Toyota is bringing back Camry and discontinuing Avensis

Stanford · 28-07-2018 3:05pm

I have nearly always driven an Avensis and find them practically bullet proof but I only do about 10-12k pa and several mechanics have told me that this mileage is too low for diesel as they run into Cat problems, would you agree?

colm_mcm · 28-07-2018 3:16pm

Stanford wrote: »

I have nearly always driven an Avensis and find them practically bullet proof but I only do about 10-12k pa and several mechanics have told me that this mileage is too low for diesel as they run into Cat problems, would you agree?

Your 07 Avensis and the current model share little other than a name. Don’t buy diesel just because You can’t get petrol. That said, they were still selling petrol Avensis even this year.

Atlantic Dawn · 28-07-2018 4:09pm

Stanford wrote: »

I have nearly always driven an Avensis and find them practically bullet proof but I only do about 10-12k pa and several mechanics have told me that this mileage is too low for diesel as they run into Cat problems, would you agree?

It's not the miles it's how they are driven, if it's all in the town it's likely going to be trouble.

Stanford · 28-07-2018 4:22pm

It is mostly town driving, tsh the car only has 80k on it, is serviced frequently and has never given me trouble, its probably only going to get some €3500 at most in a trade in so I'm seriously thinking of keeping it instead of borrowing more money

ofcork · 28-07-2018 5:08pm

Fwiw I have a diesel avensis nearly 4 years no problems take it for a spin every so often as I don't do big miles your own wiil go forever lehanes in cork haven't got the avensis on their site now.

Stanford · 28-07-2018 5:22pm

ofcork wrote: »

Fwiw I have a diesel avensis nearly 4 years no problems take it for a spin every so often as I don't do big miles your own wiil go forever lehanes in cork haven't got the avensis on their site now.

I think you're right, it will do me fine and won't be worth any less as long as I look after it, Gearys in Limerick now don't have the new Avensis on their site either

colm_mcm · 28-07-2018 6:49pm

Stanford wrote: »

It is mostly town driving, tsh the car only has 80k on it, is serviced frequently and has never given me trouble, its probably only going to get some €3500 at most in a trade in so I'm seriously thinking of keeping it instead of borrowing more money

You wouldn’t get anything near €3500 for it unless the car you’re buying has an artificially inflated price. Your best bet by far is keeping the car you have.

Stanford · 28-07-2018 7:25pm

colm_mcm wrote: »

You wouldn’t get anything near €3500 for it unless the car you’re buying has an artificially inflated price. Your best bet by far is keeping the car you have.

I think you're correct, for example my local Toyota main dealer is already fiddling the system e.g. the price of a second hand Avensis might be say, 16k, for straight deal but the website will also say 17k with a trade in, is this legal?

AMKC · 28-07-2018 7:44pm

Stanford wrote: »

Thanks but I can't afford to buy new, do you think Dealers will discount used diesel Avensis stock as the year goes on to provide for the new Camry?

Your welcome. Might as well just keep the one you have as others have said.

bazz26 · 28-07-2018 7:49pm

It's bit of a sharp practice by dealers to fudge figures but there is nothing illegal about it. All they are doing is taking the straight deal discount of 1k and adding it to your trade-in price to make it look more attractive while at the same time adding it back the asking price of their car to offset it. They do this because all people focus on is how much the dealer gives them as a trade-in value on their old car rather than focusing on the cost to trade-up price.

zilog_jones · 30-07-2018 3:23pm

Also, most main dealers have no interest in an 11-year old trade in - it's more of a nuisance to them than anything else, as they usually don't want such old cars in their forecourt (they'd take it to an auction or sell it to someone else). I got similar a few years ago getting quotes - they'd either give me nothing for the trade-in (14 year old car), or didn't want it at all.

Stanford · 30-07-2018 3:25pm

zilog_jones wrote: »

Also, most main dealers have no interest in an 11-year old trade in - it's more of a nuisance to them than anything else, as they usually don't want such old cars in their forecourt (they'd take it to an auction or sell it to someone else). I got similar a few years ago getting quotes - they'd either give me nothing for the trade-in (14 year old car), or didn't want it at all.

