General Premier League Thread 2018-19

~Rebel~

Man Utd

Fred The Red wrote: »

Just for clarification;

So Kante is a requirement to get the best out of him? Not the fact Pogba has or does not have the ability to command central midfield himself?

Would you build a team around Pogba or prefer him to compliment an already steady backbone.

In some ways he's like Gerrard... granted Gerrard definitely had more impetus on the field, but he couldn't really control a midfield either - he wanted to do too much all the time.

In both cases (paradoxically) you get the absolute best out of them when you don't need them so much. Put Pogba into a team with brilliant midfielders and clinical finishers and he'll be that extra piece that elevates everything. Like Gerrard when he had Alonso and Mascherano behind him, and Torres in front of him.

shamrock55

Man Utd

shamrock55 wrote: »

I think Pogba is massively overated and I wouldn't have him in any team I was trying to build

Total flop

ShamoBuc

Chelsea

On his day, Pogba is a seriously capable player. But I wouldn't like him any where near a team I follow.
He is so up and down. His performances at United even have them confused. They cant decide if hes a pariah or a messiah.
He goes missing for large parts of a game, his temperament is seriously suspect, he always appears to have an attitude problem. Can give up too easily for me, not trekking back and gives the sulking impression. I think he's the kind of player that could cause serious problems in a dressing room too, egocentric and hard to manage.
That said, he has a fine shot on him and can pick out the perfect pass at the right time, has a good engine, can tuck penalties away and is a 'proven winner'.
He's the kind of player you want in a team that's playing well as his positive attributes can flourish.
But outside of that, his negative attributes are to be seen all too often for me to want him near my team.

Harry Palmr

Man Utd

Wolves due to secure Raul Jimenez for 30m tonight or tomorrow.

yourdeadwright

Man Utd

Cardiff already down could get bad for them

ctrl-alt-delete

Extremely lucky for Bennett with that yellow there, he should have had another and been off for his haircut.

Frankie Cortese

Watching City v Cardiff here. How good is KDB when he’s on his game, a joy to watch. He’s pound for pound the clear best player in the league for me as much as it pains me to say it.

Looks to be back to his best for the seasons end which is bad news for a few teams.

Lavinia

Arsenal

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Wolves due to secure Raul Jimenez for 30m tonight or tomorrow.

worth every penny

ozzy jr

https://twitter.com/hashtag/emptyhad?lang=en

Going for 4 trophies.

If the team you supported was in a similar position, do you think they'd fill their ground?

Frankie Cortese

ozzy jr wrote: »

https://twitter.com/hashtag/emptyhad?lang=en

Going for 4 trophies.

If the team you supported was in a similar position, do you think they'd fill their ground?

Who knows. Barcelona during their Treble winning season had an average attendance of 72,911 out of a capacity of 99,354.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/2014–15_FC_Barcelona_season

Their lowest league attendance was 29,099 in January. Bad as the Etihad is there is more than that there tonight & at every game.

Collie D

Man Utd

Far be it from me to defend City but when you’re chasing trophies on four fronts it must get a bit expensive for fans who may have to pick and choose their games. Midweek after work and a routine three points may not make the cut if you’re saving for a potential trip to Madrid for a European final.

Plus we’re sitting here at home on the internet talking about fans not going to games.

Frankie Cortese

Collie D wrote: »

Far be it from me to defend City but when you’re chasing trophies on four fronts it must get a bit expensive for fans who may have to pick and choose their games. Midweek after work and a routine three points may not make the cut if you’re saving for a potential trip to Madrid for a European final.

Plus we’re sitting here at home on the internet talking about fans not going to games.

If I could thank that post twice I would. Made the same point more or less on our Liverpool thread. I turn on the tv to watch football, not to whip out the calculator to count people.

yourdeadwright

Man Utd

Its going to be tuff for anyone to finosh ahead of thos Coty side on tje next few years ,The win games so comfortably in when in cruise controll

ERG89

No MOTD tonight, kinda expected it but only 1 of the midweek games looked like they were competitive so it's not so bad.

