Brexit discussion thread IV

An Ciarraioch

Corbyn to give a speech today stating the fall in sterling should have been a boon to exporters, and calling for an increased emphasis on manufacturing, though quite how Britain could compete with Asian nations remains a mystery.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/url-jeremy-corbyn-brexit-economic-labour-party-cheap-labour-migrants-eu-a8460696.html?amp&utm_term=Autofeed&utm_campaign=Echobox&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter&__twitter_impression=true

Edit - hadn't got as far as page 283 in my look back through the thread before posting this!

Leroy42

An Ciarraioch wrote: »

Corbyn to give a speech today stating the fall in sterling should have been a boon to exporters, and calling for an increased emphasis on manufacturing, though quite how Britain could compete with Asian nations remains a mystery.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/url-jeremy-corbyn-brexit-economic-labour-party-cheap-labour-migrants-eu-a8460696.html?amp&utm_term=Autofeed&utm_campaign=Echobox&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Twitter&__twitter_impression=true

Didn't Boris say the pound soared after TM speech?

bilston

EdgeCase wrote: »

bilston wrote: »

The Peace Process started under John Major when he was occasionally reliant on the UUP.

The key word there is *started*. It could well have ended up much like the Sunningdale Agreement and other attempts in the past had it not been for the New Labour landslide and a very independent and utterly pragmatic approach taken by Mo Mowlam, Blair and co.

We are back to the old days again, unfortunately.

Oh I agree with all that. Tony Blair (whatever his other faults) certainly did great things for Northern Ireland, but he had the freedom to do it. But John Major did his bit too.

breatheme

The problem is that, if your currency is weak, sure, you can sell more, but then it also costs more money to import raw materials. It then depends on what you're producing, whether you need to import raw materials or not, etc. It's a very blanket statement and such a shame to hear that come from the opposition leader.

Zubeneschamali

breatheme wrote: »

The problem is that, if your currency is weak, sure, you can sell more, but then it also costs more money to import raw materials.

Strange to see Corbyn trumpeting weak Sterling since what it really means is UK workers getting paid less in real money.

ArmaniJeanss

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

Strange to see Corbyn trumpeting weak Sterling since what it really means is UK workers getting paid less in real money.

I don't see it as trumpeting, more just pointing out that the government failed to take the export advantage that the pound falling gave them.

Basic politicking - government dun bad, we'd do better.

brickster69

Nody wrote: »

El Weirdo wrote: »

I assume that would also apply to many Irish people who moved back home after spending their working lives in the UK?

Yup...

And he highlighted the threat that a staggering 38m contracts would be “left in legal limbo”, because it would also be illegal to pay claims in EU countries

“If a claim comes in two years down the line, in a country like Germany, their lawyers will be advising them you can’t pay the claim,” Mr Evans told the committee.

And that's nothing compared to the Trillions of Euros in derivative trades which could have no legal basis come March. Absolutely no chance of writing each contract out again, it would take years.
https://www.insurancejournal.com/news/international/2018/06/27/493351.htm

Water John

When is the next quarter results published? These may show NI officially in recession. Always a wake up call. NI in minus ROI in big plus.

Imreoir2

Leroy42 wrote: »

So the Secretary of State for NI would look for the UK parliament to pass EU laws in the UK for the use in only NI?

And what would happen, for example, if standards diverge? Extreme example that farmers are now allowed to use GMO feed. Farmers in the UK would produce cheaper meats for example. What does the farmer in NI do to compete? And why should a farmer, a UK citizen, not be allowed to choose to be under UK law rather than EU law?

And I think the UK see all this and that is why they are so set against it. They can foresee the problems down the line. At some point, NI will start to openly question where their future actually lies.

I think we are tieing ourselves up in knots pondering the administrative details. You could ask the what if question all day. The reality is that this will only come into effect if a treaty is agreed and signed. The answer to those questions will be in the terms of the treaty. It is not beyond the genious of man to make such an arrangement work.

ArmaniJeanss

correct horse battery staple wrote: »

UK is not a communist state with only state led industry, private companies did take advantage of weaker sterling and still being in eu, and they still had weak growth due to Brexit, guess what happens once they lose access to Eu market

I wasn't saying whether Corbyn was right or wrong in what he said - merely pointing out the context of a basic 'them bad, us good' political speech.
I do get slightly baffled by this belief here that Corbyn should be leading the way for the remain side and that it's somehow remiss of an opposition leader not to do so - when actually his main aim should be to get Labour elected. The time may come when that aim aligns with Remain but at the moment it doesn't.

ancapailldorcha

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

I wasn't saying whether Corbyn was right or wrong in what he said - merely pointing out the context of a basic 'them bad, us good' political speech.
I do get slightly baffled by this belief here that Corbyn should be leading the way for the remain side and that it's somehow remiss of an opposition leader not to do so - when actually his main aim should be to get Labour elected. The time may come when that aim aligns with Remain but at the moment it doesn't.

Thing is, he came out for remain before the referendum. The signs are that the country is heading for a cliff edge. The opposition is supposed to hold the government to account, not enable it to descend into petty blue-on-blue squabbling.

