dor83 wrote: »

If Juve actually want Pogba back Utd should just tell them a straight swap of him and Darmian for Pjanic and Sandro, I think Pjanic is an excellent player and would be an improvement on Pogba(more consistent) and while he is more valuable Sandro for Darmian would make up the difference.

Pogba is a miles better player than pjanic. not even a contest

dor83

bangkok wrote: »

Pogba is a miles better player than pjanic. not even a contest

At his best he probably is but how often is he at his best for Utd?

bangkok

dor83 wrote: »

At his best he probably is but how often is he at his best for Utd?

he is still better than pjanic even when he is average

Drumpot

bangkok wrote: »

he was useless in the world cup anyway

How does that benefit us if he won’t put in the same performances for united?

I don’t care what he did for Juventus or does for France if he won’t put in the same efforts for united.

Funny that Pogba said he didn’t change his haircut to stop distractions and focused on the job at hand for France..... Jose was quoted as saying that his France performances showed he can play brilliant when he has no distractions and focuses on what his team needs.

Let me guess, he needs to play alongside Kante to perform? Or Deshamps makes him feel more loved? Or he played in a slightly different role to the one people were saying he couldn’t do at united?

Eventually bangkok you have to see that Pogbas issues at united and failure to perform at the levels we saw at the WC are not all completely down to external factors beyond Pogbas control. So then what good is it united having a world class player who’s not arsed making it work and will only step it who
When it suits him.

bangkok

Drumpot wrote: »

How does that benefit us if he won’t put in the same performances for united?

I don’t care what he did for Juventus or does for France if he won’t put in the same efforts for united.

Funny that Pogba said he didn’t change his haircut to stop distractions and focused on the job at hand for France..... Jose was quoted as saying that his France performances showed he can play brilliant when he has no distractions and focuses on what his team needs.

Let me guess, he needs to play alongside Kante to perform? Or Deshamps makes him feel more loved? Or he played in a slightly different role to the one people were saying he couldn’t do at united?

Eventually bangkok you have to see that Pogbas issues at united and failure to perform at the levels we saw at the WC are not all completely down to external factors beyond Pogbas control. So then what good is it united having a world class player who’s not arsed making it work and will only step it who
When it suits him.

i blame jose.

did you see that "performance" yesterday v Bayern? nothing short of disgraceful. wouldnt be a bit surprised to see leicester turn up to old trafford and beat utd

dor83

bangkok wrote: »

he is still better than pjanic even when he is average

No he's not, Pjanic is a fantastic player who is in the top tier for his position and while Pogba has the potential to be probably the best player in the world(certainly in his position) he doesn't show it enough for Utd. Over the course of a full season I would much rather have Pjanic in a team than Pogba right now, plus he is one of the best free kick takers around so that is a bonus.

Drumpot

bangkok wrote: »

i blame jose.

did you see that "performance" yesterday v Bayern? nothing short of disgraceful. wouldnt be a bit surprised to see leicester turn up to old trafford and beat utd

You blame a manager for a player not giving a f**k? Seriously?

bangkok

Drumpot wrote: »

You blame a manager for a player not giving a f**k? Seriously?

i blame the manager for us playing **** football as a team, not just pogba

Mitch Connor

Drumpot wrote: »

How does that benefit us if he won’t put in the same performances for united?

I don’t care what he did for Juventus or does for France if he won’t put in the same efforts for united.

Funny that Pogba said he didn’t change his haircut to stop distractions and focused on the job at hand for France..... Jose was quoted as saying that his France performances showed he can play brilliant when he has no distractions and focuses on what his team needs.

Let me guess, he needs to play alongside Kante to perform? Or Deshamps makes him feel more loved? Or he played in a slightly different role to the one people were saying he couldn’t do at united?

Eventually bangkok you have to see that Pogbas issues at united and failure to perform at the levels we saw at the WC are not all completely down to external factors beyond Pogbas control. So then what good is it united having a world class player who’s not arsed making it work and will only step it who
When it suits him.

No

Pogba said he didn't change his hair so that others wouldn't be able to use it against him - so they, not him, would concentrate on his football.

Drumpot

Mitch Connor wrote: »

No

Pogba said he didn't change his hair so that others wouldn't be able to use it against him - so they, not him, would concentrate on his football.

