Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2018

yourdeadwright

brevity wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Same lad out a kick out out for a corner early this season ,Was he concussed then ?

No, probably not.

Look, Karius has made his mistakes but that's what happens when a club buys a player early in his career. He cost £5m too btw. We are looking to replace him with someone who could cost upwards of 40 or £50m - some perspective is required.

He's not infallible and, as we've seen at the world cup, every keeper makes mistakes.

Has he shown some improvement? I believe so. Do we need an upgrade? Probably. But whoever it is, it won't be cheap.

He makes mistake iv never seen a pro make before

Mr.H

brevity wrote:

Look, Karius has made his mistakes but that's what happens when a club buys a player early in his career. He cost £5m too btw. We are looking to replace him with someone who could cost upwards of 40 or £50m - some perspective is required.

This is exactly the issue.

When talking about replacing him i am on board...... to a degree. Talking about allison donurama or oblak. All great choices. But then you have people naming some mid table german keeper or a relegation candidate keeper in the premier league as if its a sure upgrade. When we signed migs he was also wanted by chelsea and arsenal also looked at him reportedly. Doesnt even matter if those reports were true because he was seen as a good purchase. Now people are naming players that ate not even as highly rated and thinking that these cult status names are the correct choice.

If we are replacing our keepers it needs to be with a big name keeper. Someone who would be linked with top european teams and not just the likes of everton and west brom.

Karius was seen as a cult choice. Migs was seen as a great keeper who could be better with a better team. Neither worked out. But id rather either of them than schmeichel.

Spend 80 million on a keeper instead of buying fekir or asensio. Lets strengthen our weakest area.

Mr.H

yourdeadwright wrote:

He makes mistake iv never seen a pro make before

You ever watch brucies lowlights? Although at least he was probably paid for them

redzerdrog

machiavellianme wrote: »

That is an incorrect equation. Karius is superior to no one.

Pickford is worse

Agent Coulson

Pearce has put what he thinks is the market value on each of the players.

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/liverpool-squad-summer-transfer-window-14832074

Mr.H

redzerdrog wrote:

Pickford is worse

There are tonnes of keepers worse than ours. Joe hart anyone? Fabianski?

redzerdrog

Also karius >>>> Mignolet

Still not what we need though

Also would much prefer oblak to alisson

redzerdrog

Mr.H wrote: »

There are tonnes of keepers worse than ours. Joe hart anyone? Fabianski?

Even Loris for spurs was shocking last season, Cech too

After de gea, courtois and ederson the standard is pretty poor and none of the premier league keeps would be a marked upgrade on karius

Gbear

ERG89 wrote: »

Here are 2. There are other mistakes in games we won so he got away with it. There probably would be more had he not been dropped for mignolet which sums up his time at the club.

He would be nowhere near the starting XI of any big side now (bar maybe a Wenger managed Arsenal). We should sign another goalkeeper; he's clearly not good enough from when he was first dropped (for being thrown in too quick) to being reduced to a punchline in the game vs Real Madrid.

Given the ****ty quality of the video (presumably to dodge a copyright claim), I'm not sure you can claim a mistake for the Payet one, but regardless, what's more important is when it was.
Karius was thrown in the deep end early on and clearly couldn't cope. I think we saw a marked improvement in his second spell in the 2nd half of 17/18. It'd be more relevant if you could point to mistakes from this period.
It might sound like I'm trying to dodge here, but players do actually get better over time.

I take your point generally, that we should be looking for an upgrade, but some going on like he's the worst keeper in the division are talking ****e, IMO.

If you actually look at the keepers in the league, rather than some idealised fictional keepers, you can see that Karius isn't some pub player in comparison.

The only ones head and shoulders above him in the top 10 (don't watch enough of the others, and it's such a different job anyway given how they require less focus and have less expectation on them, that I think they're not really relevant), are DeGea and Courtois, and even Courtois has had a ****e season, while DeGea is throwing them in every other week for Spain.

