Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2018

Bit of the statement..."“At the time of our evaluation Mr Karius’s principal residual symptoms and objective signs suggested that visual spatial dysfunction existed and likely occurred immediately following the event. Additional symptomatic and objectively noted areas of dysfunction also persisted. It could be possible that such deficits would affect performance."

sabat

mosstin wrote: »

As for Karius's future - take the concussion out of the equation for a moment - were many fans surprised by his errors?

In retrospect though, the two specific errors he made were quite unusual, even for a keeper with a chequered history. If he had flapped at a cross for one and let another one in at his near post you'd say "typical Karius" but to commit two of the all-time bizarre howlers in a game, especially as he seemed confident beforehand, does make me think there's something in this.

Guy:Incognito

Augeo wrote: »

He was seemingly speaking coherently to the ref.... seemingly in charge of his arms to show the elbow motion. Didn't seem confused or dizzy.

Is concussion something that creeps up a few mins after the event....he didn't seem anyway dazed....got up fairly promptly. Made some other saves...pas de problem...seemingly of course.

Aren't CT scans required fairly soon after the incident?

Any medical experts around?

Ive never (that i know of) had a concussion but have a listen to professional rugby players talking about it. Plenty have on the radio etc. Theyll often say they've no memory of playing the rest of the game after taking the hit. But have played it all the same and in plenty of cases, played quite well.

Demosthenese

Augeo wrote: »

He was seemingly speaking coherently to the ref.... seemingly in charge of his arms to show the elbow motion. Didn't seem confused or dizzy.

Is concussion something that creeps up a few mins after the event....he didn't seem anyway dazed....got up fairly promptly. Made some other saves...pas de problem...seemingly of course.

Aren't CT scans required fairly soon after the incident?

Any medical experts around?

Yes, a CT scan is the way to know if you have concussion. Been concussed twice on the pitch and played on oblivious to the fact that i was! The former i was told afterwards i "might have been" out for a few seconds. Felt a little groggy and sore head from the impact but from my perspective i was grand. Of course in hindsight i was in bits, team-mates manager etc should have taken me off the pitch. Sore head for about 3 weeks. Point is i actually did ok for the remainder of the game ... so its not like Karius would have been too aware of this. Looking at the replay, he was up fast enough and never really went down for a pro longed period - for a physio to intervene and check him out.

Feel for him on the last goal for sure, Benzema one was a bit of sneakyness from the striker and naivety from keeper.

Yet, i'd still be happier if we signed a proven class keeper.

Minderbinder

astradave wrote: »

If Karius informed the ref and assistant that he had got an elbow or even a blow to the head, the ref should have stopped the game and allowed him to be checked out.

The failing imo is on the officials side.

Well apart from the pure thuggery by Ramos

Maybe if goalkeepers weren’t so overprotected in the game people might actually believe them when they complain like Karius did.

Karius should have stayed down if he felt even the slightest thing was wrong. Do the people suggesting it’s the ref’s fault for telling him to carry on think the game wouldn’t have been stopped if the goalkeeper was lying on the floor?

BenEadir

Irishmale0399 wrote: »

Press on mainland EU are stating that the link is coming from within Madrids management. Someone would want to talk to the player and his agent to clear up the matter.......

So the press are stating the link is coming from within Madrids management. That sounds like pretty reliable evidence to me. It's an open and shut........................ Hang on, one person saying the story is from a link without getting any sort of attributable affirmation from the person involved or validation from another source is..................... nothing more than click bait hearsay.

Irishmale0399 wrote: »

As for Nabil Fekir.....have LFC or its employees stated or said at any point publically that they have a deal in place with him or that he is joining??

No and neither have Madrid made any such statements about Mane, have they?

You really shouldn't fall for this click bait crap.

razorblunt

Agent Coulson wrote: »

I'm sure all footballers do baseline tests for there clubs anyway before the start of the season.


So it will be easy enough to test during the season if they get a bang to the head.

Even just the basic changes like allowing for blood subs and HIA assessment subs.
I know the HIA might leave itself open to misuse but they could work around it.

mada999

there now on Today FM... "Karius collided with Ramos..." wtf... can people not call it like it is... elbow to the head

Moist Bread

mada999 wrote: »

there now on Today FM... "Karius collided with Ramos..." wtf... can people not call it like it is... elbow to the head

They are just trying to stay impartial.

Grayditch

History remembers who won, not how it was won. We got done by a notorious rat bag. It is what it is, time to forget it.

corwill

Grayditch wrote: »

History remembers who won, not how it was won. We got done by a notorious rat bag. It is what it is, time to forget it.

The only revenge or justice or closure to be had is go and win something next year.

Greybottle

It's a hard one to call for the Ref, Karius looked OK from the TV pictures after the incident, but they need to introduce a procedure if a player complains of concussion. This of course will be abused left, right and centre.

