Ireland Under 20 2019 6 Nations and World Championships

RuPi

This might help with working out some of the Irish 20’s

https://inpho.ie/assignment/loLcFkE489Rb1IjumtjmDA..a?wosid=Hlr4tPX1xB7Qp4Z7MQQRtM&woinst=2&ts=_OuyshioQtz-yUqrcxItjg..a

Thermoman12

RuPi wrote: »

This might help with working out some of the Irish 20’s

https://inpho.ie/assignment/loLcFkE489Rb1IjumtjmDA..a?wosid=Hlr4tPX1xB7Qp4Z7MQQRtM&woinst=2&ts=_OuyshioQtz-yUqrcxItjg..a

Thank you

The Lost Sheep

On twitter Collinho who also posts on mfans was at game and tweeted updates

Thermoman12

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

On twitter Collinho who also posts on mfans was at game and tweeted updates

What’s the twitter account called?

The Lost Sheep

Thermoman12 wrote: »

What’s the twitter account called?

collinho

Thermoman12

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

collinho

Ah thank you, found it, cheers

Mucky_Tackies

Munster pack dominated Irish pack until changes rang in after halftime. Collisions, contact area and most notably scrum, Munster were superior. Lineout let them down, ire much sharper in that regard.

Ire looked most dangerous when going wide or playing off turnovers but got bossed in contact until about midway through 2nd half. Munster 6&8 had notably good games, Irish backrow seemed very lacking

Ire depth really counted , big improvement when subs came in versus Munster subs not having as big an impact.

Irish fullback Jake something lovely runner of the ball. Moved to 10 for injury cover but looked great at 15. Irish right winger looked a class act too. Everything that came near him, he made good of be it to hand or in the air. Irish substitute 15, small guy in headgear, very threatening when he came on, constantly looked for gaps and got on the ball.

Ref didn't police offside line for either team so became bit of a free for all at times, difficult for either team to get through phases. Neither 10 had great game but Munster 10 had some lovely relieving kicks, great strike of a ball.

Well contested game, number of Munster players outshone counterparts and a number of Irish subs put down a marker. Irish front row will be very disappointed in performance

Thermoman12

Mucky_Tackies wrote: »

Munster pack dominated Irish pack until changes rang in after halftime. Collisions, contact area and most notably scrum, Munster were superior. Lineout let them down, ire much sharper in that regard.

Ire looked most dangerous when going wide or playing off turnovers but got bossed in contact until about midway through 2nd half. Munster 6&8 had notably good games, Irish backrow seemed very lacking

Ire depth really counted , big improvement when subs came in versus Munster subs not having as big an impact.

Irish fullback Jake something lovely runner of the ball. Moved to 10 for injury cover but looked great at 15. Irish right winger looked a class act too. Everything that came near him, he made good of be it to hand or in the air. Irish substitute 15, small guy in headgear, very threatening when he came on, constantly looked for gaps and got on the ball.

Ref didn't police offside line for either team so became bit of a free for all at times, difficult for either team to get through phases. Neither 10 had great game but Munster 10 had some lovely relieving kicks, great strike of a ball.

Well contested game, number of Munster players outshone counterparts and a number of Irish subs put down a marker. Irish front row will be very disappointed in performance

Who were the centers for Ireland?

The Lost Sheep

Thermoman12 wrote: »

Who were the centers for Ireland?

Sean French, David Hawkshaw
https://munsterrugby.ie/2018/12/31/report-munster-a-dev-v-ireland-u20s/

Wegians89

The Lost Sheep wrote: »

Sean French, David Hawkshaw
https://munsterrugby.ie/2018/12/31/report-munster-a-dev-v-ireland-u20s/

Is that Conor Hayes that was on the Irish bench not the Connacht one? Or do Munster have a different one?

The Lost Sheep

Wegians89 wrote: »

Is that Conor Hayes that was on the Irish bench not the Connacht one? Or do Munster have a different one?

It'll be guy with Connacht.

Locke_Lamora

Thermoman12 wrote: »

Who were the centers for Ireland?

I’ve been told Moore should be out for a while due to an injury when he scored his intercept in the last game.