Fitz*

Man Utd

When is the last time anyone even gave City a tough game? They've been at walking pace for weeks

ERG89

FitzShane wrote:

When is the last time anyone even gave City a tough game? They've been at walking pace for weeks

Wigan gave them a game tbf

Frankie Cortese

FitzShane wrote: »

When is the last time anyone even gave City a tough game? They've been at walking pace for weeks

It’s hard to give them a game when they’re averaging 68% possession. The best way to beat them is to counter & take your chances, that’s why Liverpool were successful last year against them they nullified that against Liverpool to an extent this year.

The 2 other ways unfortunately are to have players of the same ilk who can maintain the ball for longer than 3 passes or else you’re hoping for them to be off their game like they were for their last league defeat away to Newcastle.

Frankie Cortese

ERG89 wrote: »

Wigan gave them a game tbf

Swansea maybe? It’s been over 12 months since they’ve played Wigan.

Unearthly

Nice result for City

Utopia Parkway

Man Utd

City win. Can hear the individual hand claps in what’s left of the crowd.

Utopia Parkway

Man Utd

FitzShane wrote: »

When is the last time anyone even gave City a tough game? They've been at walking pace for weeks

They’ve had a very handy run of games to be fair. Granted they make it look easy at times. The tough part of their run in (on paper anyway) is still to come.

Frankie Cortese

Utopia Parkway wrote: »

City win. Can hear the individual hand claps in what’s left of the crowd.

Whatever you gets your kicks from

Utopia Parkway

Man Utd

Frankie Cortese wrote: »

Whatever you gets your kicks from

Just thought it odd. Only turned over as the game was ending.

Utopia Parkway

Man Utd

Utopia Parkway wrote: »

Just thought it odd. Only turned over as the game was ending.

You could hear the players shouting at one point. Brutal support there for a team going so well.

shamrock55

Chelsea

A genuine question, why can't city fill their stadium, it's crazy to think that this is one of the best teams England has ever seen and is currently going for 4 trophies, Manchester prob has 2 m people yet city can't find 50 odd thousand fans every 2nd wk

Frankie Cortese

shamrock55 wrote: »

A genuine question, why can't city fill their stadium, it's crazy to think that this is one of the best teams England has ever seen and is currently going for 4 trophies, Manchester prob has 2 m people yet city can't find 50 odd thousand fans every 2nd wk

Weeknight, local fan base, school evening, late finish at work, & 10 days notice of the re arranging of the fixture all add to the problem. Probably have a core base of 70k working class fans.

As you say, still in the hunt for 4 trophies, maybe families are prioritising bringing them & the kids to a fixture of a bit More importance.

SEPT 23 1989

Man Utd

RoboKlopp wrote: »

You could hear the players shouting at one point. Brutal support there for a team going so well.

Plenty of support at Wembley on Saturday

theoneeyedman

Frankie Cortese wrote: »

Weeknight, local fan base, school evening, late finish at work, & 10 days notice of the re arranging of the fixture all add to the problem. Probably have a core base of 70k working class fans.

As you say, still in the hunt for 4 trophies, maybe families are prioritising bringing them & the kids to a fixture of a bit More importance.

Yea, it's a strange one though. Not a one off (tonight I mean), I've seen several televised games there this season like that, big swathes of blue seats. It's not like the football isn't of a sufficient quality, City are flying, playing high quality football, and in the hunt for 4 trophies.

It's amazing though, with a hard core of 70k working class fans, we're told they have had huge increases in commercial revenue....

Frankie Cortese

theoneeyedman wrote: »

Yea, it's a strange one though. Not a one off (tonight I mean), I've seen several televised games there this season like that, big swathes of blue seats. It's not like the football isn't of a sufficient quality, City are flying, playing high quality football, and in the hunt for 4 trophies.