Alisson? I certainly don't see €70m's of improvement. I haven't been impressed. Oblak has a good reputation, but you know a few mistakes and his name will be dirt with at least half the fan base.

There's more to getting a top keeper in than the splashing money on the man between the sticks. He needs support from his team, he needs leeway to build up confidence, he needs understanding through the ups and the downs.

I think we're so ingrained as a footballing culture and possibly as Liverpool fans in particular that we'll just end up ****ing ruining whoever we get anyway.
That's not to say we shouldn't try, but I'm not convinced there'll be a night and day difference as soon as they're in the door.

I'd be hugely optimistic about any signing in the front 2/3 of the pitch but, in my eyes, anyone in the backline is as good as doomed to fail until they prove otherwise over a period of time, and I'm happy to be sanguine about that.

It's a much easier job for the forward players because they're judged by how many things they create, while defenders are judged on whether or not they make any errors at all, and in a highly strung system, our lads are on a hiding to nothing.

Mr.H

redzerdrog wrote:

Also would much prefer oblak to alisson

Id be happy if oblak was our only other signing this summer. Of course we would still be light up front but we would have a phenomenal first team.

gimli2112

tbh if it wasn't for the first goal in the Champions League final (still haven't seen/remember the Bale one) I'd be willing to give Karius a chance but it's....just.....so......BAD
I don't think you could even excuse it with concussion

redzerdrog

gimli2112 wrote: »

tbh if it wasn't for the first goal in the Champions League final (still haven't seen/remember the Bale one) I'd be willing to give Karius a chance but it's....just.....so......BAD
I don't think you could even excuse it with concussion

I actually think the bale one is less forgivable

Gbear

gimli2112 wrote: »

tbh if it wasn't for the first goal in the Champions League final (still haven't seen/remember the Bale one) I'd be willing to give Karius a chance but it's....just.....so......BAD
I don't think you could even excuse it with concussion

Simple as misjudging the distance. Easy to imagine with concussion.

.red.

redzerdrog wrote: »

I actually think the bale one is less forgivable

That was the second time a ball came straight at him and he missed it. If he'd have stood still it would have bounced off his face.
Can't remember who the other one was against (maybe west ham?)but he "parried" it onto the crossbar and got away with it. Very weak hands from him.

If he starts the season as number 1 I'd be worried about Klopp being concussed, not Karius.

Iused2likebusts

I think. Karius had a terrible misjudgement against Roma but it didn't end up as a goal . I could be wrong on that one.

Iused2likebusts

I think. Karius had a terrible misjudgement against Roma but it didn't end up as a goal . I could be wrong on that one.

ERG89

Iused2likebusts wrote:

I think. Karius had a terrible misjudgement against Roma but it didn't end up as a goal . I could be wrong on that one.

He flapped a shot out for Dzeko's goal in Rome & misjudged a Kolarov shot that hit the bar.

Iused2likebusts

ERG89 wrote: »

He flapped a shot out for Dzeko's goal in Rome & misjudged a Kolarov shot that hit the bar.

Just googled it there. This is exactly it he is a disaster that game finished 5 2 so that attempt at the kolorav shot is forgotten about its a horrendous error that we didn't get punished for. I love klopp but if he starts the season as him as our No. 1 he is setting himself up for a massive fall.

marklazarcovic

There may not be a top keeper that wants to move to us,or move clubs at all, it's not as simple as sign a top keeper, I wish it was.

redzerdrog

marklazarcovic wrote: »

There may not be a top keeper that wants to move to us,or move clubs at all, it's not as simple as sign a top keeper, I wish it was.

This!

Mad how people this it's just like football manager

Iused2likebusts

marklazarcovic wrote: »

There may not be a top keeper that wants to move to us,or move clubs at all, it's not as simple as sign a top keeper, I wish it was.

