Toyota is bringing back Camry and discontinuing Avensis

DaveyDave

I believe someone in the insurance forum said that insurance quotes are based on the amount of claims on that particular model. My mam could get a cheaper quote on a 245hp Golf GTI PP than a slow i30 110hp diesel. Obviously NCB etc comes into play but only does so much for you.

zilog_jones

tretorn wrote: »

...in reality would I use much less fuel with my existing 2 litre Rav than the new hybrid 2.5 litre one.

How do you know that? The new model isn't out yet, no reliable fuel economy figures are available. The new Camry with the same engine does 62 MPG on the US EPA tests, and they're achievable in the real world.

Assuming fuel economy based on displacement and nothing else is silly.

AMKC

tretorn wrote: »

Im thinking of trading a diesel Rav4 in for the new Rav4 but have just discovered the new Rav4 Hybrid is automatic only.

Also I dont know about pre ordering it before I have driven it.

Im not sure what to do now.

I would say shop around. Have a look at the Mazda CX-5 and the Peugeot 3008.

tretorn

I have always driven Toyotas, totally reliable cars that never cost much in maintenance.
Im nervous of moving but there is a new VW small crossover that looks nice.

Skylinehead

grogi wrote: »

Today, when you can have a 1.0 130PS, the capacity is not important anymore. With the wake of small turbocharged petrols, the insurance companies changed the way they look at engine capacity.

Not entirely, Liberty will tell you where to go if you want any engine over 2.5l and you're under 30.

vectra

zilog_jones wrote: »

How do you know that? The new model isn't out yet, no reliable fuel economy figures are available. The new Camry with the same engine does 62 MPG on the US EPA tests, and they're achievable in the real world.

Assuming fuel economy based on displacement and nothing else is silly.

Is that US or UK gallon?

colm_mcm

tretorn wrote: »

I have always driven Toyotas, totally reliable cars that never cost much in maintenance.
Im nervous of moving but there is a new VW small crossover that looks nice.

That’s the T Roc. Also available in Seat Andrew Skoda flavours. Toyota do the CH-R which competes with these.

There are also other versions of the Tiguan, the Skoda Karol and Seat Ateca.

mickdw

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

Mid size dude

Fair enough but I was referring to within the Toyota offering.

Small was traditionally the starlet / Yaris,
Medium Corolla and
Large - Carina / Avensis since Camry was gone.

My point was that if a Toyota buyer is looking for a Toyota bigger than a corolla, the camry is the only option (unless they go for Rav4) and it will be seen as the large offering from Toyota in that context.

To be honest, I don't use the 'Full Size' as an actual classification at all. I think that's an American thing.

mickdw

DaveyDave wrote: »

What large saloon cars have small turbo engines in them? I only see 1 litre turbos in hatchbacks and hatchback sized crossovers.

Ford I was referring to, fitting 1.0 turbo petrol to the Mondeo. You also have 1.2 Qashqai,

grogi

mickdw wrote: »

Isn't there a massive shift in the market when Toyota release their large family car with a 2.5 petrol engine. Hybrid or not, this can only be a move for the better considering some are going to 1.0L turbos

Toyota already goes against the rest of the market. The new yaris comes with an upsizied 1.5l...

V8 Interceptor

mickdw wrote: »

Fair enough but I was referring to within the Toyota offering.

Still midsize. Their full size saloon/sedan is the Avalon.

mickdw wrote: »

My point was that if a Toyota buyer is looking for a Toyota bigger than a corolla, the camry is the only option .

In Ireland, yes. We don't buy many Full Sizers. Most of them wouldn't fit.

I'm not sure if you could class an A6 as a full size because there's the A8. Or perhaps the latter is at Limo standard?

mickdw

Try walking into Toyota in this country and ordering an Avalon. It doesn't exist in this market.

AMKC

tretorn wrote: »

I have always driven Toyotas, totally reliable cars that never cost much in maintenance.
Im nervous of moving but there is a new VW small crossover that looks nice.

I would suggest looking at the Seat Ateca and the Skoda Karoq.

The Kia Sportage is well worth looking at too and it has just been updated. It holds its value well too.

V8 Interceptor

mickdw wrote: »

Try walking into Toyota in this country and ordering an Avalon. It doesn't exist in this market.

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

In Ireland, yes. We don't buy many Full Sizers. Most of them wouldn't fit.

.

JohnBoy26

grogi wrote: »

Toyota already goes against the rest of the market. The new yaris comes with an upsizied 1.5l...

That's probably because it's a rebadged mazda 2

colm_mcm

grogi wrote: »

Toyota already goes against the rest of the market. The new yaris comes with an upsizied 1.5l...

They’re still doing the 1.0 , nothing in between that and the 1.5 though.