It's amazing though, with a hard core of 70k working class fans, we're told they have had huge increases in commercial revenue....

Probably have a huge commercial revenue in the middle & Far East plus in Africa what with the fans gained from Yaya Toure & Mahrez. I’d imagine that hugely outweighs the domestic revenue in terms of merchandise anyways.

It’s the potential you’re paying for now though if as a sponsor you’re investing, you’re banking on them dominating Europe & gaining huge numbers of fans in South America, the states & China & Japan, then the money roles in for the sponsors, they can effectively charge as they please because from a marketing prospective if you miss the boat early then it’s doubtful your getting on it after it.

theoneeyedman

Frankie Cortese wrote: »

Probably have a huge commercial revenue in the middle (& Far) East

Look, we all know (Even if many don't want to admit it) where the vast majority of the money has come from, it's been covered many times here and in media. 'Commercial revenue', It's fantasy stuff, but anyway.....

Great battle for 3rd/4th, 3 points separating 4 teams. Ole has brought United from the depths of 6th all the way to 6th

Gonna be tight, I guess what it does is to keep everyone honest in the games v City, especially Spurs who won't be able to idle in their EPL game amidst the Champions league games.

~Rebel~

Man Utd

They'd be much better off lowering ticket prices to whatever price gets them a full house every game. As mentioned, the bulk of their revenue comes from external sources anyway, might as well show a bit of goodwill towards the community and let them in.

shamrock55

Man Utd

shamrock55 wrote: »

A genuine question, why can't city fill their stadium, it's crazy to think that this is one of the best teams England has ever seen and is currently going for 4 trophies, Manchester prob has 2 m people yet city can't find 50 odd thousand fans every 2nd wk

They are still a small club in terms of fanbase compared to others in the league.

~Rebel~

Man Utd

FitzShane wrote: »

When is the last time anyone even gave City a tough game? They've been at walking pace for weeks

Were far from comfortable against West Ham and Bournemouth only a few weeks ago. Scraped past each by 1.

Frankie Cortese

RoboKlopp wrote: »

They are still a small club in terms of fanbase compared to others in the league.

Very true, was actually just looking back on their average attendances by season, it’s actually been very solid even before the take over & the extension the average gate was 43k. Seems there’s been no influx of plastics attending anyways I’d use the term plastics if the gates rose up but they’ve been consistent & that number before the takeover of a club that stature is impressive it has to be said.

citytillidie

ERG89 wrote: »

No MOTD tonight, kinda expected it but only 1 of the midweek games looked like they were competitive so it's not so bad.

It is not a normal midweek round of games so there would be no MOTD

citytillidie

FitzShane wrote: »

When is the last time anyone even gave City a tough game? They've been at walking pace for weeks

Swansea, then City needed help from the ref to get over the line

thebaz

Man Utd

~Rebel~ wrote: »

They'd be much better off lowering ticket prices to whatever price gets them a full house every game. As mentioned, the bulk of their revenue comes from external sources anyway, might as well show a bit of goodwill towards the community and let them in.

very good point , for a team going so well must be embarassing all the empty seats - you don't see empty seats at Anfield , or Newcastle who are mid-table.

Bournemouth is another one, they only hold about 10,000 and thers often empty seats , really are a league one team

TitianGerm

Man Utd

~Rebel~ wrote: »

They'd be much better off lowering ticket prices to whatever price gets them a full house every game. As mentioned, the bulk of their revenue comes from external sources anyway, might as well show a bit of goodwill towards the community and let them in.

If the place isn't sold out a day or two before hand they could always donate the tickets to local schools and clubs. Kids and their parents would be delighted with the spare tickets.

Frankie Cortese

thebaz wrote: »

very good point , for a team going so well must be embarassing all the empty seats - you don't see empty seats at Anfield , or Newcastle who are mid-table.

