Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2018

garra

5starpool wrote: »

If, and it is still a big if, we sign Fekir and Alisson this summer, then on top of our other signings, surely this creates massive expectation? No one is entitled to win the league, but spending 350m or so, in the last 3 windows, adds pressure to win things, and I don't just mean a league or FA cup, welcome as they would be.

Even without those 2 mooted signings, it is exciting times, and I hope we can properly compete for (and win) the big prizes. I'm not exactly sure what I'm trying to get at to be honest, but there is something, somewhere trying to get out (not a toffee crisp). By the end of the 19/20 season if we haven't won much, or anything, questions will likely be asked. However, with Klopp it doesn't just feel like we have to win or else. I'm being overly sentimental here, but it feels like more, and context is key. If we didn't win anything in the next 2 seasons, I'd be disappointed, but it is about context, and I'm more emotionally willing to take that into account for a Klopp managed Liverpool than I normally would be with managers, and won't care much what the non LFC fans (and some of our own) will be bleating on about.

Then again it may be disappointing, and despite it being Klopp, feel that it is best to change things up. I hope not though.

If we sign those 2, it will round out the squad to the extent that even the most demanding, truculent fans couldn't complain about the club's investment in the team (looking at Ricero here).
If that is more pressure for our manager, then it's the right kind of healthy positive pressure. Besides, he is already under pressure to win things and has had to withstand periods of fan disillusionment already.

5starpool

garra wrote: »

If we sign those 2, it will round out the squad to the extent that even the most demanding, truculent fans couldn't complain about the club's investment in the team (looking at Ricero here).
If that is more pressure for our manager, then it's the right kind of healthy positive pressure. Besides, he is already under pressure to win things and has had to withstand periods of fan disillusionment already.

It feels like no more excuses time though. Before when we didn't win things it was because of not enough money, or not in the CL so couldn't attract people, etc. Those aren't issues anymore in the same way, so if we fail to win things in this stretch where is the optimism going to come from then? This is the fear that lies behind it all, but I'm looking forward to the season and the ride ahead anyhow. As I said, unless this coming season goes badly (out of top 4, not close to winning anything) we have 2 more seasons at least before any of this is a potential problem.

Dickerty

If we DO sign a keeper, that means we need to get rid of two of them. I am sure Migs will have offers, but I think Karius stays (his stock being very low now) and maybe Ward leaves too? Or Karius out on loan?

TitianGerm

Dickerty wrote: »

If we DO sign a keeper, that means we need to get rid of two of them. I am sure Migs will have offers, but I think Karius stays (his stock being very low now) and maybe Ward leaves too? Or Karius out on loan?

I'd say both Karius and Ward stay this Summer if we sign a keeper. Maybe Ward might get a loan move though.

Talisman

Sappy404 wrote: »

It's a shame we're not in a position to be scouting goalkeepers and are paying top dollar instead. Oblak began as 2nd choice at Benfica the season Atletico spotted him. Alisson was only made first choice at Roma because they sold Sczezny. Ederson only got a chance at Benfica when Julio Cesar got injured. Pope and Pickford are similar examples closer to home.

That said, we've known Mignolet is sub standard for 4 years and have spent less than £5m trying to address it. If this lad is actually a top keeper, I don't care what we pay for him.

In 2009, Benitez tried to bring Oblak to the club for a trial with a view to signing him before he went to Benfica.

That man and his staff had a talent for spotting young players.

yourdeadwright

Spending 60 million on a keeper  is mental if you ask me, There will be so much pressure and expectations on him he will have to be at De Gea levels to be seen as a success

TitianGerm

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Spending 60 million on a keeper  is mental if you ask me, There will be so much pressure and expectations on him he will have to be at De Gea levels to be seen as a success

You are never happy :pac:

Dickerty

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Spending 60 million on a keeper  is mental if you ask me, There will be so much pressure and expectations on him he will have to be at De Gea levels to be seen as a success

Yes, but in the current market, when a CM costs 40-50M, it's not obscene if that player is an 8-10 year investment...

Agent Coulson

I say don't spend any more this summer and save the money buy Messi next season that will then be our year.

shamrock55

I'd rather spend 60 m on a keeper then fekir

5starpool

5starpool wrote: »

It feels like no more excuses time though. Before when we didn't win things it was because of not enough money, or not in the CL so couldn't attract people, etc. Those aren't issues anymore in the same way, so if we fail to win things in this stretch where is the optimism going to come from then? ...............