I've seen clean low mileage 2007 Avensis models on Dealers forecourts for €4k

bazz26 · 30-07-2018 3:37pm

The dealer probably took it as a trade-in because the previous owner is a regular customer who had the car serviced with them over the years. They know the car is solid and they potentially can make money on selling it quickly. Asking 4k gives them a good bit of money to cover any potential warranty work they might get stung for. Reality is it's not worth anywhere near 4k but some people put extra value in buying from a dealer and getting a warranty irrespective of the age of the car. If it doesn't sell then they just sell it through the trade.

road_high · 03-08-2018 12:22pm

Why don't Toyota just re-badge a few more Peugeots if they are as desperate for new products?

vectra · 03-08-2018 12:40pm

road_high wrote: »

Why don't Toyota just re-badge a few more Peugeots if they are as desperate for new products?

Why?
Which models look the same ?

colm_mcm · 03-08-2018 1:00pm

vectra wrote: »

Why?
Which models look the same ?

The Aygo and the Proace van are developed with PSA, the Proace being just a rebadged PSA product, the Aygo is more of a joint venture

vectra · 03-08-2018 1:26pm

colm_mcm wrote: »

The Aygo and the Proace van are developed with PSA, the Proace being just a rebadged PSA product, the Aygo is more of a joint venture

Sure Opel might as rebadge them as well so then.
And Ford.

road_high · 03-08-2018 1:43pm

vectra wrote: »

Sure Opel might as rebadge them as well so then..

They already do...the Grandland and Crossland are rebadged (ugly) 3008 and 2008s. All Opels in future will be PSA platform share like all Skodas and Seats are with VW.

grogi · 03-08-2018 3:41pm

road_high wrote: »

They already do...the Grandland and Crossland are rebadged (ugly) 3008 and 2008s. All Opels in future will be PSA platform share like all Skodas and Seats are with VW.

They are not badge engineered. Sharing a platform does not equal that's the same car.

Look at the likes of Citroen C-Crosser, Peugeot 4007 and Mitsubishi Outlander. Or Opel Vivaro/Nissan Primastar/Renault Traffic - those are identical, bar the badges and optionally a few panels.

Skoda did design their cars separately from VW or Seat. Anybody saying that a Fabia is as good as a Polo, cause it simply is rebadged, has no idea what they are talking about.

vectra · 03-08-2018 7:19pm

road_high wrote: »

They already do...the Grandland and Crossland are rebadged (ugly) 3008 and 2008s. All Opels in future will be PSA platform share like all Skodas and Seats are with VW.

Specsavers

road_high · 03-08-2018 8:45pm

vectra wrote: »

Specsavers

I presume you mean about the ugly comment? They are. Dreadfully bland and generic. The 3008 by comparison looks great and the 2008 isn't bad either. Definitely won't be the sales hit Opel so desperately need.

grogi · 03-08-2018 8:50pm

road_high wrote: »

I presume you mean about the ugly comment? They are. Dreadfully bland and generic. The 3008 by comparison looks great and the 2008 isn't bad either. Definitely won't be the sales hit Opel so desperately need.

Because the best sellers: Hyundai, Toyota, VW or Skoda are soooooo unique...

Market does not want originality. The best selling collours are grey, silver and titanium, followed by moon dust and light tarmac. All exciting....

People are extremely conservative when buying a car.

road_high · 03-08-2018 9:02pm

grogi wrote: »

Because the best sellers: Hyundai, Toyota, VW or Skoda are soooooo unique...

Market does not want originality. The best selling collours are grey, silver and titanium, followed by moon dust and light tarmac. All exciting....

People are extremely conservative when buying a car.

But...those marques have at least a few snappy looking cars. Hell the Tuscon is not a too bad looking thing. I'm simply referring to the Grandland and Crossland which are very underdone style wise at a time when Opel needs to inject a bit of life into its range. People will be more forgiving of VW or Toyota as their brand and reputation can stand it. Appealing design doesn't have to be hugely unique, just fashionable.

AMKC · 04-08-2018 2:04pm

road_high wrote: »

They already do...the Grandland and Crossland are rebadged (ugly) 3008 and 2008s. All Opels in future will be PSA platform share like all Skodas and Seats are with VW.

I disagree. The Grandland X and Crossland are not ugly a bit conservative maybe yes but they are also classy. I do not get all the hate for them. The Peugeot 3008 is a stunning looking car no doubt but some old people might prefer something a bit more conservative like the Opel and that is no bad thing. At least some design has gone into the Opels unlike say a VW Tiguan which is about as exciting as a blank piece of paper.

