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Buying a House: Asking price online was not the real price

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    #32
    Frilly Knickers
    Registered Users Posts: 45 ✭Frilly Knickers


    amcalester wrote: »
    Too many variables to make that worth while (not to mention the accuracy of the data i.e. selling price).

    Agents might have different selling strategies for different houses.

    1 house the owner might want a quick sale and so may accept a lower price, others might only sell if a certain price is achieved and is happy to wait for that to happen so may advertise at exactly that price.

    At the end of the day, even if you offer a price the seller is happy with, if someone offers higher the seller will accept that price.

    How will you account for that?

    How can arming yourself with knowledge about what houses in the area sell for or the average price over asking an EA gets be a bad thing?

    The alternative in blindly guessing what you personally think a house is worth and then getting it wrong - and either not getting it or paying over the odds for it.

    it's a finger in the air and the best information you/anyone has on houses prices and agents selling strategies. Both of which are relevant variables in a bidding strategy.

    It's just an average guide, not Einsteins theory of relativity. Of course its worth doing. Suggest a better way to arm yourself with market knowledge.


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    #33
    amcalester
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭amcalester


    Frilly Knickers wrote: »
    How can arming yourself with knowledge about what houses in the area sell for or the average price over asking an EA gets be a bad thing?

    The alternative in blindly guessing what you personally think a house is worth and then getting it wrong - and either not getting it or paying over the odds for it.

    it's a finger in the air and the best information you/anyone has on houses prices and agents selling strategies. Both of which are relevant variables in a bidding strategy.

    It's just an average guide, not Einsteins theory of relativity. Of course its worth doing. Suggest a better way to arm yourself with market knowledge.

    Where did I say information was a bad thing?

    I questioned whether the exercise of tracking selling price v asking price by EA was worthwhile due to the large amount of variables and the inherent inaccuracy of the data.

    At the end of the day what the OP (or any house purchaser) thinks the house is worth is the only thing that matters as that is the price it will sell at and all the tracking of asking v selling price will be useless if someone else values it higher than you.


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    #34
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,524 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    Krombopulos Michael wrote: »
    Kara Magnificent Lamp wrote: »
    You give out about the owners wanting more than the asking price, yet you offer less than the asking price? :pac:

    I offered 5k less as there is work to do on the property that was not in the pictures with the site and discussing with the EA, she didnt go to the owner with the lesser offer, we agreed to just go with asking.
    Unless you are buying a new house always expect there to be work needed.


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    #35
    Frilly Knickers
    Registered Users Posts: 45 ✭Frilly Knickers


    amcalester wrote: »
    Where did I say information was a bad thing?

    I questioned whether the exercise of tracking selling price v asking price by EA was worthwhile due to the large amount of variables and the inherent inaccuracy of the data.

    At the end of the day what the OP (or any house purchaser) thinks the house is worth is the only thing that matters as that is the price it will sell at and all the tracking of asking v selling price will be useless if someone else values it higher than you.

    What inaccuracy though? Do you genuinely believe there is a statistically significant number of sale prices in the ppr where the sale price is wrong?

    The agent and asking come from the ads. The ads also show the condition of the house at time of sale and explain things like why two houses on one road could go for vastly different amounts.

    It's real life data. What 'you think a house is worth' is meaningless. Market factors influence what you can realistically buy followed by how much you are willing to compromise.


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    #36
    paulieeye
    Registered Users Posts: 896 ✭✭✭paulieeye


    TheShow wrote: »
    of course,
    the way the market operates is wrong though.
    a house is valued by a professional valuer and the price should not be a penny more than that.

    :pac::pac:


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    #37
    amcalester
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,121 ✭✭✭amcalester


    Frilly Knickers wrote: »
    What inaccuracy though? Do you genuinely believe there is a statistically significant number of sale prices in the ppr where the sale price is wrong?

    The agent and asking come from the ads. The ads also show the condition of the house at time of sale and explain things like why two houses on one road could go for vastly different amounts.

    It's real life data. What 'you think a house is worth' is meaningless. Market factors influence what you can realistically buy followed by how much you are willing to compromise.

    Well I can only go on my own experience and the PPR hasn't been very accurate, or timely in having the price published.

    And with the current market any delay is going to be make the data inaccurate.

    We obviously have differing opinions on whether this would be a worthwhile exercise so I'll leave it that.


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    #38
    Frilly Knickers
    Registered Users Posts: 45 ✭Frilly Knickers


    amcalester wrote: »
    Well I can only go on my own experience and the PPR hasn't been very accurate, or timely in having the price published.

    And with the current market any delay is going to be make the data inaccurate.

    We obviously have differing opinions on whether this would be a worthwhile exercise so I'll leave it that.

    There is a delay in when the price is published but it shows the exact sale date so you still know how long ago the sale was. That doesn't make it inaccurate, it makes it slightly delayed in being published.