Hands Like Flippers

Any team sheets for Irish schools u18 and clubs u18 game?

Blackheath

With both game against Leinster and Munster over had anyone an idea of what team should play against England?

The Lost Sheep

Hands Like Flippers wrote: »

Any team sheets for Irish schools u18 and clubs u18 game?

Best leave that to the youths thread. isnt really on topic for under 20 thread

Blackheath wrote: »

With both game against Leinster and Munster over had anyone an idea of what team should play against England?

Compare starting teams from both the games and see who played both and put the starters from both games possibly as favourites for first 6 nation game.

Dubinusa

Does the side this year have many standouts??
Last year, I thought the players individually were good, but the coaching was atrocious.
I would guess that Kernahan would be a lock for the starting xv. He has pro 14 experience and has looked good.
Lowry is a fine player also and comes with pro 14 experience.
There are a couple of lads left from last year also, Harry Byrne and Charlie Ryan.
England are up 1st and are always a very good team.
The last 2 years have been frustrating as some of the lads have excelled and made a mark with the provinces.
Boyle with Connacht and Doris with Leinster are 2.
I think the talent is there, but the coaching is not getting much out of them.

The Lost Sheep

Dubinusa wrote: »

Does the side this year have many standouts??
Last year, I thought the players individually were good, but the coaching was atrocious.
I would guess that Kernahan would be a lock for the starting xv. He has pro 14 experience and has looked good.
Lowry is a fine player also and comes with pro 14 experience.
There are a couple of lads left from last year also, Harry Byrne and Charlie Ryan.
England are up 1st and are always a very good team.
The last 2 years have been frustrating as some of the lads have excelled and made a mark with the provinces.
Boyle with Connacht and Doris with Leinster are 2.
I think the talent is there, but the coaching is not getting much out of them.

Being pedantic theyre all standouts but some who could really progress for me are Harry Byrne, David Hawkshaw, John Hodnett, JJ McKee and Niall Murray

DonVito

Lowry is over age.

Dubinusa

Pity bout Lowry. He looked good for Ulster.

arsebiscuits1

Dubinusa wrote: »

Does the side this year have many standouts??
Last year, I thought the players individually were good, but the coaching was atrocious.
I would guess that Kernahan would be a lock for the starting xv. He has pro 14 experience and has looked good.
Lowry is a fine player also and comes with pro 14 experience.
There are a couple of lads left from last year also, Harry Byrne and Charlie Ryan.
England are up 1st and are always a very good team.
The last 2 years have been frustrating as some of the lads have excelled and made a mark with the provinces.
Boyle with Connacht and Doris with Leinster are 2.
I think the talent is there, but the coaching is not getting much out of them.

Hawkshaw coming with arguably the biggest reputation.

Seems to have done quite well for Tarf at senior and U20 this season

Heymans

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

Hawkshaw coming with arguably the biggest reputation.

Seems to have done quite well for Tarf at senior and U20 this season

I think you'll find there is a drop off on some schools players after school and I think this is the case with Hawkshaw. Sometimes these players know their team so well and click in that environment it is difficult to come outside of that and recreate it with whom was your competitors. I think we'll see him struggle to make transition from what was a sparkling schools career into professionalism.

Sudolife

Heymans wrote: »

I think you'll find there is a drop off on some schools players after school and I think this is the case with Hawkshaw. Sometimes these players know their team so well and click in that environment it is difficult to come outside of that and recreate it with whom was your competitors. I think we'll see him struggle to make transition from what was a sparkling schools career into professionalism.

I disagree, the guy has came into every team he's ever played in and made a huge positive difference in the quality of the teams play.

He also is either going to be named captain or vice captain.

Thermoman12

Heymans wrote: »

I think you'll find there is a drop off on some schools players after school and I think this is the case with Hawkshaw. Sometimes these players know their team so well and click in that environment it is difficult to come outside of that and recreate it with whom was your competitors. I think we'll see him struggle to make transition from what was a sparkling schools career into professionalism.