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

That's probably because it's a rebadged mazda 2

In America, but are they bringing that to Europe?

zilog_jones

vectra wrote: »

Is that US or UK gallon?

Imperial gallons. You can see US gallons here: https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do?action=sbs&id=39752&id=39373&id=40720

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

That's probably because it's a rebadged mazda 2

That's the "Yaris Sedan" sold in North America, totally unrelated to the Yaris here, which is based on the XP130 Vitz and built in France.

Lantus

A mondeo and passat are cheaper at any model and spec bar one high spec passat and even the arteon is competitive against this car.

Saloon desirability is dropping so I'm not sure what this offers beyond very well established brands and models?

colm_mcm

It seems that only German saloons are in demand, and even at that the German manufacturers are offering liftbacks with a hefty premium as an alternative.

vectra

zilog_jones wrote: »

Imperial gallons. You can see US gallons here: https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do?action=sbs&id=39752&id=39373&id=40720

Imp.is all I wanted to know.
Thanks.

pablo128

colm_mcm wrote: »

It seems that only German saloons are in demand, and even at that the German manufacturers are offering liftbacks with a hefty premium as an alternative.

I was pretty amazed at how well the Camry sells worldwide with just one body style. No estate any more.

JohnBoy26

colm_mcm wrote: »

They’re still doing the 1.0 , nothing in between that and the 1.5 though.




In America, but are they bringing that to Europe?

Thought the op was talking about the mazda based yaris when they said new yaris. Don't know if they are bringing it here tbh

JohnBoy26

zilog_jones wrote: »

Imperial gallons. You can see US gallons here: https://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/Find.do?action=sbs&id=39752&id=39373&id=40720



That's the "Yaris Sedan" sold in North America, totally unrelated to the Yaris here, which is based on the XP130 Vitz and built in France.

I know but the yaris we have here is hardly new. When the op mentioned new yaris and 1.5 the mazda 2 sprang to mind

Leonard Hofstadter

Since when did the Yaris become based on the Mazda 2?

Sexual Chocolate

pablo128 wrote: »

I was pretty amazed at how well the Camry sells worldwide with just one body style. No estate any more.

Very popular here in Australia from 90s models onwards. Also the main choice for taxis as well, especially in hybrid. Irrelevant but as of last year production of them ended in Australia, as with the Falcon and Commondore.

DaveyDave

Leonard Hofstadter wrote: »

Since when did the Yaris become based on the Mazda 2?

From Wikipedia:

"In Canada, Mexico, and the United States, the Demio is sold by Toyota with slight styling changes as an iteration of the Toyota Yaris sedan"

bazz26

I see they have released photos of the new Corolla saloon:





Joining the hatchback and estate:

scooby77

Looks ok, Camry junior maybe. Pity no plans put new 2.0 hybrid in it!

elperello

The new Corolla Saloon has the same wheelbase as the outgoing Avensis at 2700.
Length is 4620 vs. Avensis at 4710
Width is 1775 vs. Avensis at 1810

Could be a successor to Avensis for some customers.

ba_barabus

Looks great to me. I'm hoping there will be a high spec version. It's a pity it's not getting the 2.0 but realistically who is going to buy it.

V8 Interceptor

The Camry's always had a slightly prestigious look to them here in Ireland. Probably because they were slightly larger than other normal D Segment saloons, had a bigger engine and were relatively rare.

In the USA they're derided as a "Moms car"!

V8 Interceptor

bazz26 wrote: »

I see they have released photos of the new Corolla saloon.

Are they going to have anything better than the 1.3L (manual) that we had to make do with in Ireland?

Leonard Hofstadter

They're going to be selling it with a 1.6 Valvematic. Odd in this day and age to launch a new car with a naturally aspirated engine although I doubt your average Corolla buyer either knows or cares. I've driven an Auris with that engine and there is loads of go in it for a NA 1.6.

As for it being big enough to replace the Avensis, it's certainly priced like an Avensis anyway, starts at something like €27k here.

bazz26

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

Are they going to have anything better than the 1.3L (manual) that we had to make do with in Ireland?

1.6 petrol and 1.8 petrol/hybrid only. The saloon is also being sold in the UK for the first time in 15 years. I don't think they will sell many there though.

Atlantic Dawn

Spotted this hybrid Honda Accord on Donedeal, wonder will Honda start bringing new versions of this in, I suppose Accord is somewhere between Avensis and Camry. I know they have ditched the current Accord onsale in Europe.



https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/honda-accord-2019-sale-now-on-132-hybrid/20358537

bazz26

Very unlikely, they recently launched a saloon version of the current Civic and it's not far off the dimensions of the old Accord that disappeared here from around 2014. Japanese and US Accords are totally different to the ones sold in Europe so I don't see the financial sense in designing a car just for Europe in a shrinking segment where SUVs are becoming more popular. Honda have just launched the CRV with a hybrid version due early next year. They don't need another saloon in between that and the Civic.

selectamatic

Leonard Hofstadter wrote: »

They're going to be selling it with a 1.6 Valvematic. Odd in this day and age to launch a new car with a naturally aspirated engine although I doubt your average Corolla buyer either knows or cares. I've driven an Auris with that engine and there is loads of go in it for a NA 1.6.