So Why should it matter what “they say” if it doesnt have any impact on team or player? Who benefits from Pogba not doing this haircut marketing crap?

Either He does and/or by extension the French team does cause the Pogba circus is that bit less a distraction.

If there is no positive benefits to his team or himself, why bother?


He did it for a reason that he felt was positive for France but won’t do it for united. He made it a point that suggested it’s an unwelcome distraction.

adox

Ah jaysus. Jose has us playing poor football but **** me players have to start taking personal responsibility for their performance levels.

How anyone can give Pogba a by and lay it all at the manger is beyond me.

bangkok

adox wrote: »

Ah jaysus. Jose has us playing poor football but **** me players have to start taking personal responsibility for their performance levels.

How anyone can give Pogba by and lay it all at the manger is beyond me.

but if jose has us playing ultra defensive as he did yesterday in a pre season friendly, how can you expect players to perform when the team shape and set up is awful?

pjohnson

adox wrote: »

Ah jaysus. Jose has us playing poor football but **** me players have to start taking personal responsibility for their performance levels.

How anyone can give Pogba by and lay it all at the manger is beyond me.

If Pogba does good its in spite of Jose. If he does bad its becase of Jose. #Pogflon

Drumpot

bangkok wrote: »

but if jose has us playing ultra defensive as he did yesterday in a pre season friendly, how can you expect players to perform when the team shape and set up is awful?

France played pretty much the same kind of counter attacking kind of tactics Jose uses....

adox

bangkok wrote: »

but if jose has us playing ultra defensive as he did yesterday in a pre season friendly, how can you expect players to perform when the team shape and set up is awful?

Matic has played well. Lukaku has played well Lingard has played well. Perrera has played well pre season as has Sanchez.

It’s just a nonsense to excuse a player playing badly by blaming the manager.

bangkok

adox wrote: »

Matic has played well. Lukaku has played well Lingard has played well. Perrera has played well pre season as has Sanchez.

It’s just a nonsense to excuse a player playing badly by blaming the manager.

pogba has also played well... a couple of poor games doesnt define a season

AS A TEAM though we are rubbish to watch and that blame falls on the manager

~Rebel~

adox wrote: »

Matic has played well. Lukaku has played well Lingard has played well. Perrera has played well pre season as has Sanchez.

It’s just a nonsense to excuse a player playing badly by blaming the manager.

Depends on the role of the player really. A defender can obviously play well regardless pretty much, as their job is reactive to what the other team does for the most part.

But proactive positions are much tougher, if a decent game plan isn't in place.

So someone can play ok, putting themselves about a bit and all that stuff, but a creative midfielder is going to have a tougher time of it if he doesn't have multiple people making runs for him to find, and a striker, or inside winger will struggle if the team isn't transitioning play quick enough to get them to the ball, or if the rest of the team is sitting too deep.

In a sense, you're right, a player can always be said to be doing the things he should be doing in whatever roll he's in, but the ceiling for the effectiveness that player can achieve depends massively on the structures in place around them.

And some players are built more than others to be willing runners, whilst others simply need the ball to come into their own.

Drumpot

bangkok wrote: »

pogba has also played well... a couple of poor games doesnt define a season

AS A TEAM though we are rubbish to watch and that blame falls on the manager

You keep shifting the goalposts to defend Pogba.

Fellani has also played well for united. You could say that about any united player at some stage. You couldn’t lower the bar for Pogba if you tried.

He is responsible for his form and application to the United cause.

He played well in a defensively minded French team at the World Cup. He was disciplined, physically imposing and very consistent. These are not qualities he has regularly shown united. He doesn’t need Jose to change anything for him to be able to do this for united.

So it’s not tactics, it’s not that he’s not playing with good players, maybe it boils down to him not liking Jose. Maybe he wants an easier path to success with less responsibility. Maybe only needing 7 games for a World Cup made it easier for him to take guidance from deshamp to quite the media circus for a month and focus on winning the cup for France? Maybe he was happy to do the same role for deshamp because he focused purely on football , instead of what he can get out of the team?

Trigger

Lord TSC wrote: »

The issu is "decent few".

The reports are saying €110m. In the current market, with such little time left, I'd want at least €160m.

I'd also not be massively confident we'd get the required business done either.