The role and function of the "assistant referee" behind the goals needs to be reviewed as well. i think I've seen them making 3 proper incursions into a referee#s decisions since they were introduced, but the amount of stuff they miss is unreal. I don't actually see the point of them anymore.

The medical statement thing is far from conclusive...........I'm pretty sure Karius made a blunder like for the 3rd goal earlier in the season or last season, got two hands to a ball and it still went in.

Dickerty

Anyway, moving on...

Looking forward to the WC! I think if deals are not done this week, it will only be non-competing players because they'll be on lock-down in their camps. And clubs will prefer to wait until after in the hope they have some big performances.

ERG89

Augeo wrote:

I'm pretty sure Karius made a blunder like for the 3rd goal earlier in the season or last season, got two hands to a ball and it still went in.

Think he parried a Kolarov effort onto the bar in a similar manner at Anfield. Got away with it then.

Thud

playing skeptic, several of the concussion tests require verbal answers, much the same as rugby players try to pass the HIA to get back on the pitch (set a very low bar in preseason test etc) it would be hugely in Karius' interest to fail the test (i have headaches, can't focus on small text etc)...there will be some CT scan results that can't be faked (even some of those will show results from previous concussions) but (a) it will make Karius feel better and (b) his value will be reinstated somewhat if club are looking to sell him

gimli2112

can't see Karius trying to con the medics into thinking he has a brain injury. the cover up would be far worse than the crime and the crime was pretty bad

givyjoe

murpho999 wrote: »

From Indykailla so you can discount that.

I know this is the "Rumours" thread but I really think silly baseless twitter rumours should be banned here

By yesterday the same 'rumour' was absolutely everywhere with the only thing scuppering the deal being Zidane leaving.

Why is there 10 pages going on and on about Ramos elbowing Karius, and not a squeak on Mane or on the growing rumours of Klopp leaving for Real. Bizarre.

Sofa Spud

givyjoe wrote: »

By yesterday the same 'rumour' was absolutely everywhere with the only thing scuppering the deal being Zidane leaving.

Why is there 10 pages going on and on about Ramos elbowing Karius, and not a squeak on Mane or on the growing rumours of Klopp leaving for Real. Bizarre.

Possibly because it's silly season, exacerbated by click bate factories like the Metro and Express, there's no reliable sources out there backing up these stories, and when you read them, they are clearly bullsh!t of the smelliest order and warrant no attention...

gimli2112

Yeah was thinking the same thing. If you believed everything you read on the internet about your club you'd live in a constant state of distress. Better of ignoring the stuff you don't want to be true and only worrying about it once you know there's something to it.
I'm totally onboard with believing good nonsense however. Is Oblak signed yet?

Mrmoe

I don't think any first team players will leave this summer including Klopp. The squad is thin enough as it is and only fringe players will be left go such as Mignolet,Ings, Sturridge and loan players. I would take Klopp on his word that he will see out his contract moreso than other managers like Pochettino. Rival teams may sow the seed of trying to get players like Mane this summer but they won't leave this transfer window.

With regard to signings a goalkeeper would have been in the top 3 regardless of what Karius did in the final. Klopp has demonstrated that he is willing to wait to get the player he wants. I'm impressed by his willingness to wait and go for quality rather than a poorer player who is available now.

BullBlackNova

Club has dismisses the Mane story as "nonsense" anyway.

As for the concussion thing, none of us can say one way or another how/if it affected Karius so not much point debating that.

What is clear, though, is that protocols need to be in place for head injuries of all sorts because there are massive implications for these things. A simple enough thing (I think) to introduce at the top level would be to have an extra official/medical official monitoring the game on a screen. If anything happens, they alert the ref who can allow a ten minute (for e.g) temporary sub - player comes off and is assessed by a member of the medical staff who gets the decision on whether they are fit to play on.

You simply cannot rely on players to report these things - who wants to walk out of the biggest game of their career?

Obviously, incidents may still be missed and a short test couldn't be entirely conclusive but these seem to be happening a few times a season and it would be tragic for something to happen because people thought someone was "faking it" for injury gains or some nonsense.

Managers make bad calls - was it Lloris at Spurs that was given the go ahead by the bench to keep going when he couldn't even walk straight? - players don't report properly - Karius - or aren't event capable of doing so - Kramer in the World Cup final in 2014.

Dcully

This is the best read out there about the Karius concussion scenario.
Having suffered consussion previously myself after a fall in a group cycle, i didnt know where i was for 2-3 hours.

https://twitter.com/Scienceofsport/status/1003878658598146048

Ardent

Can't believe there has been so much discussion about Karius and concussion -

Ramos didn't hit him hard enough to concuss him. You can see that in the footage and in Karius' immediate reaction. The hospital report is all smoke and mirrors by the club - to what end I don't know.