We need to improve by 10/15 points over the course of a PL season. That's not overly easy, to be fair it's quite a task. Staying Top4 for the next two seasons could be a challenge, not to mind winning the PL.

Talisman

5starpool wrote: »

It feels like no more excuses time though. Before when we didn't win things it was because of not enough money, or not in the CL so couldn't attract people, etc. Those aren't issues anymore in the same way, so if we fail to win things in this stretch where is the optimism going to come from then? This is the fear that lies behind it all, but I'm looking forward to the season and the ride ahead anyhow. As I said, unless this coming season goes badly (out of top 4, not close to winning anything) we have 2 more seasons at least before any of this is a potential problem.

I don't think we have a squad that is near the quality that can delivery consistency levels where we should expect to be winning things.

Salah went off injured in the CL Final and we had nothing to offer from the bench - now we have Shaqiri.

If Firminio were to get injured there is a massive drop in quality in terms of the potential replacements.

If our left back were to get injured we are back to Moreno in the team.

Take Van Dijk out of the defence for a period of time and the cracks will reappear.

Fabinho and Keita will add steel and more energy to the midfield but we still need some creative quality.

Last but not least is the matter of the goalkeeper.

Addressing those issues with the squad would be a source of optimism.

Sappy404

TitianGerm wrote: »

Alissons agent like a photo of him in a Liverpool kit. Definitely done deal now!!;)

https://i.redd.it/n4vw0xl84ea11.jpg

I'm sure you're being sarcastic, but...

5starpool

Talisman wrote: »

I don't think we have a squad that is near the quality that can delivery consistency levels where we should expect to be winning things.

Salah went off injured in the CL Final and we had nothing to offer from the bench - now we have Shaqiri.

If Firminio were to get injured there is a massive drop in quality in terms of the potential replacements.

If our left back were to get injured we are back to Moreno in the team.

Take Van Dijk out of the defence for a period of time and the cracks will reappear.

Fabinho and Keita will add steel and more energy to the midfield but we still need some creative quality.

Last but not least is the matter of the goalkeeper.

Addressing those issues with the squad would be a source of optimism.

My posts were on the assumption of buying Fekir and Alisson (or equivalent spendings). There will still be some slight shortcomings, but barring having 20+ players of near equal ability, we are getting close to the point where it can't be regarded as a work in progress, no more than any team with some natural churn can.

Muahahaha

brevity wrote: »

Twitter thread on Allison

https://twitter.com/WC_LFC_Torres/status/1018690630992658432?s=20

My knowledge of Allison (like many on here) only extends to the CL semis and a few Brazil games so that thread makes for very interesting reading. I realise stats can tell any story but the story told in that thread makes me understand why Klopp would want him and how well he fits and enhances a counter attacking style.

The main point Ive taken out of it is that Allisons stats show that he is one of the worlds best at converting defence into attack. He claims 90% of the corners he goes for and from there he seeks out quick distribution to the front three while the opposition are left exposed with one if not two centre backs having gone up for the corner now out of position.

His stats on distribution for long passes (more than 34m) results in him finding a team mate 66% of the time. In comparison DeGea finds a teammate 40% of the time and Oblak manages it at 34%. Then for even longer passes to the final third of the pitch Allison is accurate at finding a teammate 52%, Oblak falls to 14% here and DeGea 20%. I think it is insane that more than one of every two of Allisons balls to the final third finds a teammate, that is a serious supply line to Bobby, Mane & Salah and the distance of the pass means you can virtually bypass the opposition midfield.

Then it gets into stats on Expected saves Vs. Actual saves. In Allisons case he outperforms this stat in 30 out of 37 games last season. He saved Roma just under 10 goals that the average keeper would have let in. When this is translated to points on the league table without Allisons saves they would have been 11 points worse off and finished in 6th place.

Anyway Twitter is alight that we are tabling a 60m+10m add ons bid. Sign him up please

Benzino

Muahahaha wrote: »

My knowledge of Allison (like many on here) only extends to the CL semis and a few Brazil games so that thread makes for very interesting reading. I realise stats can tell any story but the story told in that thread makes me understand why Klopp would want him and how well he fits and enhances a counter attacking style.

The main point Ive taken out of it is that Allisons stats show that he is one of the worlds best at converting defence into attack. He claims 90% of the corners he goes for and from there he seeks out quick distribution to the front three while the opposition are left exposed with one if not two centre backs having gone up for the corner now out of position.