We sell abroad we don’t have to do it before the 9th, so we can bring in a player then let a bidding war commence

Drumpot

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Depends on the role of the player really. A defender can obviously play well regardless pretty much, as their job is reactive to what the other team does for the most part.

But proactive positions are much tougher, if a decent game plan isn't in place.

So someone can play ok, putting themselves about a bit and all that stuff, but a creative midfielder is going to have a tougher time of it if he doesn't have multiple people making runs for him to find, and a striker, or inside winger will struggle if the team isn't transitioning play quick enough to get them to the ball, or if the rest of the team is sitting too deep.

In a sense, you're right, a player can always be said to be doing the things he should be doing in whatever roll he's in, but the ceiling for the effectiveness that player can achieve depends massively on the structures in place around them.

And some players are built more than others to be willing runners, whilst others simply need the ball to come into their own.

What was Pogba being asked to do for a defence minded united that he wasn’t being asked to do for a defence minded France? He showed superb ability to track back , great discipline in doing whatbhemisntesm needed, intercepting and move from defence to attack very well for france. Why did he at times look like a championship player when trying similar things for united?

Lord TSC

astradave wrote: »

We sell abroad we don’t have to do it before the 9th, so we can bring in a player then let a bidding war commence

Issue is then we can't get players in part exchange, which would probably suit us more if Pogba was moving towards Juvi....

bangkok

Drumpot wrote: »

What was Pogba being asked to do for a defence minded united that he wasn’t being asked to do for a defence minded France? He showed superb ability to track back , great discipline in doing whatbhemisntesm needed, intercepting and move from defence to attack very well for france. Why did he at times look like a championship player when trying similar things for united?

france played as a team in both attack and defence.

united play like a group of players that have no idea what they are supposed to be doing

pjohnson

Lord TSC wrote: »

Issue is then we can't get players in part exchange, which would probably suit us more if Pogba was moving towards Juvi....

We'd have it sorted nice and early then both deals.



I'm suprised TFM's loan hasn't been confirmed now we have the full squad back. We confirmed Axel's today

~Rebel~

Drumpot wrote: »

What was Pogba being asked to do for a defence minded united that he wasn’t being asked to do for a defence minded France? He showed superb ability to track back , great discipline in doing whatbhemisntesm needed, intercepting and move from defence to attack very well for france. Why did he at times look like a championship player when trying similar things for united?

Couple of things there - primarily, that my statement is a general truism of football. I'm not attacking or defending any player or manager or team, it's just a fact that if a system is set up to suit certain players, those players will look better, and feel better about what they're doing.

One obvious thing in comparing a world cup against a league campaign is motivation. You know a world cup is a maximum of 7 games every 4 years. That's it. So i'd expect it to be easier mentally for any player to lock in for those 7 games to just do what needs to be done, even if they don't like their role as much. For a league campaign, it's got to all just run together. That's your career, your bread and butter... league after league after league, year after year. So if you're doing things week in week out that you're not a fan of, and don't consider to be 'your game', it'll probably get ya down a bit more. Bit of a slog.

The other side is that not all defensive minded teams are the same, and perhaps those little differences are where the difference in enjoyment of one's role comes in. France looked ready to break at all times, and Pogba had Griezmann and Mbappe largely released from any defensive duties to be ready to break through the lines at a moments notice. It looked like the runs of Griezmann and Mbappe in particular were part of a plan a lot of the time, with other players knowing what they were going to do, and making decisions based on that knowledge. Like the very early Pogba ball to a sprinting Mbappe and the follow up. That football often looks off-the-cuff, but usually isn't.

I don't watch tonnes of Utd matches in full, but i've seen enough to see that it often looks like the front three aren't necessarily on the same page. It doesn't look like it's a cohesive plan to pull defenders around and open space for the onrushing midfielders... it sort of looks like it's up to them to figure out what to do when the break happens - aside from the plan of a header knock-on to a sprinter running behind. That's the one move you can tell was planned and practiced and is very effective as a result - you don't see the same precision and repeated use with other moves I think. So perhaps being a part of a cohesive attacking plan where you're in sync with those ahead of you, acting out a game plan instead of just being expected to pull off magic, makes a similar role much more enjoyable and satisfying.