MD1990

Ardent wrote: »

Can't believe there has been so much discussion about Karius and concussion -

Ramos didn't hit him hard enough to concuss him. You can see that in the footage and in Karius' immediate reaction. The hospital report is all smoke and mirrors by the club - to what end I don't know.

So you know more about concussion than the professional's in this area?

TitianGerm

Ardent wrote: »

Can't believe there has been so much discussion about Karius and concussion -

Ramos didn't hit him hard enough to concuss him. You can see that in the footage and in Karius' immediate reaction. The hospital report is all smoke and mirrors by the club - to what end I don't know.

How in the name of God do you know he didn't get hit hard enough to be concusst?

Trigger

Ardent wrote: »

Can't believe there has been so much discussion about Karius and concussion -

Ramos didn't hit him hard enough to concuss him. You can see that in the footage and in Karius' immediate reaction. The hospital report is all smoke and mirrors by the club - to what end I don't know.

My partner was concussed by hitting her head on a car door not very hard. It depends on the area of the blow really. Ramos was running fast and hit his temple, it’s very plausible that it could result in concussion

Ardent

MD1990 wrote: »

So you know more about concession than the professional's in this area?

Believe what you want buddy.

TitianGerm

https://twitter.com/GFFN/status/1003784806910627841?s=19

Links to Malcolm now. I don't know much about him but I assume he'll play In The Middle :pac:

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Ardent wrote: »

Can't believe there has been so much discussion about Karius and concussion -

Ramos didn't hit him hard enough to concuss him. You can see that in the footage and in Karius' immediate reaction. The hospital report is all smoke and mirrors by the club - to what end I don't know.

if the hospital said he was concussed then he was concussed, and it very probably effected his performance. Why would they risk their reputation by lying...?

For the record, an impact doesn't have to be hard to cause concussion. It can also depend on where the impact occurs, the speed it occurs and whether or not the head was moving at the time of the impact. It can also be caused without impacts, such as excessive drug usage or violent shaking.

Agent Coulson

Buy all the Brazilians.

Alisson, Bernard & Malcom.


Get the 3 of them for the price of one Coutinho.

BullBlackNova

TitianGerm wrote: »

https://twitter.com/GFFN/status/1003784806910627841?s=19

Links to Malcolm now. I don't know much about him but I assume he'll play In The Middle :pac:

Reported. :mad:

:pac:

We are just gonna cram our team full of young Brazilian lads by the looks of it so. Sounds good to me!

Utopia Parkway

Ardent wrote: »

Can't believe there has been so much discussion about Karius and concussion -

Ramos didn't hit him hard enough to concuss him. You can see that in the footage and in Karius' immediate reaction. The hospital report is all smoke and mirrors by the club - to what end I don't know.

I can't imagine expert medical professionals would sign off on a diagnosis like that just to help with a bit of PR for Liverpool. Would be massively unethical.

gimli2112

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-5805385/Richard-Scudamores-plan-end-Premier-League-TV-money-row-week.html


According to the DM, Henry is a driving force for the TV money deal to be updated so the big clubs get more. Seems a bit mad that the bottom 3 clubs get more than the top 3.

corwill

BullBlackNova wrote: »

Reported. :mad:

:pac:

We are just gonna cram our team full of young Brazilian lads by the looks of it so. Sounds good to me!

He has the profile of someone who might be willing to bide his time a bit and fight for his place from the bench, in terms of breaking into the front 3.

Thud

Utopia Parkway wrote: »

I can't imagine expert medical professionals would sign off on a diagnosis like that just to help with a bit of PR for Liverpool. Would be massively unethical.

Concussion (especially a week later) is a little but like whiplash though easy enough to fake the symptoms and anyone who has headed a football regularly will have damaged brain cells

Dr Zafonte, who is a leading expert in head injuries in the NFL, said Karius' assessment involved reviewing "game film", a "physical examination" and "objective metrics".

“At the time of our evaluation, Mr. Karius’s principal residual symptoms and objective signs suggested that visual spatial dysfunction existed and likely occurred immediately following the event,” the statement said.

“Additional symptomatic and objectively noted areas of dysfunction also persisted. It could be possible that such deficits would affect performance.” It added that Karius had shown a “significant and steady improvement since the concussive event”.

Kimbot

Thud wrote: »

Concussion (especially 2 weeks later) is a little but like whiplash though easy enough to fake the symptoms and anyone who has headed a football regularly will have damaged brain cells

“At the time of our evaluation, Mr. Karius’s principal residual symptoms and objective signs suggested that visual spatial dysfunction existed and likely occurred immediately following the event,” the statement said.

“Additional symptomatic and objectively noted areas of dysfunction also persisted. It could be possible that such deficits would affect performance.” It added that Karius had shown a “significant and steady improvement since the concussive event”.