I get that but the two we have are really poor by PL standards and anyone that thinks otherwise is kidding themselves. It needs to be number 1 priority pretty much as it was last summer.

citytillidie

Iused2likebusts wrote: »

I get that but the two we have are really poor by PL standards and anyone that thinks otherwise is kidding themselves. It needs to be number 1 priority pretty much as it was last summer.

And every team knows Liverpool will be looking for a keeper so add on £10M more at least to the price tag

Agent Coulson

Pearce confirmed yesterday in an interview with Redmen TV that Klopp wants Alisson and he is Klopp's no 1 choice.

Pearce doesn't think it will happen because of the Salah tax Roma have put on Alisson.

Riesen_Meal

citytillidie wrote: »

And every team knows Liverpool will be looking for a keeper so add on £10M more at least to the price tag

The cash needs to absolutely splashed out, give Roma or Athletico a pile of cash that they won't refuse...

eyerer

redzerdrog wrote: »

marklazarcovic wrote: »

There may not be a top keeper that wants to move to us,or move clubs at all, it's not as simple as sign a top keeper, I wish it was.

This!

Mad how people this it's just like football manager

I remember using a cheat for unlimited money and the feckers still wouldn't join.. something about the club was financially unstable. Whereas in real life it worked pretty well for Chelsea and City

daheff

should we be worried if Loew quits the German job that they'll come looking for Klopp?

mosstin

daheff wrote: »

should we be worried if Loew quits the German job that they'll come looking for Klopp?

Absolutely not. Klopp would hate international management at this stage of his career.

shamrock55

I'm stunned how people are making excuses for karius,the guy is an absolute pity who has never even made a save of note for Liverpool but has made a fair few fcuk ups as we know only too well yet people want to act like they never happen.
The simple thing is if he is our no 1 next season then we can forget about winning anything and I don't care who else we bring in in defence midfield or upfront,if we don't upgrade our keeper we may aswell forget it

rossie1977

marklazarcovic wrote: »

There may not be a top keeper that wants to move to us,or move clubs at all, it's not as simple as sign a top keeper, I wish it was.

There has to be someone "better" than Karius that would move if offered a chance with the team who reached this years champions league final. Pickford is better and moved just last summer.

Karius wouldn't be starting for any of the other top 10-20 sides in Europe so he shouldn't be starting for Liverpool.

redzerdrog

shamrock55 wrote: »

I'm stunned how people are making excuses for karius,the guy is an absolute pity who has never even made a save of note for Liverpool

Just because you keep saying it doest make it true. He made plenty of saves last year

He is not giid enough but its not as simple to find a marked upgrade.

I can only think people using pickford as an example of a better keeper didnt actually see much of him last year. Yes he had the odd stormer pulling off saves when facing tons of shots but he had a fair few howlers. Liverpool game in particular was horrendous

mosstin

Why has Pickford been mentioned so often? He's a fairly average keeper who gets a better press because he's English. In that respect he's a shorter version of Joe Hart.

Knex*

What's the craic with getting tickets once you're a member, can somebody tell me? First year that I've paid for the membership and hoping to get over to a few games.

mosstin

Knex. wrote: »

What's the craic with getting tickets once you're a member, can somebody tell me? First year that I've paid for the membership and hoping to get over to a few games.

You have to fight it out online on the allocated day. You'll be bottom of the list as priorities go so you'll have to fight it out with others on the third or fourth day of allocation for games.
You log on, join the queue and pick whatever's left. It isn't pretty but I've done quite well out of it in the last few years.

Mr.H

mosstin wrote:

Why has Pickford been mentioned so often? He's a fairly average keeper who gets a better press because he's English. In that respect he's a shorter version of Joe Hart.

There are 2 world class keepers in the premier league. Degea and coutouis. They win points by themselves.

After that the beat you have is average. Cech hart and lloris used to be class but while hart has dwindled for years, the other two have slipped in the last couple of years. Still have the potential to win points by themselves.