His stats on distribution for long passes (more than 34m) results in him finding a team mate 66% of the time. In comparison DeGea finds a teammate 40% of the time and Oblak manages it at 34%. Then for even longer passes to the final third of the pitch Allison is accurate at finding a teammate 52%, Oblak falls to 14% here and DeGea 20%. I think it is insane that more than one of every two of Allisons balls to the final third finds a teammate, that is a serious supply line to Bobby, Mane & Salah and the distance of the pass means you can virtually bypass the opposition midfield.

Then it gets into stats on Expected saves Vs. Actual saves. In Allisons case he outperforms this stat in 30 out of 37 games last season. He saved Roma just under 10 goals that the average keeper would have let in. When this is translated to points on the league table without Allisons saves they would have been 11 points worse off and finished in 6th place.

Anyway Twitter is alight that we are tabling a 60m+10m add ons bid. Sign him up please

This was interesting to read, like yourself I haven't seen much of him, and what I have I haven't been impressed. I want a new GK but couldn't get excited at the prospect of Allison joining. But the above has eased some concerns.

robwen

LuckyLloyd

Talisman wrote: »

I don't think we have a squad that is near the quality that can delivery consistency levels where we should expect to be winning things.

Salah went off injured in the CL Final and we had nothing to offer from the bench - now we have Shaqiri.

If Firminio were to get injured there is a massive drop in quality in terms of the potential replacements.

If our left back were to get injured we are back to Moreno in the team.

Take Van Dijk out of the defence for a period of time and the cracks will reappear.

Fabinho and Keita will add steel and more energy to the midfield but we still need some creative quality.

Last but not least is the matter of the goalkeeper.

Addressing those issues with the squad would be a source of optimism.

I think it's okay to not sort it all out in one go tbh. When I looked at the depth chart at the weekend it looked the best it's looked since Benitez was here. Lovren is obviously better than we thought; Ox has worked out extraordinarily well; Milner / Gini / Hendo are thriving in Klopp's all action system.

I think Shaqiri is an excellent signing that gives us a significantly better option than that provided by Ings / Solanke / Lallana. Keita and Fabinho give us a level of competitiveness, quality and depth in the engine room not seen since 2004 - 2009. The Man has proven well worth waiting for at the back.

And we might yet add a couple of players ala Fekir or Allison. All you can ever do is get better and improve your depth. We've already done that. Looking around us, Chelsea are in trouble and apart from City no - one has done anything that significantly moves the needle yet.

I'm feeling good about where things sit. I think calling out competitive ultimatums is unhelpful and unrealistic but I believe we can continue establishing ourselves in the top four and challenge for a trophy on the basis of our business thus far. Keep building, keep inching, keep going.

BullBlackNova

Talisman wrote: »

I don't think we have a squad that is near the quality that can delivery consistency levels where we should expect to be winning things.

Salah went off injured in the CL Final and we had nothing to offer from the bench - now we have Shaqiri.

If Firminio were to get injured there is a massive drop in quality in terms of the potential replacements.

If our left back were to get injured we are back to Moreno in the team.

Take Van Dijk out of the defence for a period of time and the cracks will reappear.

Fabinho and Keita will add steel and more energy to the midfield but we still need some creative quality.

Last but not least is the matter of the goalkeeper.

Addressing those issues with the squad would be a source of optimism.

I'm not disagreeing with you on any of the issues really but literally every side could face similar problems.

An injury to Ederson and City have to rely on Claudio Bravo next season. Fernandinho is world class but is 33 and has little back-up, could fall apart.

If United lost De Gea or Lukaku or Matic, cracks could appear.

Spurs without Kane or Eriksson are weaker.

Chelsea without Kante could slump further down the league...

These are all "coulds" and you could make the same argument that the replacements could step up and the absences wouldn't be felt.

We don't have the league's strongest side, we are lacking in depth in certain areas, but point me to a squad that isn't. It's not practical to expect two players, capable of playing 38 games a season, for every position, and one of them happy being a back-up.

We have a lot of options. If we got Alisson and Fekir, we'd have even better ones. But there's still always a 'could' or a 'what if?' no matter who you are or what your squad is.

Harry Palmr

Neil Jones (the new goal LFC man person now Reddy has moved on) says

Harry Wilson has dodged Stoke and is now at Frank Lampard's Derby County for the season, Ojo and Kent also off to Championships sides (where they will probably find a permanent home next summer - my own feeling). Long term deals for Brewster and Awoniyi (loan) to be done.

On youth news, Adam Lewis is part of the U19 England squad and they play Turkey at 4.30 on UEFA's youtube channel.