An Ciarraioch

European Communities Act to remain in force?

https://twitter.com/lewis_goodall/status/1021732320611639296

An Ciarraioch

https://twitter.com/badmachinery/status/1021710586843942912

Leroy42

So TM has just announced that DexEU will be taking a back seat in the negotiations with the EU, May will be taking over.

Raab will deputise for May in the negotiations

Professor Moriarty

Leroy42 wrote: »

So TM has just announced that DexEU will be taking a back seat in the negotiations with the EU, May will be taking over.

Raab wil deputise for May.

As PM???

Leroy42

Oops sorry, not as PM. It comes from a Change in Machinery of Government announcement.

DExEU will continue to do all the work, but May will now take over from Davies essentially.

Strazdas

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Thing is, he came out for remain before the referendum. The signs are that the country is heading for a cliff edge. The opposition is supposed to hold the government to account, not enable it to descend into petty blue-on-blue squabbling.

He surely couldn't have possibly come out in favour of Leave before the referendum. That would have put Labour in the same boat as UKIP and the DUP as the only two parties in Parliament supporting Leave.

judeboy101

An Ciarraioch wrote: »

https://twitter.com/badmachinery/status/1021710586843942912

Not as good as R.Kellys latest tune.

bilston

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

ArmaniJeanss wrote: »

I wasn't saying whether Corbyn was right or wrong in what he said - merely pointing out the context of a basic 'them bad, us good' political speech.
I do get slightly baffled by this belief here that Corbyn should be leading the way for the remain side and that it's somehow remiss of an opposition leader not to do so - when actually his main aim should be to get Labour elected. The time may come when that aim aligns with Remain but at the moment it doesn't.

Thing is, he came out for remain before the referendum. The signs are that the country is heading for a cliff edge. The opposition is supposed to hold the government to account, not enable it to descend into petty blue-on-blue squabbling.

I'm not convinced Corbyn is a remainer at heart at all, he more than anyone could put the pressure on for a second referendum. But as said above that may not go down well in some Labour constituencies

Professor Moriarty

bilston wrote: »

I'm not convinced Corbyn is a remainer at heart at all, he more than anyone could put the pressure on for a second referendum. But as said above that may not go down well in some Labour constituencies

He's an extremely lukewarm remainer at best.

bilston

So Raab is sidelined after a week.

Interesting...

It seems a bit chaotic...unless it's part of a grander plan by May.

Leroy42

bilston wrote: »

So Raab is sidelined after a week.

Interesting...

It seems a bit chaotic...unless it's part of a grander plan by May.

We have been summising that it all must be part of a grander May plan for the last two years!

Remember only two weeks ago, Chequers was the culmination of some brilliant scheme by May to effectively cut off the Hard BRexiteers.

How did that work out for her?

Water John

So Barnier now talks to May?

Professor Moriarty

bilston wrote: »

So Raab is sidelined after a week.

Interesting...

It seems a bit chaotic...unless it's part of a grander plan by May.

It might have something to do with the tone he was setting in his first week. Threatening to default on the 39 billion, calling the EU 'irresponsible' and pushing the idea of no deal.

cml387

bilston wrote: »

I'm not convinced Corbyn is a remainer at heart at all, he more than anyone could put the pressure on for a second referendum. But as said above that may not go down well in some Labour constituencies

Corbyn is a convinced Leaver. Always has been,which is consistent with the opinion of the hard left in Britain since the formation of the common market.

It's not so much that he was a reluctant campaigner for Remain during the referendum campaign, he actually sabotaged his own party's campaign.

Rjd2

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

He's an extremely lukewarm remainer at best.

Pretty much. He might come out in the future of the second referendum but that will only be when the polls demand one, at the moment its 50/50. So it will be a mere political power play.

He like Mogg knows well the damage that a hard Brexit would cause the UK but depressingly May is facing more opposition from her own back benches than the leader of the opposition.

Professor Moriarty

Rjd2 wrote: »

Pretty much. He might come out in the future of the second referendum but that will only be when the polls demand one, at the moment its 50/50. So it will be a mere political power play.

He like Mogg knows well the damage that a hard Brexit would cause the UK but depressingly May is facing more opposition from her own back benches than the leader of the opposition.

Britain really does have crappy politicians and a crappy system. I'd put Vradkar and Martin light years ahead of May and Corbyn. Ditto our electoral system.

Water John

At this stage the Polls have swung a bit from 50/50.

judeboy101

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Britain really does have crappy politicians and a crappy system. I'd put Vradkar and Martin light years ahead of May and Corbyn. Ditto our electoral system.

PR can put the balance of power in the hands of a small group of lunatics and conmen. Look at the independent alliance.

Water John

Agree the Ind All have not achieved anything actually. Only Ind who has impressed has been Katerine Zappone. But none could be described as a lunatic or con man.
Sometimes its the large party that can be gone off track and the minority or Ind holds them to account.

Here's the link to RTE Brexit Podcasts:
https://www.rte.ie/news/brexit-republic/