As said it's a real pity the 2.0 170bhp petrol and six speed manual options aren't available it'd be a real throwback to the warm 90's Toyota's.

CJhaughey

Now that Honda UK are out of the picture with regard to having the ultimate say in what Models are sold in Europe I would hope that Honda Europe will start to bring the Accord back, I understand that Honda UK was very unhappy selling imported Models as they preferred to sell UK built models like the CRV, and Civic and were very glad to drop the Accord.

V8 Interceptor

selectamatic wrote: »

As said it's a real pity the 2.0 170bhp petrol and six speed manual options aren't available it'd be a real throwback to the warm 90's Toyota's.

Still, that 1.6L 130hp is a step up from the 1.3L. An extra 30 horse.

Is that 2.0L gonna be sold in other markets?

selectamatic

V8 Interceptor wrote: »

Still, that 1.6L 130hp is a step up from the 1.3L. An extra 30 horse.

Is that 2.0L gonna be sold in other markets?

Don't think it'll be in any European market. Australia and the US have it since last year.

V8 Interceptor

Yeah your average Irish Corolla buyers are probably middle aged family folk. 2.0L 170hp ain't gonna sell. 'Tis a pity though.

Leonard Hofstadter

The hatchback and estate will be available with the 2.0 hybrid here.

bazz26

Leonard Hofstadter wrote: »

The hatchback and estate will be available with the 2.0 hybrid here.

I heard prices of circa 37k for one of those. Don't think you will be seeing too many sold at those sort of prices.

Leonard Hofstadter

bazz26 wrote: »

I heard prices of circa 37k for one of those. Don't think you will be seeing too many sold at those sort of prices.

At those prices definitely not. Toyota Ireland are totally taking the proverbial with the pricing for these cars, €27k for the cheapest Corolla is mental (or €26k for the conventional petrol engine), it wasn't that long ago when you could get an Avensis in a good spec for the same money.

Admittedly the new car looks like a massive step forward, a bit like the difference between a Mk1 and Mk2 Avensis, and it seems to have gotten very favourable reviews in the UK press (so that must mean it's someway decent) but I still think it's very expensive.

mickdw

Its impressive looking for a corolla but I'm sure 99 percent of the ones sold here will look terrible in base spec.
It does look like they are replacing the avensis with corolla and keeping the Camry as a higher end option. The pricing would suggest so anyway.
The result will be huge corolla sales and no Camry sales.

pablo128

Leonard Hofstadter wrote: »

At those prices definitely not. Toyota Ireland are totally taking the proverbial with the pricing for these cars, €27k for the cheapest Corolla is mental (or €26k for the conventional petrol engine), it wasn't that long ago when you could get an Avensis in a good spec for the same money.

Admittedly the new car looks like a massive step forward, a bit like the difference between a Mk1 and Mk2 Avensis, and it seems to have gotten very favourable reviews in the UK press (so that must mean it's someway decent) but I still think it's very expensive.

The base Corolla with the 1.3 is 22,250.

Actually never mind that. Thats for the old model.I've been looking and it's very hard to find out the price for the non hybrid Corolla.

Borderfox

mickdw wrote: »

Its impressive looking for a corolla but I'm sure 99 percent of the ones sold here will look terrible in base spec.
It does look like they are replacing the avensis with corolla and keeping the Camry as a higher end option. The pricing would suggest so anyway.
The result will be huge corolla sales and no Camry sales.

The pictures of the corolla looked like cg, I would agree with the base spec. Ireland always get the crappiest spec going in cars

Leonard Hofstadter

I think the entry level model will be Luna spec, so for once they'll actually be some way decently equipped even if you go for the cheapest version.

Blazer

Borderfox wrote: »

The pictures of the corolla looked like cg, I would agree with the base spec. Ireland always get the crappiest spec going in cars

Blame our vrt and excise duty for that.
Ireland’s base cost of a car is on a par with the UK but we are being rode by the government here for tax.
Which is why car manufacturers offer paddy spec.

Borderfox

Blazer wrote: »

Blame our vrt and excise duty for that.
Ireland’s base cost of a car is on a par with the UK but we are being rode by the government here for tax.
Which is why car manufacturers offer paddy spec.

Looking at some of the colours on the road they let them out of the factory with only the primer on them

Im surprised that SIMI haven't taken a case to Europe over the VRT still being charged despite it being a temporary measure