The next level would be the likes of karius ederson and foster. All keepers who can be god but every so often will make an error that makes you think they arent top class.

The rest are average including migs. Pope and ryan have potential but are still below the standard of what we have.

Karius is better than average. He is a talent. He isnt good enough to win points by himself but he does make great saves. He needs a solid defence. Maybe i can forgive the final but he needs to make up for it by playing at another level this year. If we dont get a match winner we will stick with him. I know people like to exaggerate how bad he is but it doesnt make it true.

We will line up with oblak allison or karius in august.

retalivity

Ederson a level below hart???

shamrock55

redzerdrog wrote: »

Just because you keep saying it doest make it true. He made plenty of saves last year

He is not giid enough but its not as simple to find a marked upgrade.

I can only think people using pickford as an example of a better keeper didnt actually see much of him last year. Yes he had the odd stormer pulling off saves when facing tons of shots but he had a fair few howlers. Liverpool game in particular was horrendous

I agree Pickford is awfull but I don't agree it's not simple to find an upgrade on karius

shamrock55

What are these great saves people keep saying karius has made,I must have been making the tea when these happened

Knex*

mosstin wrote: »

You have to fight it out online on the allocated day. You'll be bottom of the list as priorities go so you'll have to fight it out with others on the third or fourth day of allocation for games.
You log on, join the queue and pick whatever's left. It isn't pretty but I've done quite well out of it in the last few years.

Much appreciated, Sir!

Karius is above average?
He was dropped for mignolet 18 months ago. If he's now above average achterberg deserves huge credit imo

gimli2112

shamrock55 wrote: »

What are these great saves people keep saying karius has made,I must have been making the tea when these happened

I (seriously) thought he was very good in the second leg of the CL semi-final. Commanded his area, took several crosses, looked fairly solid and we still conceded four goals.

5starpool

Whatever the opinions on Karius, I think we'll have to get used to the idea that he'll still be first choice next season. Mig will leave and ward will likely be our backup.

ERG89

gimli2112 wrote: »

I (seriously) thought he was very good in the second leg of the CL semi-final. Commanded his area, took several crosses, looked fairly solid and we still conceded four goals.

Flapped a shot out to Dzeko here. Along with the side tiring cue 40 minutes of onslaught from Roma. Think he could have easily got sent off if not for an offside flag too.
Not exactly an all-time great Liverpool performance.

rossie1977

Yes should have given away a penalty, totally at fault for Roma second goal and never got himself set for their third.

He is a massive liability. Fans at home games don't trust the guy with a simple backpass given their reactions.

rob316

We don't even need an amazing keeper lads our expectations should be extremely low. The requirement are not throw the ball into the goal in finals. The last 2 didn't get the memo.

Mr.H

Lads seriously ederson is not much better than karius if even. He cost city against us in the champions league. Also yea i would say karius is above average. He still makes mistakes but they are less regular and he has made more fantastic stops than blunders in the last few months.

elbyrneo

Mr.H wrote: »

Lads seriously ederson is not much better than karius if even

You for real?

Mr.H

elbyrneo wrote:

You for real?

I think so.

I just dont want us to buy a keeper than will be no better than karius. All this talk of pope and schmeichel is doing just that.

As for ederson he is very suspect at the back. Remember when robertson put him under pressure. The guys a joker bill. Its just not many teams attacked city this season. When we did we ripped him apart. Is nowhere as good as allison.

mosstin

shamrock55 wrote: »

What are these great saves people keep saying karius has made,I must have been making the tea when these happened

This was a smashing save. Was at this game and only watching replays afterwards did we realise how good it was. That said, he's far below the required standard.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUV8Wf_0KVM

Mr.H

Thats the thing though. We all know we need better. But average isnt better. Pope is nowhere near the answer.

brevity

Mr.H wrote: »

Thats the thing though. We all know we need better. But average isnt better. Pope is nowhere near the answer.

The Pope?!

FSG kept that under wraps.