JohnBoy26 · 04-08-2018 3:13pm

AMKC wrote: »

I disagree. The Grandland X and Crossland are not ugly a bit conservative maybe yes but they are also classy. I do not get all the hate for them. The Peugeot 3008 is a stunning looking car no doubt but some old people might prefer something a bit more conservative like the Opel and that is no bad thing. At least some design has gone into the Opels unlike say a VW Tiguan which is about as exciting as a blank piece of paper.

The crossland is a bit ugly imo, it's certainly not classy. The grandland x is ok but is dull compared to it's relative the 3008. The tiguan is understated but has a hint of class about it. They look well in the right colour.

I don't think either of the opels or the peugeot will age as well as it tbh.

04-08-2018 3:21pm

Tiguan is a very fine bus imo.....just gets mad pricey if you want 4 motion or whatever it is they call it

sob1467 · 04-08-2018 4:12pm

I'm kind of shocked. 15 pages long and there has been very little praise for a solid car in the Avensis.

My dad has drived numerous models over the years and I've put over 100k miles on my own one.

People may not have thought they were the prettiest car in the world, but they really did a good job as a standard car of getting you from a to b.

ofcork · 04-08-2018 4:14pm

I agree 100% I had an 04 petrol put 167k miles on it now have a 12 diesel no problems whatsoever.

road_high · 04-08-2018 6:03pm

sob1467 wrote: »

I'm kind of shocked. 15 pages long and there has been very little praise for a solid car in the Avensis.

My dad has drived numerous models over the years and I've put over 100k miles on my own one.

People may not have thought they were the prettiest car in the world, but they really did a good job as a standard car of getting you from a to b.

I think the Avensis was great car but they stopped developing it about a decade ago. It was paired back, rehashed a few times and fell way behind the competition. I think it's a shame that happened but I guess other markets far bigger than us dictate the direction and it wasn't popular in the rest of Europe as the market for that type of car is falling steadily. Hence why they brought in the CHR crossover.

TrailerBob · 04-08-2018 7:30pm

I thought this thread was about the Toyota Camry handover... and Opels are being mentioned... I hate Opels... last good car they had was the Ascona

colm_mcm · 04-08-2018 7:55pm

Ah I’m sure they’ll bring the Avensis back in 15 years time.

pablo128 · 04-08-2018 10:05pm

road_high wrote: »

I think the Avensis was great car but they stopped developing it about a decade ago. It was paired back, rehashed a few times and fell way behind the competition. I think it's a shame that happened but I guess other markets far bigger than us dictate the direction and it wasn't popular in the rest of Europe as the market for that type of car is falling steadily. Hence why they brought in the CHR crossover.

The chr is basically a jacked up Auris, size wise. Nowhere near as big as the Avensis.

road_high · 04-08-2018 11:54pm

pablo128 wrote: »

The chr is basically a jacked up Auris, size wise. Nowhere near as big as the Avensis.

Its weird from some angles they appear big! I think the list price of them is ludicrous- must be giving good deals to tempt buyers as they appear to be selling well. I’d say they are still taking in a few Avensis drivers

Atlantic Dawn · 05-08-2018 12:30am

I suppose pricing will be revealed in the next month or so, they need to hit about base price of the Passat on the entry level model for it to be a success.

vectra · 05-08-2018 12:47am

TrailerBob wrote: »

I thought this thread was about the Toyota Camry handover... and Opels are being mentioned... I hate Opels... last good car they had was the Ascona

I had an Ascona C 2.0i Salon
Konis all round and shorter springs
I loved that car, 230+k miles on it and it ran beautifully.
I replaced it with a Vectra A 2.0i Hatch Couldnt fault that car either.
Moved away from opels after that.

road_high · 08-08-2018 3:25pm

pablo128 wrote: »

The chr is basically a jacked up Auris, size wise. Nowhere near as big as the Avensis.

Probably same size as the Avensis Mark 1 the way things have gone with cars.

colm_mcm · 08-08-2018 5:58pm

The CHR is smaller than an Auris.

road_high · 08-08-2018 7:07pm

colm_mcm wrote: »

The CHR is smaller than an Auris.