Agent Coulson

Didn't Brewster sign his deal a few weeks back?


Anyway good to see he isn't going on loan by the looks of it even if he doesn't get much game time this season he will learn a lot training with the first team.

Harry Palmr

I think both parties committed to it when he was last in the news.

NabyLadistheman

Sappy404 wrote: »

It's a shame we're not in a position to be scouting goalkeepers and are paying top dollar instead. Oblak began as 2nd choice at Benfica the season Atletico spotted him. Alisson was only made first choice at Roma because they sold Sczezny. Ederson only got a chance at Benfica when Julio Cesar got injured. Pope and Pickford are similar examples closer to home.

That said, we've known Mignolet is sub standard for 4 years and have spent less than £5m trying to address it. If this lad is actually a top keeper, I don't care what we pay for him.

Thats probably what we done with Karius. Unfortunately it hasn't worked out like your two examples

Dickerty

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Neil Jones (the new goal LFC man person now Reddy has moved on) says

Harry Wilson has dodged Stoke and is now at Frank Lampard's Derby County for the season, Ojo and Kent also off to Championships sides (where they will probably find a permanent home next summer - my own feeling).

If Wilson and Ojo are both off, then we must be signing another attacking player. Not enough cover for the wide attacking positions.

I think Ojo may have a future, more than Origi does!

robwen

This was posted on the official LFC forum today where someone else took it from RAWK

Off RAWK

"I posted this on a few forums and the red men TV YouTube channel a couple of weeks ago. I'll start by saying take this however you will but I know someone who is very very very close to the situation. I also know I could potentially get ripped to pieces on here for this. He doesn't know everything i.e. fine details but knows what happened, how it happened and what's going on and likely to happen. Fekir passed the medical but concerns where raised over his knee and the op he had done in 2015. The op was a botch job and it's gone twice since the op. The 2nd opinion said that long periods of stress on the knee will permanently damage it. They suggested a re-corrective op which would keep him out for 4 weeks give or take. Fekir agreed to this. LFC went straight back to lyon saying that they want to drop the payment by so much % and make the payment in to games played bonuses. Over the course of the contract. So something like 40 mil then 2.5 per season over 5 years but only if Fekir plays 90% games or something like that. That's what he thinks it's likely to be but he's not sure. Anyway as soon as Lyon realised thats why the deal wasn't announced at 2pm, they lost their **** and called the deal off. Not LFC, according to him Lyon wasn't keen to sell and felt pressured in to it from Fekir's advisors, even Gerard Houllier was called in to smooth relations. Lyon think Liverpool are trying it on as they value Fekir more than the £58 mil that was agreed. He seems to be surprised that this wasn't out there weeks ago as he says most jernos know all this, they also know that Fekir signed his contract already. With Lyon pulling the plug, that obviously become nil and void. Lyon have now agreed something and it's a matter of time for them to sit down and sign the contracts. Klopp wants Fekir all done and dusted by the end of the week when he goes on holiday.
You can all call bull ***** on this, like I said I already posted most of this 2 weeks ago on redmen TV. The French "ITK" saying over 2 years is complete an utter ********. I have 110% faith in this person knowing where he is and what he does for a living. I know yous don't know that so take it with a pinch of salt and wait out a few days.
Personally, it all makes sense and fits but also the fact we've not been linked to anyone else and no other team have come in for him other than what Aulas has sprouted out. Klopp knows what he wants and is willing to wait as long as it takes as we've seen in Naby and VVD"
- from RAWK

Talisman

5starpool wrote: »

My posts were on the assumption of buying Fekir and Alisson (or equivalent spendings). There will still be some slight shortcomings, but barring having 20+ players of near equal ability, we are getting close to the point where it can't be regarded as a work in progress, no more than any team with some natural churn can.

My point is that we still have a lot of scope for improvement - your posting seemed to be heading in the direction of "If we don't do it now we really are f**ked".

Arsenal are rebuilding the defence and the team will take some time to adapt to the manager's playing style.

Tottenham have yet to sign anyone.

Man Utd will offer more of the same under Mourinho.

Man City have added one of the most creative players in the league to their squad.

Chelsea appear to be a shambles but we won't know for certain until the season begins.

Liverpool overachieved last season considering the depth of squad - we've added three players but may need to sustain the performance levels of the good parts of last season to mount a challenge to Man City's dominance in the league.