I think he’s used to playing in different environments at a high standard, he played for Dublin and won the Leinster minor hurling championship as a 16 year old, won the senior cup as a 16 year old and played a vital role in that campaign scoring two tries against Blackrock and started Ireland u18s as a 16 year old, and he also captained Leinster u19s, I would say he’s used to playing in different environments at a high standard

Lucas44

Sudolife wrote: »

I disagree, the guy has came into every team he's ever played in and made a huge positive difference in the quality of the teams play.

He also is either going to be named captain or vice captain.

Whatever about him being a good player there is absolutely no chance of him being captain or vice captain. He’s probably 3rd maybe even 4th choice 10 and 2nd choice 12 when Moore is fit. Captain will be either Craig Casey or Charlie Ryan with the other being vice . Maybe Harry Byrne or azur Allison could get a leadership role I.e vice captain

Lucas44

Thermoman12 wrote: »

I think he’s used to playing in different environments at a high standard, he played for Dublin and won the Leinster minor hurling championship as a 16 year old, won the senior cup as a 16 year old and played a vital role in that campaign scoring two tries against Blackrock and started Ireland u18s as a 16 year old, and he also captained Leinster u19s, I would say he’s used to playing in different environments at a high standard

Yes he played for Ireland u18s as an u17 but hasn’t really kicked on, Harry Byrne and Ben Healy both ahead of him at 10 and maybe even Jake Flannery

Thermoman12

Lucas44 wrote: »

Yes he played for Ireland u18s as an u17 but hasn’t really kicked on, Harry Byrne and Ben Healy both ahead of him at 10 and maybe even Jake Flannery

That’s only because he was injured for Ireland the past two years and Ben Healy hasn’t even played an u20 game yet and Jake Flannery is playing fullback, hawkshaw will start 12 with Harry Byrne at 10

Thermoman12

Lucas44 wrote: »

Whatever about him being a good player there is absolutely no chance of him being captain or vice captain. He’s probably 3rd maybe even 4th choice 10 and 2nd choice 12 when Moore is fit. Captain will be either Craig Casey or Charlie Ryan with the other being vice . Maybe Harry Byrne or azur Allison could get a leadership role I.e vice captain

What makes you think he’s not a good captain? Wouldn’t say there’s no chance of him being captain considering he’s captained teams in the past, he’s captained Leinster u19 and his school team even when he just came back from injury, Harry Byrne has never been a captain before and Azur Allison is injured and hasn’t played any warm up games for the u20s.

Thermoman12

Lucas44 wrote: »

Whatever about him being a good player there is absolutely no chance of him being captain or vice captain. He’s probably 3rd maybe even 4th choice 10 and 2nd choice 12 when Moore is fit. Captain will be either Craig Casey or Charlie Ryan with the other being vice . Maybe Harry Byrne or azur Allison could get a leadership role I.e vice captain

You clearly haven’t watched the past 2 Ireland u20 games

Lucas44

Thermoman12 wrote: »

You clearly haven’t watched the past 2 Ireland u20 games

You mean the games Casey captained the side in? You can’t have a captain who isn’t guaranteed to start

Lucas44

Thermoman12 wrote: »

What makes you think he’s not a good captain? Wouldn’t say there’s no chance of him being captain considering he’s captained teams in the past, he’s captained Leinster u19 and his school team even when he just came back from injury, Harry Byrne has never been a captain before and Azur Allison is injured and hasn’t played any warm up games for the u20s.

Never said he wasn’t a good captain, said he’s not guaranteed to start. Don’t forget that leinster u19 side didn’t include Ryan and Byrne. Ryan was named captain of Irish 18s before injury in sct final and Allison captained Irish 19s last year. In relation to Byrne I don’t think he will be captain but he has always played a year up and your captain has to be one of the first names down on the sheet

Thermoman12

Lucas44 wrote: »

You mean the games Casey captained the side in? You can’t have a captain who isn’t guaranteed to start

That’s just your opinion that he’s not guaranteed to start, anyway to be fair no one is guaranteed to start at the moment, there’s a lot of competition in the squad and I think it’s great

Thermoman12

Lucas44 wrote: »

Never said he wasn’t a good captain, said he’s not guaranteed to start. Don’t forget that leinster u19 side didn’t include Ryan and Byrne. Ryan was named captain of Irish 18s before injury in sct final and Allison captained Irish 19s last year. In relation to Byrne I don’t think he will be captain but he has always played a year up and your captain has to be one of the first names down on the sheet