But it wasnt 2 weeks later, he was checked over on the 31st wasnt he? 5 days after the game.

Ardent

Utopia Parkway wrote: »

I can't imagine expert medical professionals would sign off on a diagnosis like that just to help with a bit of PR for Liverpool. Would be massively unethical.

In the absence of obvious and outright symptoms, concussion is a subjective condition. A medical team, with sufficient prodding, would be well within their rights to diagnose concussion as certainly being within the realms of possibility.

Why Karius was not attended to on the pitch by the club's medical team immediately after the incident, or by other medical experts immediately following the match is curious. This examination taking place in Boston days later strikes me as a face-saving exercise.

Just saying.

TitianGerm

Ardent wrote: »

In the absence of obvious and outright symptoms, concussion is a subjective condition. A medical team, with sufficient prodding, would be well within their rights to diagnose concussion as certainly being within the realms of possibility.

Why Karius was not attended to on the pitch by the club's medical team immediately after the incident, or by other medical experts immediately following the match is curious. This examination taking place in Boston days later holds little water.

Just saying.

Maybe he's still complaining of dizzyness and headaches and the club sent him for checks?

smileyj1987

Ardent wrote: »

In the absence of obvious and outright symptoms, concussion is a subjective condition. A medical team, with sufficient prodding, would be well within their rights to diagnose concussion as certainly being within the realms of possibility.

Why Karius was not attended to on the pitch by the club's medical team immediately after the incident, or by other medical experts immediately following the match is curious. This examination taking place in Boston days later holds little water.

Just saying.

Thats why a ref should be micced up so everyone can hear what is being said to him. What if karius said i took a blow to the head and the ref said you are back on your feet so must be fine. Dont think it will ever be known what wad said between them both. But it does highlight he could have said something and was ignored.

Thud

TitianGerm wrote: »

Maybe he's still complaining of dizzyness and headaches and the club sent him for checks?

I'd be dizzy, having headaches and unable to sleep too if i'd lost my team the champions league final, it can't have been an easy week for him, this may be a convenient way to take a bit of focus off him

not ruling out concussion totally either but most mild concussion incidents are ok the following day...it's usually the more traumatic ones that have longer symptoms

Ardent

TitianGerm wrote: »

Maybe he's still complaining of dizzyness and headaches and the club sent him for checks?

I'm sure he was

threein99

Has he been concussed since he was signed from Mainz ?

brevity

Ardent wrote: »

Can't believe there has been so much discussion about Karius and concussion -

Ramos didn't hit him hard enough to concuss him. You can see that in the footage and in Karius' immediate reaction. The hospital report is all smoke and mirrors by the club - to what end I don't know.

Nonsense.

Agent Coulson

Roma were fined €50k for fan trouble at the first leg and are banned from selling tickets to there next European away game.

Mitch Connor

If nothing else I would love if this karius issue finally kicked off a proper discussion of concussion in football. Though that is unlikely, imo, as the action of heading the ball would come under severe pressure in any real discussion.

Agent Coulson

Mitch Connor wrote: »

If nothing else I would love if this karius issue finally kicked off a proper discussion of concussion in football. Though that is unlikely, imo, as the action of heading the ball would come under severe pressure in any real discussion.

You will also get fans, managers, referees etc who will all say the players is acting or using the concussion as an excuse.

Proper discussions may happen in real life highly doubtful they will happen on the internet where everyone has a PHD in being right.

Mitch Connor

Agent Coulson wrote: »

You will also get fans, managers, referees etc who will all say the players is acting or using the concussion as an excuse.

Proper discussions may happen in real life highly doubtful they will happen on the internet where everyone has a PHD in being right.

Unfortunately you are right.

Even if protocalls were brought on I could see clubs abusing them to their advantage.

But the point stands - it's a huge issue in football, no less so than other sports. And fact is it should be taken seriously.

Not that you were arguing against that.

For this case, I see people wondering why the Liverpool medics didn't appraise him - at that time it may not have looked serious, to anyone. Maybe it wasn't in reality, but it still may serve to highlight a lack of interest i the wider audience of football, which is hugely dangerous.

Luap

Great we don't need to splash out on a GK after all. :rolleyes:

citytillidie

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Unfortunately you are right.

Even if protocalls were brought on I could see clubs abusing them to their advantage.

But the point stands - it's a huge issue in football, no less so than other sports. And fact is it should be taken seriously.

Not that you were arguing against that.

For this case, I see people wondering why the Liverpool medics didn't appraise him - at that time it may not have looked serious, to anyone. Maybe it wasn't in reality, but it still may serve to highlight a lack of interest i the wider audience of football, which is hugely dangerous.

What a bit like this

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/tunisian-goalkeeper-filmed-faking-injury-12647813