Bournemouth is another one, they only hold about 10,000 and thers often empty seats , really are a league one team

The thing is with that, how do you manage it, do you drop them for mid week games & keep them at rate even if a Manchester derby or like January when Liverpool played there on a Thursday night & risk it that touts snap them up & sell for extortionate prices because they know they get a full house for them or do you keep it low & risk the wrath of the season ticket holders who have already paid their price which would be a higher fee.

It’s just impossible to do unless on game day you realise you’ve 5-10k spare tickets, you know you aren’t going to shift them so you do a flash sale, £10 a ticket & give a voucher to pre paid ticket purchases and season card holders for the club shop or bar for another game.

Frankie Cortese

TitianGerm wrote: »

If the place isn't sold out a day or two before hand they could always donate the tickets to local schools and clubs. Kids and their parents would be delighted with the spare tickets.

Lots of clubs do that anyways but it’s a cold weds night with school in the morning it’ll be nearly 10:30 by the time they’re home, lots of parents would refuse it in fairness.

TitianGerm

Man Utd

Frankie Cortese wrote: »

Lots of clubs do that anyways but it’s a cold weds night with school in the morning it’ll be nearly 10:30 by the time they’re home, lots of parents would refuse it in fairness.

All the local kids wouldn't have far to travel though and it's not like it would be happening every week.

thebaz

Man Utd

Frankie Cortese wrote: »

The thing is with that, how do you manage it, do you drop them for mid week games & keep them at rate even if a Manchester derby or like January when Liverpool played there on a Thursday night & risk it that touts snap them up & sell for extortionate prices because they know they get a full house for them or do you keep it low & risk the wrath of the season ticket holders who have already paid their price which would be a higher fee.

It’s just impossible to do unless on game day you realise you’ve 5-10k spare tickets, you know you aren’t going to shift them so you do a flash sale, £10 a ticket & give a voucher to pre paid ticket purchases and season card holders for the club shop or bar for another game.

the only time I have seen the Eithad full is a derby or liverpool , they are playing the best football out ther and can't pack the place - it is embarassing I'm sure for team and owners - its simple economics - they dont need the money , so drop the prices a little and fill it and maybe get more fans by doing so.

Harry Palmr

Man Utd

There are plans to expand to stadium as well.

thebaz

Man Utd

Harry Palmr wrote: »

There are plans to expand to stadium as well.

another reason to drop ticket prices !

Frankie Cortese

thebaz wrote: »

the only time I have seen the Eithad full is a derby or liverpool , they are playing the best football out ther and can't pack the place - it is embarassing I'm sure for team and owners - its simple economics - they dont need the money , so drop the prices a little and fill it and maybe get more fans by doing so.

Embarrassing for whom? The club can’t force people on seats, the fans that are in there every game have nothing to be embarrassed about & the owners have one of the best teams in Europe, I don’t see who should be embarrassed.

Maybe spare a thought for the families who are embarrassed they can’t bring there football mad sons or daughters Cos they can’t afford it & see how easy it is to get a ticket for game.

~Rebel~

Man Utd

Frankie Cortese wrote: »

The thing is with that, how do you manage it, do you drop them for mid week games & keep them at rate even if a Manchester derby or like January when Liverpool played there on a Thursday night & risk it that touts snap them up & sell for extortionate prices because they know they get a full house for them or do you keep it low & risk the wrath of the season ticket holders who have already paid their price which would be a higher fee.

It’s just impossible to do unless on game day you realise you’ve 5-10k spare tickets, you know you aren’t going to shift them so you do a flash sale, £10 a ticket & give a voucher to pre paid ticket purchases and season card holders for the club shop or bar for another game.

Ticket sales prices are broken into categories at most clubs anyway - Cat A being the highest profile. The prices of Cat A, Cat B, and Cat C are theoretically dictated by the market and demand. Clearly, Man City have totally misread their market, as their Cat B and Cat C matches are consistently under sold.