Should Pogba be doing more with his ability and wages for Utd? Yup, probably. But you can't separate humanity from ability... to get the best of one you have to appeal to the other. For the longer term, you have to make the experience feel good, like there's a goal to be achieved, and a plan to achieve it, and everyone feels better, regardless what your job is.

Adamcp898

Lord TSC wrote: »

Don't get the "I'd rather no one than Boateng" posts

There's players I'd rather more, but I'd also rather the money be spent than not, and while I don't know much about the specific player, having a player used to playing for a top level team, at a top level, is better than nothing right now.

It looks, for instance, as if we can get Boateng now and Toby next summer. Boateng would be a short term solution, but a short term solution seems better than none at all.

Again, its a "cutting your nose off to spite your face" mentality.....

Except, it's not at all though.

The reason I'd rather not sign Boateng is because I don't see the sense in pouring £50 million into CB when it won't solve the problem and worse still, it would mean the required investment in the position would be then less likely to happen and we'd find ourselves stuck in the same position Summer after Summer until the loss is swallowed.

To me, Boateng to United just smacks of another "name" signing that is of convenience to every party except we end up with the butt end of the deal, again. Bayern want rid because he's played his best football and the issues he brings, the player won't budge far because he still wants to get paid, and we see a "name" that is an easy sell to the fans and snap at the opportunity. Been far too many of this type of signing in recent years.

Cantona's Collars

David Maddock: "United were clear they will not go above £40million for the Belgium international defender, who will see his value plummet to just £25m in six months' time.
....Mourinho has told his club board to explore alternatives if Tottenham continue to play hardball over their valuation of around £55m for the 29-year-old."

jimmytwotimes 2013

Pogba to leave- SSN

https://twitter.com/SlowSportsNews/status/1026528192541204480?s=19

bangkok

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

Pogba to leave- SSN

https://twitter.com/SlowSportsNews/status/1026528192541204480?s=19

Slowsportsnews?? Nice try

jaykay74

Look, its clear that no on else will be signed in the lifetime of this jinxed thread. This thread needs to be wrapped up asap so a nice clean shiny thread brings some reward before the window closes.

Will I Am Not

The rest of Europe must be laughing at the PL transfer deadline date.

Mitch Connor

Will I Am Not wrote: »

The rest of Europe must be laughing at the PL transfer deadline date.

Yup. Utter insanity.

~Rebel~

Be interesting to see if any important prem players get poached after the window closes, with no possibility of replacing them. I think that's what a lot of this idea will come down to... if this happens enough, or to anyone important to the league's branding (Pogba, Salah, Hazard etc), I could see the idea being scrapped.

If everyone manages to hang onto their guys post deadline, then hopefully it'll start pushing the rest of Europe into matching up.

I do really like the idea of teams being set in stone before a ball is kicked though. probably not the best idea to start it on a World Cup year, but there ya go..

Trigger

jimmytwotimes 2013 wrote: »

Pogba to leave- SSN

https://twitter.com/SlowSportsNews/status/1026528192541204480?s=19

Hope you know that’s a wind up page

S.M.B.

Remember all those 4-0 wins at the start of last season? Maybe we'll head into another purple patch on Friday.

Cantona's Collars

Mina to United is still a story in both Mundo Deportivo and Diario Sport.

MD: United make an offer for Mina, but Barca want 40m.
Sport say Mina has has a preliminary agreement with Everton, but Barcelona are waiting to see if United make an improved bid.

DM_7

Annoying that United are so ill prepared that it is still transfer stories instead of looking forward to the actual football.

Trigger

astradave wrote: »

Howdy folks, I have renewed the Fantasy football league for this upcoming season. Just a fun league anyways, obviously open to everyone, I’ve added the code to my Sig but if you are on mobile here it is

1172488-264907

We are into the week when the League begins so I'm just going to drop this here again

~Rebel~

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

Mina to United is still a story in both Mundo Deportivo and Diario Sport.

MD: United make an offer for Mina, but Barca want 40m.
Sport say Mina has has a preliminary agreement with Everton, but Barcelona are waiting to see if United make an improved bid.

40 million?! Christ, seems a bit steep...
Market's crazy and all that jazz, but still... over 4 times what he moved to them for only 6 months ago, after only 4 starts - one of which was a bloody calamitous performance against Levante.

Worth buying still I think, and will be a good player, but they've some cheek asking for that sort of money at this stage of his career.