Avensis Mark 1;

Wheelbase
2,630 mm (103.5 in)
Length
Estate: 4,600 mm (181.1 in)
Others: 4,520 mm (178.0 in)

Width
1,710 mm (67.3 in)

CHR;

Wheelbase
2,640 mm (103.9 in)
Length
4,360 mm (171.7 in)

Width
1,795 mm (70.7 in)

Auris;

Wheelbase
2,600 mm (102 in)

Length
4,275 mm (168 in)

Width
1,760 mm (69 in)

reubenreuben · 08-08-2018 7:08pm

Same old, hard to get excited about them

colm_mcm · 08-08-2018 7:11pm

road_high wrote: »

Avensis Mark 1;

Wheelbase
2,630 mm (103.5 in)
Length
Estate: 4,600 mm (181.1 in)
Others: 4,520 mm (178.0 in)

Width
1,710 mm (67.3 in)

CHR;

Wheelbase
2,640 mm (103.9 in)
Length
4,360 mm (171.7 in)

Width
1,795 mm (70.7 in)

Auris;

Wheelbase
2,600 mm (102 in)

Length
4,275 mm (168 in)

Width
1,760 mm (69 in)

Sorry, i meant inside. They’re quite tight in the back.

road_high · 08-08-2018 7:19pm

colm_mcm wrote: »

Sorry, i meant inside. They’re quite tight in the back.

Are they? I've not sat in one at all but assumed they'd be very well packaged especially with the long wheelbase.

zilog_jones · 09-08-2018 7:47am

Have you been in any small crossover? They are generally terrible for rear space. It's no better than the Auris hatchback at best, if not worse. If you wanted better packaging then you'd need smaller wheels, for a start.

vectra · 09-08-2018 8:05am

Has this thread gone off topic or am I dreaming?
I thought it was about the upcoming Camry.

zilog_jones · 09-08-2018 9:15am

I think the discussion of the Avensis vs. C-HR is relevant, as it's the compact crossovers which are the market leaders now. 10 years ago, the Avensis was the 5th best selling car in Ireland, but now the best seller in that class is the Passat at 19th place - and the C-HR is selling much more than that.

It will be interesting to see how well the Camry does, but I can't see it being a big seller here. It might find a niche with taxis and hire cars maybe, if it's priced competitively. If we get the Japanese-built model, there will hopefully be benefits with the removal of the 10% tariff on Japanese cars imported to the EU.

road_high · 09-08-2018 2:29pm

zilog_jones wrote: »

Have you been in any small crossover? They are generally terrible for rear space. It's no better than the Auris hatchback at best, if not worse. If you wanted better packaging then you'd need smaller wheels, for a start.

I haven't been in one actually- I thought the selling point would be more space not less!! What exactly is the point then bar sitting higher and maybe higher ground clearance?

colm_mcm · 09-08-2018 3:15pm

road_high wrote: »

I haven't been in one actually- I thought the selling point would be more space not less!! What exactly is the point then bar sitting higher and maybe higher ground clearance?

They’re fashionable.

pablo128 · 09-08-2018 6:29pm

colm_mcm wrote: »

They’re fashionable.

Women think they're Jeep's too. I heard one bint calling her Nissan Juke a jeep. For God's sake the thing is more like a Micra but higher up.:pac:

colm_mcm · 09-08-2018 6:59pm

A juke is the same size as a CJ Jeep Cherokee!

creedp · 10-08-2018 10:17am

colm_mcm wrote: »

A juke is the same size as a CJ Jeep Cherokee!

A Cherokee is a Jeep but a Juke is a Nissan

10-08-2018 10:21am

road_high wrote: »

I haven't been in one actually- I thought the selling point would be more space not less!! What exactly is the point then bar sitting higher and maybe higher ground clearance?

I had a chr for 4 days or so last year. Great bus IMO. 50mpg, the adult in the back reckoned there was plenty room and the boot tokk 3 people's luggage no problem.

Lovely to drive, great seating position.

Couldn't fault it.

I drove it shortly after spending a month in a Ford Edge in the States and that was not too long after spending 5 weeks in a Kuga. The CHR was no doubt smaller than both of them but was at least Corolla size internally so plenty big enough for many people / families.

Toyota is bringing back Camry and discontinuing Avensis

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