All they have to do is lower those categories to whatever figure actually meets market demand. Even if they're not making much of a profit, they can almost consider it a marketing cost - the product you're really selling (the tv sales) is an awful lot better if the seats are full and the crowd are singing. They should be actively pushing to get teens and 20-somethings into the stadium to create an atmosphere.

Frankie Cortese wrote: »

Embarrassing for whom? The club can’t force people on seats, the fans that are in there every game have nothing to be embarrassed about & the owners have one of the best teams in Europe, I don’t see who should be embarrassed.

Maybe spare a thought for the families who are embarrassed they can’t bring there football mad sons or daughters Cos they can’t afford it & see how easy it is to get a ticket for game.

That's exactly the point... it's not embarrassing for the fans, it embarrassing for the club to have such incredible wealth and still set prices that the football mad sons and daughters can't afford. That they'd rather have a half empty stadium than lower their prices says a lot about how they see their supporters. They don't need to force anyone into seats - they just need to sell those seats at reasonable prices dictated by the market.

Frankie Cortese

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Ticket sales prices are broken into categories at most clubs anyway - Cat A being the highest profile. The prices of Cat A, Cat B, and Cat C are theoretically dictated by the market and demand. Clearly, Man City have totally misread their market, as their Cat B and Cat C matches are consistently under sold.

All they have to do is lower those categories to whatever figure actually meets market demand. Even if they're not making much of a profit, they can almost consider it a marketing cost - the product you're really selling (the tv sales) is an awful lot better if the seats are full and the crowd are singing. They should be actively pushing to get teens and 20-somethings into the stadium to create an atmosphere.




That's exactly the point... it's not embarrassing for the fans, it embarrassing for the club to have such incredible wealth and still set prices that the football mad sons and daughters can't afford. That they'd rather have a half empty stadium than lower their prices. They don't need to force anyone into seats - they just need to sell those seats at reasonable prices dictated by the market.

I’m on board with all that, just referencing a few posts calling the fans plastics & having a go and then is all because I don’t think that’s fair, I know your not doing it but it has been done.

Also, I noticed Cardiff support was very poor tonight too, don’t get me wrong it’s a hell of a trip from there to Manchester on a Weds night but there tickets (all away tickets) are capped at £30 & there’s no guarantee they’ll ever go back there & even more a chance of them never watching a team like this again but nothing is mentioned. Seems like if you can’t pick faults of the team or manager then go for the fans mentality.

Mr.H

Harry Palmr wrote:

There are plans to expand to stadium as well.

Maybe they should reduce the size?

~Rebel~

Man Utd

Frankie Cortese wrote: »

I’m on board with all that, just referencing a few posts calling the fans plastics & having a go and then is all because I don’t think that’s fair, I know your not doing it but it has been done.

Also, I noticed Cardiff support was very poor tonight too, don’t get me wrong it’s a hell of a trip from there to Manchester on a Weds night but there tickets (all away tickets) are capped at £30 & there’s no guarantee they’ll ever go back there & even more a chance of them never watching a team like this again but nothing is mentioned. Seems like if you can’t pick faults of the team or manager then go for the fans mentality.

You answered that yourself already really... if you're counting in post-match traffic, you're looking at close to a 5 hour drive home, on a weeknight, getting home at probably 3am if you're lucky.

To go to that match, realistically most Cardiff fans would have to take the next day off work, and pay for accommodation - far sight more than 30 quid in that case. And it also totally rules out bringing your kids. Can't blame anyone at all for not signing up for that.

Frankie Cortese

~Rebel~ wrote: »

You answered that yourself already really... if you're counting in post-match traffic, you're looking at close to a 5 hour drive home, on a weeknight, getting home at probably 3am if you're lucky.

To go to that match, realistically most Cardiff fans would have to take the next day off work, and pay for accommodation - far sight more than 30 quid in that case. Can't blame anyone at all for not signing up for that.

I know all that, I’m not having a go at any set of fans but it was clear that both clubs had a bad turn out tonight & home team or not, it’s them that are getting the blunt of it. Anyways, a discussion for another day.