    You could apply average house price inflation if you really felt the need to adjust for a month or 2 delay in published data. That figure is also freely available online BTW.

    'your experience' of the ppr having incorrect sale prices would need to be based on you having first hand knowledge of the real sale price then seeing a significantly different number in the register. It's not likely that's happened to you on more than maybe one instance (if any) , making your claim Anecdotal, not fact.

    Market research is the best tool any buyer or vendor has and online resources of asking and sold prices is the best data we have, save having first hand knowledge of every sale in Ireland.

    I'll leave it at that.


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    #39
    stimpson
    Registered Users Posts: 7,821 ✭✭✭stimpson


    One thing not mentioned is that the agent works for the vendor. If he doesn’t maximise the sale price then he’s not doing his job. Having said that, they have a legal obligation to present all offers to the vendor so if they didn’t do that then you have a point. However in this market I doubt anything is selling under the asking price.


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    #40
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    Frilly Knickers wrote: »
    What inaccuracy though? Do you genuinely believe there is a statistically significant number of sale prices in the ppr where the sale price is wrong?

    The agent and asking come from the ads. The ads also show the condition of the house at time of sale and explain things like why two houses on one road could go for vastly different amounts.

    It's real life data. What 'you think a house is worth' is meaningless. Market factors influence what you can realistically buy followed by how much you are willing to compromise.

    Actually it isn't "real lite data" or even "real time data", it is historical data of a price paid in the past. While it may give a guide of previous sales, it gives no data on what it is worth today to another bidder.

    I would think that what a buyer thinks it is worth is extremely important, in fact that consideration and ability to obtain finance are two of the most important factors when buying a home.

    I suspect most buyers consider what they can afford to be the factor which most influences what they can realistically buy.


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    #41
    M.Cribben
    Registered Users Posts: 325 ✭✭M.Cribben


    stimpson wrote: »
    One thing not mentioned is that the agent works for the vendor. If he doesn’t maximise the sale price then he’s not doing his job. Having said that, they have a legal obligation to present all offers to the vendor so if they didn’t do that then you have a point. However in this market I doubt anything is selling under the asking price.


    Asking price is just an arbitrary figure the EA estimates based on recent sales of similar properties in the area. For example, I could ask a million for my house that's really worth 500k, then sell it for 500k (50% below asking price). The figure of a million has no bearing on the final sale price, or the value of the property.

    That's why the PPR is so valuable as a source of truth.


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    #42
    denismc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,481 ✭✭✭denismc


    The banks have certain criteria for valuing a property as they are not going to mortgage a property that is valued at twice its actual value.
    So I don't think auctioneers can drag figures out of their arses .
    Listing a property at below market value can backfire as bidding will start lower and it may not reach the target price, although this is unlikely these days as demand exceeds supply, people are getting into bidding wars like they were back in the boom days.


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    #43
    Frilly Knickers
    Registered Users Posts: 45 ✭Frilly Knickers


    davo10 wrote: »
    Actually it isn't "real lite data" or even "real time data", it is historical data of a price paid in the past. While it may give a guide of previous sales, it gives no data on what it is worth today to another bidder.

    I would think that what a buyer thinks it is worth is extremely important, in fact that consideration and ability to obtain finance are two of the most important factors when buying a home.

    I suspect most buyers consider what they can afford to be the factor which most influences what they can realistically buy.

    Again, groan.

    It is 'real life data'. They aren't made up sales fgs.

    What someone thinks a house is worth isn't really a gut feeling - a gut feeling is based first and foremost on market averages, historical sale prices, comparable properties in the area. There is a tiny amount of heart at the end, but mostly and overwhelmingly market factors determine what you 'feel' a house is worth. What else would it be based on?

    What someone actually buys is based on what they can afford - again based on a price driven, on average, by the market.

    Heart is a tiny part of a sale price not the determinant of the market.


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    #44
    davo10
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,926 ✭✭✭davo10


    Frilly Knickers wrote: »
    Again, groan.

    It is 'real life data'. They aren't made up sales fgs.

    What someone thinks a house is worth isn't really a gut feeling - a gut feeling is based first and foremost on market averages, historical sale prices, comparable properties in the area. There is a tiny amount of heart at the end, but mostly and overwhelmingly market factors determine what you 'feel' a house is worth. What else would it be based on?

    What someone actually buys is based on what they can afford - again based on a price driven, on average, by the market.

    Heart is a tiny part of a sale price not the determinant of the market.


    It's data, but historical data. Typically it takes months for prices to register on the site.

    Again I'm going to have to disagree with you, most buyers invest emotionally in the house they bid on, they/we want it even though it may not be worth as much to someone as as what we pay for it. Most home owners "know" that this is the house for them, for some it is the "dream house", if that is not emotional/the heart ruling the head, I'm not sure what is.


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