Another positive is our team should not be significantly impacted by the World Cup hangover that players often experience the season following the tournament. The Tottenham, Man Utd and Man City players played significantly more in the tournament which should give us an edge but it will also favour Arsenal.

Agent Coulson

Liverpool have started talks with AS Roma for Alisson �� #LFC #Liverpool #Alisson @DiMarzio

https://twitter.com/FabrizioRomano/status/1019208077848039424?s=19

ricero

Some italian journo Fabrizio Romano just tweeted that lfc and roma have opened talks for Alisson.

As i see above Coulsen has beat me to it.

Trigger

He works for DiMarzio, basically the most reliable source you could get in Italy, he has loads of sources in clubs on his payroll.

ricero

Saying we bid 70 million euros but Roma want 75 million

davyboy1975

Here's another one

https://twitter.com/dimarzio/status/1019209478640689152?s=21

ricero

ricero wrote: »

Saying we bid 70 million euros but Roma want 75 million

We won't miss out on him over €5m if Klopp wants him anyway so all good perhaps

ricero

Great to see us finally acting like a big club if the fee is true. Its been awhile but it seems we are back at the big boy table.

fyfe79

ricero wrote: »

Great to see us finally acting like a big club if the fee is true. Its been awhile but it seems we are back at the big boy table.

Paying €75m for VVD wasn't acting like a big club?

Agent Coulson

Are we only a big club if we spend big money?

Agent Coulson

Alisson would accept the Liverpool bid it's now down to the clubs according to Fabrizio Romano.

JimboJones99

ricero wrote: »

Great to see us finally acting like a big club if the fee is true. Its been awhile but it seems we are back at the big boy table.

Yeah delighted to see us spend big and go for the targets that we want. You will get the people who will say what about the time we nearly went broke, etc etc but it looks like the club is being run properly and there doesnt seem to be any panic buying anymore. Good times for us and long may it continue.


Plus it also helps that if we are to pay €70m+ for a keeper then we are paying it to Roma, we do owe them one for last year!! €110m for Salah & Allison is still a bargain!!

Dickerty

I had a crush on a girl called Alisson. It's all come full circle!

klose

Ton of cash for a keeper but if he has an impact the sorts vvd had then I'm all in for it.

Dickerty

klose wrote: »

Ton of cash for a keeper but if he has an impact the sorts vvd had then I'm all in for it.

That's it. We have to trust Klopp given his success with VVD, Salah and Mane as his other big money signings. He will buy cheap & cheerful if necessary, but if he really wants someone, the club will back him all the way!

murpho999

Dickerty wrote: »

I had a crush on a girl called Alisson. It's all come full circle!

Was she a keeper?

gafferino

Chris Bascombe
‏
Verified account

@_ChrisBascombe
3m3 minutes ago
More
LFC have lodged bid in region of £62m for Roma keeper Alisson.

BorneTobyWilde

We have 62m of deadwood to get rid of, just buy him , we need him.

Vicxas

gafferino wrote: »

Chris Bascombe
‏
Verified account

@_ChrisBascombe
3m3 minutes ago
More
LFC have lodged bid in region of £62m for Roma keeper Alisson.

Holy christballs it might actually be happening!

MD1990

https://twitter.com/_ChrisBascombe/status/1019218715383160839

Agent Coulson

No way did I think we would go over £50m for him.

Fair play to FSG once again showing that they will pay World Record fees for Klopp's targets.

Great to have owners like that who will back the manager.

Vicxas

Pearce confirming it now too:

https://twitter.com/JamesPearceEcho/status/1019220313589080065?s=19

murpho999

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Now way did I think we would go over £50m for him.

Fair play to FSG once again showing that they will pay World Record fees for Klopp's targets.

Great to have owners like that who will back the manager.

I've been a voice in the past stating that I didn't think FSG were the owners to take us forward and compete in the transfer market but if Allisson and Fekir go ahead then we've had a very strong last 2 windows.

Utopia Parkway

Wonder did the possibility of Chelsea going after Allison if Courtois leaves force the club's hand?

Not sure if Allision is worth the money from the limited amount of him that I've seen but the goalkeeping situation had to be addressed.

Dickerty

Utopia Parkway wrote: »

Wonder did the possibility of Chelsea going after Allison if Courtois leaves force the club's hand?

Not sure if Allision is worth the money from the limited amount of him that I've seen but the goalkeeping situation had to be addressed.

That would need to happen very quickly, and he'd need to accept no CL next season. We are on the up, they are on the down. Plus Firmino and Fabinho would be a big draw I would say...