There’s no point arguing about this now, let’s just wait for the first game and see what happens it’s great the amount of talent in the squad and I think it’s one of the most talented squads in a few years, really looking forward to it

jmn51927

Arguably the most talented backline in recent history?
Casey Byrne Kernohan Hawkshaw French Turner Flannery?
Exceptional when you think of the likes of Foley Hughes Moore Wren Healy O’Sullivan Ryan all are excluded

arsebiscuits1

Heymans wrote: »

I think you'll find there is a drop off on some schools players after school and I think this is the case with Hawkshaw. Sometimes these players know their team so well and click in that environment it is difficult to come outside of that and recreate it with whom was your competitors. I think we'll see him struggle to make transition from what was a sparkling schools career into professionalism.

I'm just going to translate your post into a less condescending format:

"Rugby players who thrived in schools game either make it or they don't professionally"

Very insightful :pac:

You've given yourself a scenario where you've a 50% chance of being right all the while writing off a 19 year old who was playing SCT rugby just last season.

So far this season he has 2 appearances in an exceptionally strong Leinster A team and a fistful of appearances including starts for Clontarf.

I'd be waiting until I see him in the U20 6 nations before writing him off

elliot_st

No Azur Allison, Ryan Baird, Scott Penny or Cormac Foley so far due to injury.

arsebiscuits1

elliot_st wrote: »

No Azur Allison, Ryan Baird, Scott Penny or Cormac Foley so far due to injury.

Looks like Penny was saved for senior Leinster duty as opposed to injury ha.

Some bragging rights among his peers for that one

Heymans

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

I'm just going to translate your post into a less condescending format:

"Rugby players who thrived in schools game either make it or they don't professionally"

Very insightful :pac:

You've given yourself a scenario where you've a 50% chance of being right all the while writing off a 19 year old who was playing SCT rugby just last season.

So far this season he has 2 appearances in an exceptionally strong Leinster A team and a fistful of appearances including starts for Clontarf.

I'd be waiting until I see him in the U20 6 nations before writing him off

If he makes the team!


I think the Belvo players struggle to recreate their success at provincial and international level - I include Hawkshaw in this category.

Dubinusa

I'm thinking that Penny will be retained at Leinster during the 6nations. With Vdfand Leavy at Carton house.
He starts against Ulster this weekend. He's been impressive from what I've seen.

kingofthekong

england u20s look very very good , buckets of talent

Dubinusa

Yea, they always are loaded. Very difficult side to play against most years.
But, we punch above our weight imo.
Even last years crop will develop 3 or 4 good pro players.

Locke_Lamora

kingofthekong wrote: »

england u20s look very very good , buckets of talent

Yea there's a lot of talent throughout that whole team. Kpoku, Hill and Willis are the standouts in the forwards, but there's other names I recognise as well. In the backs, Smith, Lawrence, Maunder and Redpath will all probably play for England. Wilkinson, Sleightholme, Murley and Dingwall are all good players too. I'm not sure how strong France are this year, but it will take an exceptional team to beat a full strength England side.

Thermoman12

Locke_Lamora wrote: »

Yea there's a lot of talent throughout that whole team. Kpoku, Hill and Willis are the standouts in the forwards, but there's other names I recognise as well. In the backs, Smith, Lawrence, Maunder and Redpath will all probably play for England. Wilkinson, Sleightholme, Murley and Dingwall are all good players too. I'm not sure how strong France are this year, but it will take an exceptional team to beat a full strength England side.

Do you think Ireland have a chance against them?

Locke_Lamora

Thermoman12 wrote: »

Do you think Ireland have a chance against them?

If the clubs release all their players, I can't really see us winning. There's a lot of professional experience in that England team with Hill, Smith and Redpath having trained with the wider england squad, and some of the other names I mentioned have played really well for their club. I think this could potentially be one of those outlier years for them.

But I reckon there's quite a lot of talent in the Ireland squad as well. Doubt there will players on the same career trajectory as Ryan, Larmour, Stockdale or Porter but could turn out to be excellent players down the line. I think u20's should always be watched with that in mind.

Dubinusa

I think we'll build towards the rwc. We've been very poor these last two.
I fear relegation tbh.
But, I think the coaching ticket was very poor last year. Whoever the defence coach was, needs to be replaced.
As a collective, I thought we were at sea, the lads didn't appear to be on the same page.
Individually, there were some good players. I thought O',Sullivan was very good, Dunne was decent too.
But, other lads were poor overall, Masterson did not impress imo and neither did Sylvester.
Anyway, new group and really looking forward to the 6nations.

The Lost Sheep

Dubinusa wrote: »

I think we'll build towards the rwc. We've been very poor these last two.
I fear relegation tbh.
But, I think the coaching ticket was very poor last year. Whoever the defence coach was, needs to be replaced.
As a collective, I thought we were at sea, the lads didn't appear to be on the same page.
Individually, there were some good players. I thought O',Sullivan was very good, Dunne was decent too.
But, other lads were poor overall, Masterson did not impress imo and neither did Sylvester.
Anyway, new group and really looking forward to the 6nations.

Well we always are building towards the world championship and you cant talk about relegation at all unless you have some knowledge of other teams etc
Think you are being very unfair on named individuals there last year but its last year so move on.

Thermoman12

Dubinusa wrote: »

I think we'll build towards the rwc. We've been very poor these last two.
I fear relegation tbh.
But, I think the coaching ticket was very poor last year. Whoever the defence coach was, needs to be replaced.
As a collective, I thought we were at sea, the lads didn't appear to be on the same page.
Individually, there were some good players. I thought O',Sullivan was very good, Dunne was decent too.
But, other lads were poor overall, Masterson did not impress imo and neither did Sylvester.
Anyway, new group and really looking forward to the 6nations.

I agree with you on this one to be honest

Locke_Lamora

Dubinusa wrote: »

I think we'll build towards the rwc. We've been very poor these last two.
I fear relegation tbh.
But, I think the coaching ticket was very poor last year. Whoever the defence coach was, needs to be replaced.
As a collective, I thought we were at sea, the lads didn't appear to be on the same page.
Individually, there were some good players. I thought O',Sullivan was very good, Dunne was decent too.
But, other lads were poor overall, Masterson did not impress imo and neither did Sylvester.
Anyway, new group and really looking forward to the 6nations.

Yea, last year's team looked very messy and no attack or defensive structure. I reckon the number of decent players coming from that group could surprise people though. Doris seems to be putting pressure on Deegan, O'Toole is getting a lot of game time for a young tighthead, Hume just had a good game against Leinster considering the team he was in, Lowry has played well for Ulster, and Hugh O'Sullivan is getting minutes off the bench for Leinster.

Other players I think might turn out well are Jack O'Sullivan, Dunne, Hall and Tommy O'Brien. That's just me trying to look on the bright side though.

IMO this year should has more talent, but I'm not sure who's injured/available.

elliot_st

Likey 1st XV for England game:

1. Michael Milne(Leinster)
2. Dylan Tierney(Connacht)
3. Tom Clarkson(Leinster)
4. Ryan Baird(Leinster)
5. Charlie Ryan(Leinster)
6. Niall Murray(Connacht)
7. Martin Moloney(Leinster)
8. John Hodnett(Munster)
9. Craig Casey(Munster)
10. Harry Byrne(Leinster)
11. Liam Turner(Leinster)
12. David Hawkshaw(Leinster)
13. Sean French(Munster)
14. Jonathan Wren(Munster)
15. Jake Flannery(Munster)

Dubinusa

What! No Ulstermen?
Surely Kernahan will start. He's played senior rugby this year.
Azure Allison? Is he hurt?
When will the squad be announced?

elliot_st

Dubinusa wrote: »

What! No Ulstermen?
Surely Kernahan will start. He's played senior rugby this year.
Azure Allison? Is he hurt?
When will the squad be announced?

kernohen not likely to be released.

Allison is injured as is Stewart Moore.

JJ McKee might start at 4 if Baird doesn't make it back in time from his injury.

3rd week of Jan.